393 réponses à ce sujet

[Sion1138]

Morocco Mole wrote...

The only thing depressing about the ending is the people who lost their marbles over it.

At least they had marbles to lose.

[Seboist]

crimzontearz wrote...

And the delusions of artistdom of Mac and Walters

Mass Effect was always a b-grade (at best) pulp story and power fantasy in the shape of a linear and sub-par corridor shooter.

I'm afraid it's the fanbase that's more delusional here in thinking it's anything but that.

[Seboist]

Morocco Mole wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

And the delusions of artistdom of Mac and Walters

You know, people parrot this line over and over ad-nasuem. But is there any proof any of them actually said this? Can I see it, please? Because while I remember a lot of stupid **** from both Bioware and the fans. I can't remember either of the two themselves ever commenting on anything  post-ME3

IIRC it was IGN or some other "game journalist" site making the "artistic integrity" defense for ME3 not Mac/Casey/BW.

[RandomGuy96]

crimzontearz wrote...

You mean like MP was not needed for all endings? LOL

Or how romance choices would have "big consequences"?

Or how there wouldn't be an ABC ending choice?

Or how there would be one nice, fulfilling, golden ending, that would be triumphant and uplifting?

Or how Bioware would not pull a Lost?

Or how there'd be an ending where the Reapers win (though this can be taken as technically true)? 

Or how the EC wasn't supposed to change anything (though this was actually positive)?

Yeah. 

[PinkysPain]

It was Dr. Ray Muzyka who unintentionally made artistic integrity short hand for everything wrong with the ME3 ending.

http://blog.bioware....012/03/21/4108/

[DQX]

PinkysPain wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...
Survival + reunion scene would have put me in the mood to overlook most of the awful writing tho

I hate how they keep pretending it's just Shepard's death which was the problem ... and not the combination with the starchild sucking all illusion of agency out
of the game.

Either make Shepard a real winner, who dies to really save the universe for all his friends. Or let him get a partial victory and survive to make blue babies. Having him die AND be a tool, that's not what I wanted, not within the realm of expectations either after ME1 and ME2 (which promised a true victory AND blue babies, but I guess a true happy ending is too much to bear for the grim derp generation).

I don't think that will be a problem as it looks like they have committed to eliminate as much of the Shepard trilogy from the script.  How they are going to do that and have any sense of ME remaining is a mystery- and I think a mistake- to me. 

I think you can evolve a sequel storyline without divorcing continuity completely. However, they may have felt like they were burned by KOTOR II- which I felt was too disjointed and trying to carry it was why we don't have KOTOR III..

I think the problem is that there is a big draw in starting from the ground up- there is an adventure aspect to that.  But I also think that there is something that could have been said in moving on with the Dark Lord Revan ... or the son/daughter of Shepard.

[dreamgazer]

iakus wrote...

Morocco Mole wrote...

Ultimately, the characters do not belong to you. They are bioware's.

#ItsYourShepard

It's your Shepard, not your Commander.

[dreamgazer]

PinkysPain wrote...

It was Dr. Ray Muzyka who unintentionally made artistic integrity short hand for everything wrong with the ME3 ending.

http://blog.bioware....012/03/21/4108/

Actually, it's the fans and gaming journalists who intentionally misconstrued and exacerbated the phrase's meaning.

[PinkysPain]

Seboist wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

And the delusions of artistdom of Mac and Walters

Mass Effect was always a b-grade (at best) pulp story and power fantasy in the shape of a linear and sub-par corridor shooter.

I'm afraid it's the fanbase that's more delusional here in thinking it's anything but that.

That's non sequitur, he is basically calling ME3 pretentious ... he made no claim that ME1/ME2 were art.

If ME3 had been a pulpy power fantasy this whole mess would never have happened.

[Sion1138]

DQX wrote...

I don't think that will be a problem as it looks like they have committed to eliminate as much of the Shepard trilogy from the script.  How they are going to do that and have any sense of ME remaining is a mystery- and I think a mistake- to me. 

I think you can evolve a sequel storyline without divorcing continuity completely. However, they may have felt like they were burned by KOTOR II- which I felt was too disjointed and trying to carry it was why we don't have KOTOR III..

I think the problem is that there is a big draw in starting from the ground up- there is an adventure aspect to that.  But I also think that there is something that could have been said in moving on with the Dark Lord Revan ... or the son/daughter of Shepard.

KotOR II was written and developed at Obsidian and they probably worked within constraints set by BioWare and LucasArts.

[spirosz]

dreamgazer wrote...

PinkysPain wrote...

It was Dr. Ray Muzyka who unintentionally made artistic integrity short hand for everything wrong with the ME3 ending.

http://blog.bioware....012/03/21/4108/

Actually, it's the fans and gaming journalists who intentionally misconstrued and exacerbated the phrase's meaning.

This still isn't known?  

[spirosz]

Sion1138 wrote...

 within constraints set by BioWare and LucasArts.

Terrible constraints mind you. 

[Iakus]

Seboist wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

And the delusions of artistdom of Mac and Walters

Mass Effect was always a b-grade (at best) pulp story and power fantasy in the shape of a linear and sub-par corridor shooter.

I'm afraid it's the fanbase that's more delusional here in thinking it's anything but that.

B-grade pulp stories and power fantasies can still be fun, if told well

Not used to shoehorn in A Statement that's inappropriate for the setting.

[JustGiveItUp]

(To all of those who were so quick and loud to call, ''BULL****,'' 14 pages later and don't these usually get closed by Bioware if they're fake rumors? Just y'know, wondering.)

[rapscallioness]

Well, as far as the future of mass effect, I could see it being a sequel perhaps a thousand or so years in the future.

I mean, a poster said something about warhammer being technophobic--never played warhammer, meself. If you pick destroy--you know the galaxy is going to be extremely technophobic for quite some time after the Reapers. There's no way around that.

Even in Control--Shep is off somewhere, and has become some myth. Regardless, the ones left standing are going to still be traumatized by the Reaper invasion. Which to me means they, too, could become very technophobic after all is said and done.

With Synth...well, I could imagine them becoming technophobic IF something went wrong with the synthesis. Perhaps there were some unforeseen side effects? Maybe it won't "take" well. So, if that broke down, again, we could reasonably be at a unifying point of a galaxy that has become extremely technophobic. Depending on what could be imagined as going wrong with the process of Synthesis.

I could imagine a future mass effect galaxy that is very technophobic. The whole thing was extremely traumatic for the races. I could imagine that trying to invent, or being caught with any tech could warrant your arrest and maybe execution, because the fear of what might happen, and the horrors of what did happen.

It could turn to an extreme, zealot type of environment. Black market tech that uses mostly gum and duct tape. Lol! I could see a cult of Shepard that worships the myth, as well as those that demonize Shep--depending on if there were any nasty unforeseen side effects of Synth. Or, frankly any of the other choices. Existence would be extremely difficult for a long time. Shep's actions might not be as fondly remembered as we think they should be. Shep might eventually be blamed for using this crucible tech blindly. Not at first ofc. Everybody's just happy the Reapers are gone, but after awhile, a generation or two, when reality sets in of what they're left to deal with, some resentment might stir.

Populations may become isolated from each other. Perhaps even races that we take for granted as knowing that they exist, might be relegated to the realm of myth as well simply because of their isolation. And as other posters pointed out, this isolation over a good amount of time (tho 10,000 years seems too much to me) would lead to changing cultures and dialects, maybe even physical appearances. Depending on how long it's been and what environments races may have to live in through the aftermath.

I know the EC painted everything as just fine, but it was just fine eventually. The EC had a narrative that spanned alot of time. So, we may be alright eventually, and get back to and transcend what we were before--but that will take time.The relays in the EC may not have been destroyed, but they were still badly damaged.

Resources and populations are gonna be scarce for quite some time. The galaxy was completely trashed. The infrastructure of the mass effect civilization, as we knew it, is gone. Anything goes now. The Asari themselves may be demonized for holding out on the tech--if news of that got out. They might end up being reviled instead of revered.

All I'm saying is that it would take very little to find a common starting point for a sequel because regardless of our choices, the meu will never be the same. Not after what they went through.

I, however, am not passionately tied to any of the ending choices. I pick destroy, but I really wouldn't care if they went Synth or Control. I just don't feel that strongly about any of them, good or bad. I understand there are others that do. That's cool. I'm just speaking for myself here.

I do hope they give us a clue as to their intended narrative direction very soon. I'm about tired of floundering in the dark here.

[Nightwriter]

We overreacted to the "artistic integrity" thing, but on the other hand I think that overreaction was pretty predictable and I'm almost kind of like "well what else did you expect to happen?" They used those words so soon after the ending, when the fan community was still reeling in outrage. If you dump a bucket of icewater over someone's head you may want to wait until they've at least toweled their face dry before you say the bucket dumping was artistic, is what I mean. Even if you think it was.

[Iakus]

crimzontearz wrote...

Uh....ART? You know....it has to be dark depressing and make reflect on the meaningless nature if life or some such crap

True Art is Angsty

[dreamgazer]

iakus wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

Uh....ART? You know....it has to be dark depressing and make reflect on the meaningless nature if life or some such crap

True Art is Angsty

Blah, blah, blah ... It's the same series with a forced Virmire sacrifice and mandatory Citadel death sentence.

[Seboist]

PinkysPain wrote...

If ME3 had been a pulpy power fantasy this whole mess would never have happened.

Not a pulpy power fantasy? Then what's with Alliance reps groveling like retards at Shepard's feet in the intro to stroke the players' ego?

And it being a pulpy power fantasy is precisely why there's so much butthurt, this is a fanbase that's used to power tripping as a paragon do gooder jesus figure or a renegade badass troll with no real negative consequence and had the rug pulled from right underneath them at the end . It had nothing to do with bad writing(for which ME3 has plenty of outside of the ending) or "choices not mattering" (series is largely a linear gears clone).

[wright1978]

iakus wrote...

EC pretty clearly demonstrates they either didn't understand or didn't care what people didn't like.

This interview pretty much confirms that "Your opinion matters only if you agree with us"  (Guess what?  My Shepard isn't and never was Walter White!)

So yeah, I'm pessisitic

Yikes that's a bad interview and doesn't give me much faith that Walters should be working anywhere near an RPG based game. Really comparing a game that has always been about interactive player agency/choice to a TV series with a passive linear nature.

[dreamgazer]

Plenty of linearity and railroading in ME1 (and ME 2), folks. Open thine eyes.

[dreamgazer]

Morocco Mole wrote...

I don't feel like reading a bad article. Please post the lines in question

Walters compared the ending of ME3 with Breaking Bad's. Extremely silly comment.