42 réponses à ce sujet

[sr2josh]

Which is the larger and more powerful warship?

[General TSAR]

Geth Dreadnought.

[cap and gown]

How can there be any question? The DA got itself blown away by a bunch of regular Geth cruisers, where as the Quarians barely dented the Dreadnaught.

[General TSAR]

cap and gown wrote...

How can there be any question? The DA got itself blown away by a bunch of regular Geth cruisers, where as the Quarians barely dented the Dreadnaught.

Exactly.

Case Closed.

[sr2josh]

General TSAR wrote...

cap and gown wrote...

How can there be any question? The DA got itself blown away by a bunch of regular Geth cruisers, where as the Quarians barely dented the Dreadnaught.

Exactly.

Case Closed.

What doesn't make sense about this is how the Alliance cruisers and frigates came in and basically beat the Geth like hunters clubbing baby seals.

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

It's the Destiny Ascension.

I also forgot to mention --- they were asari. They were not special. The reason the Alliance Kicked Ass was because -- HUMANS ARE SPECIAL.

A bunch of cruisers could take out that Geth cruiser too.

The DA had more firepower in its main gun than the entire Asari fleet combined. The Asari fleet had 19 dreadnoughts. I am quoting our resident ship expert Joker. The DA was a reaper killer. It could probably take down a Reaper Capital ship in one clean shot from its main gun - that's right Sovereign. The problem was it never got in a clean shot. The Citadel fleet is just a patrol fleet to protect the Citadel. It is not the entire combined fleets of the entire galaxy. It is elements contributed of turian fleet, alliance fleet, and the Destiny Ascension. They were overwhelmed by the sheer number of Geth that attacked. I don't care how powerful a single ship is, it can get taken out if it is overwhelmed by sheer numbers.

Now the Geth Dreadnought was simply video game logic to put the entire onus on Commander Shepard. Why? Because Thanix weapons were equipped on the Quarian Fleet. What do thanix weapons do? They ignore Kinetic Barriers. How could "more intelligence" and a reaper signal prevent Thanix weapons from penetrating Kinetic Barriers. I know! Because Commander Shepard had to save the day and show how stupid the Quarians were so you could understand how cute and cuddly the Geth victims were. That's how badly written that story arc is.

Modifié par sH0tgUn jUliA, 23 décembre 2013 - 01:21 .

[Astartes Marine]

Makai81 wrote...
What doesn't make sense about this is how the Alliance cruisers and frigates came in and basically beat the Geth like hunters clubbing baby seals.

For one thing Alliance ships have better overall firepower than Asari ships, also a massed attack from the rear with a full on barrage of cannon/torpedo fire with the element of surprise aided the success.

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

Astartes Marine wrote...

Makai81 wrote...
What doesn't make sense about this is how the Alliance cruisers and frigates came in and basically beat the Geth like hunters clubbing baby seals.

For one thing Alliance ships have better overall firepower than Asari ships, also a massed attack from the rear with a full on barrage of cannon/torpedo fire with the element of surprise aided the success.

Where does it say the Alliance ships have better overall firepower?

[themikefest]

The Destiny Ascension is larger and the Dreadnought is more powerful since we don't see the ascension firing any of its weapons.

Why didn't the ascension fire its weapons at the Geth? Ususally when someone fires at me I fire back regardless of the circumstances.

[KaiserShep]

To be fair, the Destiny Ascension was blitzed by a swarm of geth ships as Sovereign tore right through the turian patrols. Even if it was able of responding in kind, it was surrounded and on its own. In a straight knife fight in orbit, the geth dreadnought would probably lay the DA to waste. The geth don't have to worry about things like failing life support or the increasing temperature due to all the weapons discharge.

Modifié par KaiserShep, 23 décembre 2013 - 01:49 .

[themikefest]

KaiserShep wrote...

To be fair, the Destiny Ascension was blitzed by a swarm of geth ships as Sovereign tore right through the turian patrols. Even if it was able of responding in kind, it was surrounded and on its own. In a straight knife fight in orbit, the geth dreadnought would probably lay the DA to waste. The geth don't have to worry about things like failing life support or the increasing temperature due to all the weapons discharge.

In a cutscene it shows the Ascension flying around for whatever reason.after the Geth and Sovereign show up. Regardless if its being swarmed or on its own the ship made no attempt to fire back. It just seems like the Asari Commander of the ship had a panic attack and didn't know what to do.

Modifié par themikefest, 23 décembre 2013 - 01:56 .

[trenq]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

It's the Destiny Ascension.

I also forgot to mention --- they were asari. They were not special. The reason the Alliance Kicked Ass was because -- HUMANS ARE SPECIAL.

A bunch of cruisers could take out that Geth cruiser too.

The DA had more firepower in its main gun than the entire Asari fleet combined. The Asari fleet had 19 dreadnoughts. I am quoting our resident ship expert Joker. The DA was a reaper killer. It could probably take down a Reaper Capital ship in one clean shot from its main gun - that's right Sovereign. The problem was it never got in a clean shot. The Citadel fleet is just a patrol fleet to protect the Citadel. It is not the entire combined fleets of the entire galaxy. It is elements contributed of turian fleet, alliance fleet, and the Destiny Ascension. They were overwhelmed by the sheer number of Geth that attacked. I don't care how powerful a single ship is, it can get taken out if it is overwhelmed by sheer numbers.

Now the Geth Dreadnought was simply video game logic to put the entire onus on Commander Shepard. Why? Because Thanix weapons were equipped on the Quarian Fleet. What do thanix weapons do? They ignore Kinetic Barriers. How could "more intelligence" and a reaper signal prevent Thanix weapons from penetrating Kinetic Barriers. I know! Because Commander Shepard had to save the day and show how stupid the Quarians were so you could understand how cute and cuddly the Geth victims were. That's how badly written that story arc is.

that

[Sir DeLoria]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

It's the Destiny Ascension.

I also forgot to mention --- they were asari. They were not special. The reason the Alliance Kicked Ass was because -- HUMANS ARE SPECIAL.

A bunch of cruisers could take out that Geth cruiser too.

The DA had more firepower in its main gun than the entire Asari fleet combined. The Asari fleet had 19 dreadnoughts. I am quoting our resident ship expert Joker. The DA was a reaper killer. It could probably take down a Reaper Capital ship in one clean shot from its main gun - that's right Sovereign. The problem was it never got in a clean shot. The Citadel fleet is just a patrol fleet to protect the Citadel. It is not the entire combined fleets of the entire galaxy. It is elements contributed of turian fleet, alliance fleet, and the Destiny Ascension. They were overwhelmed by the sheer number of Geth that attacked. I don't care how powerful a single ship is, it can get taken out if it is overwhelmed by sheer numbers.

Now the Geth Dreadnought was simply video game logic to put the entire onus on Commander Shepard. Why? Because Thanix weapons were equipped on the Quarian Fleet. What do thanix weapons do? They ignore Kinetic Barriers. How could "more intelligence" and a reaper signal prevent Thanix weapons from penetrating Kinetic Barriers. I know! Because Commander Shepard had to save the day and show how stupid the Quarians were so you could understand how cute and cuddly the Geth victims were. That's how badly written that story arc is.

[cap and gown]

Shotgun Julia brings up another important point: the Dreadnaught had plot armor, the DA didn't. Anyone or thing with plot armor is always more powerful than anyone or thing wearing a red shirt.

[General TSAR]

Makai81 wrote...
What doesn't make sense about this is how the Alliance cruisers and frigates came in and basically beat the Geth like hunters clubbing baby seals.

Humans uber alles and the Asari suck at building capital ships.

[ImaginaryMatter]

StreetMagic wrote...

cap and gown wrote...

Shotgun Julia brings up another important point: the Dreadnaught had plot armor, the DA didn't. Anyone or thing with plot armor is always more powerful than anyone or thing wearing a red shirt.

The DA has plot armor, but it's more elaborate and tries to get under your skin over time. The whole game is pushing you in different directions about humanity's role in the galaxy. One minute Shep wants hot alien sex, the next he "won't be a puppet of the Asari!!" Saving the DA is kind of a testament how much you want to get into Liara's pants (or already got into them). A testament to how much you see rainbows and butterflies and galactic cooperation when you think of the Council. A testament that you adopted Turian ideals of finding nobility in duty and sacrfice. Garrus admonishes Kaidan that Turians would happily wear L2 impants. People will appreciate humans more if they do these things. And they'll appreciate it if you throw your fleet in to save everyone.

It doesn't have to play out that way necessarily, but I think that's the undertone going on there. And it's very strong. The plot armor only falls apart if you don't give a sh*t about any of the above. And more power to you, if that's the case.

Can you clarify that a little?

[Slayer299]

trenq wrote...

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

It's the Destiny Ascension.

I also forgot to mention --- they were asari. They were not special. The reason the Alliance Kicked Ass was because -- HUMANS ARE SPECIAL.

A bunch of cruisers could take out that Geth cruiser too.

The DA had more firepower in its main gun than the entire Asari fleet combined. The Asari fleet had 19 dreadnoughts. I am quoting our resident ship expert Joker. The DA was a reaper killer. It could probably take down a Reaper Capital ship in one clean shot from its main gun - that's right Sovereign. The problem was it never got in a clean shot. The Citadel fleet is just a patrol fleet to protect the Citadel. It is not the entire combined fleets of the entire galaxy. It is elements contributed of turian fleet, alliance fleet, and the Destiny Ascension. They were overwhelmed by the sheer number of Geth that attacked. I don't care how powerful a single ship is, it can get taken out if it is overwhelmed by sheer numbers.

Now the Geth Dreadnought was simply video game logic to put the entire onus on Commander Shepard. Why? Because Thanix weapons were equipped on the Quarian Fleet. What do thanix weapons do? They ignore Kinetic Barriers. How could "more intelligence" and a reaper signal prevent Thanix weapons from penetrating Kinetic Barriers. I know! Because Commander Shepard had to save the day and show how stupid the Quarians were so you could understand how cute and cuddly the Geth victims were. That's how badly written that story arc is.

that

this x10

Thank you for nailing it on the head! 

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

Another thing ... the big lol cutscene inside the Destiny Ascension if this was a Mel Brooks movie.

They go to fire their main gun.... the "Offline 3 hrs for Scheduled Maintenance" sign. Bottom line - Bioware designed a pretty looking ship, but couldn't figure out how to create a weapons animation for it.

[ImaginaryMatter]

StreetMagic wrote...

You serious? I thought I wrote too much actually.

In any case, I'm being slightly tongue in cheek. But basically, the DA is pretty well protected by a plot that encourages you to be self-sacrificial, cooperative, etc.. It cashes in on certain ideals many people are ingrained with and don't want to abandon easily. As long as people have them, the DA is fine.

I thought that was what you were saying. Certainly the game has incentives for being the Paragon but not more so than Renegade (at least in ME1). I mean the Council is depicted as the biggest group of pricks ever, I don't think any one has positive thoughts about them.

[Darks1d3]

StreetMagic wrote...

cap and gown wrote...

Shotgun Julia brings up another important point: the Dreadnaught had plot armor, the DA didn't. Anyone or thing with plot armor is always more powerful than anyone or thing wearing a red shirt.

The DA has plot armor, but it's more elaborate and tries to get under your skin over time. The whole game is pushing you in different directions about humanity's role in the galaxy. One minute Shep wants hot alien sex, the next he "won't be a puppet of the Asari!!" Saving the DA is kind of a testament how much you want to get into Liara's pants (or already got into them). A testament to how much you see rainbows and butterflies and galactic cooperation when you think of the Council. A testament that you adopted Turian ideals of finding nobility in duty and sacrfice. Garrus admonishes Kaidan that Turians would happily wear L2 impants. People will appreciate humans more if they do these things. And they'll appreciate it if you throw your fleet in to save everyone.

It doesn't have to play out that way necessarily, but I think that's the undertone going on there. And it's very strong. The plot armor only falls apart if you don't give a sh*t about any of the above. And more power to you, if that's the case.

Something is wrong with me, I'm way too easily amused. That part had me chortling for a little bit.

Anyway, In theory I'd have to say the DA. In game however, the dreadnought wins. I think Julia is correct in her assessment.

[Astartes Marine]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...
Where does it say the Alliance ships have better overall firepower?

Common sense and a trend in the series that Asari tactics/weapons/ships are not built or designed around brute force and firepower. 

I also believe that the codex or an in-game character(s) noted that the Turians and Humans led the way in terms of firepower in ship combat with the Turians being ahead in raw power and human ships having more overall flexibility and manueverability.