1537 réponses à ce sujet

[Laughing_Man]

andy69156915 wrote...

I'm noticing something about you. You always just shoot down my idea and that's it. You never actually throw your own idea out there, your own solution. You don't add to the discussion, you just try to knock down everything I say.

How about you share your own solutions instead of just bashing mine? Saying "no, bad idea" without sharing your own ideas just makes you look like a hater.

Some people find any solution that does not leave people oppressed - "unrealistic", and not enough in line with the dark gritty fantasy world, in which There Is Only War and Wangst.

[Hellion Rex]

TheRedVipress wrote...

andy69156915 wrote...

I'm noticing something about you. You always just shoot down my idea and that's it. You never actually throw your own idea out there, your own solution. You don't add to the discussion, you just try to knock down everything I say.

How about you share your own solutions instead of just bashing mine? Saying "no, bad idea" without sharing your own ideas just makes you look like a hater.

Some people find any solution that does not leave people oppressed - "unrealistic", and not enough in line with the dark gritty fantasy world, in which There Is Only War and Wangst.

Dare I ask what you mean by "Wangst?":mellow:

[Br3admax]

TheRedVipress wrote...

andy69156915 wrote...

I'm noticing something about you. You always just shoot down my idea and that's it. You never actually throw your own idea out there, your own solution. You don't add to the discussion, you just try to knock down everything I say.

How about you share your own solutions instead of just bashing mine? Saying "no, bad idea" without sharing your own ideas just makes you look like a hater.

Some people find any solution that does not leave people oppressed - "unrealistic", and not enough in line with the dark gritty fantasy world, in which There Is Only War and Wangst.

Who said anything about "unrealistic?" They are, for the most part, all realistic. We are questioning safety. "Unsafe." 

[KainD]

TheRedVipress wrote...

Some people find any solution that does not leave people oppressed - "unrealistic", and not enough in line with the dark gritty fantasy world, in which There Is Only War and Wangst.

It's unrealistic by any standard, including RL.

[GreyLycanTrope]

eluvianix wrote...
But they can. If the Veil is torn, demons don't need a physical host, right? They can manifest physically and cross the Veil.

All the lore entries say they posses dead bodies or somehowconnect to someone or something else. Remember the Desire Demon and the Templar in DA:O? She basically needs to syphon him to meintian her form, they can probably exist for a short while without a host but they need something to remain in the physical world on a more permanant basis. Justice is another example he's sure as hell not just walking around on his own.

[Br3admax]

Actually, demons that stay without a host become Shades.

[KainD]

Greylycantrope wrote...
All the lore entries say they posses dead bodies or somehowconnect to someone or something else. Remember the Desire Demon and the Templar in DA:O? She basically needs to syphon him to meintian her form, they can probably exist for a short while without a host but they need something to remain in the physical world on a more permanant basis. Justice is another example he's sure as hell not just walking around on his own.

They can manifest in places where veil is torn, if they want to move to a place where the veil is intact, then they need a host. If there is no veil, they can move around without a host where they please. 

[Hellion Rex]

Greylycantrope wrote...

eluvianix wrote...
But they can. If the Veil is torn, demons don't need a physical host, right? They can manifest physically and cross the Veil.

All the lore entries say they posses dead bodies or somehowconnect to someone or something else. Remember the Desire Demon and the Templar in DA:O? She basically needs to syphon him to meintian her form, they can probably exist for a short while without a host but they need something to remain in the physical world on a more permanant basis. Justice is another example he's sure as hell not just walking around on his own.

"Just as treacherous, blood magic allows the Veil to be opened completely so that demons may physically pass through it into our world."  ----- Codex entry: Blood Magic: The Forbidden School

[TheKomandorShepard]

TheRedVipress wrote...

andy69156915 wrote...

I'm noticing something about you. You always just shoot down my idea and that's it. You never actually throw your own idea out there, your own solution. You don't add to the discussion, you just try to knock down everything I say.

How about you share your own solutions instead of just bashing mine? Saying "no, bad idea" without sharing your own ideas just makes you look like a hater.

Some people find any solution that does not leave people oppressed - "unrealistic", and not enough in line with the dark gritty fantasy world, in which There Is Only War and Wangst.

Because if you try create society someone will be screwd unless this is utopia? In mages case it is even more clear they can't be not oppressed if most population wants have a better life and world be safe...
Mages can't be free neither than can be controled properly.Other things that peoples are flawed and most will hate if someone is different even if you can't burn city.
 

[Veruin]

TheRedVipress wrote...

Some people find any solution that does not leave people oppressed - "unrealistic", and not enough in line with the dark gritty fantasy world, in which There Is Only War and Wangst.

Yea, that's it.  That's why we want to "oppress" the mages"

Modifié par Veruin, 06 janvier 2014 - 07:19 .

[andy6915]

Greylycantrope wrote...

eluvianix wrote...
But they can. If the Veil is torn, demons don't need a physical host, right? They can manifest physically and cross the Veil.

All the lore entries say they posses dead bodies or somehowconnect to someone or something else. Remember the Desire Demon and the Templar in DA:O? She basically needs to syphon him to meintian her form, they can probably exist for a short while without a host but they need something to remain in the physical world on a more permanant basis. Justice is another example he's sure as hell not just walking around on his own.

What about "Kitty" from Shale's recruitment?

Modifié par andy69156915, 06 janvier 2014 - 07:19 .

[GreyLycanTrope]

Br3ad wrote...

Actually, demons that stay without a host become Shades.

Shades have to adapt over a period of time though and they still need to continually draw energy from things around them.

"It has often been suggested that the only way for a demon to affect the world of the living is by possessing a living (or once living) body, but this is not always true. Indeed, a shade is one such creature: a demon in its true form that has adapted to affect the world around it.

My hypothesis is this: We already know that many demons become confused when they pass through the Veil
into our world. They are unable to tell the living from the dead, the very static nature of our universe being confusing to a creature that is accustomed to a physicality defined entirely by emotion and memory.
Most demons seek to immediately seize upon anything they perceive as life, jealously attempting to possess it—but what of those that do not? What of those that encounter no life, or fail to possess a body? What of
those that are more cautious by their nature?

These demons watch. They lurk. They envy.
In time, such a demon will learn to drain energy from the psyche of those it encounters, just as it did in the Fade.
Once it has drained enough, it has the power to manifest and will forever after be known as a shade. Such a creature spurns possession. It instead floats as a shadow across its piece of land, preying upon the
psyche of any who cross its path. Perhaps it believes itself still in the Fade? There is evidence to believe that is so."

Modifié par Greylycantrope, 06 janvier 2014 - 07:23 .

[Hellion Rex]

andy69156915 wrote...

Greylycantrope wrote...

eluvianix wrote...
But they can. If the Veil is torn, demons don't need a physical host, right? They can manifest physically and cross the Veil.

All the lore entries say they posses dead bodies or somehowconnect to someone or something else. Remember the Desire Demon and the Templar in DA:O? She basically needs to syphon him to meintian her form, they can probably exist for a short while without a host but they need something to remain in the physical world on a more permanant basis. Justice is another example he's sure as hell not just walking around on his own.

What about "Kitty" from Shale's recruitment?

Wait, did she manifest fully from the cat's body when you fight her?

[Veruin]

eluvianix wrote...

Wait, did she manifest fully from the cat's body when you fight her?

She possesses Amalia, then turns into a desire demon.

[GreyLycanTrope]

eluvianix wrote...
"Just as treacherous, blood magic allows the Veil to be opened completely so that demons may physically pass through it into our world."  ----- Codex entry: Blood Magic: The Forbidden School

This doesn't deny them needing to possess someone after they do some though.

[andy6915]

eluvianix wrote...

andy69156915 wrote...

Greylycantrope wrote...

eluvianix wrote...
But they can. If the Veil is torn, demons don't need a physical host, right? They can manifest physically and cross the Veil.

All the lore entries say they posses dead bodies or somehowconnect to someone or something else. Remember the Desire Demon and the Templar in DA:O? She basically needs to syphon him to meintian her form, they can probably exist for a short while without a host but they need something to remain in the physical world on a more permanant basis. Justice is another example he's sure as hell not just walking around on his own.

What about "Kitty" from Shale's recruitment?

Wait, did she manifest fully from the cat's body when you fight her?

See for yourself at 6 minutes.



(this is a "yes", by the way.)

Modifié par andy69156915, 06 janvier 2014 - 07:28 .

[Veruin]

andy69156915 wrote...

(this is a "yes", by the way.)

Must be different outcomes depending on what you choose.  I distinctly remember Amalia giving me an evil smirk before she shapeshifted.

[Hellion Rex]

Veruin wrote...

andy69156915 wrote...

(this is a "yes", by the way.)

Must be different outcomes depending on what you choose.  I distinctly remember Amalia giving me an evil smirk before she shapeshifted.

Did you help Kitty, or did you straight up kill her?

[GreyLycanTrope]

Like I said they can maintain a physical form for a bit, but she insists on making a deal to possess Amelia for a reason.

[andy6915]

Veruin wrote...

andy69156915 wrote...

(this is a "yes", by the way.)

Must be different outcomes depending on what you choose.  I distinctly remember Amalia giving me an evil smirk before she shapeshifted.

No, if she secretely possessed her then how is she still fighting you? And why is Amalia talking normally and acting normally compared to the version of her if you let the demon possess her? Did you watch the video I linked to?

[Veruin]

eluvianix wrote...
Did you help Kitty, or did you straight up kill her?

I can't remember for sure...I think I lied abou helping her then turned on her at the last minute.

andy69156915 wrote...
No, if she secretely possessed her then how is she still fighting you? And why is Amalia talking normally and acting normally compared to the version of her if you let the demon possess her? Did you watch the video I linked to?

Must be different outcomes depending on what you choose.

Modifié par Veruin, 06 janvier 2014 - 07:32 .

[Abraham_uk]

Honest answer: I honestly don't know.



Now speculative answer (because speculation is more fun than honesty).

I really think there aren't enouch non-combat applications of magic.

• Magic could be used to help crops grow,
• Lift heavy objects
  
• Medicine (yes I know that healers and spirit healers are few and far between)
• Create special magical locks that cannot be broken by lock picking
• Provide means of fighting daemon possession (there was a quest in Dragon Age Origins where blood magic was used to solve a problem. There was also another quest in Dragon Age 2 where yet again magic potentially saved someone's life).
• Use of elemental magic to provide electricity.

This is to list a few.
Mages can be useful in society.
They don't all have to be warriors.
They don't have to be trapped in a tower all day.
Yes they do need policing, but perhaps if they were made to feel useful, then maybe people's disposition towards them would change, and maybe the mages would be less hostile.

Finally, the Templars should maintain their roles as magical law enforcers, but they too should have strict roles preventing the abuse of mages.

Modifié par Abraham_uk, 06 janvier 2014 - 07:39 .

[Br3admax]

Greylycantrope wrote...

Br3ad wrote...

Actually, demons that stay without a host become Shades.

Shades have to adapt over a period of time though and they still need to continually draw energy from things around them.

"It has often been suggested that the only way for a demon to affect the world of the living is by possessing a living (or once living) body, but this is not always true. Indeed, a shade is one such creature: a demon in its true form that has adapted to affect the world around it.

My hypothesis is this: We already know that many demons become confused when they pass through the Veil
into our world. They are unable to tell the living from the dead, the very static nature of our universe being confusing to a creature that is accustomed to a physicality defined entirely by emotion and memory.
Most demons seek to immediately seize upon anything they perceive as life, jealously attempting to possess it—but what of those that do not? What of those that encounter no life, or fail to possess a body? What of
those that are more cautious by their nature?

These demons watch. They lurk. They envy.
In time, such a demon will learn to drain energy from the psyche of those it encounters, just as it did in the Fade.
Once it has drained enough, it has the power to manifest and will forever after be known as a shade. Such a creature spurns possession. It instead floats as a shadow across its piece of land, preying upon the
psyche of any who cross its path. Perhaps it believes itself still in the Fade? There is evidence to believe that is so."

But it is not required. Shades can go extended periods of time without necessarily having anything nearby that it can feed off of. It doesn't say that it needs to. Only that it wants to, on instinct. 

[andy6915]

Greylycantrope wrote...

Like I said they can maintain a physical form for a bit, but she insists on making a deal to possess Amelia for a reason.

I think it was more that she wanted to experience actually being human and feeling human emotions, not that she absolutely needed to possess her. Also, she merely took the cat form to trick the girl. She has been down there for decades outside of the Fade, not possessing anything. If she was going to lose all her power the longer she went without a host, why did she survive decades while keeping her power?

[Veruin]

andy69156915 wrote...
If she was going to lose all her power the longer she went without a host, why did she survive decades while keeping her power?

You should take into account that it's a magical room she's sealed in, designed to study demons.  Wouldn't be very effective if your demon lost power and you had to risk possession catching another one.  It's not just some random forest or cave.

Modifié par Veruin, 06 janvier 2014 - 07:36 .