750 réponses à ce sujet

[leaguer of one]

Akka le Vil wrote...

leaguer of one wrote...

Then clearly their is a right way and wrong way to do it. The way Zaeed's dlc was done is the right way to do . Why can't you say day one dlc is fine as long as it's done like the cerberus network dlc or shale's dlc?

Actually the good way to implement Shale would have been a patch and not a DLC.
And I don't support the entire concept of DLC (or to be more precise, of what most people think about when we speak of DLC, as basically anything is strictly speaking "downloadable content" these days).
Tacking on small part of content through micro-transactions and adding a clustercrap of little boni is just a ****ty way of milking the game, and tend to lower considerably the actual quality of the said content - most DLC are simply craptastick, I think only LotSB was actually okay in the entire Bioware history.

Longer, bigger, cohesive full expansions are the only reliable way I've seen to add to a game.

Wrong. Do you know how many people get upset over on disk dlc. That literly is holding content hostage. That's worse then day one dlc.

You clearly bias on the notion. How who it be an issue with microtransactions if it about getting content for no extra cost for buying the game new?

[Yobel]

themikefest wrote...

It doesn't bother me if its day 1 dlc or day 100 dlc. I will still purchase it.

Shoot me with a shotgun in a face. Right now. Or better yet, shoot that guy.

[Gregolian]

Navasha wrote...

I like Day 1 DLC, so your very opening statement is clearly false. In fact, I hope they do MORE Day 1 DLC.

I don't want to have to wait until I have already completed the game to find new DLC being released, I would prefer all the EXTRA content there on even my very first playthrough.

The only thing wrong with day 1 DLC is the ill-conceived concept put out there by people who don't want to pay a few extra bucks for a better game, that it is somehow "cut" content. I certainly don't want companies to stop producing extra content because a few "fans" don't understand the concept behind it.

The issue I have with Day 1 DLC is it feels like a cash in.

I agree I would want all the DLC before I finish the game BUT, I really don't want to have Day 1 DLC I have to pay for.

Course, I'll probably end up purchasing a season pass if available.

The main issue with a lot of Day 1 DLC is it feels like stuff that was supposed to be in the game from the beginning but got cut.

[Toasted Llama]

"I bought a game that has 19 hours of content for 60 bucks but an extra 1 hour of content for 10 bucks is being cut from the game! Blasphemy! The company owes me that extra hour of content because the content is cut from the game before release and I paid for the whole 20 hours!"

No.

No, you don't.

The company's decide what you pay for. Don't like what they offer? Don't buy it. Simple as that. If the company wants to make extra money from that 1 hour of game content and you think that is shady/mean/trying to milk you/not what you paid for, then don't buy the game at all.

[Chrom72]

I don't mind Day 1 DLC if it's done right. DAO had quite a few companions already, so it's not like someone who bought the game used and didn't want to buy Shale missed out on that much, or could feel like they bought an incomplete experience. In other words, it was a complete game without Shale. Same goes for Zaeed in ME2. Without Javik though ME3 felt a bit incomplete. There weren't many squadmates for ME3 comparatively to other Bioware games, so it probably would have been better to have him on the main game to start with.

So I guess what I'm trying to say is that I don't mind if the game has Day 1 DLC if it's obvious that it couldn't quite be finished in time and the game still feels like a complete product without it. Otherwise I'm not a particular fan of it.

[Eurypterid]

Akka le Vil wrote...
I do accept the point for Shale, which was offered for free after the release of the game.
I can't accept it for Javik, where they milked people as far as they could.

As I said, whether it should be offered for sale is a separate issue.

Akka le Vil wrote...
Most overused and cliché counter-argument ever.
People happily accepting to be milked are basically the definition of being sheeps, so the trite attempt at relativism is very weak and unconvincing.

Yeah, almost as overused and trite as the assertion that people are sheep just because they're willing to pay for something that you're not.

For what it's worth I don't particularly like day 1 DLC either (at least not Day 1 DLC that you have to buy) and I certainly won't buy it.

[Navasha]

Gregolian wrote...

The issue I have with Day 1 DLC is it feels like a cash in.

I agree I would want all the DLC before I finish the game BUT, I really don't want to have Day 1 DLC I have to pay for.

Course, I'll probably end up purchasing a season pass if available.

The main issue with a lot of Day 1 DLC is it feels like stuff that was supposed to be in the game from the beginning but got cut.

Let me ask you something.    Do you ever get upset when Hollywood releases an 'extended' version of a movie for more money than the regular version?    Was the regular version not a complete and whole movie?    All of the footage in an 'extended' version was all filmed at the same time as the rest of the movie.    Someone simply put some money into going back and taking all the scraps off the cutting room floor and finalizes some of those scenes to put "back" into the movie.  

That's basically what DLC is for games.   Someone gives the developer an extra hunk of cash so that they can fully develop some of the features that were left on the cutting room floor.   A year out from release, some producer says, "okay, we initially planned for this character and this feature, but there is currently no way to fit those into the final cut of the game and make the budgets."    Someone else (usually the publisher or other investor) says, "Well, what if I gave you a bit more cash so that you could hire a few more people to develop that character and features, and in exchange you could market it as a optional DLC." 

That's what you are getting... features and characters that were already conceptualized but DROPPED from the original game plan due to monetary and time constraints.   Those are the features that you are getting added BACK into the game.   They were NEVER going to appear in the game without the DLC.   I am not sure why so many have such a difficult time understanding this.

[slimgrin]

Is it too much to ask they do it like they did for DA:O? I suspect it is, because that content was substantial and free. The problem isn't day one DLC, it's what passes for paid DLC under EA. The most trivial sh*t gets charged for. And yet gamers here argue to no end for this lame-ass business model. It's like people here are begging EA to treat them like wallets. I don't get it.

Modifié par slimgrin, 21 décembre 2013 - 08:40 .

[Gregolian]

Navasha wrote...

Gregolian wrote...

The issue I have with Day 1 DLC is it feels like a cash in.

I agree I would want all the DLC before I finish the game BUT, I really don't want to have Day 1 DLC I have to pay for.

Course, I'll probably end up purchasing a season pass if available.

The main issue with a lot of Day 1 DLC is it feels like stuff that was supposed to be in the game from the beginning but got cut.

Let me ask you something.    Do you ever get upset when Hollywood releases an 'extended' version of a movie for more money than the regular version?    Was the regular version not a complete and whole movie?    All of the footage in an 'extended' version was all filmed at the same time as the rest of the movie.    Someone simply put some money into going back and taking all the scraps off the cutting room floor and finalizes some of those scenes to put "back" into the movie.  

That's basically what DLC is for games.   Someone gives the developer an extra hunk of cash so that they can fully develop some of the features that were left on the cutting room floor.   A year out from release, some producer says, "okay, we initially planned for this character and this feature, but there is currently no way to fit those into the final cut of the game and make the budgets."    Someone else (usually the publisher or other investor) says, "Well, what if I gave you a bit more cash so that you could hire a few more people to develop that character and features, and in exchange you could market it as a optional DLC." 

That's what you are getting... features and characters that were already conceptualized but DROPPED from the original game plan due to monetary and time constraints.   Those are the features that you are getting added BACK into the game.   They were NEVER going to appear in the game without the DLC.   I am not sure why so many have such a difficult time understanding this.

The Hollywood extended releases are just as much cash ins but quite often stuff is cut because no one wants to watch walking for 4 hours instead of 2 (LOTR and Hobbit).  It's still a damn cash in.

The Day 1 DLC I take issue with is the random weapons like in Assassin's Creed games or Dragon Age II, the random weapons in ME3 (I didn't have an issue with the Protheon companion as much), the worst though in my opinion is what EA has done with Battlefield and how some maps are DLC on Day 1.


Things like Awakenings, Argarramak or however you spell it, and the Legacy DLC I don't have a major issue with as those are several more hours of gameplay and are almost complete games unto themselves.  I take issue when it's for weapons and characters that don't really add to the story at all and feel like they are nickel and diming us as customers.

[Little Princess Peach]

I would like day one dlc to be different instead of a new char how about some lovely items or new pets

[Navasha]

@Gregolian - Well, we can agree there at least. I never buy the weapon/armor packs for games. I don't see the point in them. I would pay $10-$20 bucks for new missions/characters, but not a dime for a fancy looking blade.

Never played Battlefield so can't speak for maps. Generally, not multiplayer person.

[Vandicus]

Hmmm, more content made, or less content made. Decisions decisions. I think I'll go with having more content made, so Day 1 DLC please.

[slimgrin]

Vandicus wrote...

Hmmm, more content made, or less content made. Decisions decisions. I think I'll go with having more content made, so Day 1 DLC please.

Despite Bioware devs like Gaider constantly whinging about a lack of resources, EA is one of the richest publishers in the industry. The content likely gets made no matter what.

[Vandicus]

slimgrin wrote...

Vandicus wrote...

Hmmm, more content made, or less content made. Decisions decisions. I think I'll go with having more content made, so Day 1 DLC please.

Despite Bioware devs like Gaider constantly whinging about a lack of resources, EA is one of the richest publishers in the industry. The content likely gets made no matter what.

Why would they devote resources after the game is finished to something they don't plan on selling?

[slimgrin]

Vandicus wrote...

slimgrin wrote...

Vandicus wrote...

Hmmm, more content made, or less content made. Decisions decisions. I think I'll go with having more content made, so Day 1 DLC please.

Despite Bioware devs like Gaider constantly whinging about a lack of resources, EA is one of the richest publishers in the industry. The content likely gets made no matter what.

Why would they devote resources after the game is finished to something they don't plan on selling?

It's cut content, later polished for release as DLC. It's not all done after release.

[AtreiyaN7]

*rolleyes*

[ghostzodd]

EA SHILLS  ASSEMBLE

[slimgrin]

Vandicus wrote...

slimgrin wrote...

Vandicus wrote...

Hmmm, more content made, or less content made. Decisions decisions. I think I'll go with having more content made, so Day 1 DLC please.

Despite Bioware devs like Gaider constantly whinging about a lack of resources, EA is one of the richest publishers in the industry. The content likely gets made no matter what.

Why would they devote resources after the game is finished to something they don't plan on selling?

I don't know. Ask Laidlaw, Gaider, any of the devs. I've been on this forum for several years now. The number one reason I see is: not enough resources. Bioware is apparantly constantly lacking resources. They never have enough resources. Cloth physics? Not enough resources. Hair physics? Not enough resources. Branching dilaog? Not enough resources. It's like EA is barely getting by for these guys...except multilplayer. They have plenty of resources for that.

[Ridwan]

I understand the term **** more and more. Let's say DA: Inquisition is going to turn into a massive disappointment. Would that anger you lot cause you all pre-ordered it with who knows how many collectibles and DLC added to it?

Edit: Wow, the word is censored?

Modifié par M25105, 21 décembre 2013 - 10:06 .

[Heimdall]

Remember, time is a resource. The longer a game is in development the more money its development consumes. They can't add everything they want to. Lots of things end of stripped from the game, like Shale, because they just don't have time to finish implementing them until after the game is sent in for certification. Certainly they can plan DLC in advance and put in character models(Like Javik) but it's a mistake to think that's evidence that they could have necessarily included all of it the main game.

If you have an issue with how much they charge for them, that's a separate issue.

Modifié par Lord Aesir, 21 décembre 2013 - 10:26 .

[slimgrin]

Lord Aesir wrote...

Remember, time is a resource.

Time and money. I'm sure EA is just barely getting by with both.

[addiction21]

slimgrin wrote...


I don't know. Ask Laidlaw, Gaider, any of the devs. I've been on this forum for several years now. The number one reason I see is: not enough resources. Bioware is apparantly constantly lacking resources. They never have enough resources. Cloth physics? Not enough resources. Hair physics? Not enough resources. Branching dilaog? Not enough resources. It's like EA is barely getting by for these guys...except multilplayer. They have plenty of resources for that.

And in all those years you still have not learned to listen. Its not about having enough resources. Its about not having enough resources to do everything and anything ever fan on the forums asks for.

slimgrin wrote...

Lord Aesir wrote...

Remember, time is a resource.

Time and money. I'm sure EA is just barely getting by with both.

Sorry to burst that ignorant bubble but EA does not have unlimited resources and BIoWare is not their only label they can rain their limited resources on.

[In Exile]

Akka le Vil wrote...

Longer, bigger, cohesive full expansions are the only reliable way I've seen to add to a game.

That's a brilliant idea! It's a great way to keep a team-working during the long and un-even process of game development, and a great way to get value out of cut-content! You develop that cut-content into a separate game add-on. 

I wonder what would happen if they sold that through digital distribution. It would be some sort of paid content that you could download, provided you had the money and internet connection. Maybe we could call it "paid content for download"... or paid "download-able" content. Hmm.... 

Of course, it's hard to recoup the value of development costs for an expansion to a game. So perhaps developers could release content as a form of "episodes", for a lesser price-point. 

So we might have episodic paid download-able content. Why, if there's a separate budget for it, they might even develop it in parallel with the game, because different times work at different times and would otherwise be standing on their hands. 

[slimgrin]

addiction21 wrote...

slimgrin wrote...


I don't know. Ask Laidlaw, Gaider, any of the devs. I've been on this forum for several years now. The number one reason I see is: not enough resources. Bioware is apparantly constantly lacking resources. They never have enough resources. Cloth physics? Not enough resources. Hair physics? Not enough resources. Branching dilaog? Not enough resources. It's like EA is barely getting by for these guys...except multilplayer. They have plenty of resources for that.

And in all those years you still have not learned to listen. Its not about having enough resources. Its about not having enough resources to do everything and anything ever fan on the forums asks for.

slimgrin wrote...

Lord Aesir wrote...

Remember, time is a resource.

Time and money. I'm sure EA is just barely getting by with both.

Sorry to burst that ignorant bubble but EA does not have unlimited resources and BIoWare is not their only label they can rain their limited resources on.

Hello schill.

Modifié par slimgrin, 21 décembre 2013 - 10:41 .