499 réponses à ce sujet

[David7204]

Ryzaki wrote...

This is where I get confused. You have a looks requirement from friendships? For work relationships? (also you get to pick who you work with you lucky bastard).

It just means that beauty is one of many factors would affect my outlook and the likelihood of a relationship with someone. Is it a 'requirement'? Not exactly. If someone is friendly and fun to be around, I'd be friends with them regardless of what they looked like.

[Ryzaki]

J. Reezy wrote...

To address the topic right quick, I hope Cassandra's face stays the same so the OP can come back in a year to cry delicious tears.

Oh  yeah DAI isn't coming out til winter 2014... Curse you for reminding me of the long wait ahead.

[Ninja Stan]

Let's get this discussion back on track, please. Bans have been handed out.

[Ryzaki]

David7204 wrote...

It just means that beauty is one of many factors would affect my outlook and the likelihood of a relationship with someone. Is it a 'requirement'? Not exactly. If someone is friendly and fun to be around, I'd be friends with them regardless of what they looked like.

So if there's two people and you're on the borderline to being friends with the both of them you'd pick the more attractive one to be friends with because they're more attractive and that's desirable to you in a friendship relationship?

Sorry I'm just really baffled because I don't get how this logic works.

Edit: On topic

I don't see how Cassandra would be seen as less trustworthy than say Isabela or Morrigan.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 13 décembre 2013 - 08:49 .

[Hellion Rex]

Ryzaki wrote...

I don't see how Cassandra would be seen as less trustworthy than say Isabela or Morrigan.

Wait, when did her trustworthiness come into question? She seems the type to follow a cause to hell and back.

[Ryzaki]

Ah true I misread *rubs temples* I'm up way too late.

[Fredward]

Darth Brotarian wrote...
It is not the thinking and reflecting part I have an issue with, it's all the implications you lace in your post and proposition that taint your words. Hinting that sexists jokes wouldn't exist if our society didn't exists the way it did. Perhaps our sexists jokes wouldn't exists, but that hardly means anything since you never specified a limit on what sexists jokes would come or go with the alteration of culture in the first place, you just used a generalization that hints that all sexists jokes would vanish if people simply contemplated and, by the extension and implication of your words, had to justify why they thought those jokes were funny.

You imply people find them funny because they have no choice but to find them funny. I myself call bull**** on the entire notion that a persons sense of humor is something that need be contemplated deeply in the first place. That by requiring people to do that, you are essentially missing the point of what humor is by treating it as some quantifyable trait with physical worth that can be mathematically deduced, and that people just need to become smart enough to grasp that.

The sexist joke thing was just the first example I thought of where people do this, accept an external construct of what is normal or acceptable. There's also gender roles, sexual identities and issues with race. All are examples of people just accepting something as it is, as it's handed to them. Sexist jokes are tiny manifestation of this kind of thinking.

As for whether sexist jokes would exist or mutate into something else if our society changed, that's beside the point. I'm sure there will never actually be a world where such things don't exist at all and I'm not even sure a world that whitewashed would be worth living in. The point is that currently things like sexist jokes create an ambient environment in which more tangible forms of prejudice are a lot more likely. Think about some of those uber offensive vintage ads, do you think their decline and the increase of female liberties is completely incidental?

In fact here are some of those uber offensive ads. I laughed. Now I can't speak for you but I laughed because ohemgee that's really the way people used to think? In the olden days these would not have been considered funny or offensive (except the ones that are meants to be funny I assume) but they are now. Why? Because people started thinking about the kind of things they communicated. Laugh at the sexist joke, just think about why you're laughing.

[Ninja Stan]

Again, back on topic, please.

[Dominus]

I checked both images. It's true that there's a much greater width in terms of cheekbones and jaw. Calling the DA:I version an abomination, however, feels like a very strong exaggeration.

I'm not really sure what else to add to this post, that's the only main difference I can see(besides stronger realism) between the two Cassandras.

[The Flying Grey Warden]

I like her new look because she doesn't look like shes made of plastic and is super young and stuff. Didn't notice until comparing the two, but cassandra looks older, more authoritative imo.

And to me her look matches her character, instead of just seeming off before.

[SomeoneStoleMyName]

 *Sigh*
I already apologized for that, and admited that the word "abomination" was hyberbole. And that the main issue (which I had personally, and ofcourse subjectively) wasnt the beauty part - but rather the (Again, personal opinion - as people here tend to disagree) vast change in appearance. 
I simply think the change from DA:2 -> DA:I for Cassandra is way too drastic and did not stay true to how she was before. 
I also stated that the new model in itself isnt bad, but for a representation/remake of the original Cassandra - the appearance shifted waaaay too much. I used the word abomination mainly because cassandra doesent look like cassandra but someone else entirely.
It was merely an expression to say Cassandra's CHANGE was an abomination. 

Why shouldnt the artist stay true to the original? There simply wasnt a need to change her THAT much imo. Varric looks spot on, why should Varric get a 95% accuracy in his engine upgrade while Cassandra gets a total appearance change?

Edit; And again. If Bioware originally intended Cassandra to look like she does in DA:I in DA:2 but were limited by the engine to make her look like that - then that is an entirely different matter.

Edit2: Also, note to self: Way to go offending the guy at Bioware you have the most respect for. How did this get so out of hand >.<

Modifié par SomeoneStoleMyName, 13 décembre 2013 - 10:25 .

[The Flying Grey Warden]

I don't think the changes are nearly as big as people think they are, all things considered.

And this is not a picture spamming, all of these pictures are all on the topic of the OP's post above. I am not, I repeat, not derailing the thread by talking about a post made by the OP.

Modifié par The Flying Grey Warden, 13 décembre 2013 - 10:52 .

[Gotholhorakh]

Darth Brotarian wrote...

Cassandra looks great, this thread is dumb, and I hate all of you for making me agree with david in the slightest. It'll ruin my perfect track record.

And for the record, I too would think more of this persons worth,



Then I would this guys,



Because anyone can become fat just by not excising and eating poorly. But maintaining a defined healthy physique requires more work, more care, and generally more effort.

And considering the main thing being brought up has been weight, I think this is a fairly good example.

It's interesting, because on the snap judgment impulse, I would think of someone who obviously spends a lot of time at the gym as not having anything more compelling/useful to fill their time with (perhaps mentally lazy or quite dull), or not lusting after anything more intelligent, and if they are a parent, even as someone lazy/selfish/vain.

Also, male gym bunnies just scream insecurity (like an opposite of innate manliness).

Don't get me wrong, I know these rules don't apply at all in real life and are in fact nonsense so I don't mean to offend anyone, but in terms of those terribly misguided snap judgment impulses you're talking about, the ones we all ignore?

Chunky guy/girl wins over coiffeured gym bunny every time.

PS: I just read that back to myself and realised if someone else wrote it I would assume the poster was fat, haha.

Modifié par Gotholhorakh, 13 décembre 2013 - 10:56 .

[The Flying Grey Warden]

If we're on the subject of parenting, I wouldn't trust the fat guy to be a good parent health wise. I mean, if he doesn't watch his weight and health and stuff, hows he gonna make his kids eat healthy and exercise? You don't want your kid getting diabetes and obesity before they even hit their teens now.

EDIT: Oh god we're derailing. Please spare me godmod stan, I didn't mean to do it!

Cassandra should be allowed to have different hair styles!!! Yeah, different hair on the model, so we can better customize her look, though her current hair is fine.

There. Back on topic.

Modifié par The Flying Grey Warden, 13 décembre 2013 - 10:57 .

[Gotholhorakh]

The Flying Grey Warden wrote...

If we're on the subject of parenting, I wouldn't trust the fat guy to be a good parent health wise. I mean, if he doesn't watch his weight and health and stuff, hows he gonna make his kids eat healthy and exercise? You don't want your kid getting diabetes and obesity before they even hit their teens now.

Oh god we're derailing. Please spare me godmod stan, I didn't mean to do it!

Cassandra should be allowed to have different hair styles!!! Yeah, different hair on the model, so we can better customize her look, though her current hair is fine.

There. Back on topic.

Cassandra should look how she did before in my opinion - continuity is as I have said many times, actually important if your USP is your writing.

I take the point about tubby parents, although honestly I usually assume that parents lack time for themselves so don't judge, still dads who are vain = evil. Mothers not so much on that last point, but dads who spend hours at the gym, no no no no wrong. (All in terms of our baseless and unscientific snap judgment impulse, again, so no offense to anyone)

Modifié par Gotholhorakh, 13 décembre 2013 - 11:01 .

[The Flying Grey Warden]

Snap judgements are what snap judgements are, though I wonder why you think being healthy = being vain or why mothers who are vein aren't as evil. But that's off topic.

I don't think enough has been changed to constitute being up in arms, given the following pictures above and how radically different they all came out to be between origins and dragon age 2.

Modifié par The Flying Grey Warden, 13 décembre 2013 - 11:03 .

[Kaiser Arian XVII]

The Flying Grey Warden wrote...

I don't think enough has been changed to constitute being up in arms, given the following pictures above and how radically different they all came out to be between origins and dragon age 2.

It seems that the time difference between DAO and DA2 is over 200 years! Considering the change of styles in Templars, Mages etc.

[hotdogbsg]

 Back on topic, if Cassandra ends up looking like this in the final game I'll be more than happy:



:wub:

Modifié par hotdogbsg, 13 décembre 2013 - 11:22 .

[Gotholhorakh]

The Flying Grey Warden wrote...

Snap judgements are what snap judgements are, though I wonder why you think being healthy = being vain or why mothers who are vein aren't as evil. But that's off topic.

I don't think enough has been changed to constitute being up in arms, given the following pictures above and how radically different they all came out to be between origins and dragon age 2.

Well I think that has its grounding in cultural attitudes towards fathers spending time on childish things like vanity or excessive self-gratification, or perhaps more correctly which things are seen as "OK" - but let's not explore that topic too deeply here for two reasons - firstly it's incredibly out of scope as you rightly say, and secondly it comes close to "gender pollitics" a topic probably best discussed (if it must be!) face to face in better humour and more relaxed mood than has (sadly) become customary on this site. So let's leave that there.

I have to say I'd be with the OP on the change were I invested in the character, it seems quite drastic to me. Are you guys really not seeing it?

Modifié par Gotholhorakh, 13 décembre 2013 - 11:26 .

[Dominus]

*Sigh* I already apologized for that, and admited that the word "abomination" was hyberbole.

Wasn't aware. You can always edit it out if you feel it necessary.

Why shouldnt the artist stay true to the original? There simply wasnt a need to change her THAT much imo. Varric looks spot on, why should Varric get a 95% accuracy in his engine upgrade while Cassandra gets a total appearance change?

The change is noticable, but I wouldn't necessarily call it drastic. Changes more infamous for character design changes between games would be(ironically) from Infamous 2. Here's The Current Infamous 2 Protagonist, Cole Macgrath. And here's the original they had planned for the sequel.

People can look at the DA:I Cassandra and still recognize her instantly as cassandra, despite relatively minor facial changes. The above link, however, shows 2 different beings altogether. It's not the same character they'd played with in the past game, and had justifiable reasons to complain.

Modifié par DominusVita, 13 décembre 2013 - 11:34 .

[Vulpe]

 What I understood from the last 2 pages:

All overweight people are usualy lazy and don't take care of their bodies. There is no chance that some of them might have hypothyroidism or other glandular problems that might need an operation they can't afford. I mean they can totaly control their hormonal secretions and it's not like some really try to get better, but their bodies are against them. Also, there is no chance that they have ilnesses that require a certain drug that makes them fatter and screws their metabolism.

People that take care of their bodies and try to remain in shape are usualy less intelligent and don't try to broden their knowledge. Please tell that to military medics that besides going through similar things like a soldier must also learn all the things that a civilian medic must, take the same exams  and do the same school, but with some army life sprinkled on top.

At least people agree that both are sh*ty parents. It's something.

As for people that :

1) Are just lazy, eat TOO MUCH junk food, are in that condition just because they chose an unhealthy life style and teach their children to be the same way; they shouldn't surprised when they and their children will start to have serious health problems. It's their right to be so, but they are playing a dangerous game with their health.

2) Work hours and hours in the gym - that is a stupid thing to do. Muscles are not developed during the exercices, but after them, in the resting periods. When they workout some of the fibres of the skeletal muscles break (from hear the muscle soreness ). In time they repair by using the nutrients you put in your body  and the muscles get more efficent when it comes to physical effort because the body adapts to the new rutine, from her the bigger muscles - more muscle fibres.
By overworking yourself you'll just damage more tissue than your body can regenerate.

But why am I surprised ? We live in a society where, in many cases, first impresions and looks are so important that they are monopolizing every other aspect a human being might have to offer ( or not ). We are reductant to give them a chance to show us who they really are because we don't like their look or we give them to many because we expect them to be as beautiful on the inside as they are on the outside, contrary to their constantly sh*ty behaviour and personality.

This thread is a proof of my statement.

Modifié par JulianWellpit, 13 décembre 2013 - 11:52 .

[CroGamer002]

She looks very good to me.


*marked for first romance*

[Kaiser Arian XVII]

@Julian, we understand those 2.5 types of fat people.
About working hours in gyms, I think it's stupid too. You only need to do some kind of medium exercise like lifting yourself with your hands and feet from the ground or lifting yourself above a horizontal shaft and you will have an athletic body (you also need some kind of leg exercise).
It takes around 15 minutes a day but also needs resting. In the rest of the day your muscles will be developing themselves. I have somewhat a better body and strength than the guy about the fat guy (those pics), but my stamina isn't much! Stamina needs another kind of exercise.

[Giga Drill BREAKER]

hotdogbsg wrote...

 Back on topic, if Cassandra ends up looking like this in the final game I'll be more than happy:



:wub:

Whats with the picture of the guy, I though we were talking about Cassandra.