1858 réponses à ce sujet

[Ryzaki]

Br3ad wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Br3ad wrote...
That doesn't mean he practiced it more than once, is what I am saying. 

But he knows bloodmagic thus bloodmage. (Not to mention he would've at least had to use it four times for the seals. I highly doubt they were all done at the exact same moment).

These assumptions aside, how does this go back to your point of him teaching his kids that what an abomination is like?

And I've already responded to the whole, "He's a blood mage thing." Knowing something doesn't making you something. Branding someone for life for one action seems wrong to me. 

To protect themselves.

Why would any father if he knew a way without involving bloodmagic not teach his kids how to detect abominations. That can only help them. Especially since most abominations want to make more of themselves.

*shrugs* He's a bloodmage to me even if he stopped using it after that time. There's nothing wrong with being a bloodmage. It's just being a stupid one that's the problem.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 10 décembre 2013 - 09:20 .

[Ryzaki]

Br3ad wrote...
And I've already responded to the whole, "He's a blood mage thing." Knowing something doesn't making you something. I'm sure most of us here know how to kill someone. Are we all killers?

Also, branding someone for life for one action seems wrong to me. 

Have you actually done it? Then yes you are a killer for life. Nothing will change that.

[Ryzaki]

TheKomandorShepard wrote..

Yep yep arguments run out hmm?

As far nothing i pointed isn't lie malcom was forced to preform blood magic rituals by grey wardens who take leandra..
And even anders said if that was demon he would defend himself...

No got tired of you ignoring arguements and turning them into something completely different. It's recognizing a pointless arguement when I see one.

[Br3admax]

Ryzaki wrote...

Br3ad wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Br3ad wrote...
That doesn't mean he practiced it more than once, is what I am saying. 

But he knows bloodmagic thus bloodmage. (Not to mention he would've at least had to use it four times for the seals. I highly doubt they were all done at the exact same moment).

These assumptions aside, how does this go back to your point of him teaching his kids that what an abomination is like?

And I've already responded to the whole, "He's a blood mage thing." Knowing something doesn't making you something. Branding someone for life for one action seems wrong to me. 

To protect themselves.

Why would any father if he knew a way without involving bloodmagic not teach his kids how to detect abominations. That can only help them. Especially since most abominations want to make more of themselves.

Your implication was that his bloodmagic helped him identify demons. Or at least that is how I read it.

*shrugs* He's a bloodmage to me even if he stopped using it after that time. There's nothing wrong with being a bloodmage. It's just being a stupid one that's the problem.

I don't see how you are something you aren't anymore, but it's irrelevant to this conversation I guees. We have no knowledge on how knowledgeable he was on the subject to use that as to how he knows how to identify demons or abominations, which Hawke clearly couldn't do during the questline in question. 

[Br3admax]

Ryzaki wrote...

Br3ad wrote...
And I've already responded to the whole, "He's a blood mage thing." Knowing something doesn't making you something. I'm sure most of us here know how to kill someone. Are we all killers?

Also, branding someone for life for one action seems wrong to me. 

Have you actually done it? Then yes you are a killer for life. Nothing will change that.

I'm pretty sure your quote said he was knowlegeable on the subject and that was why.

As to the other things, semantics. We can debate that for days. 

[Ryzaki]

Br3ad wrote...
Your implication was that his bloodmagic helped him identify demons. Or at least that is how I read it.

Uh...no? 

My implication was experienced bloodmage/being an abomination was what allowed Anders/merrill to sense abominations and if Malcolm had been able to do such outside of bloodmagic he would've taught his kids that thus they would've been able to sense if Keran was one during that quest.

I don't see how you are something you aren't anymore, but it's irrelevant to this conversation I guees. We have no knowledge on how knowledgeable he was on the subject to use that as to how he knows how to identify demons or abominations, which Hawke clearly couldn't do during the questline in question.

Fair enough.

Malcolm probably didn't practice enough bloodmagic or with close enough relationships to be able to sense abominations using bloodmagic and with normal magic sensing abominations is probably either extremely difficult if not impossible. (that said there's absolutely nothing suggesting this is a normal mage skill and indeed plenty of arguement in both DAO and DA2 to the contrary).

Modifié par Ryzaki, 10 décembre 2013 - 09:23 .

[Ryzaki]

Br3ad wrote...
I'm pretty sure your quote said he was knowlegeable on the subject and that was why.

As to the other things, semantics. We can debate that for days. 

No I said he could use bloodmagic and knew how to use it thus he was a bloodmage =/= knowing everything about it. Merrill is no doubt a more experienced bloodmage simply from time and practice alone.

Jowan for instance I have severe doubts could tell an abomination from a toadstool. Doesn't make him any less of a bloodmage.

Plus my whole arguement was if he could identify an abomination outside of bloodmagic there was no reason he wouldn't teach this to Bethany/Hawke.  And all three of them are said to be exceptional mages. So I'm supposed to believe detecting abominations is a normal mage skill but three exceptional mages can't seem to do it? (Make that four, five if you include the Warden and Irving).

How is this not the case? Did you ignore the outside of bloodmagic or something? Did I write it in invisible ink? 

*shrugs*

Modifié par Ryzaki, 10 décembre 2013 - 09:29 .

[TheKomandorShepard]

Ryzaki wrote...

TheKomandorShepard wrote..

Yep yep arguments run out hmm?

As far nothing i pointed isn't lie malcom was forced to preform blood magic rituals by grey wardens who take leandra..
And even anders said if that was demon he would defend himself...

No got tired of you ignoring arguements and turning them into something completely different. It's recognizing a pointless arguement when I see one.

ignoring no you said that malcolm should know how detect demon and teach that his childrens because he was blood mage and i pointed that his childrends didn't know that he was blood mage and he couldn't have big knowledge because he was forced to blood magic.So as far i didn't ignore your arguments even if you make up thing... 

[Silfren]

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

Br3ad wrote...

Malcolm was not a blood mage, he used blood magic once to my knowledge, so he could get his family out of Kirkwall. He definitely made sure to teach his children not to use it.

Using it once is enough to make you a Blood Mage.

I don't buy that.  I don't think someone who uses blood magic under duress exactly once should be deemed a blood mage now and forever more.  It's stupid.  The whole point of the term is to denote someone who uses it willingly and often--someone who sees no problem with the practice, essentially.  In no way does that, or should that, describe a person who used it once, against their will, twenty-five years ago and never again.

[Silfren]

Br3ad wrote...

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

Br3ad wrote...

Malcolm was not a blood mage, he used blood magic once to my knowledge, so he could get his family out of Kirkwall. He definitely made sure to teach his children not to use it.

Using it once is enough to make you a Blood Mage.

No it isn't. How are you something that you don't actively practice? I used to play the violin. I have not in several years. I am not a violinist. I'm a retired mediocre strings player at best. Saying that he used to be a blood mage, ignoring the fact that he is dead, or that he once practiced it is more accurate. 

This.  I played baseball exactly once.  I'm not a baseball player.  I took piano for five years, ending over twenty years ago and never touching one since.  Not a pianist.  Worked on and successfully fixed my broken toilet a week ago.  Doesn't make me a plummer.  And so on and so forth.

[ScarMK]

Silfren wrote...

This.  I played baseball exactly once.  I'm not a baseball player.  I took piano for five years, ending over twenty years ago and never touching one since.  Not a pianist.  Worked on and successfully fixed my broken toilet a week ago.  Doesn't make me a plummer.  And so on and so forth.

This oddly reminds of the "Deb of Night" radio chat.

[Ryzaki]

TheKomandorShepard wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

TheKomandorShepard wrote..

Yep yep arguments run out hmm?

As far nothing i pointed isn't lie malcom was forced to preform blood magic rituals by grey wardens who take leandra..
And even anders said if that was demon he would defend himself...

No got tired of you ignoring arguements and turning them into something completely different. It's recognizing a pointless arguement when I see one.

ignoring no you said that malcolm should know how detect demon and teach that his childrens because he was blood mage and i pointed that his childrends didn't know that he was blood mage and he couldn't have big knowledge because he was forced to blood magic.So as far i didn't ignore your arguments even if you make up thing... 

Malcolm Hawke who was a bloodmage? He wouldn't tell his children how to
identify abominations without using bloodmagic? I'm supposed to believe
this?

And you completely ignoring ANDERS CLEARLY ATTACKED this wasn't some threat or crap it was an attack.

My fault is the lack of if he could after the using bloodmagic. (I assumed it would be understood if there was some way to detect abominations without bloodmagic this is something that would be taught) So yeah make up what exactly?

Modifié par Ryzaki, 10 décembre 2013 - 09:41 .

[TheKomandorShepard]

Ryzaki wrote...

TheKomandorShepard wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

TheKomandorShepard wrote..

Yep yep arguments run out hmm?

As far nothing i pointed isn't lie malcom was forced to preform blood magic rituals by grey wardens who take leandra..
And even anders said if that was demon he would defend himself...

No got tired of you ignoring arguements and turning them into something completely different. It's recognizing a pointless arguement when I see one.

ignoring no you said that malcolm should know how detect demon and teach that his childrens because he was blood mage and i pointed that his childrends didn't know that he was blood mage and he couldn't have big knowledge because he was forced to blood magic.So as far i didn't ignore your arguments even if you make up thing... 

Malcolm Hawke who was a bloodmage? He wouldn't tell his children how to
identify abominations without using bloodmagic? I'm supposed to believe
this?

And you completely ignoring ANDERS CLEARLY ATTACKED this wasn't some threat or crap it was an attack.

My fault is the lack of if he could after the using bloodmagic. (I assumed it would be understood if there was some way to detect abominations without bloodmagic this is something that would be taught) So yeah make up what exactly?

Well you are ignoring that i called that attack in my first or second comment...

Well i said that is knowledge anders may knew this malcolm not that same for wynne who also had spirit but couldn't do that what anders... 

You make up that anders attack affected only on demon or spirit when cleary there is nowhere stated that it did only effect was that spell pushed templar so his attack might be directed to provoke demon as we know that they are hostile when in human body.  

[Ryzaki]

"It had effect it pushed him like it could be provocation and abomnation after that would attack abomnations are very hostile at least when they possesed mage and well if anders could do that because of spirit why wynne couldn't do that... it was more knowledge "

Really? So you want to argue semantics about whether a push is not an attack? Really?

Also why would a demon need to defend itself from a light push? And why would that provoke it into getting itself killed? They're not stupid you know. And actually Keran groans and goes "what was that about" so it might've caused him some pain so probably not just a push.

I thought he flinched because of the light but seeing the youtube vid nope looks like Anders actually hit him. LOL.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 10 décembre 2013 - 09:59 .

[TheKomandorShepard]

Ryzaki wrote...

"It had effect it pushed him like it could be provocation and abomnation after that would attack abomnations are very hostile at least when they possesed mage and well if anders could do that because of spirit why wynne couldn't do that... it was more knowledge "

Really? So you want to argue semantics about whether a push is not an attack? Really?

Also why would a demon need to defend itself from a light push? 

Wha what do you even talking about hi attacked templar but in non harming way to provoke demon to defend themselves.

And why demon would start just killing everyone after possess someone? 
As far most demons simple after becoming abomnation attack everything execpt maybe other demons and well even then they are known from killing each other simple after having alive human body demon become psycho uldred and connor and other cases. 

and push can't cause pain?

Well to push someone you need hit him...

Modifié par TheKomandorShepard, 10 décembre 2013 - 10:02 .

[Cainhurst Crow]

We need a bane mage.

[Ryzaki]

I edited because I actually watched a video. Keran yelps and goes "what was that for?" might've caused some pain.

Cause then you don't get enemies to kill. Uldred made more abominations he didn't just kill people. Conner though did just kill pretty much everything that wasn't his immediate family though yes.

Push can cause pain but it's usually as a result from hitting something else.

[Hellion Rex]

Darth Brotarian wrote...

We need a bane mage.

A what?

[EmperorSahlertz]

Silfren wrote...

Br3ad wrote...

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

Br3ad wrote...

Malcolm was not a blood mage, he used blood magic once to my knowledge, so he could get his family out of Kirkwall. He definitely made sure to teach his children not to use it.

Using it once is enough to make you a Blood Mage.

No it isn't. How are you something that you don't actively practice? I used to play the violin. I have not in several years. I am not a violinist. I'm a retired mediocre strings player at best. Saying that he used to be a blood mage, ignoring the fact that he is dead, or that he once practiced it is more accurate. 

This.  I played baseball exactly once.  I'm not a baseball player.  I took piano for five years, ending over twenty years ago and never touching one since.  Not a pianist.  Worked on and successfully fixed my broken toilet a week ago.  Doesn't make me a plummer.  And so on and so forth.

A story:
"Here is Heinrich. Look at all these trees. Heinrich planted those, but does anyone call him "Heinrich tree-planter?" No, no one does. Look at all these houses. Heinrich built all those. But does anyone call him "Heinrich housemaker"? No, no one does.
But once, only once, did Heinrich **** a goat......."

(not meant to insult you, but to illustrate a point)

If you do something, even if it is only once, and this action is of enough questionable character, it is going to stick to you. It is a social convention.

[Cainhurst Crow]

eluvianix wrote...

Darth Brotarian wrote...

We need a bane mage.

A what?

TAKE BACK YOUR CIRCLE KIRKWALL

[Hellion Rex]

EmperorSahlertz wrote...
If you do something, even if it is only once, and this action is of enough questionable character, it is going to stick to you. It is a social convention.

In that sense, then it comes down to what one personally believes to be "questionable", as evidenced by people's differing opinions on whether or not Malcolm Hawke is a "blood mage."

[TheKomandorShepard]

Ryzaki wrote...

I edited because I actually watched a video. Keran yelps and goes "what was that for?" might've caused some pain.

Cause then you don't get enemies to kill. Uldred made more abominations he didn't just kill people. Conner though did just kill pretty much everything that wasn't his immediate family though yes.

Push can cause pain but it's usually as a result from hitting something else.

Well he killed pretty much most of the tower and yep he was also creating abomnations but he was soo messy that trick on his side wouldn't be possible pretty much everything says that he is mad both demons in uldred and connor case didn't know how world function spreding outright destruction. 

Anders attacked him with spell only visible effect was that whats i said so it might be as i said attempt to provoke demon (if that was abomnation) to attack him well was he idiot well thats up to you but he said after spell that if that was demon he would attack.

[Hellion Rex]

Darth Brotarian wrote...

eluvianix wrote...

Darth Brotarian wrote...

We need a bane mage.

A what?

TAKE BACK YOUR CIRCLE KIRKWALL

[EmperorSahlertz]

eluvianix wrote...

EmperorSahlertz wrote...
If you do something, even if it is only once, and this action is of enough questionable character, it is going to stick to you. It is a social convention.

In that sense, then it comes down to what one personally believes to be "questionable", as evidenced by people's differing opinions on whether or not Malcolm Hawke is a "blood mage."

It doesn't matter what we think, it matters what Thedas thinks.

Modifié par EmperorSahlertz, 10 décembre 2013 - 10:14 .

[Hellion Rex]

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

eluvianix wrote...

EmperorSahlertz wrote...
If you do something, even if it is only once, and this action is of enough questionable character, it is going to stick to you. It is a social convention.

In that sense, then it comes down to what one personally believes to be "questionable", as evidenced by people's differing opinions on whether or not Malcolm Hawke is a "blood mage."

It doesn't matter what we think, it matters what Theda thinks.

And yet, we are the ones having the debate, my friend.
But again, I guarantee there are those in Thedas who would have different opinions, just as we do.

Modifié par eluvianix, 10 décembre 2013 - 10:15 .