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[Grand Rider]

With weapons like the M-100 Grenade Launcher and the ML-77 Missile Launcher why should a player who uses the Soldier class invest precious points in this skill?

Both weapons can be fired rapidly and while the grenade launcher has a larger blast radius the missile launcher has a “fire and forget” feature that allows the player to fire it behind cover. The only superior trait that Concussive Shot seems to possess to me is that, beyond its recharge timer, it can be used an infinite amount of times while the two heavy weapons are ammo based.

Concussive Shot can be evolved into two different skills:

Heavy Concussive Shot: Significantly increases the power of your Concussive Shot, blasting enemies off their feet. This to me strikes a parallel with the ML-77 but lacks its tracking ability.

Concussive Blast: High-energy explosive charges give your shot an impact radius large enough to knock down multiple enemies. Sounds like a grenade launcher to me, only that I’ll bet that the M-100 does much more damage per shot.

So, with two seemingly superior alternatives; why should someone bother spending skill points on Concussive Shot?

What are your thoughts?

[RyuKazuha]

Well, sometimes you may just want to get somebody off his feet without blowing half of the map to hell.



Seriously, how should we know, if concussive shot works out well, if none of us hasn't played the game yet? We've to know the ammo-issue first and several other things that define how usefull a Ability against a weapon is. You pretty much imply that you know what a rocket launcher or grenade launcher will be like, but that's mere speculation on your terms.

[TheTWF]

Because you can use it immediately without the four second holster/draw animations.

Because you only get so many shots with the heavy weapons.

Because you might find another type of heavy weapon more useful.

[DocLasty]

It sounds like a heavy weapon that never runs out of ammo. It's useful.

[akintu]

TheTWF wrote...

Because you can use it immediately without the four second holster/draw animations.

This is what I was thinking.  You can be shooting with your AR, and with no delay fire something basically similar to a heavy weapon.  Pretty useful if you ask me!

[FERGJ]

Well, all skill is useful. But i want my soldier to be the best at what it does . SO i don't care about Cryo Ammo and Concussive Shot





My choice:50pts:

1.10 Adrenaline Rush

2.10Disruptor Ammo

3.10Incendiary Ammo

4.10combat mastery

5.10bonus



If my soldier avatar is lucky,i'll manage;..^^;

[Yojimboo]

FERGJ wrote...

Well, all skill is useful. But i want my soldier to be the best at what it does . SO i don't care about Cryo Ammo and Concussive Shot


My choice:50pts:
1.10 Adrenaline Rush
2.10Disruptor Ammo
3.10Incendiary Ammo
4.10combat mastery
5.10bonus

If my soldier avatar is lucky,i'll manage;..^^;

Errm, sorry to burst your bubble but there will only be 30 level. If i understood the videos correct, every skill has 5 level.

[Nimander]

Yojimboo wrote...
Errm, sorry to burst your bubble but there will only be 30 level. If i understood the videos correct, every skill has 5 level.

Yeah, there's 30 levels and you get a total of 50 points in those levels.  2/Level up to 20 and then 1/level after.  Bonus talent automatically gets a point into it, so total of 51 points.

This was verified by Christina Norman on the old forums.

[Zeyphon]

You misunderstood, you can get 51 points total, 2x20 for first twenty levels, then 1x10 for last ten levels. There are six "slots" to invest points into, each take 10 points to upgrade to maximum power, they have 4 segments corresponding to power, 1+2+3+4=10.

[Grand Rider]

RyuKazuha wrote...

Well, sometimes you may just want to get somebody off his feet without blowing half of the map to hell.

I hear you. But if that's the case, say a YMIR Mech or a Krogan is charging towards you, why not use the M-77 Missile Launcher to deliver that single hard-hitting punch? Or, if you're going to be swarmed by husks, why not use the grenade launcer? My point is there seems to be better alternatives.

RyuKazuha wrote...

Seriously, how should we know, if concussive shot works out well, if none of us hasn't played the game yet? We've to know the ammo-issue first and several other things that define how usefull a Ability against a weapon is. You pretty much imply that you know what a rocket launcher or grenade launcher will be like, but that's mere speculation on your terms.

Well I’ve seen footage of both heavy weapons in various clips from a multitude of sources (IGN, Gamespot, YouTube etc). In fact, the M-100 Grenade Launcher is featured in the official Soldier class description video (01:23 and 01:33) where it seems to perform exactly like the Concussion Shot with an added kick.
 
Granted, I haven’t played the game and any footage that I’ve seen to date was probably from an unfinished build but for what they do, pound for pound, I believe the two heavy weapons I’ve mentioned make Concussive Shot obsolete.

The only trait that I'll conceed to the skill other than its infinite use is its speed; if an enemy gets the drop on you then you can fire a Concussive Shot on reflex without spending precious seconds to switch weapons, but that's just about it. I could at most invest one single point for that ability and not spend another as there are heavy weapons available that'd do the job so much better.

[DocLasty]

I hear you. But if that's the case, say a YMIR Mech or a Krogan is charging towards you, why not use the M-77 Missile Launcher to deliver that single hard-hitting punch? Or, if you're going to be swarmed by husks, why not use the grenade launcer? My point is there seems to be better alternatives.



It's about conversation. You could use the missile launcher, but why waste ammo when the Concussion Shot will do the trick? Save the Missile Launcher for later, when you might be up against an enemy that you have trouble hitting, like a geth stalker.

[blank1]

You get 2 skill points per level until level 21, where you get one point. It totals out to 50, so you can max out five skills -- each skill takes 10 points to evolve. However, I'm assuming it'll be as long, if not longer, to get to level 30 in ME2 as it was to get to level 60 in ME1.

[Br0th3rGr1mm]

Limted supply of ammo for Grenade launcher and Missile launcher and an unlimited supply of Concusive Shots...

Thus endeth the lesson....

Modifié par Br0th3rGr1mm, 20 janvier 2010 - 04:57 .

[Unato]

friendly fire? if you slam a rocket point blank it will prob kill you and your enemy



limited ammo supply as well maybe... like i dunno 5 per level or something ( randomly picked number )

[Grand Rider]

Zeyphon wrote...

You misunderstood, you can get 51 points total, 2x20 for first twenty levels, then 1x10 for last ten levels. There are six "slots" to invest points into, each take 10 points to upgrade to maximum power, they have 4 segments corresponding to power, 1+2+3+4=10.

I'd like to add that the 51st point comes from a seventh bonus skill that you can unlock, otherwise you'll have up to 50 points to spend on average.

Back on topic; I'd like to thank everyone who's replied since my last reply. Many have also mentioned the speed of Concussive Shot which I've conceeded is superior in a pinch, but I'm still not convinced that it's worth leveling up when I can equip a heavy weapon for no additional charge other than its finite ammo. 

[Cactot]

Yojimboo wrote...

Errm, sorry to burst your bubble but there will only be 30 level. If i understood the videos correct, every skill has 5 level.

You have 51 total points to spend (2 per level until lvl 20, then 1 per level after, and one free one from your "bonus skill")
There are 4 levels for each skill, costing 1, 2, 3, and 4 points respectively.  So maxxing a single ability would cost 10
points, meaning you could max 5 skills if you completely ignore the rest.  (other than your free point in the bonus skill)

Source: Christina Norman
http://meforums.biow...forum=144&sp=45

[Yojimboo]

Zeyphon wrote...

You misunderstood, you can get 51 points total, 2x20 for first twenty levels, then 1x10 for last ten levels. There are six "slots" to invest points into, each take 10 points to upgrade to maximum power, they have 4 segments corresponding to power, 1+2+3+4=10.

Oh ok, thanks for clarification.

I thought it would be 30 points in total 1 level 1 point. Good to know i am wrong .

Modifié par Yojimboo, 20 janvier 2010 - 05:00 .

[DocLasty]

Unato wrote...

friendly fire? if you slam a rocket point blank it will prob kill you and your enemy

limited ammo supply as well maybe... like i dunno 5 per level or something ( randomly picked number )

I don't think this game has friendly fire. Could be wrong. At any rate, squad mates seem a lot better at staying out of your line of fire.

[akintu]

I'm willing to bet, when taking into account delays from switching weapons, Concussive Shot works out to higher sustained DPS. The cooldown is equivalent to the delay in switching to a heavy weapon. So fire your AR like crazy, fire concussive shot, fire AR like crazy, fire Concussive Shot. You've managed to fire two Concussive shots and fire your AR for a burst in the time it takes to switch to a heavy weapon and fire it.



The timing may be different, but you get the idea. I think you're downplaying the value of sustaining AR fire as opposed to watching a weapon change animation.

[rines]

With heavy weapons like the M-622 Avalanche or the M-490 Blackstorm or even another weapons seen from "Art of the Game", you guys who've seen it will know what im talking about, i doubt anyone will want to carry a dumb old 'nade launcher. And concussive shot is like infinite grenades and use it faster too. And its lock onish. Also youll probably have to put at least 2 points in it to unlock another skill under it, like 2 points in incendiary ammo for use of cyro, etc.

[Yojimboo]

DocLasty wrote...

Unato wrote...

friendly fire? if you slam a rocket point blank it will prob kill you and your enemy

limited ammo supply as well maybe... like i dunno 5 per level or something ( randomly picked number )

I don't think this game has friendly fire. Could be wrong. At any rate, squad mates seem a lot better at staying out of your line of fire.

I just hope they overhauled the complete companion AI, it was so damn annyoing that they shoot through object and walls.

[Unato]

well you can't shoot at ur team mates directly even in ME1 so I guess whenever I get a rocket launcher in ME2 I'm going to try my hardest to kill my team members by indirect fire. it should be interesting experiement

[rines]

Yojimboo wrote...

DocLasty wrote...

Unato wrote...

friendly fire? if you slam a rocket point blank it will prob kill you and your enemy

limited ammo supply as well maybe... like i dunno 5 per level or something ( randomly picked number )

I don't think this game has friendly fire. Could be wrong. At any rate, squad mates seem a lot better at staying out of your line of fire.

I just hope they overhauled the complete companion AI, it was so damn annyoing that they shoot through object and walls.

Shepard: All right guys were gonna sneak in real quitely and....
Garrus: THERE ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THAT WALL ! FIRE !
*pew pew pew pew pew*
WREX: FIRE OMGZ FIRE KEEL THEM PEW PEW PEW
Shepard: holy ****...

[Krilral]

Concussive shot does track enemies. In some videos you can see it mak some pretty sharp turns. Also it has the advantage of not using ammo. The grenade launcher and missile launcher both have very limited ammo while the concussive shot can be used infinitly with only a cooldown limiting its' use.

[Grand Rider]

Krilral wrote...

Concussive shot does track enemies. In some videos you can see it mak some pretty sharp turns. Also it has the advantage of not using ammo. The grenade launcher and missile launcher both have very limited ammo while the concussive shot can be used infinitly with only a cooldown limiting its' use.

I didn't know it could track, if that's the case then that would drastically improve my opinion of it. Could you point me in the direction of the clip you saw where it tracks please?