1537 réponses à ce sujet

[ianvillan]

Mike Smith wrote...

Total freedom for mages. Let the ones that want to remain in the Circle system do that and run the circles, let the rest go out and lives their lives in the world.

As for the templars, wean them off of lyrium and have them join the individual nations armies.It's not like the Chantry needs a private army.

The Chantry uses Templars to guard there Chantry buildings and provide protection for the Chantry brothers and sisters.

They also use them to guard their missionary's and make sure that the missionary's can get access to other lands.

[Veruin]

Mike Smith wrote...

Total freedom for mages. Let the ones that want to remain in the Circle system do that and run the circles, let the rest go out and lives their lives in the world.

Let's throw the effects on the economy, demons, and the capabilities for magic out the window so mages don't feel "oppressed".

Can't forget education since there's typically 1-2 circles per country and unless you want mages to live in actual slums around the tower, they have no means to travel to them.

Modifié par Veruin, 07 janvier 2014 - 08:42 .

[Lulupab]

Veruin wrote...

Now you know how everyone else feels when people actually try to justify Anders's actions. <_<

At least they use proper grammar when talking about Anders.

Anyway depends on who is justifying Anders' actions and how they are doing it. His actions can indeed be justified but morality behind it is subjective. While I can see why at least half the members here will think its nothing less than terrorism.

But lets not forget its Thedas where even human rights doesn't exis, how can terrorism be a concept? People are seeing worse things than terror itself on a daily basis. Before Anders, building kept blowing up and people kept getting massacred but we didn't know about them to judge them and that is how Thedas is and there is also a unique part about what Anders did. Anders destroyed a symbolic building and most importantly people who had nothing to do with it (other mages in the circle) got punished for it. I cannot think of any better scenario where the signal "its for a change" is sent globally. I know what Anders did can be considered terrorism if we are to compare it to real life but its two side of a single coin, one man's terrorist is one man's freedom fighter. No matter how evil you think his actions were they were neccesary and another mage might have done something much worse like those mages who wanted to destroy the grand chantry in Orlais and kill the divine. Bioware simply chose best even if meant demonizing a favorite character they made the perfect scenario to start the mage Templarwar.

[Lulupab]

TheKomandorShepard wrote...

Rassler wrote...



I cannot argue with that logic. Not to mention my inside grammer **** is urging me to end its life.

This will haunt your dreams for rest of your life.

Yay you posted picture that only make my point stronger thank you :happy:

Great. Now you cannot even comprehend pun. That was meant to be a joke besides he is not using magic he is gonna choke you to death in your dreams. I agreed to disagree with you.

[Lulupab]

Double post. Delete.

Modifié par Rassler, 07 janvier 2014 - 08:47 .

[Veruin]

Rassler wrote...

But lets not forget its Thedas where even human rights doesn't exis, how can terrorism be a concept? People are seeing worse things than terror itself on a daily basis. 

Instead of simply assassinating/killing the Grand Cleric in public and removing the symbol for compromise, Anders blows up a building.  Hell, given that the bomb was obviously magical, he could've done used that and the same thing would've happened.  Compromise gone, RoA declared, mage war.  But no, he has to blow up a church with people that have no ability to change things.  Anders is as much of a politcal idiot as loghain is.

Modifié par Veruin, 07 janvier 2014 - 08:47 .

[Hellion Rex]

Veruin wrote...

Rassler wrote...

But lets not forget its Thedas where even human rights doesn't exis, how can terrorism be a concept? People are seeing worse things than terror itself on a daily basis. 

Instead of simply assassinating/killing the Grand Cleric in public and removing the symbol for compromise, Anders blows up a building.  Hell, given that the bomb was obviously magical, he could've done used that and the same thing would've happened.  Compromise gone, RoA declared, mage war.  But no, he has to blow up a church with people that have no ability to change things.

Not that I agree with Anders, but Elthina's supposed neutrality didn't do anything either. She sat there for a decade, and did nothing to rein Meredith in, which she could have done as her superior.

[AresKeith]

eluvianix wrote...

Veruin wrote...

Rassler wrote...

But lets not forget its Thedas where even human rights doesn't exis, how can terrorism be a concept? People are seeing worse things than terror itself on a daily basis. 

Instead of simply assassinating/killing the Grand Cleric in public and removing the symbol for compromise, Anders blows up a building.  Hell, given that the bomb was obviously magical, he could've done used that and the same thing would've happened.  Compromise gone, RoA declared, mage war.  But no, he has to blow up a church with people that have no ability to change things.

Not that I agree with Anders, but Elthina's supposed neutrality didn't do anything either. She sat there for a decade, and did nothing to rein Meredith in, which she could have done as her superior.

In a way I can understand why she didn't, because if she did many Templars would view it as her playing favorites with the Mages

[Veruin]

eluvianix wrote...

Not that I agree with Anders, but Elthina's supposed neutrality didn't do anything either. She sat there for a decade, and did nothing to rein Meredith in, which she could have done as her superior.

Unless the chantry itself was a symbol for compromise (Isn't the chantry the buzzword for oppression instead of compromise?), I don't see how that completely takes away from Elthina.  She didn't do squat, but people still saw her as keeping both sides cooled. Of course, they didn't know any better.

Either Anders wanted to take his frustration out on the chantry and tried to justify it or some other thing that I had thought of but now lost.

Modifié par Veruin, 07 janvier 2014 - 08:52 .

[Lulupab]

Veruin wrote...

Rassler wrote...

But lets not forget its Thedas where even human rights doesn't exis, how can terrorism be a concept? People are seeing worse things than terror itself on a daily basis. 

Instead of simply assassinating/killing the Grand Cleric in public and removing the symbol for compromise, Anders blows up a building.  Hell, given that the bomb was obviously magical, he could've done used that and the same thing would've happened.  Compromise gone, RoA declared, mage war.  But no, he has to blow up a church with people that have no ability to change things.  Anders is as much of a politcal idiot as loghain is.

I don't think killing grand cleric alone would have been enough. They'd probably brand anders a murderer and punish him accordingly. People in Other countries couldn't care less about a simple murder unless maybe its the divine herself. The more I think about it the more I realize the idea of blowing up the chantry was the best to start a global war and bioware knew it before us. Plus the fact that all mages got punished for what Anders did is also an important factor. They don't see mages as people but they see them as mages. This caused anger across all Thedas.

[Hellion Rex]

Veruin wrote...

eluvianix wrote...

Not that I agree with Anders, but Elthina's supposed neutrality didn't do anything either. She sat there for a decade, and did nothing to rein Meredith in, which she could have done as her superior.

Unless the chantry itself was a symbol for compromise (Isn't the chantry the buzzword for oppression instead of compromise?), I don't see how that completely takes away from Elthina.  She didn't do squat, but people still saw her as keeping both sides cooled. Of course, they didn't know any better.

Either Anders wanted to take his frustration out on the chantry and tried to justify it or some other thing that I had thought of but now lost.

I don't think the Chantry is a symbol of oppression at all. I will agree that she kept both sides cooled, but neither did she seem to actively attempt to make Orsino and Meredith see eye to eye.

[Jeremiah12LGeek]

My solution: A giant game of naked twister, all the mages vs all the templars. Either everyone wins (and there are many newborns at the next now-annual event) or the winning team sets the rules for the next year. Magic is permitted, but only if it equally effects both sides.

[TheKomandorShepard]

Rassler wrote...

Great. Now you cannot even comprehend pun. That was meant to be a joke besides he is not using magic he is gonna choke you to death in your dreams. I agreed to disagree with you.

Well picture made my point stronger so you helped me i only wanted to express my gratitude for doing that.

[Lulupab]

eluvianix wrote...

Veruin wrote...

eluvianix wrote...

Not that I agree with Anders, but Elthina's supposed neutrality didn't do anything either. She sat there for a decade, and did nothing to rein Meredith in, which she could have done as her superior.

Unless the chantry itself was a symbol for compromise (Isn't the chantry the buzzword for oppression instead of compromise?), I don't see how that completely takes away from Elthina.  She didn't do squat, but people still saw her as keeping both sides cooled. Of course, they didn't know any better.

Either Anders wanted to take his frustration out on the chantry and tried to justify it or some other thing that I had thought of but now lost.

I don't think the Chantry is a symbol of oppression at all. I will agree that she kept both sides cooled, but neither did she seem to actively attempt to make Orsino and Meredith see eye to eye.

Well Elthina was practically useless. I loved how the game allowed me to choose the conversation wheel "you are useless" over and over  but maybe she didn't deserve to die but she could have easily prevented many things. It has come to my attention that grand cleric can announce a knight commander unfit for the job and demand a change in command. She could have at least do this. I'm sure no one would consider it siding with mages as she is simply removing the imcompotent from the command.

[Last seeker]

Unless the blight ended permanantly, and veil sealed up forever.

The last game in Dragon Age fanchise may provide that solution but it would be the last and hardly find something that kept driving the fan to pursuit it.

[AresKeith]

Rassler wrote...

I don't think killing grand cleric alone would have been enough. They'd probably brand anders a murderer

That's what happened anyway

[TheKomandorShepard]

Well i agree elthina was useless and chantry symbol of compromise rly? That guys support templars and well were on templars side all time that why seekers ultimately were nothing more than elite templars until current divine chantry was templar supporter and well after divine cut this for compromise they were enraged because they didn't had control and left chantry.

[Lulupab]

AresKeith wrote...

Rassler wrote...

I don't think killing grand cleric alone would have been enough. They'd probably brand anders a murderer

That's what happened anyway

Indeed but as I mentioned before something more was needed for it to attract global attenton. I've always accepted what Anders did was murder. I only argued about terrorism which it was not.

[Kikidori]

Step 1: Call Zevran,
Step 2: Let him smooth talk everyone.
Step 3: ???
Step 4: Profit

[Veruin]

Kikidori wrote...

Step 1: Call Varric
Step 2: Let his glorious chest hair smooth talk everyone.
Step 3: ???
Step 4: Profit

FFY.

[Sylvius the Mad]

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

To bring up a hypothetical scenario:
Would you consider alien cogniscient species to be beneath your concern or above your understanding, based on their physical and psychological attributes? Would you acknoweldge the differences between the two species?

It doesn't even have to be alien species. It could be the neanderthales who appears to have been our physiological and intellectual superiors (bigger muscles and brains), would you consider them your equals or acknowledge the differences?

I'd acknowledge the differences.  And if one of them decided to subjugate me, I'd be hard-pressed to make a decent argument that they should stop.

Mages should not be consdiered lesser or above mundanes.

But how do you convince them not to see themselves as such?

But the differences between the two should be acknowledged. There is nothing wrong with acknowledging the differences between two persons. 

I completely agree.

[Pasquale1234]

TheKomandorShepard wrote...

1)Chantry isn't god it may have/had influence but many in chantry don't rly like mages , and peoples don't rly care for mass slaughter as long they aren't victims and yet i had point elves or RoA my point proven.

You haven't proven anything.

The sale / enslavement of elves was one of the tools the Warden had against Loghain at the Landsmeet - because it is illegal and unacceptable.

The RoA has only ever been acceptable as a last resort.

2)Nope all templars in kirkwall throw themselves at circle because of word mad woman arlik wanted slaves so he could control them many templars are fanatics drunk with heatred

As with most of your other arguments, you're making that up.

I don't see a problem if behlen is king with lyrium guy is smart enough to see benefit in that...

Maybe, but the dwarves have always cooperated with the Chantry RE lyrium availability.  Again, you'd have to establish yourself as the supreme authority.  The dwarves cooperating with you is not guaranteed.

Besides i plan brainwash new anti-magical faction to be loyal qunari mage who killed himself.

Brainwashing to the degree you propose would take a least a generation to take root.

But here's a question - how would you expect to accomplish it?

4)And well not all i don't see problem with that (grey wardens) so you are way exaggerate that why all nobles will attack me because im killing mages bah not make me laugh they are hated by most i see parent who have mage children may deliver problems still majority hate their children if they turn out to be mage.And i don't think that one noble want ****** off entire world because he don't want give us portal for demons...

Again, you're making all this stuff up.

How soon you've forgotten that a powerful Fereldan noble (Arl Eamon) has a mage son (Connor).  In some games, Wynne is asked to serve as court advisor / mage to Queen Anora and / or King Alistair.  In all games, Fereldan's Circle of Magi helped at Ostagar.  In some games, Wynne, Morrigan, and Fereldan's Circle of Magi are recognized for their service in defeat of the Blight.  In some games, the GW recruit mages.

So it seems this mage hatred is not quite as ubiquitous as you would like it to be.

But don't let the facts stop you.

5)Yep thats why anti-magical organisation will deal with punishmets will force many to sell mages and even more if someone will help caputre mage reward will be offered (of course if it will be real mage) so not only organisation will awake fear but also greed so we have hate , fear and greed on our side.

Those who live by the sword shall perish by the sword.  The same holds true for hate, fear, and greed.

Flemeth what she can do?

Pretty much whatever she wants.

Modifié par Pasquale1234, 07 janvier 2014 - 09:44 .

[Chari]

Put both factions in the same closed place and wait till they kill each other. The end, no crisis, no sides to keep it going on. Repeat if neccessary

[Aolbain]

Rassler wrote...

Aolbain wrote...

Same as before, but charge of the Circles are handed over to the Inquisition.

I like your solution and your signature 

Why thank you.

[TheKomandorShepard]

Pasquale1234 wrote...
chop

1.Very naive... do i have mention that elves are weak argument at landsmeet much better argument is about blood magic so yes it serves only for politically destroying your enemy smiliar like in orlais everyone backstabs if you get caught it is bad... also slaughter in alienage and it wasn't first my point that peoples don't care is proven even epilogue for elves mention that if true...
RoT used only as last resort well rivain circle would say otherwise and yet no one cares 
If you want more hear guys who gossip about mages in dao they say they should all be killed so:devil:

2.Wasn't meredith mad woman and wasn't templars following her orders until her end where she wanted kill her?

3.I have time when this generaton of mages will be choped i will have some break... 
As i said i will do what chantry do to templars (haha guys are nuts "the order dictates..":lol:) only i will make it stronger pure killing machines.

4.And again i m not making nothing up... and what arl eamon is duty wh*** even isolde knew that thats why she didn't tell him (well with new law for such thing she would be be punished ) his type would kill his son if that was his duty.You can also ask for freedom for mage and what anora/alistair could do nothing that same for wynne... 
Besides you are making this up i played pro-mage few times and nowhere circle is even mentioned forl helping with blight only person who mention that mages helped with blight (morrigan or wynne) is ander oh sorry elthina mention also that if your warden was a mage but he claims that maker stoped blight so... 
If you free circle in da 2 bartender will mention that and tell that ferelden circle gained autonomy and that will be disaster no one cares that mages helped in blight as that no one cares that mages helped with qunari... 

Heatred toward mages is mentioned by many like wynne , morrigan templars even use that as excuse... in ferelden you can hear what peoples think about mages here have  (sure it is only when hawke will take templar side but if you will take mage side peoples will support only removing meredith not supporting mages).And well in asunder we can see also this topic...

5.Only in fairy tales or when sword is used incorrectly my friend


6.

Modifié par TheKomandorShepard, 07 janvier 2014 - 10:00 .