Modifié par Mecheon, 14 décembre 2013 - 03:50 .
Custom Content Challenge: December 2013: Dark Sun
Débuté par
The Amethyst Dragon
, déc. 02 2013 03:09
#101
Posté 14 décembre 2013 - 03:45
Mecheon
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Cannot find a reference for their construction for the life of me, but I'd also say some hide sails or carapace bits would work
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#102
Posté 14 décembre 2013 - 04:06
PLUSH HYENA of DOOM
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Shem:- I already started work on a War Drik based on that piece of art you've posted... It went HIDEOUSLY wrong. It became grotesquely rubbish, I mean, not just bad but really TERRIBLE. So I gave up trying to animate a creature that was as broad as it was long, has no legs worth a damn yet is supposed to be able to flail and swipe with its paws (?!) and started on the Mekillot instead.
I did think about making some sort of cargo-wagon sort of thing to be pulled behind one or two Mekillots but that raises the question of animating the finished composite so that when the creatures turn, the wagon follows logically rather than swinging about like an extension of their tails and it... becomes complicated. Unfortunately, I know I'm not going to have time to hit all the animation issues with big bricks, especially given that I'm none too good at complex custom animations anyway.
ALSO, by the time you've got a pair of 30-35 foot Creature models hauling a 50 foot plus trailer around, they take up so much space that they're going to have SERIOUS practical limitations in any normal Area in a Module. You can only create an Area up to 32x32 Tiles at maximum. One PHoD Mekillot is over 2 Tiles in length, add two Mekillots abreast plus a wagon such as the one in the art (above the Drik) and you've got a composite "Creature" model of about 4 or 5 Tiles wide by at least 7 Tiles in length.
Add to that the fact that they won't even remotely fit through any narrow canyon or anything, won't go around any corner without several hundred yards of walkable space all around, PLUS the fact that if there's any kind of sand dune, small rock, etc, in the Mekillots' path that either one of them has to rise to go over, the wagon behind them will levitate freakishly when they do so. And they get stuck a lot... Which means you'd be limited to using the "Mekillots plus Wagon" model to huge Areas of nothing but completely flat, open Tiles which would be distinctly boring.
In other words, it just didn't seem a practical undertaking within the constraints of NWN. That's why I went back to my completely bloody awful War Drik and thought about transposing the rider onto the Mekillot, simply as a means of denoting the beast as "domesticated". I'll probably carry on with that plan anyway, since I've got a use for it in my own Modules, (assuming I ever get around to doing the Modules I have in mind).
In terms of scale, that's a standard-sized Human woman in the WIP image, standing about as close to the Mekillot's front leg as she can. That gives a rough size guide to anyone wanting to build "conveyances" of any sort to be pulled by the beasts. But as to linking the Mekillot(s) to wagons, it's definitely going to be a big animation issue, unless someone has a cunning plan I haven't thought of. If anyone does have any blistering ideas on how to make a Mekillot caravan a viable reality in NWN, given the above problems, I'd be interested to hear them.
EDIT:- I could do THREE versions of the Mekillot without recourse to having them pulling stuff...
1:- Standard Wild Mekillot
2:- Caravan Mekillot with Guardsman rider
3:- Caravan Mekillot with Cargo
(The Cargo version would simply have piles of crates, sacks, etc heaped on its back (something like the Pack Ox models on a huge scale). Several of these, with a few of the Guard version flanking them, plus assorted other NPC's alongside (perhaps some on Draygoth's Crodlu mounts) could make up a trade caravan that might actually be able to follow waypoints and scripts and navigate an Area without getting stuck. Maybe.) It's the best shot at a fully-fledged Athas caravan (which can actually move about) that I can think of within the framework of NWN - and what I can do between poking fibreglass Dinosaurs with pointed sticks).
I did think about making some sort of cargo-wagon sort of thing to be pulled behind one or two Mekillots but that raises the question of animating the finished composite so that when the creatures turn, the wagon follows logically rather than swinging about like an extension of their tails and it... becomes complicated. Unfortunately, I know I'm not going to have time to hit all the animation issues with big bricks, especially given that I'm none too good at complex custom animations anyway.
ALSO, by the time you've got a pair of 30-35 foot Creature models hauling a 50 foot plus trailer around, they take up so much space that they're going to have SERIOUS practical limitations in any normal Area in a Module. You can only create an Area up to 32x32 Tiles at maximum. One PHoD Mekillot is over 2 Tiles in length, add two Mekillots abreast plus a wagon such as the one in the art (above the Drik) and you've got a composite "Creature" model of about 4 or 5 Tiles wide by at least 7 Tiles in length.
Add to that the fact that they won't even remotely fit through any narrow canyon or anything, won't go around any corner without several hundred yards of walkable space all around, PLUS the fact that if there's any kind of sand dune, small rock, etc, in the Mekillots' path that either one of them has to rise to go over, the wagon behind them will levitate freakishly when they do so. And they get stuck a lot... Which means you'd be limited to using the "Mekillots plus Wagon" model to huge Areas of nothing but completely flat, open Tiles which would be distinctly boring.
In other words, it just didn't seem a practical undertaking within the constraints of NWN. That's why I went back to my completely bloody awful War Drik and thought about transposing the rider onto the Mekillot, simply as a means of denoting the beast as "domesticated". I'll probably carry on with that plan anyway, since I've got a use for it in my own Modules, (assuming I ever get around to doing the Modules I have in mind).
In terms of scale, that's a standard-sized Human woman in the WIP image, standing about as close to the Mekillot's front leg as she can. That gives a rough size guide to anyone wanting to build "conveyances" of any sort to be pulled by the beasts. But as to linking the Mekillot(s) to wagons, it's definitely going to be a big animation issue, unless someone has a cunning plan I haven't thought of. If anyone does have any blistering ideas on how to make a Mekillot caravan a viable reality in NWN, given the above problems, I'd be interested to hear them.
EDIT:- I could do THREE versions of the Mekillot without recourse to having them pulling stuff...
1:- Standard Wild Mekillot
2:- Caravan Mekillot with Guardsman rider
3:- Caravan Mekillot with Cargo
(The Cargo version would simply have piles of crates, sacks, etc heaped on its back (something like the Pack Ox models on a huge scale). Several of these, with a few of the Guard version flanking them, plus assorted other NPC's alongside (perhaps some on Draygoth's Crodlu mounts) could make up a trade caravan that might actually be able to follow waypoints and scripts and navigate an Area without getting stuck. Maybe.) It's the best shot at a fully-fledged Athas caravan (which can actually move about) that I can think of within the framework of NWN - and what I can do between poking fibreglass Dinosaurs with pointed sticks).
Modifié par PLUSH HYENA of DOOM, 14 décembre 2013 - 04:28 .
#103
Posté 14 décembre 2013 - 05:27
henesua
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The best way to do a conveyance of that size is as a tileset rather than as a creature. You could use a big desert placeable skybox sphere animated to suggest movement (ala OTRs and Lord of Worms work on ships and placeable sky spheres) or some super creative use of "windows" on the conveyance itself.
#104
Posté 14 décembre 2013 - 07:58
PLUSH HYENA of DOOM
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Good thought...
It would require a Placeable of a huge, fortified wagon (with some Mekillot standing in front of it), or possibly a Tile group addition to the Desert Tileset, though a Placeable would be more versatile since it could be positioned anywhere. This would have a ramp or other boarding structure which could be equipped with an Area Transition - into a mini Tileset of the interior as henesua suggested, with scrolling skybox, etc...
Given the limited time I've currently got, however, getting the assorted Mekillot creature versions done to my satisfaction is going to probably be as much as I can get finished on top of the other stuff.
It would require a Placeable of a huge, fortified wagon (with some Mekillot standing in front of it), or possibly a Tile group addition to the Desert Tileset, though a Placeable would be more versatile since it could be positioned anywhere. This would have a ramp or other boarding structure which could be equipped with an Area Transition - into a mini Tileset of the interior as henesua suggested, with scrolling skybox, etc...
Given the limited time I've currently got, however, getting the assorted Mekillot creature versions done to my satisfaction is going to probably be as much as I can get finished on top of the other stuff.
#105
Posté 14 décembre 2013 - 10:16
Shemsu-Heru
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@PLUSH HYENA of DOOM:
You have already made a lot of good stuff for this challenge and I really thank you for that; And the last thing that I want to, would be to abuse of your kindness.
When I posted the Drik picture, my only intention was to show that there is a "domestic animal" even bigger than the Mekillot. Not to direct you in order to made one. Also the Drik is basically a giant tortoise, and I think that there are some models of this in the vault.
As well, when I posted the Mekillot wagon picture, I only wanted to show that this is the way in what mekillots are regulary used, instead of be mounted. I didn't try to convice you to make one. Also make a animated Mekillot wagon could be a great headache. I you really like the mekillot fortified wagons, just a placeable would be enought.
Please, don't do more than you really want to to. I would hate that you become overloaded and exhausted, buy my cause.
You have already made a lot of good stuff for this challenge and I really thank you for that; And the last thing that I want to, would be to abuse of your kindness.
When I posted the Drik picture, my only intention was to show that there is a "domestic animal" even bigger than the Mekillot. Not to direct you in order to made one. Also the Drik is basically a giant tortoise, and I think that there are some models of this in the vault.
As well, when I posted the Mekillot wagon picture, I only wanted to show that this is the way in what mekillots are regulary used, instead of be mounted. I didn't try to convice you to make one. Also make a animated Mekillot wagon could be a great headache. I you really like the mekillot fortified wagons, just a placeable would be enought.
Please, don't do more than you really want to to. I would hate that you become overloaded and exhausted, buy my cause.
#106
Posté 15 décembre 2013 - 02:58
PLUSH HYENA of DOOM
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I already started the Drik as the second or third creature I tried, days back - entirely my own choice! It just completely failed to cooperate which is why I gave up and thought the Mekillot would be simpler. The trouble with the Drik is it's just so damned broad. I might have another look at the model before I delete it entirely, just to see if it can be rescued but I don't have much hope.
Having got a basic Mekillot done, it shouldn't be too much additional work to do some variants which may not be absolutely true to the Dark Sun mythos but which will be more practical to the constraints of NWN. As to a Placeable of the fortified wagon... um... I doubt I'll have time, but you never know...
EDIT:- Given that, if it's going to be done right, the fortified wagon would have visible interior areas on two levels and a great deal of detail, I don't think I'm going to have time to hit it with a big brick along with the Mekillot AND the Drik... AND grappling the Velociraptors.
I looked again at my pathetic Drik model from a week and half back and have concluded that it's too rubbish to be allowed to live. However, I did note a couple of points about it where I'd gone wrong and believe these points can be hammered into submission with the application of a COLOSSAL BRICK. I have thus started again on a completely NEW Drik model (which may go wrong like the first one, but it's worth a try).
Having got a basic Mekillot done, it shouldn't be too much additional work to do some variants which may not be absolutely true to the Dark Sun mythos but which will be more practical to the constraints of NWN. As to a Placeable of the fortified wagon... um... I doubt I'll have time, but you never know...
EDIT:- Given that, if it's going to be done right, the fortified wagon would have visible interior areas on two levels and a great deal of detail, I don't think I'm going to have time to hit it with a big brick along with the Mekillot AND the Drik... AND grappling the Velociraptors.
I looked again at my pathetic Drik model from a week and half back and have concluded that it's too rubbish to be allowed to live. However, I did note a couple of points about it where I'd gone wrong and believe these points can be hammered into submission with the application of a COLOSSAL BRICK. I have thus started again on a completely NEW Drik model (which may go wrong like the first one, but it's worth a try).
Modifié par PLUSH HYENA of DOOM, 15 décembre 2013 - 08:40 .
#107
Posté 15 décembre 2013 - 07:48
Shemsu-Heru
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This Gith, have been giving me quite work. But it's almost ready. I already have to animate this thing; If the animation part won't give me too much troubles i hope to have it finished soon. I have been so stubborn, that I wanted it like a skinned cretaure I hope not have to regret that....
I have based, mainly, on their 2nd Edition appearance and on the art of Gerald Brom...
I have based, mainly, on their 2nd Edition appearance and on the art of Gerald Brom...
Modifié par Shemsu-Heru, 15 décembre 2013 - 07:51 .
#109
Posté 16 décembre 2013 - 12:40
PLUSH HYENA of DOOM
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Shem:- The Gith are looking good...
I'll check on your suggestions for simpler Mekillot wagons... Meanwhile, my second attempt at the Drik just MIGHT work this time... he said with an uncharacteristic degree of optimism...
I'll check on your suggestions for simpler Mekillot wagons... Meanwhile, my second attempt at the Drik just MIGHT work this time... he said with an uncharacteristic degree of optimism...
#110
Posté 16 décembre 2013 - 11:56
Draygoth28
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Shem, amazing work on the Gith . Really looking forward to adding them to my DS mod.
#111
Posté 17 décembre 2013 - 05:34
PLUSH HYENA of DOOM
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Just recalled that the "Starbright" series of Modules I started with the ABC, (which I'm still reworking and extending), contain just a tiny bit more CC now than the ABC released versions... Amongst said CC are a number of versions I made of the Ghurra, (a large species of aggressive ground sloth which turns up in "Demoness Tales" from time to time). These include pack versions carrying crates and also war steeds like these...
This is more or less the same sort of thing I was thinking of doing with the Mekillot, riders on seats bolted to the bony carapace, though not necessarily with the war banners and so on. Would this be completely at odds with Dark Sun mythology or not?
I ask mainly because the Mk II Drik has taken a massive nosedive into the territory of "rubbish" and gone spectacularly wrong. Again. I can see where it's going wrong, and why, but I just haven't got the time at the moment to deal it a crippling blow with a supremely gargantuan brick. So, with the Drik currently out of order, I'm back to poking the Mekillot around (also trying a Sand Crawler) but wondered if mounted Mekillot might be "acceptable" on Athas?
This is more or less the same sort of thing I was thinking of doing with the Mekillot, riders on seats bolted to the bony carapace, though not necessarily with the war banners and so on. Would this be completely at odds with Dark Sun mythology or not?
I ask mainly because the Mk II Drik has taken a massive nosedive into the territory of "rubbish" and gone spectacularly wrong. Again. I can see where it's going wrong, and why, but I just haven't got the time at the moment to deal it a crippling blow with a supremely gargantuan brick. So, with the Drik currently out of order, I'm back to poking the Mekillot around (also trying a Sand Crawler) but wondered if mounted Mekillot might be "acceptable" on Athas?
Modifié par PLUSH HYENA of DOOM, 17 décembre 2013 - 05:45 .
#112
Posté 17 décembre 2013 - 11:56
Draygoth28
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Maybe make a Mekillot loaded down with packs and a rider. Just a suggestion...that Mekillot looks sweet. I am a huge fan of this version.
#113
Posté 17 décembre 2013 - 02:21
Shemsu-Heru
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Very Nice PHOD.
While It's true that Mellikots are regularly used with wagons. I think that is not impossible that some one, just mount one, especially if the Melllikot is going to be use as a war-beast instead of a merchant transport. So if you want to make that version, please do it, also, I love the way that your guard is riding-sitting in your Churra, and the war banners.
While It's true that Mellikots are regularly used with wagons. I think that is not impossible that some one, just mount one, especially if the Melllikot is going to be use as a war-beast instead of a merchant transport. So if you want to make that version, please do it, also, I love the way that your guard is riding-sitting in your Churra, and the war banners.
#114
Posté 17 décembre 2013 - 02:21
Shemsu-Heru
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Athasian Gith; This carnivorous humanoids usually are nothing better than desert raiders.
I have finished with the animations. After all the Gith have needed, a new full set of supermodels. I just have taken the standard humanoid supermodels, and changed the position of some body-parts. The result is not always perfect, because I know almost nothing, about creating new animations, however it's working quite well.
PS - Just in case someone is wondering; This creature is not related with Githyankis or Githzerais....
I have finished with the animations. After all the Gith have needed, a new full set of supermodels. I just have taken the standard humanoid supermodels, and changed the position of some body-parts. The result is not always perfect, because I know almost nothing, about creating new animations, however it's working quite well.
PS - Just in case someone is wondering; This creature is not related with Githyankis or Githzerais....
Modifié par Shemsu-Heru, 17 décembre 2013 - 02:29 .
#115
Posté 17 décembre 2013 - 02:44
Estelindis
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Wow. This is shaping up to be an incredible month. The gith look great!
#116
Posté 17 décembre 2013 - 02:45
Mecheon
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They are related. Just they ended up on Athas somehow and devolved into their present form
Good stuff all the same
Good stuff all the same
#117
Posté 17 décembre 2013 - 06:31
Ssythilac
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The gith looks like a truly masterpiece Shem! 
Outstanding work!
Outstanding work!
#118
Posté 18 décembre 2013 - 12:35
Shemsu-Heru
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Mecheon wrote...
They are related. Just they ended up on Athas somehow and devolved into their present form
Good stuff all the same
Sure? I never have heard that they could be realated; Also the Limbo and the Astral plane, when githyankis and githzerais, have their homes, are inacessible in the Dark Sun cosmology...
#119
Posté 18 décembre 2013 - 02:56
Mecheon
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Its vaguely implied in some 2E work, but the 4E book out and out says they're descended from GithyankiShemsu-Heru wrote...
Mecheon wrote...
They are related. Just they ended up on Athas somehow and devolved into their present form
Good stuff all the same
Sure? I never have heard that they could be realated; Also the Limbo and the Astral plane, when githyankis and githzerais, have their homes, are inacessible in the Dark Sun cosmology...
Athas is sort of a one way street. Its actually possible to access it from the outside, its just impossible to actually escape from it back to the rest of the D&D cosmology
#120
Posté 18 décembre 2013 - 05:53
PLUSH HYENA of DOOM
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Here's a proper look at the basic Mekillot, though I still want to hit the textures with a moderately proportioned brick a bit. At least the beak doesn't look quite so much like the prow of the Titanic any more... You're guaranteed to get this in the PHoD Dark Sun Animals pack.
However, Velociraptor grappling is now taking up a considerable amount of time...
Also, PLUSH HYENA of DOOM has now realized that with a spectacular lack of foresight, instead of going for some rather dull looking flat bands of bony armour over the Mekillot's back, he instead went for the much more interesting look of layered, chitinous shield plates which are much more aesthetically interesting... and will be damned difficult to balance saddles, seats, riders, banners, crates, sacks or any other damn thing on top of...
Ho hum.
PS:- Shem, looks like your work on the Gith's animations was well worth the effort. Excellent.
However, Velociraptor grappling is now taking up a considerable amount of time...
Also, PLUSH HYENA of DOOM has now realized that with a spectacular lack of foresight, instead of going for some rather dull looking flat bands of bony armour over the Mekillot's back, he instead went for the much more interesting look of layered, chitinous shield plates which are much more aesthetically interesting... and will be damned difficult to balance saddles, seats, riders, banners, crates, sacks or any other damn thing on top of...
Ho hum.
PS:- Shem, looks like your work on the Gith's animations was well worth the effort. Excellent.
Modifié par PLUSH HYENA of DOOM, 18 décembre 2013 - 06:03 .
#121
Posté 18 décembre 2013 - 12:25
Draygoth28
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Now that's a Mekillot...very cool
#122
Posté 18 décembre 2013 - 01:05
Rolo Kipp
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<reading...>
@ PHoD: Carve out a niche and bolt them on... the damned beast wont feel a thing :-)
But definitely keep that look!
<...frankenstein's lab-notes>
@ PHoD: Carve out a niche and bolt them on... the damned beast wont feel a thing :-)
But definitely keep that look!
<...frankenstein's lab-notes>
#123
Posté 18 décembre 2013 - 03:17
Shemsu-Heru
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This obsidian spear is the typical weapon of the giths; It's seems that this weapon, not only is able to cause piercing damage also slashing damage....
Modifié par Shemsu-Heru, 18 décembre 2013 - 03:18 .
#124
Posté 18 décembre 2013 - 05:47
Draygoth28
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You are very talented my friend. Keep up the good work.
#125
Posté 18 décembre 2013 - 06:06
PLUSH HYENA of DOOM
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Rolo, if you're so darn sure the forty foot behemoth won't feel anything, YOU go trying to carve lumps out of it when its back's turned...
OK, I'm starting on the War Mekillot, somewhat similar to the Ghurra Cavalry Steeds above... It will have banners... This is YOUR chance to VOTE on a PHoD Animal! (How very unthrilling).
Is there any particular Athasian insignia, emblem, etc, that I should put on the banners? If nobody has any great preference and I fail to find any suitable Dark Sun banner reference, I'll just do some sort of generic, fantasy war banner kind've thing... and resist at all costs the urge to draw Comedy Hyenas on them!
OK, I'm starting on the War Mekillot, somewhat similar to the Ghurra Cavalry Steeds above... It will have banners... This is YOUR chance to VOTE on a PHoD Animal! (How very unthrilling).
Is there any particular Athasian insignia, emblem, etc, that I should put on the banners? If nobody has any great preference and I fail to find any suitable Dark Sun banner reference, I'll just do some sort of generic, fantasy war banner kind've thing... and resist at all costs the urge to draw Comedy Hyenas on them!
Modifié par PLUSH HYENA of DOOM, 18 décembre 2013 - 06:07 .
