905 réponses à ce sujet

[Seival]

spirosz wrote...

Seival wrote...

J. Reezy wrote...

spirosz wrote...

Seival, you haven't answered -

spirosz wrote...

Seival have you played Journey or LIMBO?

spirosz wrote...

The reason I ask this, is because those two indie games moved me more than a lot of "AAA" titles ever would and in relation to your argument about budget and what needs to be put in a game to make it meaningful or philosophical -tell me this isn't meaningful - oh wait - it didn't have voice acting.

Nope, and never planning to try.

Only AAA.
Only PS3 and PS4.
Only great stories with best possible visual part.
Multiplayer competitive or cooperative games sometimes, but also AAA-only and PS3/PS4-only.

Wait.  So you're not open-minded then?.  Gotcha.  

Journey is a PS3 exclusive and probably better than most AAA titles released in a long time and it's a two hour experience.  And here - Lacks meaning cause no voice acting right?  Lack story cause no "visual" style up to your par, right?  

I'm arguing your point that only AAA titles can achieve philisophical meanings throughout those experiences, which is obviously false.  

Where did I say that game with poor graphics can't have philosophical meanings?

What I said and repeated a lot of times here, is that great story plus great visual part is always superior to just a great story.

Modifié par Seival, 16 décembre 2013 - 11:05 .

[AresKeith]

Seival wrote...

What I said and repeated a lot of times here, that great story plus great visual part is always superior to just a great story.

lol Nope

[spirosz]

Seival wrote...

 is always superior to just a great story.

^Right there.  That's implying it in every way.  

[Seival]

spirosz wrote...

Honestly Seival, I try to understand your perspective, but the fact that you choose to ignore other games that are just as or in certain cases, more viable in what games can achieve, just... I don't know - I guess I find it amusing that you push for so much, yet lack so much wisdom and value in what other games have to offer. Its sad really.

Try harder

[spirosz]

Seival wrote...

spirosz wrote...

Honestly Seival, I try to understand your perspective, but the fact that you choose to ignore other games that are just as or in certain cases, more viable in what games can achieve, just... I don't know - I guess I find it amusing that you push for so much, yet lack so much wisdom and value in what other games have to offer. Its sad really.

Try harder

Back at you sweetie. 

[Seival]

spirosz wrote...

Seival wrote...

spirosz wrote...

Honestly Seival, I try to understand your perspective, but the fact that you choose to ignore other games that are just as or in certain cases, more viable in what games can achieve, just... I don't know - I guess I find it amusing that you push for so much, yet lack so much wisdom and value in what other games have to offer. Its sad really.

Try harder

Back at you sweetie. 

I'm not trying to understand your perspective, because I understood and accepted it as valid long time ago. But this is not my perspective, and never will be.

[Seival]

J. Reezy wrote...

Seival wrote...

spirosz wrote...

Seival wrote...

spirosz wrote...

Honestly Seival, I try to understand your perspective, but the fact that you choose to ignore other games that are just as or in certain cases, more viable in what games can achieve, just... I don't know - I guess I find it amusing that you push for so much, yet lack so much wisdom and value in what other games have to offer. Its sad really.

Try harder

Back at you sweetie. 

I'm not trying to understand your perspective, because I understood and accepted it as valid long time ago. But this is not my perspective, and never will be.

So you'll forever be a narrow-minded gamer who has a flawed view of the gaming world then? Gotcha. We more open-minded gamer would appreciate it if you would stop spouting your opinions as some kind of absolute truth in the world of video games. Because, as you've implicitly confirmed, you'll never know what you're talking about.

It seems to me that you are talking to the mirror, not to me.

[AresKeith]

Try harder Seival

[Seival]

AresKeith wrote...

Try harder Seival

Don't worry, I'm always trying harder, AresKeith

[spirosz]

That's... what she said.

[Cyonan]

Seival wrote...
Explores, and quite enough for me to recognize the questions I mentioned and think about them for considerable amount of time. I believe that time I spent on playing ME Trilogy is almost equal to the time I spent thinking about ideas behind the story.

And by the way, I believe that Battle for Rannoch proves the Catalyst was right. Why? We both know that peace is a thing that cannot last forever while there are still so many differences in the world. Let's pay our attention not on the possible fact of Shepard calming down both sides, but on the fact of the war on Rannoch itself. The war happened after all the warnings both sides had, and under the Reaper threat. And how often the history will repeat itself? Untill one of the sides will gone forever? Is it possible to stop this from happening once and for all? What exactly causes the war? How to prevent it?... Not an easy questions. And very interesting questions to think about...

...K:SF also asked these questions, and did it in really amazing way. One of the main reasons why I love the story so much.

In your Rannoch example, there is no mention of the idea of "will this peace even last?". They do sort of get into the idea of what caused the war a bit, but not really anything else on your list.

It's fine that you went all philosophical on it, but it should not be confused with that part of the game actually being philosophical.

If you want to explore an idea then explore the idea. Don't just say it and then never go back to it, but have Shepard be unable to stop the war at all no matter how hard you try, or have to make great sacrifices in order to get it done. In the case of video games they're interactive, so let me interact with the idea. Make me virtually experience it as Commander Shepard rather than making the statement and then doing nothing with it.

What you're trying to argue feels a lot like I could make a post that has nothing but "wars are hard to stop" in it, and if somebody spends time thinking about it then I made a very deep and philosophical post.

In reality, I made a simple statement about war and left it at that.

[Seival]

This topic will be really interesting to re-discuss in 10 years or so, after the game development will make a few more steps forwards.

[Br3admax]

Of course graphics and story are great features to have, but how does that inherently make a combination of them better? When I remember a video game, I don't use the number of skin cells that I can see as a basis of its quality. Graphics, for me, will never be as memorable as the story. Graphics are something that will always be one upped and forgotten. Look at KotOR. I love the game to pieces but the graphics in it are worse than just about anything else from that time. Next comes DA. It has better graphics and a story of similar quality. Does that make DA a better game? To me it does not. Sure you can talk about all of the flashy lights, shiny things, and pretty colors that you like, Seiv. And you can continue hope-scotching around on what you think is the "greatest game of all time," like the rest of us have seen you do. We'll continue judging products by the more memorable content given and the story presented.

[AresKeith]

Seival wrote...

This topic will be really interesting to re-discuss in 10 years or so, after the game development will make a few more steps forwards.

Except game developers aren't looking at games from Quantic Dreams for step in directions

And they shouldn't

[spirosz]

Seival wrote...

This topic will be really interesting to re-discuss in 10 years or so, after the game development will make a few more steps forwards.

Yes of course.  New projects like Journey, LIMBO, Beyond and so on.  

[Seival]

AresKeith wrote...

Seival wrote...

This topic will be really interesting to re-discuss in 10 years or so, after the game development will make a few more steps forwards.

Except game developers aren't looking at games from Quantic Dreams for step in directions

And they shouldn't

Time will tell.

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

Seival is like a reverse hipster tbh.

While most hipsters delve deep into the indie scene and claim intellectual superiority because they find games that are thought provoking, Seival delves deep into the most mainstream games that focus on graphics with a modicum of philosophical thought and claims intellectual superiority.

And I have no idea why someone would want to look at Quantic Dream for gameplay. The debate about graphics and "digital acting" aside, QTEs are a blight. Games ought to be moving towards systemic interactivity and combine that with good writing (ala Deus Ex 1), as opposed to railroading.

QTE is even worse than most cinematic heavy games in this regard, because it abolishes the idea of a consistent gameplay platform and replaces it with a "press x to continue" model. A movie would be more convenient in such a scenario.

Has anybody posted that Indigo Prophecy video yet?

I cannot imagine any sane person thinking this is a good model to use, when it comes to designing "gameplay".

(Of course Seival would probably say the only thing wrong with the video is that the graphics are too old.)

Modifié par CrustyBot, 16 décembre 2013 - 11:53 .

[spirosz]

Only good part about that video was the music, haha. The "great!" had me rolling.

[Fast Jimmy]

CrustyBot wrote...

Seival is like a reverse hipster tbh.

While most hipsters delve deep into the indie scene and claim intellectual superiority because they find games that are thought provoking, Seival delves deep into the most mainstream games that focus on graphics with a modicum of philosophical thought and claims intellectual superiority.

And I have no idea why someone would want to look at Quantic Dream for gameplay. The debate about graphics and "digital acting" aside, QTEs are a blight. Games ought to be moving towards systemic interactivity and combine that with good writing (ala Deus Ex 1), as opposed to railroading.

QTE is even worse than most cinematic heavy games in this regard, because it abolishes the idea of a consistent gameplay platform and replaces it with a "press x to continue" model. A movie would be more convenient in such a scenario.

Has anybody posted that Indigo Prophecy video yet?

I cannot imagine any sane person thinking this is a good model to use, when it comes to designing "gameplay".

(Of course Seival would probably say the only thing wrong with the video is that the graphics are too old.)

Well... to be fair... Farenheit/Indigo Prophecy was a really amazing game, in my humblest opinion. Because, despite all that quicktime nonsense (the game WAS saturated with it), it was also acceptable to fail in many cases. The endgame has scenes where it is, quite literally, impossible to win, even with cheats. Yet the game presents it as a game where your will/power contests with someone else who you, in all reality, should have no chance at beating.

In addition, even when you can win (like the scene you have here) and you lose, it's not an instant game over in almost any instance. The game's idea of "mental health" means by doing basic things... like cleaning up your bloody clothes after you are mind controlled to murder someone... helps improve your mental health, while failing at things costs you mental health. Since holding your won against a barrage of attacks in your apartment keeps you more sane, success here keeps your health high. Taking a beating (like I did when i played it) meant your health drops.  Heck, in one case, where you are being psychically attacked to see visions of monsters while you are in a discussion with your boss, FAILING the quick time event (not pressing anything at all) meant your character did not try and dodge any of the unseen creatures... meaning he was not harmed and he remained calm and cool looking,so his boss did not see him as someone losing his mind, which INCREASED your mental health score.

I detest QTEs with a passion, but if a game was going to have them as a foundation of their gameplay, you could do a LOT worse than Indigo Prophecy. In my opinion, of course.

Modifié par Fast Jimmy, 17 décembre 2013 - 12:11 .