160 réponses à ce sujet

[Hellion Rex]

thats1evildude wrote...

The in-game evidence suggests that the gains from blood magic aren't cumulative in the way you hope. You can't ****** the thumbs of ten people and get the same returns as cutting the throat of one person. If you could, why wouldn't Jowan simply ask for a line of volunteers to open up their wrists instead of killing Isolde?

I also want to stress again that the Joining has never been described as blood magic anywhere in the lore.

Check the Wiki' entry on Blood Magic for the Joining. Plus it's magic mixed with darkspawn blood, archdemon blood, and lyrium. How could that not be a form of blood magic?

Modifié par eluvianix, 09 décembre 2013 - 08:46 .

[Fredward]

Eh. It's still a tool. Merrill only ever used her own blood (I assume) and she was still able to purify the eluvian. Is it easy to abuse? Very. Does that mean everyone will abuse it? No.

[Ianamus]

Ieldra2 wrote...

MisterJB wrote...
And yes, this is something entirely new and was possibly introduced by Bioware because the fans were a bit more accepting of blood magic than they wished them to be; the primary reaction to "blood mage" in the forums seems to be "so what".
So, now, blood mages are more likely to be nefarious than not because it's not just about blood, it's also about how much suffering was inflicted in the process of acquiring it.

This, however, is something not shown in the games. I don't think Bioware's attempt to "evilize" blood magic really worked so far - and I don't think it should. The original concept was about blood being perceived as something special and, for lack of a better word, sacred. In other words, blood magic was one of those intangible evils some people believe in and others don't. The controversy was very well circumscribed. The lore added by WoT I changes the whole concept in a very fundamental manner and leaves those who have already adapted to the old concept out in the cold. I consider this a really bad retcon. 

We'll see how things turn out in DAI. 

Considering it fixes so many plot holes with regards to "why sacrifice that person when we can just get five buckets of blood and do the same thing?" I think the change was a much needed one. 

[Hellion Rex]

Foopydoopydoo wrote...

Eh. It's still a tool. Merrill only ever used her own blood (I assume) and she was still able to purify the eluvian. Is it easy to abuse? Very. Does that mean everyone will abuse it? No.

^^ This.

[MisterJB]

Inprea wrote...
Do you have any proof that Jowan tortured Conor's mother to get enough power for the blood ritual? That or exactly how painful was it when he stabbed himself granting him enough power to knock several templars on their tails?

Who did Malcolm Hawke torture to reinforce Cory's prison? I didn't see any evidence that he used blood other then his own. 

You're throwing out some very big numbers there. How about offering some lore that gives the actual ratio instead of just assuming that blood taken painfully is one hundred times more potent then that given willingly?

I am giving you the lore as stated by the writers of the game. The ratio was an assumption, yes, but the fact remains that blood taken forcefully and through great suffering offers more power than any other.
The fact that Jowan required Isolde's life rather than simply have the survivors of Redcliff make a line and offer the equivalent amount of blood that is in a normal person suggests that there are, in fact, effects of blood magic that can't be reproducedd without pain and death of the subject.

Modifié par MisterJB, 09 décembre 2013 - 08:51 .

[Vulpe]

Inprea wrote...

Rather then bleeding a single slave dry and depriving yourself of a slave why not just take a little blood from several slaves or even volunteers?

There is a case in a DA comic where an old blood mage ( that also knows healing magic ) is something like the guardian of a group of people that live in the woods and they offer him some blood so that he could cast protective a protective shield spell ( I think it's also an invisibility one )  around their camp. They all have bandaged wrists because they take turns in providing him some blood, but he doesn't make them suffer more than it's necessary and he doesn't abuse his power.

EDIT

He also boils it and uses it to heal the main character.

Modifié par JulianWellpit, 09 décembre 2013 - 08:54 .

[Hellion Rex]

JulianWellpit wrote...

Inprea wrote...

Rather then bleeding a single slave dry and depriving yourself of a slave why not just take a little blood from several slaves or even volunteers?

There is a case in a DA comic where an old blood mage ( that also knows healing magic ) is something like the guardian of a group of people that live in the woods and they offer him some blood so that he could cast protective a protective shield spell ( I think it's also an invisibility one )  around their camp. They all have bandaged wrists because they take turns in providing him some blood, but he doesn't make them suffer more than it's necessary and he doesn't abuse his power.

Do you have the name of that mage on hand?

[HiroVoid]

JulianWellpit wrote...

Inprea wrote...

Rather then bleeding a single slave dry and depriving yourself of a slave why not just take a little blood from several slaves or even volunteers?

There is a case in a DA comic where an old blood mage ( that also knows healing magic ) is something like the guardian of a group of people that live in the woods and they offer him some blood so that he could cast protective a protective shield spell ( I think it's also an invisibility one )  around their camp. They all have bandaged wrists because they take turns in providing him some blood, but he doesn't make them suffer more than it's necessary and he doesn't abuse his power.

I'll just go ahead and point out if these are the old comics, those are easily the least reliable and most suseptible to change due to being written by someone outside of Bioware.

[Hellion Rex]

HiroVoid wrote...

JulianWellpit wrote...

Inprea wrote...

Rather then bleeding a single slave dry and depriving yourself of a slave why not just take a little blood from several slaves or even volunteers?

There is a case in a DA comic where an old blood mage ( that also knows healing magic ) is something like the guardian of a group of people that live in the woods and they offer him some blood so that he could cast protective a protective shield spell ( I think it's also an invisibility one )  around their camp. They all have bandaged wrists because they take turns in providing him some blood, but he doesn't make them suffer more than it's necessary and he doesn't abuse his power.

I'll just go ahead and point out if these are the old comics, those are easily the least reliable and most suseptible to change due to being written by someone outside of Bioware.

Ok, the guy's name is Fallstick. Huh....Old god worshipper as well as maleficar.

[Vulpe]

eluvianix wrote...

JulianWellpit wrote...

Inprea wrote...

Rather then bleeding a single slave dry and depriving yourself of a slave why not just take a little blood from several slaves or even volunteers?

There is a case in a DA comic where an old blood mage ( that also knows healing magic ) is something like the guardian of a group of people that live in the woods and they offer him some blood so that he could cast protective a protective shield spell ( I think it's also an invisibility one )  around their camp. They all have bandaged wrists because they take turns in providing him some blood, but he doesn't make them suffer more than it's necessary and he doesn't abuse his power.

Do you have the name of that mage on hand?

He's the one Gleam meets in the forests...Fallstick. The one that boils blood in a pot and uses some to heal the internal injuries of Gleam. He serves the Man Of Light and reffers to his guys as his blood band.

EDIT

Here's the link to the wiki

Modifié par JulianWellpit, 09 décembre 2013 - 09:00 .

[HiroVoid]

XD Fallstick. Okay. The names in the old comics were hilarious if anything.

[Hellion Rex]

HiroVoid wrote...

XD Fallstick. Okay. The names in the old comics were hilarious if anything.

The protagonist's name was "Gleam."

[HiroVoid]

I'm aware along with the templar named "Duty".

[Dayze]

For why people don't use blood magic of animals....well they do, Dragons at least.

We know at least "one" kind of animal can be used for blood magic.

That being said I suspect the reason why humans vs most other kinds of animals is due to Human's connection to the fade and ability to do magic. Find a cow in Thedas who can cast fireballs and their blood probably is as good as any humans.

But despite what has been written; most of the Lore doesn't support much evidence of their being a "huge" difference in blood willingly given or blood taken from the unwilling. And either way; its still pretty powerful.

[thats1evildude]

eluvianix wrote...

Check the Wiki' entry on Blood Magic for the Joining. Plus it's magic mixed with darkspawn blood, archdemon blood, and lyrium. How could that not be a form of blood magic?

The Wiki does not label it as blood magic.

It is a ritual that uses specially-prepared blood. All magic that uses blood is not blood magic - there are grey areas. Unless you're implying that Duncan was secretly a maleficar?

I accept nothing stated in the first Dragon Age comics because they were really effin' awful and we should all pretend they don't exist. That's a position shared by Bioware, methinks.

Modifié par thats1evildude, 09 décembre 2013 - 09:03 .

[Hellion Rex]

HiroVoid wrote...

I'm aware along with the templar named "Duty".

Orson Scott Card certainly got reallllly creative with those names.

[Hellion Rex]

thats1evildude wrote...

eluvianix wrote...

Check the Wiki' entry on Blood Magic for the Joining. Plus it's magic mixed with darkspawn blood, archdemon blood, and lyrium. How could that not be a form of blood magic?

The Wiki does not label it as blood magic.

It is a ritual that uses specially-prepared blood. All magic that uses blood is not blood magic - there are grey areas. Unless you're implying that Duncan was secretly a maleficar?

I accept nothing stated in the first Dragon Age comics because they were really effin' awful and we should all pretend they don't exist. That's a position shared by Bioware, methinks.

http://dragonage.wikia.com/wiki/Blood_magic#Blood_magic_and_the_Grey_Wardens
Second paragraph. And also, remember the Joining potion was prepared before hand. Who's to say that there wasn't a blood mage among the Grey Wardens present at Ostagar.

[HiroVoid]

eluvianix wrote...

thats1evildude wrote...

eluvianix wrote...

Check the Wiki' entry on Blood Magic for the Joining. Plus it's magic mixed with darkspawn blood, archdemon blood, and lyrium. How could that not be a form of blood magic?

The Wiki does not label it as blood magic.

It is a ritual that uses specially-prepared blood. All magic that uses blood is not blood magic - there are grey areas. Unless you're implying that Duncan was secretly a maleficar?

I accept nothing stated in the first Dragon Age comics because they were really effin' awful and we should all pretend they don't exist. That's a position shared by Bioware, methinks.

http://dragonage.wikia.com/wiki/Blood_magic#Blood_magic_and_the_Grey_Wardens
Second paragraph. And also, remember the Joining potion was prepared before hand. Who's to say that there wasn't a blood mage among the Grey Wardens present at Ostagar.

Now where's the source of the information?

[The Flying Grey Warden]

This was one ****ty blood mage then. And why couldn't my mage chat up this "blood mage" who was ostagar at all? Why couldn't I meet any other wardens for that matter? Where the heck were they that whole time?

[The Elder King]

I think that at Ostagar it was stated that mages prepared the 'drink'.

[Hellion Rex]

The Flying Grey Warden wrote...

This was one ****ty blood mage then. And why couldn't my mage chat up this "blood mage" who was ostagar at all? Why couldn't I meet any other wardens for that matter? Where the heck were they that whole time?

Sh***y blood mage? And there were plenty of Wardens down on the battle field that you never meet. Why would you have had to meet this one?

[thats1evildude]

It states that the Grey Wardens sometimes use blood magic. What of it?

It does not say "The Joining is blood magic."

Modifié par thats1evildude, 09 décembre 2013 - 09:17 .

[Vulpe]

The Flying Grey Warden wrote...

This was one ****ty blood mage then. And why couldn't my mage chat up this "blood mage" who was ostagar at all? Why couldn't I meet any other wardens for that matter? Where the heck were they that whole time?

During day, they were busy gathering all that wood that Duncan used to make that fire he was standing next to with your dog (if you are a noble). Night time - they probably had their last lunch and beauty sleep.

[Dayze]

JulianWellpit wrote...

eluvianix wrote...

JulianWellpit wrote...

Inprea wrote...

Rather then bleeding a single slave dry and depriving yourself of a slave why not just take a little blood from several slaves or even volunteers?

There is a case in a DA comic where an old blood mage ( that also knows healing magic ) is something like the guardian of a group of people that live in the woods and they offer him some blood so that he could cast protective a protective shield spell ( I think it's also an invisibility one )  around their camp. They all have bandaged wrists because they take turns in providing him some blood, but he doesn't make them suffer more than it's necessary and he doesn't abuse his power.

Do you have the name of that mage on hand?

He's the one Gleam meets in the forests...Fallstick. The one that boils blood in a pot and uses some to heal the internal injuries of Gleam. He serves the Man Of Light and reffers to his guys as his blood band.

EDIT

Here's the link to the wiki

Any other references to the "Man of Light" aside from that guy?

[Hellion Rex]

thats1evildude wrote...

It states that the Grey Wardens sometimes use blood magic. What of it? We already knew that.

It does not say "The Joining is blood magic."

"In the Warden's Keep DLC, the Warden learns of an ancient Grey Warden mage named Avernus who utilized blood magic to manipulate the darkspawn taint used in the Joining (the Joining itself being a form of blood magic)."