876 réponses à ce sujet

[Armass81]

Vicious wrote...

Back when ME2 came out a LOT of people called out the idea that the Illusive man was just 'putting on a front' with the Normandy SR2, hiding his organization's true colors, and that he filled it with a bunch of familiar or friendly faces.

Hell there is banter that the crewmembers don't really know much about Cerberus and just joined to save the colonies. This pops back up again in ME3 where they finally come out and say it, but it was absolutely referenced prior.

Bioware never changed Cerberus: they were always bad guys. If you missed the referencing dialogue shame on you.

I guess some people got too into TIMs charm. Usually people with not the greatest intentions for all can be very charmful and deceitful, if it serves their own ends. Some politicians are masters at it. Acting unlike what they really are at heart. And people keep falling for it.

In a way TIM is a lot like that kind of politician, road to his hell was paved with good intentions.

Modifié par Armass81, 06 décembre 2013 - 10:19 .

[AlanC9]

dreamgazer wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

It wasn't in "very poor taste" (lol), and the audience there even picked up on his joking tone.

yeah I saw the video...joking my butt

Hey, that interpretation's on you, buddy. 

How about someone linking the video so we can all interpret it for ourselves?

[AlanC9]

crimzontearz wrote...

Ahahaha please. ME forums have always been toxic.

not even remotely like this but nice try. There were complaints but not THIS

Shoulda been here after NWN1 was released. The only real difference is that the ME3 haters hung around forever, while the NWN haters stalked off to other forums. (I'd say RPGCodex, but AFAIK those guys have always hated Bio, except maybe for BG1.)

[crimzontearz]

I was transitioning (or had already transitioned) entirely to consoles at that time, I came back to the forums for ME1 (yeah Jade Empire I never got into that, the setting turned me off)

[Farangbaa]

AlanC9 wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

Ahahaha please. ME forums have always been toxic.

not even remotely like this but nice try. There were complaints but not THIS

Shoulda been here after NWN1 was released. The only real difference is that the ME3 haters hung around forever, while the NWN haters stalked off to other forums. (I'd say RPGCodex, but AFAIK those guys have always hated Bio, except maybe for BG1.)

I never really understood why one would linger on the forums of a game they hate. But it happens a lot. In some MMO's people linger around the forums for months breaking down the game at every oppertunity they get.

But this, this is a really special place. Because... how long ago was ME3 released? 

Modifié par Psychevore, 06 décembre 2013 - 03:52 .

[crimzontearz]

How about someone linking the video so we can all interpret it for ourselves?

It was posted here back then, no idea where to find it now

[crimzontearz]

I never really understood why one would linger on the forums of a game the hate. But it happens a lot. In some MMO's people linger around the forums for months breaking down the game at every oppertunity they get.

But this, this is a really special place. Because... how long ago was ME3 released?

If you do not care for a game you do not linger (you do not see me lingering on, say, the oblivion boards)...but those who do linger for a long LOOOONG while even tho a game in the serie might have disappointed them

[Iakus]

AlanC9 wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

It wasn't in "very poor taste" (lol), and the audience there even picked up on his joking tone.

yeah I saw the video...joking my butt

Hey, that interpretation's on you, buddy. 

How about someone linking the video so we can all interpret it for ourselves?

Mass Effect: Past, Present, Future

[dreamgazer]

iakus wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

It wasn't in "very poor taste" (lol), and the audience there even picked up on his joking tone.

yeah I saw the video...joking my butt

Hey, that interpretation's on you, buddy. 

How about someone linking the video so we can all interpret it for ourselves?

Mass Effect: Past, Present, Future

Thanks.

Speaks for itself, really.  Don't know what to tell you if you take that "seriously". 

[Iakus]

[quote]dreamgazer wrote...

Mass Effect: Past, Present, Future

[/quote]

Thanks.

Speaks for itself, really.  Don't know what to tell you if you take that "seriously". 
[/quote]

The mere fact that the scene is ambiguous enough that this interpretaton can be taken seruiously by so many only highlights how badly the endings were screed up.  Extended cut was specifically made to add "clarity and closure".  Obviously the breath scene was not enough of either.

[dreamgazer]

iakus wrote...

The mere fact that the scene is ambiguous enough that this interpretaton can be taken seruiously by so many only highlights how badly the endings were screed up.  Extended cut was specifically made to add "clarity and closure".  Obviously the breath scene was not enough of either.

Most ambiguous endings can be interpreted negatively if the audience member wills it, though. 

[Argentoid]

crimzontearz wrote...

Then just let it rest crimzon, don't believe that because someone trolled Shepard's fate it means the actual truth. Hell, even a dev told you Shepard is alive, not to mention Tully Auckland's statement.

Nevermind that dude who trolled. It''s not canon.

Not "A" dev but actually one of the leads, Preston.

NOT the point tho...

Man... You're quite a douche.

[CronoDragoon]

iakus wrote...

The mere fact that the scene is ambiguous enough that this interpretaton can be taken seruiously by so many only highlights how badly the endings were screed up.  Extended cut was specifically made to add "clarity and closure".  Obviously the breath scene was not enough of either.

A lot of things highlight how badly the endings were botched, but this particular case also highlights how many forum goers read a transcript or biased paraphrases on a forum without bothering to look into it themselves.

[ruggly]

I haven't figured out how I feel about the possible dark energy ending. It's still pretty bad, but I feel like I could laugh at it more, and then just destroy all of the reapers anyways.

[Iakus]

dreamgazer wrote...

Most ambiguous endings can be interpreted negatively if the audience member wills it, though. 

Doesn't help when that kind of ending is encouraged, whether or not it was in jest.


At any rate, they shouldn't make ambiguous endings in a DLC designed to provide "clairty and closure", particularly when the audience is already hostile towards the endings.  It's just plain common sense

ChronoDragon wrote...

A lot of things highlight how badly the endings were botched, but this particular case also highlights how many forum goers read a transcript or biased paraphrases on a forum without bothering to look into it themselves.

I think it's pretty obvious that I at least looked into it myself.  And I have made no secret that the scene (as well as many other aspects) sucked.  It's far too ambiguous especially compared to Shepard's obvious death in every other outcome.  So where does that leave me?

Modifié par iakus, 06 décembre 2013 - 05:35 .

[CronoDragoon]

iakus wrote...
I think it's pretty obvious that I at least looked into it myself.  And I have made no secret that the scene (as well as many other aspects) sucked.  It's far too ambiguous especially compared to Shepard's obvious death in every other outcome.  So where does that leave me?

As someone who wanted a reunion scene, was bitter he didn't get one, and used the above quote as ammunition for why the breath scene is unsatisfactory. Note that I'm not trying to diss you or anything; I think that's a pretty neutral analysis that we can agree on.

For the record I also wanted a reunion scene and did not know the context of that quote at first. Since it seems obvious by now from multiple members of BW that the breath scene ain't supposed to be that ambiguous, it seems like a waste not to just include a short "finding Shepard" scene in the EC and get rid of the breath scene.

Modifié par CronoDragoon, 06 décembre 2013 - 05:40 .

[AlanC9]

CronoDragoon wrote...
Since it seems obvious by now from multiple members of BW that the breath scene ain't supposed to be that ambiguous, it seems like a waste not to just include a short "finding Shepard" scene in the EC and get rid of the breath scene.

Was the ambiguity obvious pre-EC? Before the EC most of the chatter was about how terrible it was that Shepard only lived if you played MP. The position that he didn't live no matter what looked like a crank position. Of course, some of the folks pushing that idea were cranks.

[LinksOcarina]

iakus wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

Most ambiguous endings can be interpreted negatively if the audience member wills it, though. 

Doesn't help when that kind of ending is encouraged, whether or not it was in jest.


At any rate, they shouldn't make ambiguous endings in a DLC designed to provide "clairty and closure", particularly when the audience is already hostile towards the endings.  It's just plain common sense

Says who? 

The clarity and closure aspect did just that, considering it showed off what the heck happened and gave the entire story closure outside of pure ambiguity. The EC made things less ambiguous for everyone, you keep focusing on one aspect intentionally left ambiguos by design. 

That was never going to be changed, nor should it be either at this point because it diminishes what was changed.

If anything, the breath scene should have been removed if it caused so much trouble, but too late for that now. 

Modifié par LinksOcarina, 06 décembre 2013 - 06:21 .

[Argentoid]

Here's something I noticed...

Wasn't the whole "TIM looking at a dying sun" also a foreshadow of the Dark Energy problema? I mean, maybe he was also studying the whole deal, and his findings would be somewhat revealed in ME3.

[JamesFaith]

Argentoid wrote...

Here's something I noticed...

Wasn't the whole "TIM looking at a dying sun" also a foreshadow of the Dark Energy problema? I mean, maybe he was also studying the whole deal, and his findings would be somewhat revealed in ME3.

Nope, it was mentioned in book (Retribution?) that he like monumental sceneries in background to look more important. 

[CronoDragoon]

AlanC9 wrote...
Was the ambiguity obvious pre-EC? Before the EC most of the chatter was about how terrible it was that Shepard only lived if you played MP. The position that he didn't live no matter what looked like a crank position. Of course, some of the folks pushing that idea were cranks.

No, I didn't think it was ambiguous at all. Neither did anyone I spoke to outside of this forum about the ending. The freaking movie file is called "Shepardalive" or something. Chris Priestly didn't help things though when he posted on the forums that they made it "ambiguous" on purpose because some Shepards like sacrificing their character and thought it was a fitting ending. I think that's when this whole thing took off.

[Argentoid]

JamesFaith wrote...

Argentoid wrote...

Here's something I noticed...

Wasn't the whole "TIM looking at a dying sun" also a foreshadow of the Dark Energy problema? I mean, maybe he was also studying the whole deal, and his findings would be somewhat revealed in ME3.

Nope, it was mentioned in book (Retribution?) that he like monumental sceneries in background to look more important. 

I know that. In Retribution it is stated that TIM likes to feel he is in control of it and yadda yadda yadda, but it still smells like a foreshadow. He could have chosen a big planet for all I know.

Modifié par Argentoid, 06 décembre 2013 - 07:43 .

[Iakus]

LinksOcarina wrote...

Says who? 

Says Iakus.  Try to keep up here

The clarity and closure aspect did just that, considering it showed off what the heck happened and gave the entire story closure outside of pure ambiguity. The EC made things less ambiguous for everyone, you keep focusing on one aspect intentionally left ambiguos by design. 

And thus EC failed to provide clarity or closure for an aspect that is obviously important to a large section of the fanbase.

Maybe not to you.  But just because you're happy doesn't mean everyone has to be.

That was never going to be changed, nor should it be either at this point because it diminishes what was changed.

Says who?  You?

If anything, the breath scene should have been removed if it caused so much trouble, but too late for that now.

And replaced with a rescue, or somethng that clearly showed Shepard surviving?  Agree 100%

Modifié par iakus, 06 décembre 2013 - 10:37 .

[Iakus]

CronoDragoon wrote...

As someone who wanted a reunion scene, was bitter he didn't get one, and used the above quote as ammunition for why the breath scene is unsatisfactory. Note that I'm not trying to diss you or anything; I think that's a pretty neutral analysis that we can agree on.

I have other problems with the ending, which, if they had been addressed would hav emade me...not happy, but at least content...with the breath scene.

But the tacked on breath scene in addition to what came before did feel like one final "Screw you!" from Bioware, yeah.

For the record I also wanted a reunion scene and did not know the context of that quote at first. Since it seems obvious by now from multiple members of BW that the breath scene ain't supposed to be that ambiguous, it seems like a waste not to just include a short "finding Shepard" scene in the EC and get rid of the breath scene.

If it wasn't supposed to be ambiguous, they shouldn't have made it ambiguous, and call it ambiguous at panels, etc.  Especially with EC.  They should have removed it entirely and replaced it, like tehy did with the relay scenes.