677 réponses à ce sujet

[Cainhurst Crow]

Lebdood wrote...

The Mad Hanar wrote...

I still don't see how including someone of a certain race or sexual preference or orientation in a video game empowers any group. Not everyone plays video games. I'm hispanic, but you don't see me asking for hispanic characters to be in Dragon Age because I feel left out. : /

Apples to Oranges.

Nationalities and ethnic groups are irrelevant on Thedas. There is no such thing as "hispanic" on Thedas. 

On the other hand, you already some semblance of LGBT representation, since sexual orientation is not exclusive to real world demographics.

This is fair game.

I disagree. The free marches hate fereldans, orliasians and fereldans hate eachothers guts, everyone hates the qunari and tevinter imperium, the imperium hates orlesians, orlisians hate tevinterians, and everyone and their mother thinks antivans and rivians are a bunch of pirate weirdos.

Nationality and nationalism both are still huge factors in every day life in thedas.

[Lebanese Dude]

The Mad Hanar wrote...
Still. I can call up my transgender friends right now and ask them if they care about being represented in video games. Being respected in real life matters much more to them. I'm addressing this need that I've noticed on the BSN for people of all different types to be included in the game, and I just want to know why. It helps no one. It serves no purpose except for the people who asked for it to give each other high fives for being so open-minded and it give Bioware an opportunity to pat themselves on the back for being progressive. It doesn't legalize gay marriage. It doesn't stop disciminiation. It literally does nothing of value.

However, if Bioware did want to add a minority character of whatever type, then I'd be okay with it. I trust them enough to not focus too much on one aspect of a character.

Ander's mage obession notwithstanding.

But...this is a video game forum is it not? The topic of whether we should bother because the real world is more important is irrelevant...

All that matters is the video game, namely Dragon Age Inquisition. Your friends may not want transgender representation, but some players do. Why should they not be free to go ahead and ask their questions? Why must they be called out on it?

---

And yes BioWare should not make it a focus of the character unless it's very relevant to the story.

Modifié par Lebdood, 06 décembre 2013 - 12:21 .

[Lebanese Dude]

Darth Brotarian wrote...

Lebdood wrote...

The Mad Hanar wrote...

I still don't see how including someone of a certain race or sexual preference or orientation in a video game empowers any group. Not everyone plays video games. I'm hispanic, but you don't see me asking for hispanic characters to be in Dragon Age because I feel left out. : /

Apples to Oranges.

Nationalities and ethnic groups are irrelevant on Thedas. There is no such thing as "hispanic" on Thedas. 

On the other hand, you already some semblance of LGBT representation, since sexual orientation is not exclusive to real world demographics.

This is fair game.

I disagree. The free marches hate fereldans, orliasians and fereldans hate eachothers guts, everyone hates the qunari and tevinter imperium, the imperium hates orlesians, orlisians hate tevinterians, and everyone and their mother thinks antivans and rivians are a bunch of pirate weirdos.

Nationality and nationalism both are still huge factors in every day life in thedas.

I meant the ones on Earth, hence using "hispanic" as an example. I should have been clearer. Edited.

Modifié par Lebdood, 06 décembre 2013 - 12:20 .

[sandalisthemaker]

How dare you people ask for this?

[sandalisthemaker]

There must be a reason for it.
One that I deem acceptable.
If not, then it is just pandering fanservice ****** MATERIAL smut.
EW.

[MrMrPendragon]

The Mad Hanar wrote...

Lebdood wrote...

The Mad Hanar wrote...

I still don't see how including someone of a certain race or sexual preference or orientation in a video game empowers any group. Not everyone plays video games. I'm hispanic, but you don't see me asking for hispanic characters to be in Dragon Age because I feel left out. : /

Apples to Oranges.

Nationalities and ethnic groups are irrelevant on Thedas. There is no such thing as "hispanic" on Thedas. 

On the other hand, you already some semblance of LGBT representation, since sexual orientation is not exclusive to real world demographics.

This is fair game.

It serves no purpose except for the people who asked for it to give each other high fives for being so open-minded and it give Bioware an opportunity to pat themselves on the back for being progressive. It doesn't legalize gay marriage. It doesn't stop disciminiation. It literally does nothing of value.

Those in bold.

I completely agree with your statement. This transgender NPC isn't a requirement. If anything, it's just a bonus that Bioware may or may not tackle.

If they do that's great.

If they don't that's fine with me too.

[Killdren88]

sandalisthemaker wrote...

Killdren88 wrote...

It is great that Bioware even tackles the subject. But having representation for the sake of it seems to ask too much. Do you want to see transgender men at balls in gowns?

Yes.
You don't? There must be something wrong with you. Clearly.

I honestly don't see the issue. If Bioware has the time and resources for it to happen then by all means but do it in a intelligent way. Don't put them in for the sake of satisfying a group of people. Bioware has enough to work with as it is. Bioware doesn't need to be on a soapbox tackling these issues. That just opens a can of worms and attention that Bioware doesn't need. Just create a game that will be loved by all...ignore the emoticon. It was an accident using a phone.

[addiction21]

Br3ad wrote...

As "spot on" as this was, as in it didn't match what anyone said, you continue to ignore the ones we made. The thing about an arguement is that one must pay attention to both sides, not the one that we agree with. 

No it is absolutely spot on because you don't want to listen or think about what you are saying. You just talk and talk and talk. Repeating "well that's not what I/we are saying at all" but clearly never taking the moment to think about as to why others might be misinterpreting you.

[CynicalShep]

Darth Brotarian wrote...

Lebdood wrote...

Darth Brotarian wrote...

General TSAR wrote...

CynicalShep wrote...
because you are asking for understanding and respect from me while not offering me any.

Preach it brother.

What's even funnier is the other poster is too afraid to even reply to cynical. And if that's the case, I think cynical just nailed them 100% with that one.

Well CynicalShep didn't really lie. Respect is a two-way street.

The problem is, most people on his side don't bother.

True, but we can at least all agree, there are people on both our sides who don't see eye to eye.

You guys have plantiff, we have kommander. And trust me, neither are good alternatives.

This doesn't have to be hard after all. I see we are perfectly capable of having a civil conversation, too.
Btw, the sex/gender semantics argument reminds me of this

[AlexanderCousland]

The only skepticism I have with this is, If they treat the character with the dignity it deserves that means the fact that he/she is transgender would eventually have to be introduced to the player. Of course only if the Writer's deemed it nescessary for us to know. In any case, Let's say he/she was a LI....I certainly wouldn't like the fact that my Crush has extra junk in her panties and I didn't know until she decided to tell me, It's a situation I wouldn't hope for in real life....I think, making my character respond to an issue like that inside a video game....is uncomfortable. I mean that in the least homophobic way possible, because I feel everyone should be able to feel apart of something.

[sandalisthemaker]

Killdren88 wrote...

sandalisthemaker wrote...

Killdren88 wrote...

It is great that Bioware even tackles the subject. But having representation for the sake of it seems to ask too much. Do you want to see transgender men at balls in gowns?

Yes.
You don't? There must be something wrong with you. Clearly.

I honestly don't see the issue. If Bioware has the time and resources for it to happen then by all means but do it in a intelligent way. Don't put them in for the sake of satisfying a group of people. Bioware has enough to work with as it is. Bioware doesn't need to be on a soapbox tackling these issues. That just opens a can of worms and attention that Bioware doesn't need. Just create a game that will be loved by all...ignore the emoticon. It was an accident using a phone.

There is no way to definitively know if they are "doing it" because they want to or because they are "doing it" to satisfy people just by playing the game.
However, they *are* doing it because they want to. The devs have stated as much.

[Cainhurst Crow]

sandalisthemaker wrote...

There must be a reason for it.
One that I deem acceptable.
If not, then it is just pandering fanservice ****** MATERIAL smut.
EW.

You get a gold star.

[Lebanese Dude]

The Mad Hanar wrote...

Lebdood wrote...

But...this is a video game forum is it not? The topic of whether we should bother because the real world is more important is irrelevant...

All that matters is the video game, namely Dragon Age Inquisition. Your friends may not want transgender representation, but some players do. Why should they not be free to go ahead and ask their questions? Why must they be called out on it?

Because people always being up such topics as inclusiveness and privilege in these topics, which are real world issues. They speak as if including minority characters would combat things like privilege when in reality, all that would happen is that a minority character would be in a random video game.

We are speaking of Dragon Age here. It's a roleplaying game, where one aspect of our identities namely our sexual orientation, does translate to the world of Thedas.

I don't ask for Middle Eastern representation because that would be silly since there is no such thing as the Middle East in Thedas. However, there are varying skin tones and multiple sexual orientations ALREADY present in the setting in one form or another since this is a BioWare game.

What people here are discussing is one way to further improve BioWare's already stellar inclusivity record because they want it to be better. Isn't that what all reasonable requests are about?

Modifié par Lebdood, 06 décembre 2013 - 12:48 .

[Br3admax]

Lebdood wrote...

Br3ad wrote...
Okay, again, no one is dog piling anyone for wanting a certain character. All characters should have a reason to be there. We've been saying this for a very long time now.

Again, not everything has to have an explicit reason to exist. It can just exist.

Yes it does. This is a video game, literally everything needs a reason to exist. Straight character and transexual character alike.

That is what we mean. If you didn't get that, now you do. We meant that. We do not hate minorities, a lot of us are minorities. We do in fact get it. We do not hate ourselves or others. Did I cover it all, or did I leave something out? 

Minorities come in all shapes and types, but not all are created equal.

For example, 99.9% of humans won't lynch a guy for being black, but a more than reasonable amount would do the same for a gay man.

Wow, can't tell if joking or not. Seriously. Wow. 

Don't compare minorities to each other, and don't claim to know what they are feeling when you have no idea.

And you guess my sexual orientation too. Genius. Sure, I'm straight. But you didn't know that. You profiled anyone who disagreed as straight. Guess what, some of the people disagreeing with you aren't. Guess which ones.

I'd rather be black than gay in the Middle East.

What does that have to do with this discussion? Or am I too priveleged to understand? 

[Lebanese Dude]

ArcherTactlenecks wrote...
Those in bold.

I completely agree with your statement. This transgender NPC isn't a requirement. If anything, it's just a bonus that Bioware may or may not tackle.

If they do that's great.

If they don't that's fine with me too.

How could you agree with that? Video games are one form of media, and media is one of the biggest factors in raising awareness of any social issues.

It's not like BioWare is going to spearhead LGBT revolutions in Uganda, but it makes a difference and promotes more representation in other games.

---

Granted, I agree with your sentiment that it's not a requirement of mine to buy Dragon Age. It would just make the game better.

[Br3admax]

addiction21 wrote...

Br3ad wrote...

As "spot on" as this was, as in it didn't match what anyone said, you continue to ignore the ones we made. The thing about an arguement is that one must pay attention to both sides, not the one that we agree with. 

No it is absolutely spot on because you don't want to listen or think about what you are saying. You just talk and talk and talk. Repeating "well that's not what I/we are saying at all" but clearly never taking the moment to think about as to why others might be misinterpreting you.

We've already explained what we meant several times. Others clearly don't care what we meant. They still don't. This has nothing to do with our point, and more to do with disagreeing with theirs. 

[Cainhurst Crow]

sandalisthemaker wrote...

Darth Brotarian wrote...

sandalisthemaker wrote...

There must be a reason for it.
One that I deem acceptable.
If not, then it is just pandering fanservice ****** MATERIAL smut.
EW.

You get a gold star.

NEATO.
*TWERKS*

There's just one thing though.

[sandalisthemaker]

Darth Brotarian wrote...

sandalisthemaker wrote...

Darth Brotarian wrote...

sandalisthemaker wrote...

There must be a reason for it.
One that I deem acceptable.
If not, then it is just pandering fanservice ****** MATERIAL smut.
EW.

You get a gold star.

NEATO.
*TWERKS*

There's just one thing though.

WHAT'S THAT, SWEETS?

[The Hierophant]

sandalisthemaker wrote...

The Hierophant wrote...
 classless pandering 

We are well beyond that already.

*Miranda ass shots.*

There's more to Miranda than dat ass. Like say...daddy issues. 

I doubt her character was soley created to appease people who like big booty white girls. :innocent:

Characters who are usually included for appeasement tend to be offensive to all five senses like JJ from Good Times casting in The Guyver film...





I'd prefer it if Bio doesn't sink to new lows but rather that they raise the bar. Mind you Maevaris is cool but lol @ Serendipity.

Modifié par The Hierophant, 06 décembre 2013 - 12:34 .

[MrMrPendragon]

Lebdood wrote...

ArcherTactlenecks wrote...
Those in bold.

I completely agree with your statement. This transgender NPC isn't a requirement. If anything, it's just a bonus that Bioware may or may not tackle.

If they do that's great.

If they don't that's fine with me too.

How could you agree with that? Video games are one form of media, and media is one of the biggest factors in raising awareness of any social issues.

It's not like BioWare is going to spearhead LGBT revolutions in Uganda, but it makes a difference and promotes more representation in other games.

---

Granted, I agree with your sentiment that it's not a requirement of mine to buy Dragon Age. It would just make the game better.

If they wanted "raising awareness" as one of their major goals, then they should just make a separate project for that. A transgender npc is hardly a beacon for awareness.

Do you think people will even remember that one transgender npc when they're shooting fireballs from their hands or saving Rhys and Evangeline from nasty templars?

[Lebanese Dude]

Br3ad wrote...
Yes it does. This is a video game, literally everything needs a reason to exist. Straight character and transexual character alike.

Really? Why does Carver have no beard? Reasons. Same thing applies to sexual orientation.

Wow, can't tell if joking or not. Seriously. Wow. 

This is not the proper place to discuss this, but no I'm not joking. There used to be a test that probed suspected "homos" from behind to see if they were gay. It's illegal to be gay in many countries around the world. Must I elaborate?
Oh. I'm also speaking about the year 2013. Yes this still exists.

And you guess my sexual orientation too. Genius. Sure, I'm straight. But you didn't know that. You profiled anyone who disagreed as straight. Guess what, some of the people disagreeing with you aren't. Guess which ones.

You made it quite clear in your previous posts. You are not new to me on this forum.

What does that have to do with this discussion? Or am I too priveleged to understand? 

It was relevant but probably an unnecessary addition. I do not think you are too privileged to understand so please don't put words in my mouth. I believe you do not have all your facts straight and I'm giving you my piece now.

Modifié par Lebdood, 06 décembre 2013 - 12:39 .

[Lebanese Dude]

ArcherTactlenecks wrote...
Do you think people will even remember that one transgender npc when they're shooting fireballs from their hands or saving Rhys and Evangeline from nasty templars?

The fact that the "Anders / m!Hawke" controversy is still discussed is more than enough to prove my point.

[Mr.House]

Br3ad wrote...

addiction21 wrote...

The Mad Hanar wrote...

I still don't see how including someone of a certain race or sexual preference or orientation in a video game empowers any group. Not everyone plays video games. I'm hispanic, but you don't see me asking for hispanic characters to be in Dragon Age because I feel left out. : /

And if you did ask you shouldn't be dog piled on for asking.

Okay, again, no one is dog piling anyone for wanting a certain character. All characters should have a reason to be there. We've been saying this for a very long time now. That is what we mean. If you didn't get that, now you do. We meant that. We do not hate minorities, a lot of us are minorities. We do in fact get it. We do not hate ourselves or others. Did I cover it all, or did I leave something out? 

You're a bigot.

Modifié par Mr.House, 06 décembre 2013 - 12:39 .

[sandalisthemaker]

Bioware is inclusive because they want to be.
What do you guys think of that?