891 réponses à ce sujet

[Master Warder Z_]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

Oh it did. I was in the discussion. I can't be bothered with finding a years old forum post though. So you can either take my word for it, or leave it.

David Gaider wrote...

The issue is this:

By the time the Right of Annulment is invoked, the tower in question has moved beyond the possibility of mages being brought under control enough that Tranquility would even be possible. It's possible some mages might survive the initial assault, but the order cannot be "take any prisoners you can" simply because by that point a mage might have been corrupted and become a blood mage... something which cannot be detected under normal circumstances. Thus capturing them becomes a means for them to escape the quarantine.

So therefore the order is "kill everyone". At the end of the day, if any mages are still alive for whatever reason... then, yes, I imagine they could theroretically be made Tranquil as opposed to executed outright.

Horray!

Merely provide a link and a page and i will scan through and acknowledge it.

I mean sure it's just theoritical and thus has limited to no bearing on the reality of DA but still it came from Gaider so has the weight of "possiblity" behind it.

I never mind having new information that proves old idea's wrong.

[Medhia Nox]

Gaider's posts always illuminate just how much headcanon goes around these boards.

[TEWR]

Here ya go

Very bottom of the first page.

[Master Warder Z_]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

Here ya go

Very bottom of the first page.

Acknowledged.

As i said not an official part of the lore but it has gaider backing the theocritical concept.

But who knows if it will even be an idea backed by him today? Bioware within this universe has retconned, and bent and twisted the lore into a basically unrecognizable shape.

But still at least the point was proven that it was indeed mentioned and an idea given by him.

[Lotion Soronarr]

thetinyevil wrote...
Right. Sure. Yeah.

Most amazing reply ever.

So deep.
So detailed.
Such wit and genius.

[d1ta]

I support peace between Mages and Templars.. Although how and through what kind of process / agreement, I honestly don't know.
But I do wish that the mages get to see their family every now and then or maybe even give them a chance to form their own family. That's all I could think of atm.

[Nightdragon8]

SgtSteel91 wrote...

But if Hawke sides with the Mages then Cullen lets him go too. With mages like Merrill, Bethany if she's in the Circle, and Anders if they live at the end.

Well considering Hawke and crew pretty much wiped out a bunch of templars and a effectivly OP Meridith, trying to arest him now would just get everyone else killed.


I do have a question, So is the "only" way to learn blood magic is making a contract with a demon? Or can you use it without ever contacting a demon in learning how to use it.

Because if you require a contract kind of thing then I could understand why bloodmagic could be extremely bad other than the fact that it pretty much makes Templar magic resistance useless. (at least the way it potrayed in the games cutscenes)

Modifié par Nightdragon8, 20 décembre 2013 - 10:50 .

[TEWR]

Nightdragon8 wrote...


I do have a question, So is the "only" way to learn blood magic is making a contract with a demon? Or can you use it without ever contacting a demon in learning how to use it.

Because if you require a contract kind of thing then I could understand why bloodmagic could be extremely bad other than the fact that it pretty much makes Templar magic resistance useless. (at least the way it potrayed in the games cutscenes)

There are books on the subject, which is how Jowan learned, though they're rare. And the Chantry went to great lengths to destroy any and all tomes on the subject when blood magic was made illegal. Demons are merely the quickest way to learn blood magic, as the arcane arts are eternal in the Fade (Torpor's introductory statements are clear on this).

That's also why Demons have been harder to fight for the Templars lately. There was a time when the Templars and Mages would work together against the Demons, but the Demons adapted -- particularly Pride Demons -- and now it's mostly the Templars who do the work.

I imagine a few mages also tried to make a break for it, which might've also had something to do with the lack of mages now being used to fight Demons with the Templars.

[Jaison1986]

Blood mages can teach other mages how to use it as well. In the circle quest is suggested Uldred was the only one that made an deal with the demon, and all the other blood mages learned it from him. Though, it seems there are dangers only from learning it, as it seems blood mages are so powerful that they easily attract the attention from demons then an regular mage would. And apparently blood mages feel an natural desire to become more powerful, so weak willed blood mages are corrupted by it.

[thetinyevil]

Blood Magic is also a slippery slope.

[dragonflight288]

thetinyevil wrote...

Blood Magic is also a slippery slope.

You won't find anyone, not even mage supporters who approve of blood magic, that will say otherwise. Some believe that its potential benefits surpass the dangers when used by an experienced mage and if they agree to have far less freedoms or agree to be checked on by templars with much higher regularity in order to practice it legally....like using it for research purposes on how to best combat demons or other blood mages or the like.

[Nightdragon8]

dragonflight288 wrote...

thetinyevil wrote...

Blood Magic is also a slippery slope.

You won't find anyone, not even mage supporters who approve of blood magic, that will say otherwise. Some believe that its potential benefits surpass the dangers when used by an experienced mage and if they agree to have far less freedoms or agree to be checked on by templars with much higher regularity in order to practice it legally....like using it for research purposes on how to best combat demons or other blood mages or the like.

for me its, whos blood are you using. If you are using your own then I don't really have any issues, cause your the one paying the price for using it. Letting volentiers as in those that want to help you atain a goal help you I don't have any issues but, when people get pushed or used without there concent is bad/evil so.

Any sort of power is a slippery slope, I'm sure normal magic is the same way. Its just limited to the power of the mage using it.

So, this just runs into the debate of blood magic is "evil" or just a tool a mage can do, I rest on the tool side, cause anything can be used to kill another person even your hands, so. *shrugs*

The biggest issue then is demons, can Templars sense when a demon in a mage?

[Lord Raijin]

dragonflight288 wrote...

thetinyevil wrote...

Blood Magic is also a slippery slope.

You won't find anyone, not even mage supporters who approve of blood magic, that will say otherwise. Some believe that its potential benefits surpass the dangers when used by an experienced mage and if they agree to have far less freedoms or agree to be checked on by templars with much higher regularity in order to practice it legally....like using it for research purposes on how to best combat demons or other blood mages or the like.

I don't have a problem with using blood magic for as long as it's used in a responsible way, and that the mage who's using it knows what they're doing, and shows respect for the art.

[Lotion Soronarr]

dragonflight288 wrote...

thetinyevil wrote...

Blood Magic is also a slippery slope.

You won't find anyone, not even mage supporters who approve of blood magic, that will say otherwise. Some believe that its potential benefits surpass the dangers when used by an experienced mage and if they agree to have far less freedoms or agree to be checked on by templars with much higher regularity in order to practice it legally....like using it for research purposes on how to best combat demons or other blood mages or the like.

I found quite a few.....

[Medhia_Nox]

@Lord Raijin: Soo...... Quentin?

[SgtSteel91]

Medhia_Nox wrote...

@Lord Raijin: Soo...... Quentin?

Merrill, too. She learned blood magic primarily to power a healing spell she used when building her Eluvian.

A lot of people get, rightly, hung up on the mind control and demon summoning aspects of blood magic when in the begining it was used to power spells that would have needed more magic or lyrium than a mage could provide.

Modifié par SgtSteel91, 20 décembre 2013 - 06:29 .

[The Elder King]

SgtSteel91 wrote...

Medhia_Nox wrote...

@Lord Raijin: Soo...... Quentin?

Merrill, too. She learned blood magic primarily to power a healing spell she used when building her Eluvian.

I think Medhia was begin sarcastic. Quentin isn't at all a good example of a blood mage.

[Medhia_Nox]

@hhh89: I was, but I was also trying to point out that I'm sure he (Quentin) believed he was doing the right thing and treating blood magic with respect.

How do you determine ANY of those variables that Lord Raijin states would make blood magic "okay".

For myself - there isn't ever a reason blood magic should be used by a competent mage capable of real magic.

Modifié par Medhia_Nox, 20 décembre 2013 - 06:34 .

[The Elder King]

@Medhia Nox: well, I think that Quentin believed he was doing the right thing, but he was also insane. It's not probably a good example to show if a blood mage thinks what he's doing is right.
I'd say that maybe what Lord Raijin means to use BM in a responsible way is to not use it to take advantages on people or hurting them unless it's necessary for defending themselves.
Though I don't have a clue what he meant with 'respecting the art'.

Modifié par hhh89, 20 décembre 2013 - 06:41 .

[Karlone123]

It's fun to debate the mage-templar ethics ingame, but not so fun when people go too far and totally destroy my whole reason for being here.

[Lord Raijin]

Medhia_Nox wrote...

@Lord Raijin: Soo...... Quentin?

I'm not a big fan of the R.o.T but in Quentin case, I would make an exception. The man was too dangerous and his mind was not down to earth. He is far from being responsible.

[Medhia_Nox]

@Lord Raijin: And yet someone on here suggested his mad experiments had great applications for the future.

So.... would the end justify the means? Did you Tranquil someone who you would later canonize as the first "Doctor of Tranplant Blood Magic?"

For me - the end does not justify how Quentin got there.

I have yet to see a Blood Mage who fits your description.

[Asdrubael Vect]

HiroVoid wrote...

This is a thread dedicated to how the mages and templars can finally resolve their differences to form a new cohesive alliance without the need for mass killing or genocide on either side.  For the most part, I have seen people generally agree templars of some form need to stick around while most templar supporters have agreed that the circle system needs to be reformed or improved to some degree especially in comparison to that of Kirkwall's circle.  The big point is finding that right compromise or point in between.  This topic is also for the express purpose of how to establish that form of an alliance and the details it would involve.  Saying there can be no alliance will be considered spam.

Tevinter system is the only solution. Others will sooner start another similar conflict with mages and templars

thre is will be no alliance(only inprisoning) betwen them because this is impossible then Orlais Templar Order(persons with their educations propaganda and with their holy rights and freedoms "to do anything with mages" who are not have equil rights even with common peoples) exist...the solution is destroing Orlais Templar Order and reforming to Imperrium Templar Order

[Afro_Explosion]

Dark Korsar wrote...

HiroVoid wrote...

This is a thread dedicated to how the mages and templars can finally resolve their differences to form a new cohesive alliance without the need for mass killing or genocide on either side.  For the most part, I have seen people generally agree templars of some form need to stick around while most templar supporters have agreed that the circle system needs to be reformed or improved to some degree especially in comparison to that of Kirkwall's circle.  The big point is finding that right compromise or point in between.  This topic is also for the express purpose of how to establish that form of an alliance and the details it would involve.  Saying there can be no alliance will be considered spam.

Tevinter system is the only solution. Others will sooner start another similar conflict with mages and templars

thre is will be no alliance(only inprisoning) betwen them because this is impossible then Orlais Templar Order(persons with their educations propaganda and with their holy rights and freedoms "to do anything with mages" who are not have equil rights even with common peoples) exist...the solution is destroing Orlais Templar Order and reforming to Imperrium Templar Order

The tevinter system doesnt work at all, the mages hold power over the templars and they are only allowed to step in during extreme cases they don't even have lyrium they're just templars in name.

[thetinyevil]

Medhia_Nox wrote...

@Lord Raijin: And yet someone on here suggested his mad experiments had great applications for the future.

So.... would the end justify the means? Did you Tranquil someone who you would later canonize as the first "Doctor of Tranplant Blood Magic?"

For me - the end does not justify how Quentin got there.

I have yet to see a Blood Mage who fits your description.

As disgusting and horrible Quentin's research was there would be positive medical uses for it. Like reatching severed limbs to people, organ transplants along with a whole host of other things. I am in no way saying I approve what he did but some of what he learned could help people.