168 réponses à ce sujet

[Sir DeLoria]

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...

Necanor wrote...

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...
Tali gets utterly shredded by banshees (imagine a person being sucked into a blender).

Jack and her squad get vaporized by a direct hit from a Reaper.

Shepard puts Ashley down personally.

Well, you certainly have a very...vivid fantasy. But how can a Banshee "blender" someone to death? 

Quite easily. Imagine a bunch of banshees tearing her apart at once.

But then she'd just be torn apart, not "shredded to tiny pieces". Why would so many Banshees even focus so much on her? Even when multiple Banshees were around in ME3 it seemed that only one would go for the kill. 
Maybe your slightly sadistic fanfic needs a little rethinking, just sayin:?

[David7204]

Allow me to point out that the complaints that characters should be dropped because they're 'pointless' really have no merit at all. Particularly for an RPG, where players often demand the ability to kill or dismiss companions at their leisure.

The merit of a character is not based on how much they supposedly 'contribute' to the main plot from an in-story context. Nearly all side characters for any every story in existence could be compressed or eliminated without significantly changing the central plot. That goes tenfold, again, for an RPG, where players often demand a wide selection of companions in the first place.

Modifié par David7204, 08 décembre 2013 - 10:50 .

[MassivelyEffective0730]

Necanor wrote...

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...

Necanor wrote...

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...
Tali gets utterly shredded by banshees (imagine a person being sucked into a blender).

Jack and her squad get vaporized by a direct hit from a Reaper.

Shepard puts Ashley down personally.

Well, you certainly have a very...vivid fantasy. But how can a Banshee "blender" someone to death? 

Quite easily. Imagine a bunch of banshees tearing her apart at once.

But then she'd just be torn apart, not "shredded to tiny pieces". Why would so many Banshees even focus so much on her? Even when multiple Banshees were around in ME3 it seemed that only one would go for the kill. 
Maybe your slightly sadistic fanfic needs a little rethinking, just sayin:?

Not really. You're attributing a gameplay concern with the actual circumstance. Sure, there's one death animation in the gameplay. Does that mean it's the only way the Banshee is going to kill? Most likely not.

[Br3admax]

David7204 wrote...

Allow me to point out that the complaints that characters should be dropped because they're 'pointless' really have no merit at all. Particularly for an RPG, where players often demand the ability to kill or dismiss companions at their leisure.

The merit of a character is not based on how much they supposedly 'contribute' to the main plot from an in-story context. Nearly all side characters for any every story in existence could be compressed or eliminated without significantly changing the central plot. That goes tenfold, again, for an RPG, where players often demand a wide selection of companions in the first place.

I hardly think that you are an expert of RPGs to be making such broad generalizations, David. 

[David7204]

It's really very simple logic. Obviously, a companion that can be killed at any time can't play much of a role in the story. So a player who demands the ability to kill or dismiss his companions and then whines that certain companions should be scrapped because they don't supposedly play enough of a role would be...immensely foolish, wouldn't he?

Modifié par David7204, 08 décembre 2013 - 10:57 .

[DeinonSlayer]

David7204 wrote...

It's really very simple logic. Obviously, a companion that can be killed at any time can't play much of a role in the story.

Zevran disapproves -10

I think Morrigan is actually the only DA:O companion you can't kill. I know all NV companions can die in Hardcore mode.

Modifié par DeinonSlayer, 08 décembre 2013 - 10:58 .

[Mr.House]

David7204 wrote...

Allow me to point out that the complaints that characters should be dropped because they're 'pointless' really have no merit at all. Particularly for an RPG, where players often demand the ability to kill or dismiss companions at their leisure.

The merit of a character is not based on how much they supposedly 'contribute' to the main plot from an in-story context. Nearly all side characters for any every story in existence could be compressed or eliminated without significantly changing the central plot. That goes tenfold, again, for an RPG, where players often demand a wide selection of companions in the first place.

Get rid of Alistair in DAO, get rid of Bastila in KOTOR, get rid of Mitsuru in Persona 3, get rid of Naoto in P4 ect and see what happens. Some characters can be getten rid of because they are ponitless or don't have a big impact(does not make them horrible characters) and some are vital to the plot.

[Mr.House]

David7204 wrote...

It's really very simple logic. Obviously, a companion that can be killed at any time can't play much of a role in the story.

Play DAO or P3 before you yap your gums.

[Br3admax]

David7204 wrote...

It's really very simple logic. Obviously, a companion that can be killed at any time can't play much of a role in the story. So a player who demands the ability to kill or dismiss his companions and then whines that certain companions should be scrapped because they don't supposedly play enough of a role would be...immensely foolish, wouldn't he?

Not really. Of course you aren't basing this off of experience, so your misunderstanding is very understandable. If the character contributed, the player would not want to remove them in the first place. Companions who contribute too much or too little are the bane of any good RPG, but you again, wouldn't know that. Therefore, you shouldn't be telling anyone what they should or should not think. 

Modifié par Br3ad, 08 décembre 2013 - 11:01 .

[Hazegurl]

David7204 wrote...

Allow me to point out that the complaints that characters should be dropped because they're 'pointless' really have no merit at all. Particularly[/i] for an RPG, where players often demand the ability to kill or dismiss companions at their leisure.

The merit of a character is not based on how much they supposedly 'contribute' to the main plot from an in-story context. Nearly all side characters for any every story in existence could be compressed or eliminated without significantly changing the central plot. That goes tenfold, again, for an RPG, where players often demand a wide selection of companions in the first place.

Or perhaps they mean that the character is pointless on a gameplay level as well. I admit I use squad mates I like and leave the rest to rot on the ship. Also, many believe that if the fluff was trimmed it would open more content for the characters they actually like.

ex: Let me kick off Liara and have my LI visit me for at least one of my dreams or just hanging out in my cabin and ask me what's wrong. They don't have to bother having this one character head to my room every single time I have a dream and my LI gets a little bit more air time even if it isn't on the same level

[David7204]

DeinonSlayer wrote...

David7204 wrote...

It's really very simple logic. Obviously, a companion that can be killed at any time can't play much of a role in the story.

I know all NV companions can die in Hardcore mode.

Hey, look at that. All of them 'play' (by the definition this thread is using) zero role in the central plot and with each other.

Modifié par David7204, 08 décembre 2013 - 11:00 .

[Br3admax]

David7204 wrote...

DeinonSlayer wrote...

David7204 wrote...

It's really very simple logic. Obviously, a companion that can be killed at any time can't play much of a role in the story.

I know all NV companions can die in Hardcore mode.

Hey, look at that. All of them 'play' (by the definition this thread is using) zero role in the central plot and with each other.

#Didn'tRead
#TooObvious 

[Jorji Costava]

In response to the OP, I'd suggest that there are a number of characters from ME2 that could easily have been dropped; I'd start with Grunt, Thane, Jack and the DLC characters. As far as who should show up in ME2, I'd go with Legion and maybe your Cerberus buddies (Miranda and/or Jacob), probably Miranda, since she was a bit higher up on the Cerberus food chain to begin with.

[MassivelyEffective0730]

DeinonSlayer wrote...

David7204 wrote...

It's really very simple logic. Obviously, a companion that can be killed at any time can't play much of a role in the story.

Zevran disapproves -10

I think Morrigan is actually the only DA:O companion you can't kill. I know all NV companions can die in Hardcore mode.

You can still kill her in Witch Hunt. Hell, look at ME2. You can kill 10 possible squadmates in the game easily. Or KotOR, where you can kill the majority of the crew (Juhani, Jolee, Bastila, Mission, Carth - even if you can't technically kill him, you can make him leave.)

You can dismiss everyone in DA:O, and you can have everyone hate you. 

ME3 seems to be the exception rather than the norm in allowing (or in this case, detaching) the player the ability to define how their character's affect the story.

[Seboist]

David7204 wrote...

DeinonSlayer wrote...

David7204 wrote...

It's really very simple logic. Obviously, a companion that can be killed at any time can't play much of a role in the story.

I know all NV companions can die in Hardcore mode.

Hey, look at that. All of them 'play' (by the definition this thread is using) zero role in the central plot and with each other.

Great summary of the ME2 squad.

[teh DRUMPf!!]

David7204 wrote...


The merit of a character is not based on how much they supposedly 'contribute' to the main plot from an in-story context. Nearly all side characters for any every story in existence could be compressed or eliminated without significantly changing the central plot.

"Pointless" doesn't just mean making no contribution to the plot.

Characters like Jacob are literally good for nothing.

That goes tenfold, again, for an RPG, where players often demand a wide selection of companions in the first place.

A lot of RPGs don't even have a party of characters that travel with the PC. .

I, for one, do not like a "wide-selection" and that is one of my core issues with ME2's squad. It's too damn big.

ME1 was right for me. ME3 was a bit more than I'd like, but still better than frickin 12.

Modifié par HYR 2.0, 08 décembre 2013 - 11:07 .

[Sir DeLoria]

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...

Necanor wrote...

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...
Quite easily. Imagine a bunch of banshees tearing her apart at once.

But then she'd just be torn apart, not "shredded to tiny pieces". Why would so many Banshees even focus so much on her? Even when multiple Banshees were around in ME3 it seemed that only one would go for the kill. 
Maybe your slightly sadistic fanfic needs a little rethinking, just sayin:?

Not really. You're attributing a gameplay concern with the actual circumstance. Sure, there's one death animation in the gameplay. Does that mean it's the only way the Banshee is going to kill? Most likely not.

But why would a whole group of rare, elite Banshees ignore the battle around them and all other enemies just to focus on one lone Quarian engineer? 
And why do you even want to kill her such a horrid way? I know you really dislike her, but what I've seen you write so far is realld, really disturbing. What did she do to deserve that? 

[David7204]

I think people are failing to grasp this simple point. Pretty much all fiction, and in particular fiction with lots of characters, and in very particular RPGs, have characters that could be eliminated, and often eliminated very easily. And we seem to have people here that think they've somehow discovered something by realizing that. Who seem to think they're clever enough to have stumbled across a truth those silly writers have overlooked?

Hardly.

Modifié par David7204, 08 décembre 2013 - 11:07 .

[DeinonSlayer]

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...

DeinonSlayer wrote...

David7204 wrote...

It's really very simple logic. Obviously, a companion that can be killed at any time can't play much of a role in the story.

Zevran disapproves -10

I think Morrigan is actually the only DA:O companion you can't kill. I know all NV companions can die in Hardcore mode.

You can still kill her in Witch Hunt. Hell, look at ME2. You can kill 10 possible squadmates in the game easily. Or KotOR, where you can kill the majority of the crew (Juhani, Jolee, Bastila, Mission, Carth - even if you can't technically kill him, you can make him leave.)

You can dismiss everyone in DA:O, and you can have everyone hate you. 

ME3 seems to be the exception rather than the norm in allowing (or in this case, detaching) the player the ability to define how their character's affect the story.

In ME2, if I recall, you can technically have a playthrough where you only recruit Miranda, Jacob, Jack, Mordin, and Garrus. You can sell Legion, ignore Tali, Thane and Samara's recruitment missions and never wake Grunt up.

[Mr.House]

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...

DeinonSlayer wrote...

David7204 wrote...

It's really very simple logic. Obviously, a companion that can be killed at any time can't play much of a role in the story.

Zevran disapproves -10

I think Morrigan is actually the only DA:O companion you can't kill. I know all NV companions can die in Hardcore mode.

You can still kill her in Witch Hunt. Hell, look at ME2. You can kill 10 possible squadmates in the game easily. Or KotOR, where you can kill the majority of the crew (Juhani, Jolee, Bastila, Mission, Carth - even if you can't technically kill him, you can make him leave.)

You can dismiss everyone in DA:O, and you can have everyone hate you. 

ME3 seems to be the exception rather than the norm in allowing (or in this case, detaching) the player the ability to define how their character's affect the story.

Only Mordin and Miranda(and even then there vital parts are small)where vital to the M2 plot. Everyone else could be throwen away.

[DeinonSlayer]

Necanor wrote...

But why would a whole group of rare, elite Banshees ignore the battle around them and all other enemies just to focus on one lone Quarian engineer? 
And why do you even want to kill her such a horrid way? I know you really dislike her, but what I've seen you write so far is realld, really disturbing. What did she do to deserve that? 

Can we please stop talking about this?

[Br3admax]

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...

DeinonSlayer wrote...

David7204 wrote...

It's really very simple logic. Obviously, a companion that can be killed at any time can't play much of a role in the story.

Zevran disapproves -10

I think Morrigan is actually the only DA:O companion you can't kill. I know all NV companions can die in Hardcore mode.

You can still kill her in Witch Hunt.

No, you stab her and she falls through the mirror. She however, does not die here. 

[Br3admax]

David7204 wrote...

I think people are failing to grasp this simple point. Pretty much all fiction, and in particular fiction with lots of characters, and in very particular RPGs, have characters that could be eliminated, and often eliminated very easily. And we seem to have people here that think they've somehow discovered something by realizing that. Who seem to think they're clever enough to have stumbled across a truth those silly writers have overlooked?

Hardly.

How many RPGs have you played David? Obviously, not enough.