711 réponses à ce sujet

[Wayning_Star]

but even IF everything is organized, the basis for a provocative assault upon the catalyst has to have some sort of known criteria to be rational. Destruction is just as unproven as any choices given. There is no way to know what is what with the catalyst, as it's enigmatic as well as the ONLY trustable cosmic power as a resource. So, I'm wondering if we could even destroy it, especially if it's got to agree to self destruct "just" because Shepard says to do so. Why would it do any of that stuff? Who is running the MEU.. it's not the catalyst. lol

[CronoDragoon]

StreetMagic wrote...
I don't necessarily see it as a synthetic problem. The failure in these past cycles is ultimately a problem of Control in general. At least with Leviathan and with the Protheans before us (Javik mentions that their weakness was organizing everything under one Prothean banner).

The same could have happened with this cycle too. It has it's own issues of Control. Krogan uplifted by Salarians, Asari are a remnant of uplift measures by Protheans, etc.. I guess humans are lucky for having only caught the Protheans' eyes - it doesn't look like they did the same to humans as they did the Asari. Humans are a wildcard (or wild fire, if you will), as evolution intended.

As for all the other cycles, maybe the same thing happened as it did with Javik's.

The point is that you say the Leviathan era can't be used, but it's actually the Leviathan era that gives any weight at all to the idea that organics can defeat synthetics (before Shepard's cycle, that is). The Leviathans had real power in the universe then, whereas species that continually were dominated by the Reapers could have only reinforced the Catalyst's premises regarding the superiority of synthetics.

Modifié par CronoDragoon, 18 décembre 2013 - 06:07 .

[General TSAR]

StreetMagic wrote...

General TSAR wrote...

Oblivion to toasters and sexbots!

That's all there is to it.

So you actually choose Destroy to get rid of them specifically.

I'll choose Destroy too, but that's where I differ. I can barely give a **** about Geth or EDI or whoever. I'll kill them to get rid of Reapers, but it's nothing personal. Heh.

I shot the tube to wipe out the Reapers, the Geth were permanently decommissioned in the Rannoch systen by their creators, so the only appliance that was destroyed was the sexbot which was really just the cherry on top of the cake or sundae or whatever.

Modifié par General TSAR, 18 décembre 2013 - 06:11 .

[Sir DeLoria]

General TSAR wrote...

Oblivion to toasters and sexbots!

That's all there is to it.

Amen.

[Wayning_Star]

I think it's an evil plot myself, but... bioware isn't actually saying anything, inside the story or out. lol

the game is an open book with fans writing their versions. Logic dictates a canon though, hard put to run that one past the fan base though... I've never been able to bonafy any association with destroy as working, mainly because the trusted catalyst says it's non-functional. Kind of a semantic trap or a hint as to the actual winner of that canon race. What undermines that theory is the aforementioned problem with who is actually controlling the catalyst AND Shepard in the end game, via the crucible choices. Who ever they are, they're seemingly pushing for synthesis as the ONLY way out of the trap evolution with technology has sprung on the MEU. We don't get to know much really, we don't even know the "reach" of the catalyst or the reapers. They technically could be just about everywhere all at once considering the relays... controlled by the catalyst for a time (long/short? who knows?)

It kind of makes the destroy choice too good(simple) to be true.

[General TSAR]

The writers got backed into a corner and so they had to come up with a deus ex machina to conclude the plot which they then inserted some circular logic nonsense and liberally applied metaphysical junk and voila.

That's the endings, nothing profound, just horrendously bad writing they are trying to pass off as a "too deep for you" standard.

[Wayning_Star]

StreetMagic wrote...

Wayning_Star wrote...

It kind of makes the destroy choice too good(simple) to be true.

Not necessarily. They originally released the game with Destroy being the one that required the most dedication to building up War Assets. Anything less and the galaxy goes down the toilet.

sauce for the goose/gander..lol (that being online gaming) really though I understand that deference, but can imagine many reasons for it. I noticed that if you find all the 'little' things that they added up as well. I figured bioware wanted to make the game more demanding for the more strategic minded players. Logistics rules!!

(I'm too lazy to play out those type of games myself.  )

[jamesp81]

KaiserShep wrote...

Lol, seeming infinite is not infinite.

I met a guy once who thought drinking a fifth of whiskey made him infinite enough to fight three bouncers at once.

He was wrong about that:P

[AlanC9]

StreetMagic wrote...

Not necessarily. They originally released the game with Destroy being the one that required the most dedication to building up War Assets. Anything less and the galaxy Shepard goes down the toilet.

Fixed. Synthesis always needed more EMS than Destroy -- it was only the breath clip that needed more than Synth.

[TigusVidiks]

General TSAR wrote...

The writers got backed into a corner and so they had to come up with a deus ex machina to conclude the plot which they then inserted some circular logic nonsense and liberally applied metaphysical junk and voila.

That's the endings, nothing profound, just horrendously bad writing they are trying to pass off as a "too deep for you" standard.

Unfortunately, that says it all.

[The Twilight God]

rekn2 wrote...

The Twilight God wrote...

spirosz wrote...

Can't replace the spirit, that is all I'm going to say.

But you can replace the Geth spirits?

Organic machines are still machines. Organic matter is made of the same electrons, neutrons and protons as the Geth polymers. The idea that some spirit is linked to a particular configuration of atoms is absurd. Consciousness is consciousness regardless of the vessel. But Bioware reconned the "synthetic destruction" from the script. It just says all technology will be destroyed and all technology clearly wasn't destroyed. Only synthesized material is shown to be effected. The Kid lied.

i still have no clarification on that

The husks disintegrated.

That's it. The "terminators" (which are a product of synthesis) inside the reaper dreadnaughts can be assumed to have disintegrated as the ships (squids) feel over inert. EDI, whose quantum blue box is made out of dead reaper died. No nothing else is show to have been affected by high EMS destroy. Shepard, who is full of tech can survive. The Quarians who are also full of tech supposedly survive. Kasumi is alive whose brain is run by tech supposedly survives. The Normandy and all the various races' ships were still working. The only exception is the relays and citadel which overloaded (an entirely different circumstance). There is no signs whatsoever that anything other that reaperized material was targeted by the space magic.

The Kid said ALL technology would be effected. Was ALL technology effected? I couldn't tell. Maybe some lights blinked for a few seconds maybe? *shrug*

[The Twilight God]

Necanor wrote...

The Twilight God wrote...

spirosz wrote...

Can't replace the spirit, that is all I'm going to say.

But you can replace the Geth spirits?

Organic machines are still machines. Organic matter is made of the same electrons, neutrons and protons as the Geth polymers. The idea that some spirit is linked to a particular configuration of atoms is absurd. Consciousness is consciousness regardless of the vessel. But Bioware reconned the "synthetic destruction" from the script. It just says all technology will be destroyed and all technology clearly wasn't destroyed. Only synthesized material is shown to be effected. The Kid lied.

Synthetics get killed in Destroy, the ending slides confirm that. 

Show me the slide which confirms this and I'll show you the slide confirming that the volus all died when all their suits malfunctioned and they suffocated or exploded.

[The Twilight God]

iakus wrote...

TigusVidiks wrote...

 so what? even if it's the guy behind IT-Con, it's just another guy so unhappy with the actual endings he got, he needs to make up something in his mind to make sense of it all.

Only certain speculations are permitted, dontchaknow?  <_<

Yes. And apparently veiled insults are permitted.

[The Twilight God]

TigusVidiks wrote...

Necanor wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

Don't bother engaging The Twilight God on the point. Read his sig. This is the guy behind IT-Con.

Oh...oh god...thanks Alan, you just saved me a lot of trouble:mellow:

 so what? even if it's the guy behind IT-Con, it's just another guy so unhappy with the actual endings he got, he needs to make up something in his mind to make sense of it all.

I haven't made anything up.

The Kid says nothing about synthetics being destroyed. If you claim otherwise YOU are making things up. Now you're welcome to believe whatever you wish and interpret what you see however you'd like. But it is just your belief. Just like my views are my beliefs. However, I can back my belief with evidence.

[KaiserShep]

The only "evidence" I see here is the lack of a slide or cutscene specifically showing dead geth. Everything else is hugely speculative. Things like focusing on reaper-derived hardware or code or anything of the sort is purely a fan-made theory, so that doesn't reconcile EDI's demise. If one wishes to believe that the geth survived and the catalyst lied, that's fine, but this should come with acceptance of the fact that this is merely head-canon.

Modifié par KaiserShep, 19 décembre 2013 - 05:21 .

[Darks1d3]

Maybe there is more "closure" with the other endings. However I still prefer destroy. Synthesis brings about a boring "utopia", and control has Shepard become the god emperor. But atleast Leto had the good fortune to die after 3500 years and had the chance to remember his humanity near the end. But forever ever stuck as an AI with the starbrat as your only company? That's a special kind of hell.

[durasteel]

I pick blue because I like the color.

No, seriously... the end has no satisfaction to offer. Green and refuse are offensively stupid, to me, but between red and blue... I just don't care. The last moments of the game are far beyond my threshold for suspension of disbelief, so I'm not making a decision for the galaxy, I'm not making a choice as Shepard... I'm just picking a color.

[KaiserShep]

The other endings only really give more closure in terms of Shepard's fate, since we obviously see him/her die beforehand, but I don't recall it being anything more than that.