243 réponses à ce sujet

[Laughing_Man]

eluvianix wrote...

And don't forget about that one blood mage who attempted to become an "Ascended Man" either. I don't think that the ritual required that much blood either.

Hmm... who exactly are you talking about?... (seems like I'm repeating myself...)

Modifié par TheRedVipress, 07 décembre 2013 - 06:46 .

[Jedi Master of Orion]

In World of Thedas there is a letter from one of the magisters to her apprentice about why blood magic is usually a bad idea. One of the 3 examples she used was a magister who used blood magic to become "the Ascended Man" (it doesn't explain what that was) but in the end he just ended up turning into a horrible abomination.

[Hellion Rex]

TheRedVipress wrote...

eluvianix wrote...

And don't forget about that one blood mage who attempted to become an "Ascended Man" either. I don't think that the ritual required that much blood either.

Hmm... who exactly are you talking about?... (seems like I'm repeating myself...)

"And what of Magister Calanthius, that fool who bellieved he could make himself the "Ascended Man" with blood magic? Thirty three slaves died in that rite, and Calanthius became an abomination so horrific that his apprentices tore their eyes out at the sight of him". ---- World of Thedas

[DKJaigen]

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

The Juggernauts of Minrathous certainly means that Tevinter has a defensive advantage if their capital were ever attacked, but with the invention of the Templars, Tevinter has lost a lot of the advantages they used to have in an offensive.

Templar are worthless in battlefield conditions. while effective against mages they also have to deal with tevinter soldiers who can easily bog down the templar order . any sane commander would enmass target the templars with non magical artillery and arrow barrages al the while shielding his mages with troops. i also doubt that the templars are an effective fighting force against regular soldiers. templars operate in small groups and this will not fit on the battlefield where formation is essential.

Most likely the circle of mages had a far greater impact (confirmed in asunder) on the battlefield .  Defeating several exalted marches and defeating the qunari on their home soil alone means that they are the most powerful land army. however qunuari have the advantage at sea.

[Jedi Master of Orion]

They drove the Qunari from Tevinter after 50 years of subjugation and help from the other nations.

[Hellion Rex]

DKJaigen wrote...

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

The Juggernauts of Minrathous certainly means that Tevinter has a defensive advantage if their capital were ever attacked, but with the invention of the Templars, Tevinter has lost a lot of the advantages they used to have in an offensive.

Templar are worthless in battlefield conditions. while effective against mages they also have to deal with tevinter soldiers who can easily bog down the templar order . any sane commander would enmass target the templars with non magical artillery and arrow barrages al the while shielding his mages with troops. i also doubt that the templars are an effective fighting force against regular soldiers. templars operate in small groups and this will not fit on the battlefield where formation is essential.

Most likely the circle of mages had a far greater impact (confirmed in asunder) on the battlefield .  Defeating several exalted marches and defeating the qunari on their home soil alone means that they are the most powerful land army. however qunuari have the advantage at sea.

Indeed. The Circles of Magi were one of the biggest advantages in that conflict.

[Laughing_Man]

DKJaigen wrote...

Templar are worthless in battlefield conditions. while effective against mages they also have to deal with tevinter soldiers who can easily bog down the templar order . any sane commander would enmass target the templars with non magical artillery and arrow barrages al the while shielding his mages with troops. i also doubt that the templars are an effective fighting force against regular soldiers. templars operate in small groups and this will not fit on the battlefield where formation is essential.

Most likely the circle of mages had a far greater impact (confirmed in asunder) on the battlefield .  Defeating several exalted marches and defeating the qunari on their home soil alone means that they are the most powerful land army. however qunuari have the advantage at sea.

Regarding the effectivness of templars against magic.
Seems to me that Templars are simply able to cast certain spells from the spirit school, by using Lyrium: A veriaty of dispel types, and a weaker version of "mana clash".

(that does raise the question what exactly is the difference in this regard between the schools, shouldn't a Templar be able to get limited access to all types of magic in the same way? Seems logical to me.)

And if so, their presence is not an automatic win against magic users, but rather it depends on the willpower and skill of both the mage and the Templar.

The advantage Templars will have, probably lies in their ability to use multiple mediocre "casters" as a way to defeat one Mage. (assuming of course that at this point the mage does not resort to blood-magic to level the playing field)

[Hellion Rex]

TheRedVipress wrote...

And if so, their presence is not an automatic win against magic users, but rather it depends on the willpower and skill of both the mage and the Templar.

The advantage Templars will have, probably lies in their ability to use multiple mediocre "casters" as a way to defeat one Mage. (assuming of course that at this point the mage does not resort to blood-magic to level the playing field)

Indeed. All it take is a few seconds of good timing to deprive a mage of their power and then to quickly kill them, if they don't resort to blood magic.

[Asdrubael Vect]

Templars(their powers work only at very close range and they not protects against flame,lightning, ice, big flying stones and many other things) are very weak cannon fodder against Magisters who are:

1)the most quality educated(Chantry circles have worst and censored education compared for Nevarra and especially Tevinter) and skilled mages in Thedas

2)mages who are noble warriors-knights trained(Chantry specially ban such things in circles and do not allowed mages to have weapons and armors) to use weapons and armors and they have very quality and enchanted weapons and armors

3)mages who have knoledge and experiense of blood magic

and do not forget that magisters have a very good army

Modifié par Dark Korsar, 07 décembre 2013 - 07:31 .

[EmperorSahlertz]

hhh89 wrote...

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

The Juggernauts of Minrathous certainly means that Tevinter has a defensive advantage if their capital were ever attacked, but with the invention of the Templars, Tevinter has lost a lot of the advantages they used to have in an offensive.

Considering that most mages in Tevinter likely use blood magic, I don't think they lost that much.

The only advantage Blood Magic holds against a Templar, is taht the Templar cannot cut off their magic. The Templars still resist blood magic just fine.

[Laughing_Man]

eluvianix wrote...

TheRedVipress wrote...

And if so, their presence is not an automatic win against magic users, but rather it depends on the willpower and skill of both the mage and the Templar.

The advantage Templars will have, probably lies in their ability to use multiple mediocre "casters" as a way to defeat one Mage. (assuming of course that at this point the mage does not resort to blood-magic to level the playing field)

Indeed. All it take is a few seconds of good timing to deprive a mage of their power and then to quickly kill them, if they don't resort to blood magic.

Well, if they don't have the sense to do what they need to save their lives, I would say that their death is partly their own fault.

[Br3admax]

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

hhh89 wrote...

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

The Juggernauts of Minrathous certainly means that Tevinter has a defensive advantage if their capital were ever attacked, but with the invention of the Templars, Tevinter has lost a lot of the advantages they used to have in an offensive.

Considering that most mages in Tevinter likely use blood magic, I don't think they lost that much.

The only advantage Blood Magic holds against a Templar, is taht the Templar cannot cut off their magic. The Templars still resist blood magic just fine.

Atctually it's a lot harder for them to resist.

[Hellion Rex]

TheRedVipress wrote...

eluvianix wrote...

TheRedVipress wrote...

And if so, their presence is not an automatic win against magic users, but rather it depends on the willpower and skill of both the mage and the Templar.

The advantage Templars will have, probably lies in their ability to use multiple mediocre "casters" as a way to defeat one Mage. (assuming of course that at this point the mage does not resort to blood-magic to level the playing field)

Indeed. All it take is a few seconds of good timing to deprive a mage of their power and then to quickly kill them, if they don't resort to blood magic.

Well, if they don't have the sense to do what they need to save their lives, I would say that their death is partly their own fault.

Oh, I agree entirely. If I was pushed into a corner like that, and had to fight or die, I would use every tool I had to fight for my life, consequences be damned.

[Hellion Rex]

Br3ad wrote...

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

hhh89 wrote...

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

The Juggernauts of Minrathous certainly means that Tevinter has a defensive advantage if their capital were ever attacked, but with the invention of the Templars, Tevinter has lost a lot of the advantages they used to have in an offensive.

Considering that most mages in Tevinter likely use blood magic, I don't think they lost that much.

The only advantage Blood Magic holds against a Templar, is taht the Templar cannot cut off their magic. The Templars still resist blood magic just fine.

Atctually it's a lot harder for them to resist.

Indeed. Evangeline could barely hold it off for more than a few seconds.

[Laughing_Man]

eluvianix wrote...

Indeed. Evangeline could barely hold it off for more than a few seconds.

I'm assuming you talk about mind-control.
There's also the "rip-you-to-shreds" magic, which I'm assuming is kinda difficult to resist, considering it concerns laws of nature rather than willpower.

[EmperorSahlertz]

DKJaigen wrote...

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

The Juggernauts of Minrathous certainly means that Tevinter has a defensive advantage if their capital were ever attacked, but with the invention of the Templars, Tevinter has lost a lot of the advantages they used to have in an offensive.

Templar are worthless in battlefield conditions. while effective against mages they also have to deal with tevinter soldiers who can easily bog down the templar order . any sane commander would enmass target the templars with non magical artillery and arrow barrages al the while shielding his mages with troops. i also doubt that the templars are an effective fighting force against regular soldiers. templars operate in small groups and this will not fit on the battlefield where formation is essential.

Most likely the circle of mages had a far greater impact (confirmed in asunder) on the battlefield .  Defeating several exalted marches and defeating the qunari on their home soil alone means that they are the most powerful land army. however qunuari have the advantage at sea.

The only reason that Tevinter was ever able to "defeat" the Qunari during the Qunari Wars, was because the Qunari was busy fighting the rest of Thedas. If the Qunari had wished to, they could ahve just destroyed Tevinter, and then moved on to the rest of Thedas, but it would seem that the Qunari were impatient.

And the Templars are first and foremost an army. An army that specializes against magical opponents. They'd be just as fine fighting Tevinter Magisters as they would the Tevinter slave soldiers.
And why exactly would a field commander put his Templars, if he only had such a small force of them that he couldn't afford casualties, in a place where the enemy could concentrate fire on them without losing men fo their own. That would be downright incompetent of the field commander in question.

[Hellion Rex]

TheRedVipress wrote...

eluvianix wrote...

Indeed. Evangeline could barely hold it off for more than a few seconds.

I'm assuming you talk about mind-control.
There's also the "rip-you-to-shreds" magic, which I'm assuming is kinda difficult to resist, considering it concerns laws of nature rather than willpower.

Not mind control. The mage used a blast of fire, empowered by his blood (it was explicitly stated) to quickly overwhelm Evangeline's attempts to counter it with her own power.

[EmperorSahlertz]

It was the amount of power, not that it was blood magic. The mage could theoretically had attained the same results with some lyrium, and it would also have been hard for Evangeline to resist.

[Laughing_Man]

eluvianix wrote...

Not mind control. The mage used a blast of fire, empowered by his blood (it was explicitly stated) to quickly overwhelm Evangeline's attempts to counter it with her own power.

Ah.
I was referring to controling another's blood, AKA Magneto Vs. the lecherous prison guard that had too much Iron in his blood... (the last X-Man movie I think.)

[Hellion Rex]

TheRedVipress wrote...

eluvianix wrote...

Not mind control. The mage used a blast of fire, empowered by his blood (it was explicitly stated) to quickly overwhelm Evangeline's attempts to counter it with her own power.

Ah.
I was referring to controling another's blood, AKA Magneto Vs. the lecherous prison guard that had too much Iron in his blood... (the last X-Man movie I think.)

Ok yeah. A sole templar probably could not stand against blood magic like that.

[Laughing_Man]

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

It was the amount of power, not that it was blood magic. The mage could theoretically had attained the same results with some lyrium, and it would also have been hard for Evangeline to resist.

DA lore suggests otherwise.

[TK514]

eluvianix wrote...

TheRedVipress wrote...

eluvianix wrote...

TheRedVipress wrote...

And if so, their presence is not an automatic win against magic users, but rather it depends on the willpower and skill of both the mage and the Templar.

The advantage Templars will have, probably lies in their ability to use multiple mediocre "casters" as a way to defeat one Mage. (assuming of course that at this point the mage does not resort to blood-magic to level the playing field)

Indeed. All it take is a few seconds of good timing to deprive a mage of their power and then to quickly kill them, if they don't resort to blood magic.

Well, if they don't have the sense to do what they need to save their lives, I would say that their death is partly their own fault.

Oh, I agree entirely. If I was pushed into a corner like that, and had to fight or die, I would use every tool I had to fight for my life, consequences be damned.

I would totally risk becoming a demon possessed abomination and killing all my friends and loved ones to save my own life.

Oh, wait, no I wouldn't.

[Peer of the Empire]

No.  The charge of armored knights will smash the magister rabble

[Hellion Rex]

TK514 wrote...

eluvianix wrote...

Oh, I agree entirely. If I was pushed into a corner like that, and had to fight or die, I would use every tool I had to fight for my life, consequences be damned.

I would totally risk becoming a demon possessed abomination and killing all my friends and loved ones to save my own life.

Oh, wait, no I wouldn't.

Right. And so if you were about to be slaughtered in a corner by templars, you would sit there and just let them kill you?

Modifié par eluvianix, 07 décembre 2013 - 08:58 .

[Fredward]

Orlais, Tevinter and Nevarra are the power players. And the Qunari ofc.