181 réponses à ce sujet

[Hellion Rex]

andy69156915 wrote...

So hey... Could Arlathan actually be the Black City? Like the Magisters actually sent the city to the Fade, it got corrupted, and later the Magisters revisited it and got corrupted too and brought the taint back with them?

And maybe that is just the Fade half of the city and the physical half really is in a secret part of the Deep Roads. Maybe the Darkspawn originated from the sunken city of Arlathan, considering the Darkspawn started underground. Or maybe the ancient section that the red lyrium and the idol came from WAS Arlathan and we just didn't know it... Would explain why the place is so different from typical Dwarven-made places.

I admit, I'm throwing a lot of random guesses right now.

No, I don't think so. It specifically says the magisters sunk the city "with a horrifying blood ritual." I don't think it is the Black City.

[andy6915]

eluvianix wrote...

No, I don't think so. It specifically says the magisters sunk the city "with a horrifying blood ritual." I don't think it is the Black City.

You don't think so to which part? Because it being in the Deep Roads actually fits with "sinking" a city.

And about the Fade part, you don't find it strange that the city was destroyed so utterly that not even a speck of it is left in the entire world? Them actually sending it to the Fade would explain why it had not even a trace left.

[Chari]

eluvianix wrote...

Twitter tagline reads: “Here lies the abyss, the well of all souls. From these emerald waters doth life begin anew.”

Maric quoted this in the book, it is the place where she convinced the Maker that mortals deserved a second chance. I guess we'll learn sth about both Andraste and Arlathan

Modifié par Chari, 07 janvier 2014 - 09:34 .

[EmperorSahlertz]

andy69156915 wrote...

So hey... Could Arlathan actually be the Black City? Like the Magisters actually sent the city to the Fade, it got corrupted, and later the Magisters revisited it and got corrupted too and brought the taint back with them?

And maybe that is just the Fade half of the city and the physical half really is in a secret part of the Deep Roads. Maybe the Darkspawn originated from the sunken city of Arlathan, considering the Darkspawn started underground. Or maybe the ancient section that the red lyrium and the idol came from WAS Arlathan and we just didn't know it... Would explain why the place is so different from typical Dwarven-made places.

I admit, I'm throwing a lot of random guesses right now.

I did once have this half-baked theory that the Black City was indeed Arlathan, from which the Elves used to live, and that the Tevinters "buried" it by sealing it off from the rest of the world and the Fade, and they did so to contain some great evil. This of course meant that the ancient Tevinter was not all that bad, but something went wrong along the way.

Wouldn't really fit, but could be sort of a good twist.

[Fredward]

Pretty.

[Cainhurst Crow]

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

eluvianix wrote...

There had to have been more than one ancient Elven city right? Perhaps this is just a different city.

Arlathan was the name of city and the country. The legend does not specify which the Tevinter buried. Could have been the entire land.

How exactly do you bury a countryside? There was probably undeveloped areas of the elvish country and wooded areas as well. Did trees and rocks and little deers get swallowed up by the earth as well? And if so,  why is there no large barren area on thedas' s map?

It makes more sense thst the city was buried and the land conquered by tevinter.

[Cainhurst Crow]

Chari wrote...

eluvianix wrote...

Twitter tagline reads: “Here lies the abyss, the well of all souls. From these emerald waters doth life begin anew.”

Maric quoted this in the book, it is the place where she convinced the Maker that mortals deserved a second chance. I guess we'll learn sth about both Andraste and Arlathan

Now that is an interesting little piece of info.

This ruin, connected to both, could prove more interesting then finding arlathan itself.

[lady_v23]

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...

I suppose nows not the best time to mention how I want to throw screaming elven children into flaming pits with blight wolves to rip them to pieces, with a vertically bisected head of an elf as my shoulder pouldrens, and allowing my men to have their way with the knife eared harlots and proceeding to use them as arrow practice, all while choreographing their delightful screams of terror, agony and misery into a perfect adaptation of the nutcracker score by Pyotr Ilyich Tchaikovsky.

..sarcasm?

[TK514]

Darth Brotarian wrote...

How exactly do you bury a countryside? There was probably undeveloped areas of the elvish country and wooded areas as well. Did trees and rocks and little deers get swallowed up by the earth as well? And if so,  why is there no large barren area on thedas' s map?

It makes more sense thst the city was buried and the land conquered by tevinter.

Three thousand years is plenty of time for a once destroyed area to become overgrown and unrecognizable.  I agree that they probably just destroyed the city, but regardless of the scale of the devastation, you'd never know it had ever been there in modern Thedas.

[nightcobra]

 "The ultimate hope for a concept artist is for the final in-game art to surpass its concept art. That has definitely the case with this image. Come Inquisition’s release, I think everyone will agree that the in-game version makes this image look restrained and quaint. "

[Knight of Dane]

Huh so they are boasting. I like boasting. It gives me hope.

[Jedi Master of Orion]

Arlathan was the name of the city. The name of the civilization was "Elvhenan." Or at least this was the word used for all the places the elves lived.

The Imperium did stretch as far as southern Ferelden at one point but the ruins are clearly elven. I believed the ruin that Tamlen and Mahariel stumbled into was part of the same series of ruins as the ones the werewolves hid inside in the Brecillian Forest.

Tamlen says the architecture looks human but the artifacts are elven, which is similar to what the other Brecillian Forest ruins indicate. The Lair of the Werewolves has the same architecture and is in the same forest. It's also filled with elven artifacts. The Arcane Warrior gem says that humans and elves lived there together. The lore for the Arcane Warrior says that it was knowledge that comes from the Ancient Elves. This seems to indicate it was a long lost elven ruin. We know the Imperium would not build a place where humans and elves coexist. We know almost nothing of the ancient elves.

One thing that's worth noting is that the one and only thing that the stories tell us from the days before Arlathan (and thus recorded history) was that the elves lived throughout Thedas in many places including the Brecillian Forest. Hahren Paivel even says "We were as varied as the shemlen, though fewer in number."

I've come to suspect that that the ancient elves were not one unified nation with unifed ideals, even if they shared a similar culture or knowledge.

Modifié par Jedi Master of Orion, 07 janvier 2014 - 10:20 .

[EmperorSahlertz]

Darth Brotarian wrote...

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

eluvianix wrote...

There had to have been more than one ancient Elven city right? Perhaps this is just a different city.

Arlathan was the name of city and the country. The legend does not specify which the Tevinter buried. Could have been the entire land.

How exactly do you bury a countryside? There was probably undeveloped areas of the elvish country and wooded areas as well. Did trees and rocks and little deers get swallowed up by the earth as well? And if so,  why is there no large barren area on thedas' s map?

It makes more sense thst the city was buried and the land conquered by tevinter.

How would I know? It is a legend after all...

[JoltDealer]

Arlathan may be back in Inquisition, eh? If that is true then it definitely has to do with the giant tear in the Veil. I don't know exactly how it was cast down, but it may be tied to the Fade somehow.

[EmperorSahlertz]

Jedi Master of Orion wrote...

Arlathan was the name of the city. The name of the civilization was "Elvhenan." Or at least this was the word used for all the places the elves lived.

The Imperium did stretch as far as southern Ferelden at one point but the ruins are clearly elven. I believed the ruin that Tamlen and Mahariel stumbled into was part of the same series of ruins as the ones the werewolves hid inside in the Brecillian Forest.

Tamlen says the architecture looks human but the artifacts are elven, which is similar to what the other Brecillian Forest ruins indicate. The Lair of the Werewolves has the same architecture and is in the same forest. It's also filled with elven artifacts. The Arcane Warrior gem says that humans and elves lived there together. The lore for the Arcane Warrior says that it was knowledge that comes from the Ancient Elves. This seems to indicate it was a long lost elven ruin. We know the Imperium would not build a place where humans and elves coexist. We know almost nothing of the ancient elves.

One thing that's worth noting is that the one and only thing that the stories tell us from the days before Arlathan (and thus recorded history) was that the elves lived throughout Thedas in many places including the Brecillian Forest. Hahren Paivel even says "We were as varied as the shemlen, though fewer in number."

I've come to suspect that that the ancient elves were not one unified nation with unifed ideals, even if they shared a similar culture or knowledge.

So if you found Egyptian artifacts inside of a Roman looking building (entirely plausible scenario) you would immediately assume the building was Egyptian of origin and not Roman?

Let me ask you a follow up question: Which is easier, to move and store artifacts in your building, or to construct a building around these artifacts?

[TK514]

Jedi Master of Orion wrote...

We know the Imperium would not build a place where humans and elves coexist. 

Do we?  We know the Imperium that destroyed Arlathan and can be traced down to the modern Imperium wouldn't, but we know little to nothing about human/elven relations before the falling out.  There could have been a period when what would eventually become the Imperium had close ties to the elven kingdom(s), including building great works and cities together.

[Angrywolves]

The Black Fox and his friends went looking for it and disappeared.Would be nice to know what happened to them.

I still think there are some ancient elves out there somewhere.

[Jedi Master of Orion]

The artifacts were not just left in storage. They had been in use. The phylactery of the Arcane Warrior doesn't seem to mention that he was just kept in storage. There is even an entire room specifically created for an elven ritual.

Also apparently some of the ghosts were elven models.

Modifié par Jedi Master of Orion, 07 janvier 2014 - 10:43 .

[CybAnt1]

BTW, it's interesting everyone assumes that is a picture of a city (Arlathan or anything else) sinking into a lake.

It also could be depicting a city - yes perhaps the big A - rising up out of a lake it had been sunk in. 

Modifié par CybAnt1, 07 janvier 2014 - 10:42 .

[Ianamus]

I'm not convinced that incredibly small island is the old Elven capital. Even the entire lake doesn't seem large enough.

That said, whatever ruin it is depicting is beautiful. I really hope this is an in-game location that we get to visit, and that it looks as amazing in-game.

Modifié par EJ107, 07 janvier 2014 - 10:50 .

[Jedi Master of Orion]

TK514 wrote...

Jedi Master of Orion wrote...

We know the Imperium would not build a place where humans and elves coexist. 

Do we?  We know the Imperium that destroyed Arlathan and can be traced down to the modern Imperium wouldn't, but we know little to nothing about human/elven relations before the falling out.  There could have been a period when what would eventually become the Imperium had close ties to the elven kingdom(s), including building great works and cities together.

Human/Elf relations in general we know very little about but the Imperium was almost always hostile. There's a 200 year period between the founding of the Imperium and the breakout of the war that destroyed Arlathan. But it strikes me as unlikley they ever would have had close ties to anyone much less the elves of Arlathan. That would require the early years of the Imperium to have been a radically different place than it is today or even during it's golden age. There's no record of any shift like that happening. Even in the very early days, before the Tevinter Imperium itself was formed, the Cult of the Old Gods and blood magic were common among it's people and leaders.

In either case though, it was not until after the enslavement of the elves that the Imperium entered a period of rapid expansion and would have been able to reach Ferelden at all.

[EmperorSahlertz]

Jedi Master of Orion wrote...

The artifacts were not just left in storage. They had been in use. The phylactery of the Arcane Warrior doesn't seem to mention that he was just kept in storage. There is even an entire room specifically created for an elven ritual.

Also apparently some of the ghosts were elven models.

The ruin in the Brecillian Forest that the Grey Warden visist to aid Zathrian's clan was Tevinter in origin, of that there is no doubt. Every character who can comment on it says so.
The one only the Dalish character visists was of human architecture, but housed Dalish artifacts. Now this ruin looked EXACTLY like all the other examples of Tevinter architecture we saw, so chacnes are that it was of Tevinter origins aswell, and that the Elves either took it from the Tevinter at some point, or they simply lived in it at some point after its original abbandonment. The matter of fact is that none of the ruins we visit in DA:O were Elven.
Fenris does however mention that he can show Bethany (or is it Merrill?) the ruin mages have wrought on Elvenkind, so I would assume that someone somewhere has found some Elven ruins.

[Shadow of Light Dragon]

Knight of Dane wrote...

I bet bioware has someone hired as "official teaser" whose job is to quote random parts of Dragon Age lore to random pictures just to make us go insane.

"Morrigan's secrets revealed!"

[azarhal]

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

Jedi Master of Orion wrote...

The artifacts were not just left in storage. They had been in use. The phylactery of the Arcane Warrior doesn't seem to mention that he was just kept in storage. There is even an entire room specifically created for an elven ritual.

Also apparently some of the ghosts were elven models.

The ruin in the Brecillian Forest that the Grey Warden visist to aid Zathrian's clan was Tevinter in origin, of that there is no doubt. Every character who can comment on it says so.
The one only the Dalish character visists was of human architecture, but housed Dalish artifacts. Now this ruin looked EXACTLY like all the other examples of Tevinter architecture we saw, so chacnes are that it was of Tevinter origins aswell, and that the Elves either took it from the Tevinter at some point, or they simply lived in it at some point after its original abbandonment. The matter of fact is that none of the ruins we visit in DA:O were Elven.
Fenris does however mention that he can show Bethany (or is it Merrill?) the ruin mages have wrought on Elvenkind, so I would assume that someone somewhere has found some Elven ruins.

I agree with Jedi Master of Orion here. There is nothing Tevinter in any of the Brecillian Forest ruins, everything is elven. It's like you are believing Duncan saying the Eluvian is a Tevinter artifact when it's not. In-game characters are unreliable when it comes to history.

[Grieving Natashina]

 According to the wiki, the Eluvian was created by the elves.

It was crafted by the elves of Arlathan to be used as portals for telecommunication and perhaps even teleportation between their cities, using a type of magic different from that of the modern Circle of Magi or even the Tevinter Imperium. 

Only after the elven empire fell did the Tevinter start using them, but even then...

After the fall of Arlathan, the Tevinter magisters attempted to unlock the secrets of the Eluvians, but all they could use them for was long-distance communication.

That's where I think Duncan got confused.  The Tevinters did make use of the mirror, but it wasn't their creation.  Not too surprising, given that the Tevinters didn't seem to invent much on their own.  They were great at stealing ideas though.

As far as the topic goes, that's a very nice piece of concept art.  I've been curious about the elves for a long time.  I'm hoping that by going to one of the remains of their ancient cities, we'll learn more about the myths.  Just like I think the Inquisitor is going to learn more about the Chantry, I think we'll learn more about the elves and the Creators.  

Modifié par Starsyn, 07 janvier 2014 - 11:39 .