154 réponses à ce sujet

[TeamLexana]

David7204 wrote...

Zoikster wrote...

No -- Read in its entirety. Still insufficient in my mind to explain why you dislike being able to talk to your companion. You mentioned preferring party banter; well why not have both?

Why not have high quality conversations 100% of the time instead of less than 100%? Any conversation that can be held anywhere is almost certainly going to be of low cinematic quality compared to conversations in a fixed location.

Why is cinematic quality such a high importance? You are playing an rpg not watching a movie. 

[NRieh]

This. I understand wanting to talk to your companions at any time unlike ME3 and DA2 but I don't understand the appeal of talking to them in the midlle of the deep roads or some other random place.

My guess is that 'any time' was the biggest issue, not 'anywhere'.

[Amirit]

Nrieh wrote...

David Gaider:
....they felt they could only talk to a companion when the companion wanted. Which is perception only

But...that's what actually happens in game. There is a handful of one-liners, that you can hear clicking on your companion, but you can only initiate a talk when companion has some business aka 'quest'.
...
Yet me (player) could only say something to companions during those cut-scenes, which were either 'accept quest - return quest' or some little 'aftermath' triggered by those quests (aka 'questioning beliefs'). Also, those cut-scenes were the only option to see companion-companion interaction (I mean SEE, not hear in party banters). That's not much like 'perception' to me, that's simple math.

Not to mention, that for those players, who do not headcanon, it's the _only_ available content.

QFTT

I am more then happy to know that in DAI we can get at least ME1-2 style of conversation with our companions. But I would feel safer talking about it if David Gaider would not give that hint in a way "in DA2 you had the same stuff just with a quest mark". Because it was not. And responce is a bit confusing and contradictory this way.
Well, let's hope for the best.

[azarhal]

Amirit wrote...

Nrieh wrote...

David Gaider:
....they felt they could only talk to a companion when the companion wanted. Which is perception only

But...that's what actually happens in game. There is a handful of one-liners, that you can hear clicking on your companion, but you can only initiate a talk when companion has some business aka 'quest'.
...
Yet me (player) could only say something to companions during those cut-scenes, which were either 'accept quest - return quest' or some little 'aftermath' triggered by those quests (aka 'questioning beliefs'). Also, those cut-scenes were the only option to see companion-companion interaction (I mean SEE, not hear in party banters). That's not much like 'perception' to me, that's simple math.

Not to mention, that for those players, who do not headcanon, it's the _only_ available content.

QFTT

I am more then happy to know that in DAI we can get at least ME1-2 style of conversation with our companions. But I would feel safer talking about it if David Gaider would not give that hint in a way "in DA2 you had the same stuff just with a quest mark". Because it was not. And responce is a bit confusing and contradictory this way.
Well, let's hope for the best.

Gaider is right with his "DA2 had the same stuff with a quest mark", it's you people who totally fail at maths or fail to understand what he's saying.

Both DAO and DA2 had conversations gated by affection/friendship level. In DAO, you can consume them in like 10 minutes by using gifts, companion has nothing to tell you between threshold (you can still enter dialog mode, but they have nothing new to say to you). In DA2, friendship is harder to raise so the threshold hit are more spaced, but still the companion has nothing to tell you between threshold ( you do not enter dialog mode if the companion have nothing to say).

Both DAO and DA2 had character quests. DA2 gets one per act for that matter. You get a conversation before and after the quest in both game, but it's easier to trigger them in DAII (you get a quest mark to tell you the companion have a quest basically). Same thing for gifts, both games have one gift per character that triggers a conversation. And again, same thing for the Fade trip, companions that came with you will get a new piece of dialog about it.

The quantity is the same for both games, the spacing and presentation are different (this is exactly what Gaider is saying).

[Angrywolves]

The quality wasn't the same for both games, that's for sure imo.

shrugs.

As it is Bioware has had a lot more time to work on things this time around, so we're hopeful of better things.

[Gorkanus]

andy69156915 wrote...

Zoikster wrote...

andy69156915 wrote...

I actually agree with David here. Conversations definitely felt more alive in DA2 and ME2 and ME3 than in prior games where conversations were much more static.

Def disagree with this. 

So you prefer objectively worse cinematology and camera work and directing just so you can have a conversation in the middle of a battle if you want*.

*And yes that happens. I once had Allistair make me choose between him and Zevran when we were surrounded by darkspawn because I accidently clicked him at a bad time... Who then got mad when I said it wasn't the time for this conversation, because in a middle of a fight is obviously the best time to bring THAT up.

OOOOH thats Hilarious :D:D

[Nightdragon8]

Gorkanus wrote...

andy69156915 wrote...

Zoikster wrote...

andy69156915 wrote...

I actually agree with David here. Conversations definitely felt more alive in DA2 and ME2 and ME3 than in prior games where conversations were much more static.

Def disagree with this. 

So you prefer objectively worse cinematology and camera work and directing just so you can have a conversation in the middle of a battle if you want*.

*And yes that happens. I once had Allistair make me choose between him and Zevran when we were surrounded by darkspawn because I accidently clicked him at a bad time... Who then got mad when I said it wasn't the time for this conversation, because in a middle of a fight is obviously the best time to bring THAT up.

OOOOH thats Hilarious :D:D

Granted I had something like htat myself but, they have already said only in "safe zones" so that wont be an issue anymore.

As for "cinematology" Da:O ME1, ME2 DA2 all had pretty much the same. DA:O I don't think had panning camras. I don't remember DA2 having panning cameras... I think it had a form of zoom. I think ME had panning cameras.

I think ME3 did the best with merging Cutscenes and controled action.

[In Exile]

Nrieh wrote...

This. I understand wanting to talk to your companions at any time unlike ME3 and DA2 but I don't understand the appeal of talking to them in the midlle of the deep roads or some other random place.

My guess is that 'any time' was the biggest issue, not 'anywhere'.

I think it's both. If it's not anywhere, then it's not anytime. 

Modifié par In Exile, 25 décembre 2013 - 05:08 .

[Amirit]

azarhal wrote...
Gaider is right with his "DA2 had the same stuff with a quest mark", it's you people who totally fail at maths or fail to understand what he's saying.

Both DAO and DA2 had conversations gated by affection/friendship level. In DAO, you can consume them in like 10 minutes by using gifts, companion has nothing to tell you between threshold (you can still enter dialog mode, but they have nothing new to say to you). In DA2, friendship is harder to raise so the threshold hit are more spaced, but still the companion has nothing to tell you between threshold ( you do not enter dialog mode if the companion have nothing to say).

Both DAO and DA2 had character quests. DA2 gets one per act for that matter. You get a conversation before and after the quest in both game, but it's easier to trigger them in DAII (you get a quest mark to tell you the companion have a quest basically). Same thing for gifts, both games have one gift per character that triggers a conversation. And again, same thing for the Fade trip, companions that came with you will get a new piece of dialog about it.

The quantity is the same for both games, the spacing and presentation are different (this is exactly what Gaider is saying).

Are you sure you did play DAO and DA2? Really sure? Because I do not understand how can you not see the difference.  "Both DAO and DA2 had conversations gated by affection/friendship level."  - wrong. In DAO you could continue some "investigating" conversations no matter of your affection level.  You could get loops in answers as well - still there WERE conversations even after all quests were done or there was not enough affection. In DA2 outside the companion quest you could not get a word from your companion. You could visit any of them as many times as you wanted but they would not talk to you AT ALL. Not even "Wrex-Shepard", so to speak. 

And THIS IS the difference, this is the thing OP is asking for - an ability to get SOMETHING from companions outside their quests. An illusion of conversation. Preferably with a several subjects, not one only, but even one is better then nothing. I assume from DG answer this is what we are going to get (thank you, Bioware for that) but bringing DA2 into the subject as an example of "the same" did not sound reassuring.

Modifié par Amirit, 25 décembre 2013 - 07:14 .

[Leomerya12]

Agreed. I feel a cutscene is a bit sterile. Also, the fact that you have to make "appointments", instead of candidly starting a conversation is unnatural as well.

[azarhal]

Amirit wrote...

azarhal wrote...
Gaider is right with his "DA2 had the same stuff with a quest mark", it's you people who totally fail at maths or fail to understand what he's saying.

Both DAO and DA2 had conversations gated by affection/friendship level. In DAO, you can consume them in like 10 minutes by using gifts, companion has nothing to tell you between threshold (you can still enter dialog mode, but they have nothing new to say to you). In DA2, friendship is harder to raise so the threshold hit are more spaced, but still the companion has nothing to tell you between threshold ( you do not enter dialog mode if the companion have nothing to say).

Both DAO and DA2 had character quests. DA2 gets one per act for that matter. You get a conversation before and after the quest in both game, but it's easier to trigger them in DAII (you get a quest mark to tell you the companion have a quest basically). Same thing for gifts, both games have one gift per character that triggers a conversation. And again, same thing for the Fade trip, companions that came with you will get a new piece of dialog about it.

The quantity is the same for both games, the spacing and presentation are different (this is exactly what Gaider is saying).

Are you sure you did play DAO and DA2? Really sure? Because I do not understand how can you not see the difference.  "Both DAO and DA2 had conversations gated by affection/friendship level."  - wrong. In DAO you could continue some "investigating" conversations no matter of your affection level.  You could get loops in answers as well - still there WERE conversations even after all quests were done or there was not enough affection. In DA2 outside the companion quest you could not get a word from your companion. You could visit any of them as many times as you wanted but they would not talk to you AT ALL. Not even "Wrex-Shepard", so to speak. 

And THIS IS the difference, this is the thing OP is asking for - an ability to get SOMETHING from companions outside their quests. An illusion of conversation. Preferably with a several subjects, not one only, but even one is better then nothing. I assume from DG answer this is what we are going to get (thank you, Bioware for that) but bringing DA2 into the subject as an example of "the same" did not sound reassuring.

The investigation conversations are present in DA2, when you get to talk to a companions the little selection(s) on the left of the dialog wheels are exactly that (usually middle and topmost, bottom was mostly for romance). You get one chance to get the convo though, that's a difference in presentation (not quantity). Loops in answers don't add any more conversation dialogs.You have to be delusional to think that getting something in a loop is a new conversation/dialog options.

And there was way more than companion quest in DA2. The companion quests were when they gave you something to do (Aveline and the ambush, Aveline and Donnic, Anders and meeting Karl, Anders and his bomb ingredients, etc where companion quests). The rest were all companion dialogs triggered by various things: friendship/rival threshold, advancing in the main story, Fade trip etc. They used quest markers to indicate that the companion had something new to say so you didn't have to talk to everyone after every damn quests like in DAO. It would have been a nightmare in DAII with them all living in different part of town...

[HiroVoid]

TeamLexana wrote...

David7204 wrote...

Zoikster wrote...

No -- Read in its entirety. Still insufficient in my mind to explain why you dislike being able to talk to your companion. You mentioned preferring party banter; well why not have both?

Why not have high quality conversations 100% of the time instead of less than 100%? Any conversation that can be held anywhere is almost certainly going to be of low cinematic quality compared to conversations in a fixed location.

Why is cinematic quality such a high importance? You are playing an rpg not watching a movie. 

David's right.  There shouldn't be dialogue between companions including each other when walking around if the convos aren't in a high quality cutscene.

[Toasted Llama]

azarhal wrote...

The investigation conversations are present in DA2, when you get to talk to a companions the little selection(s) on the left of the dialog wheels are exactly that (usually middle and topmost, bottom was mostly for romance). You get one chance to get the convo though, that's a difference in presentation (not quantity). Loops in answers don't add any more conversation dialogs.You have to be delusional to think that getting something in a loop is a new conversation/dialog options.

And there was way more than companion quest in DA2. The companion quests were when they gave you something to do (Aveline and the ambush, Aveline and Donnic, Anders and meeting Karl, Anders and his bomb ingredients, etc where companion quests). The rest were all companion dialogs triggered by various things: friendship/rival threshold, advancing in the main story, Fade trip etc. They used quest markers to indicate that the companion had something new to say so you didn't have to talk to everyone after every damn quests like in DAO. It would have been a nightmare in DAII with them all living in different part of town...

While I usually preferred something like Leliana's "I know that look, you have something on your mind, don't you?" then followed by a couple of questions I could ask at any point in the game, I'll agree with you here that loops don not add actual conversations.

I guess people just liked the feeling that they could talk to companions about subjects they have already talked about before at any point in the game when they check for new conversations (again at any point in the game)

[Amirit]

azarhal wrote...
You have to be delusional to think that getting something in a loop is a new conversation/dialog options.

And you have to be incredibly arrogant to think that others preferences in games are worthless and should not be even discussed.
I'll try one more time (just in case you are honestly reading replies here and simply do not comprehend what people are talking about, not just making statements without reading).

In DA2 you could have a conversation with the companion ONLY when your companions had - in your words - "something new to tell you". Should you come to, say, Fenris, after the Bitter Pill was finished - all he would say is the same one-liner you can get from him anywhere. NOTHING MORE.
On the contrary in DAO you were able to get as lengthy conversation as you wanted when YOU wanted it. YOU initiated the conversation and could stop it at any moment and start again when you wanted to. Investigation options were not bound to the main plot or relations points - they existed as separate stories about companions past, future or vision of present events. You could simply greet your companion (and get the answer), you could discuss one topic or have all dialog options _for that part of the game_ if you wanted to. 
So, yes, technically there were more then simple quest giving\\receiving in DA2 companion interactions. But the only time you could get that "technicaly more" is when companions quest was active. You were not able get it in portions at your convenience, you were not able to ask a stupid repeatable question over and over again should you feel like it. No. The only time you could interact was the specific plot points. 
Got it now? I just do not know how else to explain. And this is what OP (and others) was asking for - to give us back the freedom to talk to our companions at our convenience and do not turn them into some silent mannequins between big plot points. 
Looks like we are going to get it. Amen.

[Toasted Llama]

Amirit wrote...

And you have to be incredibly arrogant to think that others preferences in games are worthless and should not be even discussed.
I'll try one more time (just in case you are honestly reading replies here and simply do not comprehend what people are talking about, not just making statements without reading).

In DA2 you could have a conversation with the companion ONLY when your companions had - in your words - "something new to tell you". Should you come to, say, Fenris, after the Bitter Pill was finished - all he would say is the same one-liner you can get from him anywhere. NOTHING MORE.
On the contrary in DAO you were able to get as lengthy conversation as you wanted when YOU wanted it. YOU initiated the conversation and could stop it at any moment and start again when you wanted to. Investigation options were not bound to the main plot or relations points - they existed as separate stories about companions past, future or vision of present events. You could simply greet your companion (and get the answer), you could discuss one topic or have all dialog options _for that part of the game_ if you wanted to. 
So, yes, technically there were more then simple quest givingreceiving in DA2 companion interactions. But the only time you could get that "technicaly more" is when companions quest was active. You were not able get it in portions at your convenience, you were not able to ask a stupid repeatable question over and over again should you feel like it. No. The only time you could interact was the specific plot points. 
Got it now? I just do not know how else to explain. And this is what OP (and others) was asking for - to give us back the freedom to talk to our companions at our convenience and do not turn them into some silent mannequins between big plot points. 
Looks like we are going to get it. Amen.

Just want to point out that those plot point conversations were basically the approval rating points of DA:O. So technically, any "new" conversations happened at certain points, whether these were plot or approval related.

[Bleachrude]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

They offer no improvement in player agency.  They in no way enhance the ability to roleplay your character.  They offer no meaningful content at all that can't be provided in a less expensive way.

Simply turning off the cinematics and replacing everything with text descriptions would improve DA2 (and ME), in my eyes, and make it vastly cheaper to develop.

I disagree with this.

Take when you walk into the battery as is having a Garrus conversation with his father. . THAT is a cinemtatic conversation and simply replacing it with a letter would not have made the scene as emotional as it was. Indeed, one of the complaints against ME3 was that there was too many emails.

At the same time, it triggers another conversation that you can have with Garrus but it is tied to a cinemtatic event that makes no sense if you can have it ANYWJERE at any time.

[David Gaider]

Just to spare further argument on this point, I'll elaborate regarding the differences between DAO's and DA2's approach to character interaction.

DAO had cinematic conversations that were gated (and by "gated" I mean the requirements to make the conversation trigger) by approval level and certain plot points (if they were important to the character).

By default (meaning if there were no cinematic conversations waiting) they had an "investigate" conversation--which is essentially the series of questions you could ask about their background. Some of those questions were themselves gated by approval level or plot points, so as time went on you might get a few new ones opening up.

Beyond that, DAO had one short personal plot for the companion, generally with a follow-up cinematic conversation.

In comparison, DA2's content was more on the cinematic conversation side. There was no default investigate conversation at all, and those sorts of questions were interspersed throughout their cinematic conversations. The cinematic conversations were, however, forcibly spread throughout the game since they were gated by Act as well as by approval level and plot point-- the purpose being to have the player come to know the follower gradually.

What DA2 had a lot more of was on the personal plot side--of which there were three in the game, and each was larger than the single personal plot in DAO. These were designed to give the player a way to get to know the follower outside of simply asking them questions, and their cinematic conversations were designed to largely work in conjunction with these plots (to represent an ongoing narrative). I'm not certain that everyone (who visits the BSN, anyhow) actually looks on these personal plots as follower interaction, however, and instead sees them as plots like any other plot which just happen to feature the follower. Depends on what they were looking for, probably.

As I mentioned, the cinematic conversations and personal plots in DA2 were alerted to the player through a quest--partly due to convenience, but more because the chore of "checking in" with each follower was more burdensome than in DAO because each follower was behind a separate level load (being spread throughout Kirkwall as they were). That's the only real difference with their mechanical function in comparison to DAO--in DAO, unless the follower initiated dialogue with the player, the player was free to ignore them and would never know they had a new dialogue.

Insofar as which game's approach is better, that's debatable. As I mentioned, some of the differences are largely one of perception. A player that was used to DAO's approach might have missed being able to go to a follower in the camp and run through all their dialogues at once, feeling like they "got to know" a follower after an hour of talking to them in the investigate conversation. They may have gotten the initial cinematic conversation, clicked on the follower again and received their "I have nothing else to tell you right now" bark, and thought "is that it?" There's also the perception of agency, such as being told when it was okay to talk to the follower again rather than being left to discover that on one's own. The experience likely varied depending on what you went in expecting.

Ultimately, the content for followers is being re-shuffled once again--the default investigate dialogue is re-appearing, so there is conversation to be had with a follower even when they don't have a big cinematic scene awaiting, and that comes at the expense of the extra personal plots as was in DA2. Also gone are the alerts, in part because we felt the agency comment was fair and in part because it's no longer necessary (for mechanical reasons)...and also because the player will likely be getting more than enough quests anyhow, they don't need more added onto their list just to go talk to someone (who they may not even wish to talk to, for all we know).

The total amount of content, as in the actual amount of writing that goes into an individual follower and the amount of interaction you have with them over the course of the game, is the same in DAO as in DA2 as it will be in DAI.

Modifié par David Gaider, 26 décembre 2013 - 01:36 .

[werewoof]

David Gaider wrote...

Just to spare further argument on this point, I'll elaborate regarding the differences between DAO's and DA2's approach to character interaction.

DAO had cinematic conversations that were gated (and by "gated" I mean the requirements to make the conversation trigger) by approval level and certain plot points (if they were important to the character).

By default (meaning if there were no cinematic conversations waiting) they had an "investigate" conversation--which is essentially the series of questions you could ask about their background. Some of those questions were themselves gated by approval level or plot points, so as time went on you might get a few new ones opening up.

Beyond that, DAO had one short personal plot for the companion, generally with a follow-up cinematic conversation.

In comparison, DA2's content was more on the cinematic conversation side. There was no default investigate conversation at all, and those sorts of questions were interspersed throughout their cinematic conversations. The cinematic conversations were, however, forcibly spread throughout the game since they were gated by Act as well as by approval level and plot point-- the purpose being to have the player come to know the follower gradually.

What DA2 had a lot more of was on the personal plot side--of which there were three in the game, and each was larger than the single personal plot in DAO. These were designed to give the player a way to get to know the follower outside of simply asking them questions, and their cinematic conversations were designed to largely work in conjunction with these plots (to represent an ongoing narrative). I'm not certain that everyone (who visits the BSN, anyhow) actually looks on these personal plots as follower interaction, however, and instead sees them as plots like any other plot which just happen to feature the follower. Depends on what they were looking for, probably.

As I mentioned, the cinematic conversations and personal plots in DA2 were alerted to the player through a quest--partly due to convenience, but more because the chore of "checking in" with each follower was more burdensome than in DAO because each follower was behind a separate level load (being spread throughout Kirkwall as they were). That's the only real difference with their mechanical function in comparison to DAO--in DAO, unless the follower initiated dialogue with the player, the player was free to ignore them and would never know they had a new dialogue.

Insofar as which game's approach is better, that's debatable. As I mentioned, some of the differences are largely one of perception. A player that was used to DAO's approach might have missed being able to go to a follower in the camp and run through all their dialogues at once, feeling like they "got to know" a follower after an hour of talking to them in the investigate conversation. They may have gotten the initial cinematic conversation, clicked on the follower again and received their "I have nothing else to tell you right now" bark, and thought "is that it?" There's also the perception of agency, such as being told when it was okay to talk to the follower again rather than being left to discover that on one's own. The experience likely varied depending on what you went in expecting.

Ultimately, the content for followers is being re-shuffled once again--the default investigate dialogue is re-appearing, so there is conversation to be had with a follower even when they don't have a big cinematic scene awaiting, and that comes at the expense of the extra personal plots as was in DA2. Also gone are the alerts, in part because we felt the agency comment was fair and in part because it's no longer necessary (for mechanical reasons)...and also because the player will likely be getting more than enough quests anyhow, they don't need more added onto their list just to go talk to someone (who they may not even wish to talk to, for all we know).

The total amount of content, as in the actual amount of writing that goes into an individual follower and the amount of interaction you have with them over the course of the game, is the same in DAO as in DA2 as it will be in DAI.

that's good to hear. i was all for the personal plot stuff in da2, but at times it felt kind of disjointed because like you said, a) you're being "told" when it's okay to to talk to them and if it's not, you just get a default bark and rarely was it just a casual chat about, say, where they're from, but a big personal event. it felt like i was being told that i know these characters really well, even though i didn't always feel like i did. 

of course some of that can be attributed to da2's limited developmental time. but i am looking forward to being able to chat them up for fun again.

although i'll never understand people who complain about how origins' content was gated and "omg you're CUTTING US OFF FROM CONTENT i actually have to TALK TO THESE PEOPLE to get to access it" and then subsequently ask for realism. even less so people who make a fuss over how "you can exhaust all those options in ten minutes if you use some gifts"

like alrighty then you deliberately exploited a game mechanic to blast through content you could have just as easily spaced out by not asking it all at once and then complained about it, cool 

[Hrungr]

David Gaider wrote...

The total amount of content, as in the actual amount of writing that goes into an individual follower and the amount of interaction you have with them over the course of the game, is the same in DAO as in DA2 as it will be in DAI.

Thanks for chiming in on this. This last little bit is interesting though - by "total amount of content", I assume that means companion banter as well. In a game as large as DAI appears to be I'm kinda surprised the companion content wasn't upped as well.

[Toasted Llama]

tiktac wrote...

although i'll never understand people who complain about how origins' content was gated and "omg you're CUTTING US OFF FROM CONTENT i actually have to TALK TO THESE PEOPLE to get to access it" and then subsequently ask for realism. even less so people who make a fuss over how "you can exhaust all those options in ten minutes if you use some gifts"

like alrighty then you deliberately exploited a game mechanic to blast through content you could have just as easily spaced out by not asking it all at once and then complained about it, cool 

What? You haven't heard? If there's a loophole you are forced to exploit it! I've yelled my thumb to stop pressing A everytime I was about to give a gift to my companions but it just wouldn't stop!

(Or my index finger to stop pressing uhh... rightclick? or was it leftclick... anyhow, failed there as well)

[werewoof]

Toasted Llama wrote...

tiktac wrote...

although i'll never understand people who complain about how origins' content was gated and "omg you're CUTTING US OFF FROM CONTENT i actually have to TALK TO THESE PEOPLE to get to access it" and then subsequently ask for realism. even less so people who make a fuss over how "you can exhaust all those options in ten minutes if you use some gifts"

like alrighty then you deliberately exploited a game mechanic to blast through content you could have just as easily spaced out by not asking it all at once and then complained about it, cool 

What? You haven't heard? If there's a loophole you are forced to exploit it! I've yelled my thumb to stop pressing A everytime I was about to give a gift to my companions but it just wouldn't stop!

(Or my index finger to stop pressing uhh... rightclick? or was it leftclick... anyhow, failed there as well)

if you resist, bioware will break through your window and hold you at gunpoint until you exploit every gift loophole and use all the dialogue options at once

Modifié par tiktac, 26 décembre 2013 - 01:57 .

[werewoof]

Hrungr wrote...

David Gaider wrote...

The total amount of content, as in the actual amount of writing that goes into an individual follower and the amount of interaction you have with them over the course of the game, is the same in DAO as in DA2 as it will be in DAI.

Thanks for chiming in on this. This last little bit is interesting though - by "total amount of content", I assume that means companion banter as well. In a game as large as DAI appears to be I'm kinda surprised the companion content wasn't upped as well.

i think he might mean like, in relation to the size of the game. 

[David Gaider]

Hrungr wrote...
Thanks for chiming in on this. This last little bit is interesting though - by "total amount of content", I assume that means companion banter as well. In a game as large as DAI appears to be I'm kinda surprised the companion content wasn't upped as well.

That's probably due to my developer terminology--which isn't always the same as fan terminology (hence why I defined a few things in my response above, as I wasn't sure). From our perspective, the banter between followers that you hear throughout the game isn't part of the same batch of content as the follower interactions. That's considered "exploration writing", and comes from the budget assigned to levels (as the more levels there are, the more banter we'll need).

[kheldorin]

tiktac wrote...

that's good to hear. i was all for the personal plot stuff in da2, but at times it felt kind of disjointed because like you said, a) you're being "told" when it's okay to to talk to them and if it's not, you just get a default bark and rarely was it just a casual chat about, say, where they're from, but a big personal event. it felt like i was being told that i know these characters really well, even though i didn't always feel like i did. 

of course some of that can be attributed to da2's limited developmental time. but i am looking forward to being able to chat them up for fun again.

although i'll never understand people who complain about how origins' content was gated and "omg you're CUTTING US OFF FROM CONTENT i actually have to TALK TO THESE PEOPLE to get to access it" and then subsequently ask for realism. even less so people who make a fuss over how "you can exhaust all those options in ten minutes if you use some gifts"

like alrighty then you deliberately exploited a game mechanic to blast through content you could have just as easily spaced out by not asking it all at once and then complained about it, cool 

Because you don't know when that conversation opportunity would expire. If you go back to camp very rarely, ie space your conversations too far apart, you'll miss a lot of dialogue. And personally, making a journey back to camp just to talk to your other team mates is pretty unrealistic. What are they doing at camp while you're away anyway? It's like they don't have a life and plans of their own.

Modifié par kheldorin, 26 décembre 2013 - 02:03 .

[David Gaider]

tiktac wrote...
although i'll never understand people who complain about how origins' content was gated and "omg you're CUTTING US OFF FROM CONTENT i actually have to TALK TO THESE PEOPLE to get to access it" and then subsequently ask for realism. even less so people who make a fuss over how "you can exhaust all those options in ten minutes if you use some gifts"

like alrighty then you deliberately exploited a game mechanic to blast through content you could have just as easily spaced out by not asking it all at once and then complained about it, cool 

It boils down to the amount of hand-holding we engage in. It's always going to be a discussion on our part as to where on the spectrum we should fall--should we allow the player to gorge themselves if they wish, at the expense of pacing and lack of content further down the road, or forcibly gate the content to get better pacing, at the expense of agency? For DAI, we're pulling back the throttle a little to let the player have more content up-front (should they so desire) while still gating things further down the line as it makes sense. Meaning it won't be possible to "blast through" a follower's entire relationship when you first meet them, but neither are you restricted to one short conversation. Ideally this should feel more natural to the player (particularly since there's far more reason to return to the base than just to talk to followers), but that's a balance we'll need to work out over the next year.

Modifié par David Gaider, 26 décembre 2013 - 02:13 .