297 réponses à ce sujet

[Il Divo]

eternal_napalm wrote...

If an rpg is choices affecting story, that makes CoD Black Ops 2 a rpg I guess

True.

But if we rely on the stats = RPG definition, then we actually can conclude that most Sports Games are action RPGs, much like Amalur or Dark Souls which is something you don't see in normal conversation. The Sports game genre is considered pretty distinct from the RPG genre.

Although, I don't think it's simply the presence of choices in the story, but how often we're presented with those choices. For example, KotOR has brief amounts of swoop racing, overall would we say KotOR is a racing game?

Modifié par Il Divo, 15 décembre 2013 - 11:48 .

[Cheylus]

Video games developpers are more open-minded, creative and less conservative than most players.

[Costin_Razvan]

eternal_napalm wrote...

If an rpg is choices affecting story, that makes CoD Black Ops 2 a rpg I guess

It's a better RPG then Mass Effect 3 is.

[Addai]

Jestina wrote...

It's been defined since at least the 70's. TW is just an action story. There's no input from the player on the character being played in the world. Appearance, gender, mannerisms, skills, profession, etc. are all already defined by the writers...without any collaboration from the player.

Since when do you choose what mannerisms your avatar uses?

You're talking rot. You do shape Geralt's skills and appearance, so right there your custom-tailored dismissal falls flat on its rear. How about instead of making up some bollocks definition of what an RPG is you just say it's not your game and move on.

[spirosz]

Regardless of how you view it being an RPG or not, you should expect going in that you'll be limited to looking a certain way, knowing certain people and having certain pre-defined aspects, but this does not stop the game from letting you choose how the story unfolds, how you choose to deal with certain characters and eventually, how the story ends. Regardless of it fitting the "oh so defined" definition of an RPG. I 'lol' at people complaining that since you can't change the appearance or other aspects, it's like no shit - this was approached to you from the get-go.

Modifié par spirosz, 16 décembre 2013 - 04:11 .

[Maverick827]

Ravensword wrote...

CrustyBot wrote...

Planescape: Torment is not an RPG.

According to Maverick.  I'm dumb.

Let's not go around putting words into people's mouthes.

[AventuroLegendary]

simfamSP wrote...

Costin_Razvan wrote...

eternal_napalm wrote...

If an rpg is choices affecting story, that makes CoD Black Ops 2 a rpg I guess

It's a better RPG then Mass Effect 3 is.

Hardly. Yes, ME3 is a load of ****e in the story department. But the narrative is irrelevant to the genre. If so Legacy of Kaine is an RPG and so is the Assassin's Creed series.

Black Ops 2's singleplayer is probably the most interesting thing I've seen out of Call of Duty in years. The choices and endings seem gimmicky but they're a nice addition to a year-by-year subpar storyline. 

As to the topic, RPG is too broad to be used as a label. I often see it used as a badge of honor rather than a consistent genre.

Modifié par LegendaryAvenger, 16 décembre 2013 - 06:53 .

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

Il Divo wrote...

eternal_napalm wrote...

If an rpg is choices affecting story, that makes CoD Black Ops 2 a rpg I guess

True.

But if we rely on the stats = RPG definition, then we actually can conclude that most Sports Games are action RPGs, much like Amalur or Dark Souls which is something you don't see in normal conversation. The Sports game genre is considered pretty distinct from the RPG genre.

Sports games are Action RPGs. A My Career mode in most sports games is tantamount to a sports-themed RPG campaign. An RPG is carried by it's mechanics, whereas Sports games are labeled as such because of their content. It's not mutually exclusive, though most people make that mistake.

Hell, the NBA2K games even have dialog options now, and a way to roleplay the typical selfish showboat/team player personas on the court. 

[spirosz]

Crustystaphtit.

[2Pac]

**** got srs

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

EntropicAngel wrote...

Need For Speed Undercover is an RPG.

You can't control the story, but you choose what types of cars you drive (your "weapons"). Additionally, you get actual XP points for winning races, more for doing really well, and when you level up the story is unlocked, more cars (weapons) are unlocked, and you get stat boosts (powertrain, tires, nitrous, braking, acceleration, etc).

 

I know you're being facetious, but when a character creation screen looks like this: 



It's a little hard to refute the point.

[spirosz]

EntropicAngel wrote...

it still isn't awesome.

I agree 100%. 

[Fast Jimmy]

CrustyBot wrote...

EntropicAngel wrote...

Need For Speed Undercover is an RPG.

You can't control the story, but you choose what types of cars you drive (your "weapons"). Additionally, you get actual XP points for winning races, more for doing really well, and when you level up the story is unlocked, more cars (weapons) are unlocked, and you get stat boosts (powertrain, tires, nitrous, braking, acceleration, etc).

 

I know you're being facetious, but when a character creation screen looks like this: 



It's a little hard to refute the point.

Agreed. In all seriousness.

If more traditional RPGs want to honestly hold their title like it means something these days when there are more complex build options in a NBA2K or a God of War game, then they need to step their game up, both literally and metaphorically. Having six stats that lead to simple "highest DPS=best build, every time" logic that a kindergartener could design is pure insanity to me. And proof that designers think the entire gaming population has been lobotomized.

[Seboist]

Il Divo wrote...

Seboist wrote...

CrustyBot wrote...

Planescape: Torment is not an RPG.

Lol, inorite?

Comical how these LARPers think creating a shallow self-insert with customizable hairstyles and whatever make believe that only exists in their head being the core of a video game RPG.

Honestly Seb, if we relied on your pitiful understanding of what an RPG is, I think we'd all be much worse off.

Nah, we'd end up with actual RPGs with stats, inventory,looting,etc not semi-interactive "cinematic" mcshooters like Mass Effect 2 and 3.

But your ignorant presumption is duly noted.

[spirosz]

Agreed. In all seriousness.

If more traditional RPGs want to honestly hold their title like it means something these days when there are more complex build options in a NBA2K or a God of War game, then they need to step their game up, both literally and metaphorically. Having six stats that lead to simple "highest DPS=best build, every time" logic that a kindergartener could design is pure insanity to me. And proof that designers think the entire gaming population has been lobotomized.

^

Modifié par spirosz, 17 décembre 2013 - 12:23 .

[Fast Jimmy]

EntropicAngel wrote...

I'm actually not really being facetious. I'm mostly refuting the whole "an RPG is based on stats" definition.

I won't get into my definition though, it's not worth it. I'll just have to agree with Addai (*gasp*): to those who genuinely don't like it, just say it's not your game and move on. Not that I think The Witcher is anything special, and I certainly consider both games poorer than most Bioware games I've played, but still. It's not worth arguing over.

J. Reezy wrote...

I KNOW YOU AIN'T SCOFFING AT THE NOTION THAT A BASKETBALL GAME LIKE NBA 2K CAN BE AN RPG MR. FARRON!

Oh, I accepted that Final Fantasy has never been an RPG a long, long time ago. Doesn't mean it isn't still awesome.

I think the answer isn't to try and say certain games aren't RPGs. Because millions upon millions of gamers are going to look at a game like the FF series and say it is, OBVIOUSLY, an RPG. Or that WoW is an MMORPG. These ideas are so ingrained that trying to say its not the case is impossible. Every game with stats "has RPG elements." Every game with dialogue, ESPECIALLY with dialouge options, is going to be called an RPG. 

The answer is, instead, to create a term that identifies games that allow true character control as well as choice and consequence in the plot. And there may be even two (or more) different definitions in there, as well. A game like TellTale's TWD would easily be a game that is fundamentally built on one of those and not the other (choice and consequence but not character creation/definition).

Something like "(1)a choice driven, (2)cinematic, (3)level-based RPG" may work for TW3. A "(1)choice driven, (2)character freedom, (3)level-based RPG" may be a better name for DA:O.  

EDIT: Bear with me as I struggle to correct the BSN's wonky BBCode rules.

Modifié par Fast Jimmy, 17 décembre 2013 - 12:28 .

[Seboist]

CrustyBot wrote...

EntropicAngel wrote...

Need For Speed Undercover is an RPG.

You can't control the story, but you choose what types of cars you drive (your "weapons"). Additionally, you get actual XP points for winning races, more for doing really well, and when you level up the story is unlocked, more cars (weapons) are unlocked, and you get stat boosts (powertrain, tires, nitrous, braking, acceleration, etc).

 

I know you're being facetious, but when a character creation screen looks like this: 



It's a little hard to refute the point.

Pretty sad how sports games are more complex RPGs than what's getting passed around as such in the west.

[Fast Jimmy]

And it's funny to me, because Madden, FIFA and NBA2K sell WAY more than RPGs these days.

I could see taking the path to stupidville if it resulted in more sales. But these games that sell 10 million+ every year? Their systems and concepts are the way more advanced ones. It's the exact opposite of what a gaming exec would say to expect... yet people are still designing games like gaming execs think they should be.