1537 réponses à ce sujet

[Hellion Rex]

MisterJB wrote...

The rebellion does hamper most plans regarding the management of the Circles, not just my tiny suggestion. Therefore, I don't see why I was singled out.

I'm just saying, accidental babies are one of the reason romantic attachment between Circle mages are discouraged; although the strong emotions that come with it are probably dangerous when experienced by mages; and obligatory vasectomies would solve that.
It's not like that would place mages in the endangered species list since their numbers are replenished by toddlers born to normal couples.

Would they even know how to do a vasectomy?

[MisterJB]

thetinyevil wrote...
Yeah not enough is taken from mages lets take more. What's next, castration?

That is actually a give and take situation. We take the possibility of accidental babies away and we give more freedom for Circle mages to openly form romantic relationships amongst themselves.
Most mages will never have children anyway, and those who do will never see them. They wouldn't really be losing anything.

[General TSAR]

Rubios wrote...

Eliminate templars and create a self regulated mage government thing.

Tevinter Imperium? Pass. 

[MisterJB]

eluvianix wrote...
Would they even know how to do a vasectomy?

Well, the first one ever was in the 19th century so, probably not.
It would help with some issues, tough.

[Hellion Rex]

General TSAR wrote...

Rubios wrote...

Eliminate templars and create a self regulated mage government thing.

Tevinter Imperium? Pass. 

Manaveris Draconis, heathen!

[Pasquale1234]

MisterJB wrote...

Actually, an obligatory vasectomy to Circle mages wouldn't be a bad idea. It would prevent accidental babies which would remove one of the reasons romantic attachments are discouraged.

Or better yet - castrate them.  Not only would it make them incapable of reproducing, but it would also reduce / remove the desire for intimacy and make them calmer overall.

Edit:  I see someone beat me to it.

Nevermind.

Modifié par Pasquale1234, 14 janvier 2014 - 06:31 .

[General TSAR]

Just segregate the circles and have M!Templars guard the M!Mages and F!Templars watch the F!Mages.

No accidental births, no fraternization between the sexes, and sexual assault diminshes.

Modifié par General TSAR, 14 janvier 2014 - 06:33 .

[Veruin]

Pasquale1234 wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

Actually, an obligatory vasectomy to Circle mages wouldn't be a bad idea. It would prevent accidental babies which would remove one of the reasons romantic attachments are discouraged.

Or better yet - castrate them.  Not only would it make them incapable of reproducing, but it would also reduce / remove the desire for intimacy and make them calmer overall.

That is probably the closest thing Thedas would have to a vasectomy.

Modifié par Veruin, 14 janvier 2014 - 06:31 .

[Hellion Rex]

General TSAR wrote...

Just segregate the circles and have M!Templars guard the M!Mages and F!Templars watch the F!Mages.

No accidental births and no fraternization between the sexes.

My male mages would be down with that.

[MisterJB]

Pasquale1234 wrote...
Or better yet - castrate them.  Not only would it make them incapable of reproducing, but it would also reduce / remove the desire for intimacy and make them calmer overall.

That's just cruel.
Plus, Varys has made wary of eunuchs.

[Pasquale1234]

MisterJB wrote...

Pasquale1234 wrote...
Or better yet - castrate them.  Not only would it make them incapable of reproducing, but it would also reduce / remove the desire for intimacy and make them calmer overall.

That's just cruel.
Plus, Varys has made wary of eunuchs.

Some would say that forced sterilization is cruel.

[Hellion Rex]

Pasquale1234 wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

Pasquale1234 wrote...
Or better yet - castrate them.  Not only would it make them incapable of reproducing, but it would also reduce / remove the desire for intimacy and make them calmer overall.

That's just cruel.
Plus, Varys has made wary of eunuchs.

Some would say that forced sterilization is cruel.

Very cruel.

[MisterJB]

Pasquale1234 wrote...
Some would say that forced sterilization is cruel.

Why is it so in this case?
Circle mages are forbidden to have children; most of them will never have them, those who do will never see them.
I'm not an expert but I don't believe a vasectomy does anything to reduce the desire and capacity for sex and the mage numbers are replenished with mages from the outside world.

So, what would they lose? On the other hand, they would stand to gain more freedom to openly engage in romantic relationships.
This would translate into rather than having quickies in dark corners, mages might actually be permitted to marry and live in each other's quarters.

Modifié par MisterJB, 14 janvier 2014 - 06:46 .

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

Actually, while dealing with the children presents certain problems, having more mages in the population can be a good thing. So I'm not really sure I want to spider the mages.

Edit: Though I can see Varys himself approving.

Modifié par Riverdaleswhiteflash, 14 janvier 2014 - 06:59 .

[Pasquale1234]

MisterJB wrote...

Pasquale1234 wrote...
Some would say that forced sterilization is cruel.

Why is it so in this case?
Circle mages are forbidden to have children; most of them will never have them, those who do will never see them.
I'm not an expert but I don't believe a vasectomy does anything to reduce the desire and capacity for sex and the mage numbers are replenished with mages from the outside world.

So, what would they lose? On the other hand, they would stand to gain more freedom to openly engage in romantic relationships.
This would translate into rather than having quickies in dark corners, mages might actually be permitted to marry and live in each other's quarters.

You're trying to rationalize something that, for many people, is a very emotional issue.  It really isn't all that much different from forced castration, which can also be rationalized.

Your only support for this idea is the fact that Circle mages are not allowed to have children - which, in itself bars them from fulfilling a very natural human desire.  Consider the billions of dollars spent and massive hassles people go through for fertility treatments, and you might have some idea of the profundity of people's desire to have children.

[TheKomandorShepard]

Riverdaleswhiteflash wrote...

Actually, while dealing with the children presents certain problems, having more mages in the population can be a good thing. So I'm not really sure I want to spider the mages.

Yes because exploding bombs who blow up our own citizens is very good thing thedas disagrees why they should when already losts caused by mages are gigantic...

And now many bi*** about that magic is called curse and why it shouldn't when disadvantages are colosal being mages in da sucks sure you can light a fire or heal bruise at cost fu*** turning into unstoppable creature who will destroy everything on their path when you will be forced watch unable to do anything it is so every day you live in fear becoming abomnation and well society hates you for that.It is like ability to turn everything that you touch into gold but you know result...  

So rly anything need chantry to make that same conclusions?

about relationship i would prohibit mages relationship because well emotions often make you mooron and distract you and mages can't be distracted because it lead to possession.Of curse i would do that if i believed that circles can control mages which is false... i never understand why templars are so stupid and let half of circle escape damn anders did it 7 times...

[Lotion Soronarr]

dragonflight288 wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...
Family is more than just a biological connection.
Think of a Circle as one big family. Not connected by blood, but by everything else.
The mages in the circle live together their whole lives, share the same interests, talk about the same stuff. They essentialy are one big family.

While family can easily be more than just blood, try telling that to the six year old who had just been torn from his mothers arms. (S)he's not going to listen. All they know is that they've been taken away from their family. And that can be traumatizing, especially during such a critical period of emotional development. 

It's easy to step back and say the circle can be their new family, but that does nothing to take into account what they're feeling. 

I think a good example is Aneirin. Wynne pushed him, thought he was stubborn and didn't give him what he needed, time to adjust, time to get over the expectations of prejudice simply because he was an elf, time to help him with his emotional needs. She calls it her only and greatest regret that she couldn't help him as she wanted to, and spent years thinking he was dead. He was 14 years old but while in the Circle he lacked any connection to the mages there. He didn't think of them as family. However, after he escaped, got run through by templars, and then taken in by a Dalish clan, he turned out all right and became a healer, living peacefully in the forest, and is at peace with himself and the world, far more than most Circle mages we meet in-game.

You can use Aneirin as an example - I can use almost ever other mage we see as a counter-example. Both Wynne and Irwing, and many other seem content. They have found a purpose and family within a circle.

You think a bological family guarantess sucess and a healthy emotional development? It does not. There are many broken families and many children that are never properly brought up.
The cirlce, by nature of bing big, gives one more poeple to form a closer bond to, but there is no guarantee. After all, people are different.

Wrong. Stop spreading your propaganda.

There is a lot of circumstantial evidence that supports this.

It does not. Kell is jsut one amogn so many mages.
I can find a self-hating emo loony on the street and claim that he is proof our society is rotten and needs purning.

It's quite deeply embetted in Andrastian society. If you wish to accuse me of spreading propaganda, you'll have to take away all such instances in the game and books.

you ARE spreading propaganda, because you throw it all at the feet of the Chantry.
The fact that the people have SEEN what mages and abominatiosn can do, and stories and rumors spread, seesm to compeltely escape you.

So instead of saying 'stop spreading propaganda,' use in-game evidence or evidence from the books that completely dismiss what I say on a cultural and sociological level. And I can tell you right now, you won't be able to to do it.

I already have. Your asseriton is that Andrastianism and the Chantry are spreading mage hate, and that is unsubstantiated.
1-2 reverend mothers do not the Chantry make.

No they don't. I just played it today. Your mage quarters have walls, but a very large open area to enter in without a door. There IS  door to enter the area, and there are four bedrooms within the single room, but not a single one of them have a door.

Engine limitation? Design oversight?
Ever noticed how oversized the rooms are for player navigation convenience?

Hell, evne in Kirkwall the rooms have doors.

I wasn't saying there wasn't a reason for it, but pointing out that it adds to the level of fear and paranoia, and the fact that the templars don't do anything to refute the more wild gossip that spreads, well the fully-trained mages don't either.

You know that denying rumors only spreads more rumors.
So where is your fact?

The point I'm making overrall is that despite how nice the facilities are at the Circle, it's not an environment that fosters and promotes emotional health and stability.

Life in general doesnt' promote emotional health in stabilty.

[TK514]

So make it optional. Want to be allowed to play pillow games? Here's an option that lets you do so without having to hide it.

Though, frankly, I have my doubts about its efficacy in a world with Healing Magic. I also seem to recall someone, maybe Wynne?, obliquely mentioning methods of contraception, though I may be misremembering. If magical contraception, or even herbal contraception isn't in widespread use to give mages the freedom to sleep with whoever, then there's more to it than just babies.

Like the whole "Boo hoo, my true love broke up with me. He/She just doesn't understand that we are meant to be together forever! Well, I will MAKE them understand. They WILL love me! *slits wrist* *makes the blood magic happen*"

Love is a crazy powerful emotion, for good or ill.

Modifié par TK514, 14 janvier 2014 - 07:17 .

[Veruin]

TK514 wrote...
Like the whole "Boo hoo, my true love broke up with me. He/She just doesn't understand that we are meant to be together forever! Well, I will MAKE them understand. They WILL love me! *slits wrist* *makes the blood magic happen*"

That almost sounds like what the BSN would do. 

Let's not forget you can make a deal with Connor's Desire Demon for "the love/affection of my companions".  So, if not blood magic, it is possible with a demon.

Modifié par Veruin, 14 janvier 2014 - 07:19 .

[Lord Raijin]

What constitutes an "accidental pregnancy"? If 2 mages fall in love with each other and have sex the baby that they reproduce is not an accident.

eluvianix wrote...

Pasquale1234 wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

Pasquale1234 wrote...
Or better yet - castrate them.  Not only would it make them incapable of reproducing, but it would also reduce / remove the desire for intimacy and make them calmer overall.

That's just cruel.
Plus, Varys has made wary of eunuchs.

Some would say that forced sterilization is cruel.

Very cruel.

It's also very cruel to have the templars kidnap newborn babies from an already weaken mage. I mean how ethical is it to beat an already beaten down individual?

[Veruin]

Lord Raijin wrote...

What constitutes an "accidental pregnancy"? If 2 mages fall in love with each other and have sex the baby that they reproduce is not an accident.

So, people who have sex with a condom or under birth control are purposely trying to conceive?

[Medhia Nox]

@Veruin: Nevermind - misread what you wrote.

Modifié par Medhia Nox, 14 janvier 2014 - 07:37 .

[General TSAR]

Lord Raijin wrote...
What constitutes an "accidental pregnancy"? If 2 mages fall in love with each other and have sex the baby that they reproduce is not an accident.

You're right, it's gross fraternization and wouldn't have happened if the morons kept their robes down or were kept in segregated circles.

It's also very cruel to have the templars kidnap newborn babies from an already weaken mage. I mean how ethical is it to beat an already beaten down individual?

Maybe the two mages should have thought of that before getting it on. 

Also it's not kidnapping, the Chantry is well within its power to take any and all children born to mage parents within their Circles.

Modifié par General TSAR, 14 janvier 2014 - 07:42 .

[TK514]

Lord Raijin wrote...

It's also very cruel to have the templars kidnap newborn babies from an already weaken mage. I mean how ethical is it to beat an already beaten down individual?

It's not kidnapping if it's legal, and what the Circles do is legal.  And please don't try to say it isn't legal.  They've been doing it openly for almost a thousand years.  If it weren't legal, they'd have been brought to task by some soft hearted noble with the ear of a monarch and a love for ther poor mage relative long before the Dragon Age.

[Jaison1986]

TK514 wrote...

Lord Raijin wrote...

It's also very cruel to have the templars kidnap newborn babies from an already weaken mage. I mean how ethical is it to beat an already beaten down individual?

It's not kidnapping if it's legal, and what the Circles do is legal.  And please don't try to say it isn't legal.  They've been doing it openly for almost a thousand years.  If it weren't legal, they'd have been brought to task by some soft hearted noble with the ear of a monarch and a love for ther poor mage relative long before the Dragon Age.

Legal on paper anyway. I might as well make an Inquisitor that change the law by punishing maker worshipers with an decaptation, and it would be completely alright because it's the law. Just because something is legal, it doesn't mean that it's acceptable.