177 réponses à ce sujet

[Asdrubael Vect]

mx_keep13 wrote...

Dark Korsar wrote...

Ancient Tevinter who obey Old Gods is why HUMANS mages and non-mages shouldn't have too much power.

*fixed

Modern tevinter is essentially the same as old tevinter. Blood magic is only legal in name, and they are still reliant on slaves to the point it will collapse without it. 

bla bla bla blood magic is evil and slavery is bad bla bla

blood magic is the only thing why Thedas does not became blighted wasteland with holed veil filled with darkspawns and deamons...the only problem is Orlais with his Orlais Chanty and their n*zi politics agains mages and non-andrastians, especially non-humans

slavery is ALL Thedas economic problems, magic and mages have nothing with it, MODERN Tevinter(who have a very big problems since many sh*t what happened in Thedas for last millenia) atleast have a system and laws for their slaves who can become liberati while other countries does not have it and slaves as a alianage elves are cheap things in hands of nobles

slavery is common for Orlais, Antiva/Rivain and Free Marshes, and andrastian nonslaves who called "servants" life is slightly better than slaves life

Modifié par Dark Korsar, 13 janvier 2014 - 09:30 .

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Dark Korsar wrote...
blood magic is the only thing why Thedas does not became blighted wasteland with holed veil filled with darkspawns and deamons.

Well to be fair blood magic is the reason we have Darkspawn in the first place.

[Asdrubael Vect]

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Dark Korsar wrote...
blood magic is the only thing why Thedas does not became blighted wasteland with holed veil filled with darkspawns and deamons.

Well to be fair blood magic is the reason we have Darkspawn in the first place.

no it is the Old Gods are reason why we have taint and darkspawns

[The Elder King]

@Dark Korsar: do you still believe that the a mojority of slaves and non-slaves in Tevinter live better than the people in other countries, as well as slaves knowing multiple languages (and how to read?)

[Veruin]

Dark Korsar wrote...
no it is the Old Gods are reason why we have taint and darkspawns

*Facepalm*

[Lulupab]

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Dark Korsar wrote...
blood magic is the only thing why Thedas does not became blighted wasteland with holed veil filled with darkspawns and deamons.

Well to be fair blood magic is the reason we have Darkspawn in the first place.

Yes, that is if what the chantry says is true. Even if its true the tevinter mages could have used lyrium to enter the fade as well it was their corruption that caused that. They used blood magic to enter the fade but it was not blood magic itself that corrupted the golden city, it was them as a people and what they did not their tool of doing it.

You do realize phylactries of mages and joining ritual of grey wardens is blood magic as well right? You can't simply drink darkspawn blood and become a grey warden. Blood magic is a tool, that is it. It can be used for good or ill just like many things.

Modifié par Rassler, 13 janvier 2014 - 09:35 .

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Rassler wrote...
You do realize phylactries of mages and joining ritual of grey wardens is blood magic as well right? You can't simply drink darkspawn blood and become a grey warden. Blood magic is a tool, that is it. It can be used for good or ill just like many things.

I know that, yes. Like you, I see no real problem with blood magic. It's when a mage uses it on others to control or harvest them that I have a problem with, but then I have a problem with a mage casting an iscicle through someone too.

[Veruin]

Rassler wrote...
Yes, that is if what the chantry says is true. Even if its true the tevinter mages could have used lyrium to enter the fade as well it was their corruption that caused that. They used blood magic to enter the fade but it was not blood magic itself that corrupted the golden city, it was them as a people and what they did not their tool of doing it.

They COULD have used lyrium does not mean they had the lyrium needed to even attempt such a thing.  If they didn't have the lyrium then they would never have been able to enter the fade.

[BioWareM0d13]

tybert7 wrote...

As much as we'd like to pretend that warriors and rogues have power, the REAL powers are mages.  A great warrior can dispatch a group of enemies, a great rogue can dispatch a heavily guarded and powerful enemy, but a great mage can dispatch entire armies with arcane power.

Incorrect.

Remember that it was those non-magic using people who forced all those supposedly all powerful mages to wear shackles.

tybert7 wrote...

REAL power, not contained in the swinging of metal sticks and twigs, but calling on the forces of nature or worse itself.

Except for Tevinter and amongst the Dalish, power is wielded by men who don't use magic. Apparently magic isn't all you make it out to be. After all the mages in every realm except Tevinter and wherever the Dalish camp, is shackled in one form or another.

tybert7 wrote...

They ARE Power.  Why should they accept being shackled and bound?  The Tevinter Imperium have it right, all peoples should live under a mageocracy.  Except drarves, they can live under the dirt. 

Because might makes right in the world of Thedas, and the non magic users were powerful enough to force the mages into towers, or to wear leashes (Qunari).

They had to accept being shackled and bound because they were less powerful. Had they been more powerful, they could have successfully resisted. Obviously, they couldn't.

[Afro_Explosion]

Yet blood magic is made powerful by pain and suffering, and naturally thins the veil.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Veruin wrote...

Rassler wrote...
Yes, that is if what the chantry says is true. Even if its true the tevinter mages could have used lyrium to enter the fade as well it was their corruption that caused that. They used blood magic to enter the fade but it was not blood magic itself that corrupted the golden city, it was them as a people and what they did not their tool of doing it.

They COULD have used lyrium does not mean they had the lyrium needed to even attempt such a thing.  If they didn't have the lyrium then they would never have been able to enter the fade.

There's also the fact that blood magic thins the Veil, so it is only logical for them to use it to enter the Fade. And according to Corypheus the Golden City was already black by the time they got there.

[Asdrubael Vect]

hhh89 wrote...

@Dark Korsar: do you still believe that the a mojority of slaves and non-slaves in Tevinter live better than the people in other countries, as well as slaves knowing multiple languages (and how to read?)

depends

1)does they are citizens of Tevinter

2)does they have a job and does they are lazy or drunkards to not work

3)does they live close to Qunari-Seheron or to Orlais

4)does they are refugees

5)does they are Qunari or Old God worchippers

6)does they are mages or dwarves

[The Elder King]

@Dark Korsar: I'm talking about slaves and common folks in Tevinter.

[Lulupab]

Veruin wrote...

Rassler wrote...
Yes, that is if what the chantry says is true. Even if its true the tevinter mages could have used lyrium to enter the fade as well it was their corruption that caused that. They used blood magic to enter the fade but it was not blood magic itself that corrupted the golden city, it was them as a people and what they did not their tool of doing it.

They COULD have used lyrium does not mean they had the lyrium needed to even attempt such a thing.  If they didn't have the lyrium then they would never have been able to enter the fade.

I didn't use that argument to make Tevinter appear like saints. I meant blood magic is not to blame. Grey wardens have done much worse by using blood magic to stop blights and it was worth it. What is a few more demons in this world if it stops a blight? A lesser evil to prevent bigger evils.

Blood magic is a tool and a dangerous one at that. Its by no mean evil on its own, but it grants too much power its alluring and can lead to corruption. Again like many other powerful things.

[Asdrubael Vect]

Rassler wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

Dark Korsar wrote...
blood magic is the only thing why Thedas does not became blighted wasteland with holed veil filled with darkspawns and deamons.

Well to be fair blood magic is the reason we have Darkspawn in the first place.

Yes, that is if what the chantry says is true.

You do realize phylactries of mages and joining ritual of grey wardens is blood magic as well right? You can't simply drink darkspawn blood and become a grey warden. Blood magic is a tool, that is it. It can be used for good or ill just like many things.

they lie and this is very easy to proof, if someone simply remember how all darkspawns are BORN from survived females who was specially tainted by darkspawns and not by tainted creatures, and what tainted creatures are became a simply working slaves to darkspawns who after die because of taint:D no talk about other proofs and about  elves and dwarfes who claimed that those who was in "Black City" are not responsible for blight 

this is silly Orlais Chantry anti-mages and anti-Tevinter bull**** propoganda who was created after 2 blight

they use more of blood magic, if someone remember magic barrier for phylactries....but why i even say this if all knows about Orlais Chantry hypocrisy

Modifié par Dark Korsar, 13 janvier 2014 - 09:58 .

[Beerfish]

Mages are notoriously poor cooks. Do we want a society ruled by people who force us all to eat only Ramen and Kraft dinner?

[Afro_Explosion]

Beerfish wrote...

Mages are notoriously poor cooks. Do we want a society ruled by people who force us all to eat only Ramen and Kraft dinner?

So they eat like a college freshman?

[Hellion Rex]

mx_keep13 wrote...

Beerfish wrote...

Mages are notoriously poor cooks. Do we want a society ruled by people who force us all to eat only Ramen and Kraft dinner?

So they eat like a college freshman?

Hey now! I can cook a multiple course meal in my dorm!!

[Veruin]

eluvianix wrote...

Hey now! I can cook a multiple course meal in my dorm!!

You probably can, but can you afford to? 

Modifié par Veruin, 13 janvier 2014 - 09:54 .

[drake heath]

I'd be cool with that, I'd have to be a mage though, because I wouldn't stand for it if I wasn't, it's unfair when the privileged class doesn't include me.

Obviously if I was in Thedas I wouldn't be a peasant, or some slave, I'd be a mage, and a really cool one at that.

Modifié par drake heath, 13 janvier 2014 - 10:09 .

[Asdrubael Vect]

hhh89 wrote...

@Dark Korsar: I'm talking about slaves and common folks in Tevinter.

it depends of what kind of common folks you asking

as we know servants/alianage elves live slightly better than Tevinter slaves so if you asking about this common folks you already have the answer

" Slave hunters may capture elves in other nations (where, for the most part, slavery is illegal) and smuggle them into the Imperium, but those who are caught doing so are executed and made an example of. Those slaves who are sold on the black market are considered "non-contract" slaves, and have the worst living conditions of all.

It is still legal for elves and humans and even Qunari to be sold into slavery in Tevinter, People may also choose to sell themselves into slavery to provide for their families. Dwarves are thus far not known to be kept as slaves in the Imperium, presumably due to their upstanding relations they held with them for millennia as well as for their fundamental importance in providing the Imperium with lyrium.

Slaves are not allowed to own property or serve in the military. Many of them are skilled workers who have been trained in a profession. However, they are not considered artisans, nor can they keep apprentices. Even when armed and serving as professional soldiers or bodyguards, slaves[/b] are not honored with military ranks

Slaves can only legally be set free before a judge, with the owner present to formally state the slaves have been granted freedom, or by the owner's will upon his or her death. These emancipated slaves are known as Liberati[/b], a subclass with limited rights and are not considered citizens. Liberati can join a Circle of Magi or serve as an apprentice in trade. Liberati may also own property, but cannot join the military or have a say in governance"


and now it depends of what kind of slaves in Tevinter you asking....illegal slaves, Qunari-Orlais prisoners of wars, house servants, slaves soldiers/bodyguards are not the same

Modifié par Dark Korsar, 13 janvier 2014 - 10:18 .

[andar91]

[quote]Sylvius the Mad wrote...

[quote]andar91 wrote...

Because raw power does not equal the ability to lead effectively.[/quote]
Like that ever stopped a despot.



I never claimed that it would stop the people wanting to seize power. The poster asked why mages shouldn't rule, and I answered. Mages could lead effectively, but the OP seemed to suggest that more power=greater leadership.

[Aolbain]

This, right here, is a perfect validations of the chantrys stance on mages.

[Hellion Rex]

Veruin wrote...

eluvianix wrote...

Hey now! I can cook a multiple course meal in my dorm!!

You probably can, but can you afford to? 

Hush, you!

[Beerfish]

eluvianix wrote...

mx_keep13 wrote...

Beerfish wrote...

Mages are notoriously poor cooks. Do we want a society ruled by people who force us all to eat only Ramen and Kraft dinner?

So they eat like a college freshman?

Hey now! I can cook a multiple course meal in my dorm!!

Course 1 plain Ramen
Course 2 Ramen with crackers
Course 3 Ramen and broccoli
Course 4 Ramen and cheese cubes.