8 réponses à ce sujet

[Henioo]

Hello to all.

Ideally, I would like a developer's answer, but I know they are busy people and may not be able to find the time to take part in the discussion, and thus I'd welcome discussion from other users.

As far as I know, it was never touched upon in any Dragon Age media released so far. How do the last names work in Thedas in marriage? Is it like in modern real life, that either the man or the woman may choose to change their last name, hyphen two of them, or is it like in the old days that the woman takes man's name?

I am asking particularly because I am interested what would be the case with the Queens of Ferelden. For example, would Anora marrying Cailan become Anora Theirin, Anora Mac Tir-Theirin, or just remain Anora Mac Tir? Another example is Queen Rowan, née Guerrin. Did she die as Rowan Theirin?

What do you think?

[Viktoria Landers]

An interesting question. I think women assume the name of their husband, however I am not entirely certain. Or perhaps they have the option/freedom to keep their previous last name after marriage.

[Ferretinabun]

Well we do know that Hawke's mother, Leandra, was an Amell before she married Malcom Hawke. Their children were Hawkes. Though I can't remember if Leandra is ever referred to as a Hawke.

[BevH]

It's been stated, by David Gaider I think, that the Dragon Age universe is roughly based on medieval Europe. But I also think that the family name would follow the higher ranking noble. So in the cases of Anora and Rowan, they would've become Theirin. I don't believe that most commoners would have a last name, or if they do, it would be based on their trade. For example, Alex the Smith would become Alex Smith. As for Leandra, she thought of herself as an Amell, but the children were Hawke, so I'm not sure if she ever took the name Hawke for herself.

[wiccame]

In a conversation, Leandra told Hawke she felt like an Amell again, one of the responses you could give was...You're a Hawke. Whether or not it implied her last name however I'm not sure.

Also leandra's cousin Revka (mother of human mage warden) must have been an Amell for the warden to have the name, whether she was married again, not sure, but I would assume so, because there was more than one child and I don't think she would have remained un married. Maybe with one but 2+ I'm not so sure.

If so that would mean Leandra took on Hawke but Revka kept Amell, not very consistant.

Modifié par wiccame, 29 novembre 2013 - 01:22 .

[BevH]

wiccame wrote...

In a conversation, Leandra told Hawke she felt like an Amell again, one of the responses you could give was...You're a Hawke. Whether or not it implied her last name however I'm not sure.

Also leandra's cousin Revka (mother of human mage warden) must have been an Amell for the warden to have the name, whether she was married again, not sure, but I would assume so, because there was more than one child and I don't think she would have remained un married. Maybe with one but 2+ I'm not so sure.

If so that would mean Leandra took on Hawke but Revka kept Amell, not very consistant.

Until the birth of Revka's first child, whether the warden or one of the other children, the Amells were very high nobility in Kirkwall. So if my theory is correct, whoever Revka married would take the name Amell.

[wiccame]

Yeah you could be right, and Leandra becoming a Hawke because Malcolm being an apostate, couldn't take the name Amell maybe.

[Corker]

In DA2, Aveline's father was Benoit Du Lac, yet she is Aveline Vallen - she took Wesley's last name. And she apparently changes it again:

Aveline: You're making a name for yourself in the templars.
Carver: And you've changed yours, Aveline Hendyr. Let me know if you ever need him run out of town or something.
Aveline: (Laughs) I will do that, Carver.

Bryce and Eleanor Cousland share a surname (his, I assume).

Guillaume de Launcet, his wife and all his children share a surname. He was referred to by that name in discussions about Leandra Amell's betrothal to him, so I assume it's his.

In their codex entries, neither Isolde nor Anora are referred to with surnames. Anora is called "Anora of Ferelden" by Empress Celene, although that seems like it just might be a description rather than a byname.

Certainly there seem to be family names in human and dwarven cultures: House Tethras (surface dwarves), Aeducan (Orzammar), Helmi (Orzammar), Dumar (Kirkwall), Threnhold (Kirkwall), Guerrin (Ferelden), Kendalls (Ferelden), Howe (Ferelden), Vael (Starkhaven). Lord and Lady Helmi share a surname, either because they're distantly related members of the same house, or because one changed names when they married in.

In all these cases, the name of the father transmits to the children; but also in all these cases, the father is the ruling noble, so there's no way to disambiguate whether or not it's gender-linked or class-linked. The only two examples I can think of that might help:

Moira Theirin - but I don't think we know if she was the Theirin, or if she married a Theirin man.

Sophia Dryden - her young son was taken by her brother, Toben Dryden, after her death, so it's unclear if Levi bears his great-grandmother's name because he would have inherited it from her, or because it passed down from Toben Dryden. It is interesting that Sophia kept the Dryden name. She had it as an arlessa as well; since her brother is a Dryden, it's not her married name. Either her son was the result of a liaison, or she did not take her husband's name. (I can't find a husband mentioned in the codices, but it's hardly a detail relevant to her narrative.)

I would lean toward a variety of customs. Some women seem to have stopped using any surname (Isolde, Anora), some took their husband's (Cousland), and some kept their own (Dryden). Keeping the higher "ranking" name makes sense, and perhaps those women who drop all surnames are doing so from a sense of propriety - Isolde could hardly keep an Orlesian surname in post-rebellion Ferelden, no matter how important her family was, and Anora thinks so highly of her father (and not so highly of Cailan, it seems, even if she was fond of him) that perhaps she didn't want to replace Mac Tir with Theirin, even if it was a more glorious and ancient name.

[Wulfram]

The wiki says that Moira Theirin was Brandel's daughter.

The persistence of the Couslands, Howes, and Theirins as holders of their respective titles would seem to imply that either Fereldan women can pass on the name in at least some circumstances or the succession laws are more biased against women than I think they are.