155 réponses à ce sujet

[mopotter]

Raydiva wrote...

So long as I get a choice of someone who does not hate a whole group of people (hates all mages or templars), has a warped spirit/demon in them (making it a really weird three-way), might give me an STD if there are no mage healers around and/or has some weird, dangerous artifact that can suck your soul out in the bedroom I'll be happy.

I like this.  

I'm a huge Alistair fan, I have a thing for guys who make me laugh, but I liked Zev too.  I've had pretty good luck with the romances they have offered me.  I even liked Anders, until he blew up the Chantry.  I liked Fenis too, until he left me after one night.  

[mopotter]

CybAnt1 wrote...

I remember when there were Romance guides for games like BG2, because picking the right lines and making the right decisions were critical for continuing the Romance.

It just seemed to me that the Romance guide, for anybody, in DA2, was fairly simple.

1. Get their Friendship up and get them to like you as a Friend. Give gifts.
2. Wait for dialogue with Heart icons next to it. Pick that! (Duh.)
3. Don't flirt with anybody else. Ok, maybe do it for a while, so you can see the two of them bicker. But you will be eventually forced to choose!
4. Sleep with them.
5. Profess undying love (OK, unless it's Isabela, then you scare her off.) Especially in the farewell scene.
6. The End. Rinse and repeat.

Now, look, everybody knows my feelings on the dialogue wheel. But it seems to be Romancing has really been dumbed-down when all you have to do is look for a Heart icon to know you're saying the right "romancer" thing, instead of maybe actually thinking about what you have to say and how it impacts the person.

I'm gonna say it: yes, so the Heart icon makes you know for sure you're saying something "romanceish" to the person, but that is one ambiguity that doesn't need to be removed. Its presence is what basically turns romance in these games into autopilot, which is certainly nowhere like real life. 

Agree.  Well, I like the dialogue wheel, but not a fan of the heart thing.  I am old fashion that way.  I just want to say "sorry not interestsed" if they misundersand my inquiry about their preferences.  

And I really don't care for the gift giving to increase how much they like me,  Even though I will use if if available.  I gave away a lot of dog bones in DAO to characters who should have thrown them back at me.    

I just want some good dialogue and some humor, a little teasing and a lot of well, romance.

[mopotter]

d1ta wrote...

Well, here's to hoping for a good romance arc =)

And I hope the humans won't get an ouchy surprise somewhere along the road this time (somewhere from being a mistress so you can keep your guy if you're not from the 'proper' lineage, taking the dark ritual for that happily ever after or boyfriend became a terorist no matter what you say or do) .. I could only hope, LoL. It's pretty much up to the writter on how they're going to write.

As for my preferences, I'd prefer a 'regular' and 'stable' guy (already had my share of 'dramatic relationships' in the past, thank God it's over. Don't want it again, even in my games). Some might say they're the boring type, but then again it's different strokes for different folks and I wouldn't dream of telling them that they have the wrong taste ever.

I would be happy with this.  My husband says I like the boyscout type.  But I think I like the humor and the boyscout types seem to have a better sense of humor,   I adored Alistair, the humor, the rose.   

Did not like the dark ritual, I started romancing Zev because of it, not as great for me but he was ok in his own way.  My human noble warden had no problem killing him though, since he tried to kill her. 

[CybAnt1]

(i) But not with her distance from you romantically. Not to mention the human-elf divide, which Merril brings up in the friendship romance. 

Sure, she's worried about taking a shemlen as her beloved. The good news is, you know exactly the right things to say to deal with this fear. Just pick the heart-marked line. 

(ii) But her chasitty is irrelevant unless you're romancing her, cf. the scene with Zevran. 

She's commitment phobic, so as long as you avoid the mistake of professing love too soon to her, & just don't lose her as a companion in Act 2, you'll know exactly what to say to her to deal with her fears in Act 3, just pick the heart-marked line. 

(iii) Anders carrying a +1 in his head has distinct and unique challenges for a romance that has nothing to do with him being a terrorist. 

Yes, he doesn't want to share a life with you as long as the possessing spirit inside of him makes it a potential constant threeway, the good news is you can always defeat these fears. How? Pick the heart-marked line. 

(iv) No, that's not it. Fenris being a rape victim is a distinct obstacle.

Yes, this is what makes him break up with you in Act 2, but don't worry, like I just said, you can get him back in Act 3, you can win over the self loathing and self doubt he suffers from. How? Pick the heart-marked line. 

Noticing a trend - the one I started by pointing out? 

I guess while I would agree that DA2 romances have (storyline) obstacles, the heart icon, like I've been saying all along, gives you a "win" button to overcome all of them. 

It's a bit, again, like in combat, having a "press this and 1 enemy dies" button. Press it enough times, and you know the battle will be over. 

The heart button is a bit like that for romances in DA2. 

[Ultim Asari]

My favorite romances were Alistair and Merrill. I hope that both make a return in DA:I and I hope that Cassandra is also a romance option.

[teh DRUMPf!!]

 Alistair is the only DA:O romance I haven't pursued.

[aphelion4]

I liked all the male romances and romanced every single one ( on different characters of course 8D). Alistair remains my favourite though, for his humour, charm and sincerity. Varric probably would have been second had he been bangable. Y U NO PUT VARRIC ROMANCE BIOWARE? GAWD

I liked Alistair and Varric because of how normal they were, in comparison to guys like Fenris, Anders and Zevran who all had baggage. While baggage can be attractive, when it's your only choice (DA2) then it can be a bit annoying.

If there are romances in DA:I, I'd like variety basically. Someone different than Alistair, Fenris, Zevran, and Anders.

[Friera]

Even though its Mass Effect, the best romance...ever, was Thane. God I love that romance.

(sorry, doublepost)

Modifié par Friera, 19 janvier 2014 - 01:04 .

[Friera]

CybAnt1 wrote...

(iv) No, that's not it. Fenris being a rape victim is a distinct obstacle.

Yes, this is what makes him break up with you in Act 2, but don't worry, like I just said, you can get him back in Act 3, you can win over the self loathing and self doubt he suffers from. How? Pick the heart-marked line. 

Noticing a trend - the one I started by pointing out? 

I guess while I would agree that DA2 romances have (storyline) obstacles, the heart icon, like I've been saying all along, gives you a "win" button to overcome all of them. 

It's a bit, again, like in combat, having a "press this and 1 enemy dies" button. Press it enough times, and you know the battle will be over. 

The heart button is a bit like that for romances in DA2.

Then again. Only giving gifts and suddenly they fall head-deep in love with you is even less realistic. I´d take DA2 romance over DA:O Romance anyday.

Both need improvement, though. Excited to see what´s gonna happend in the next installment.

[CybAnt1]

I will agree on that, in DA2, each companion might have 1 or 2 things you can give to them as gifts, but these are things that have deep meaning to them and they will have a reactive cutscene. Instead of the dozens of rubbish trinkets you could give them in DAO, being barely acknowledged by a "friendship +5" floaty and little else, not even a voiced "thank you, that was really nice of you". Yes, that WAS an improvement.

They've apparently said DA:I romances will be event-driven. Neither the autopilot processes of "find & give gifts over and over" or "press the heart line over and over".

That, to my ears, sounds quite good, but as always we've got to see the implementation. 

Modifié par CybAnt1, 19 janvier 2014 - 02:09 .

[luckycooky25]

i hope so everything is beter isabelle becuase it was only safe for my mage to date her

[esper]

CybAnt1 wrote...

Right then. Then I say that when the combat should stop hand-holding me. Sometimes when I pick fire ball in combat, my mage should cast cone of cold, because obviosly pressing the fireball icon on the talent menu shouldn't allow my character to win and cast a fire ball every single time.

Let me repeat one more time, so the point is understood.

I understand the problem with "ninjamancing" and I have no problem with having the initial decision to romance made to the player as clear as possible so you aren't taken to be a love machine by accident. Forget the yellow heart. Have a giant chocolate heart with Valentine's Day music playing in the background. Whatever floats your boat.

But then having anything after that point have to be pointed out to the player as being a romantic overture by that heart assumes players are too stupid to know when flirting is flirting just by reading dialogue, (*) throughout the entire romance. 

And yes, trust me, you can "win" with every romanceable character throughout the game by picking every heart-marked mini-choice. OK. And making sure that if you flirt with somebody else, you eventually stop. Compare this to the at least slightly more well-thought-out 'romance paths' in BG2, and tell me which is more dumbed down. 

Sure, the Isabela romance runs into the biggest potential obstacles, but those appear whether she's your friend/rival or romancee. 

The problem with the DA2 romances is that they faced no (romance-specific) obstacles. The Aragorn-Arwen romance in Lord of the Rings is powerful because there are forces that represent obstacles. There's even something close to a love triangle.

I guess the reason I fixate on this point is Bioware used to know how to write this. I see hints they'll be doing it again in DAI. Hopefully. 

(*) Of course, this is getting to "heart" of my problem with the dialogue wheel in general. 

Oh, and one more thing, though a side point. There are many games with magic where you can sometimes either fail at casting a spell, or cast the wrong spell by accident, at least some of the time. I don't mind them, and find it an interesting element. Makes magic less of a "WInning!" sure thing. 

As always, tastes differ. 

Actually if you pick every heart icon in game you lock out of both Fenris and Sebastian. So no, you can't win them all. (Though I think Fenris might have been a bug).

The romance in lord of the ring doesn't face the obstable of making their feelings clear, in fact as I remember it it was more the elf/human immortal/not immortal, father won't give his daughter up which are the issues. It has nada to do with the romance in bioware as they all begin at the 'we need to communicate we have feelings for each other' stage.

And again if my character makes a romantic overture I want to know if beforehand. Just as if I want to know if my character starts yelling.


The BG2 romances weren't so great if you play female characters let's leave it at that. Also I don't enjoy a game where I have to have a walkthrough open in order to pick every single dialog choice.

I would also like to add that I don't see romance as a game in real life or in roleplay. In real life I can communicate fluidly and attempt to change misconceptions, I can't do that in a game. In a roleplaying game I see the romance as as a way to enchance my character and the story, I have never felt that I have 'won' once I reach the culmination scene.

If I want to play a challinging romance game I either pick up a dating sim or a visual novel with focus on romance which have these kind of stories and gameplay in depth and I am saying this without any hint of sarcasm.

[esper]

CybAnt1 wrote...

I will agree on that, in DA2, each companion might have 1 or 2 things you can give to them as gifts, but these are things that have deep meaning to them and they will have a reactive cutscene. Instead of the dozens of rubbish trinkets you could give them in DAO, being barely acknowledged by a "friendship +5" floaty and little else, not even a voiced "thank you, that was really nice of you". Yes, that WAS an improvement.

They've apparently said DA:I romances will be event-driven. Neither the autopilot processes of "find & give gifts over and over" or "press the heart line over and over".

That, to my ears, sounds quite good, but as always we've got to see the implementation. 

Not to delibaratly pick a fight, but I don't think event driven that solve the heart icon or not issue as the heart icon is to do with how our character expresses itself. We still have the issue of the dialog choice are present in those event.

Though I am glad that they make attempts to have approval be something more fluid.

[CybAnt1]

The romance in lord of the ring doesn't face the obstable of making their feelings clear, 

Yeah, that's why I switched to another example, that's more similar to the game -- Knight's Tale. 

If you've seen the movie, it's all about "Sir" William trying to figure out the right things to say to Joscelyn -- and often saying the wrong ones. The point is that he can. 

The BG2 romances weren't so great if you play female characters let's leave it at that. 

Agreed, mostly because the ladies had Anomen or nothing, and Anomen was a Sebastian Vael with more hangups. 

Back in the day, the BG2 devs felt no obligation to give the ladies as many choices as the men, and there was no thought given to same-sex romance. Of course, there were mods ... 

If I want to play a challinging romance game I either pick up a dating sim or a visual novel with focus on romance which have these kind of stories and gameplay in depth and I am saying this without any hint of sarcasm. 

Again, I agree with the point that romance doesn't need to be the centerpiece of the story - it almost never is in fantasy. Well, except for Krull, where he figures out he really loves the woman he's in an arranged marriage to, and he no longer needs a whirly flying glaive, he & his bride-to-be can destroy the Beast with blasts of flaming love.

Still, I maintain, romance in a fantasy game feels more true to the genre, if not true always to real life, where the player has to overcome, and not just experience, obstacles, challenges, and adversities to win his true love. Yes, it's a side plot. But side plots can be done well. And my view is either do them well, or leave them out. 

Modifié par CybAnt1, 19 janvier 2014 - 03:35 .

[Pasquale1234]

CybAnt1 wrote...

Still, I maintain, romance in a fantasy game feels more true to the genre, if not true always to real life, where the player has to overcome, and not just experience, obstacles, challenges, and adversities to win his true love. Yes, it's a side plot. But side plots can be done well. And my view is either do them well, or leave them out. 

I love it when you can do that - and I think that some of the companion quests in DA can help to create that feeling.

I usually romanced Isabela, and mostly because I found her to be a breath of fresh air amongst the heaviness of the other LI's issues and having to watch the world fall apart around me.  Then you get to this huge romantic moment where Hawke gets to play the hero in laying it all on the line for her by accepting the Arishok's challenge - and the fight itself turns out to be like this.

[BraveVesperia]

I think all of the romances have been well done so far, except Sebastian's. It wasn't even the fact that it's lacking in content compared to the others, it's the fact that femHawke's flirt lines are all really inappropriate for this Chantry guy. And it doesn't really set her up as a person willing to have an asexual/chaste relationship.

Other than that, all of the romances have interesting stories and whatnot. I'd like a few more light-hearted moments with the LI though (outside of banter). Anders, Fenris and Merrill's storylines were all pretty heavy and angsty.

[agonis]

Pasquale1234 wrote...

CybAnt1 wrote...

Still, I maintain, romance in a fantasy game feels more true to the genre, if not true always to real life, where the player has to overcome, and not just experience, obstacles, challenges, and adversities to win his true love. Yes, it's a side plot. But side plots can be done well. And my view is either do them well, or leave them out. 

I love it when you can do that - and I think that some of the companion quests in DA can help to create that feeling.

I usually romanced Isabela, and mostly because I found her to be a breath of fresh air amongst the heaviness of the other LI's issues and having to watch the world fall apart around me.  Then you get to this huge romantic moment where Hawke gets to play the hero in laying it all on the line for her by accepting the Arishok's challenge - and the fight itself turns out to be like this.

Yeah, that fight. *giggles*
 Thanks for the video.

It felt so very much undeserved to become Champion of Kirkwall that way and as much as I enjoy the comedy of fights where the Hero survives due to his jogging skills (like the last duel against Darth Malak if you are "mage"), I hope there will be more heroic duels in Dragon Age:I.
They don´t have to be a half an hour of wasted time and resources (like in DA: O and DA:][). ME:3 had some really nice fights that didn´t feel like you could win them by battle of material.

Back to topic:

Alaister was the only character that I didn´t romance. I was playing Mage and his bickering about his past and his present felt odd considering what happened at the Tower and was awaiting me if I failed the test in the Fade.
And his refusal to lead that little gang of misfits and his reluctance at becoming king didn´t endear him to me either.
For me the whole situation wasn´t about what my companions or myself wanted, it was about what was necessary. Tha world was falling to pieces, it wasn´t the time for a jourey of self discovery. You are able to do what is necessary (like marrying and becoming King), do it. It will save many others.

Don´t get me wrong, I care about Alaister. But in a kind of disapproving way. (Which I find great.) 

[KBomb]

Although Zevran was my favorite romance, I really liked the Alistair one - only as a human noble. No way I'd be someone's mistress, pfft. That being said, I think it was his wit and goofiness that made him stand out. I love awkward guys.

I would have loved to romance Loghain. I hated him at first, but after reading the novels, his character and why he was the way he was and to see what drove him to his decisions appealed to me storywise. He was complicated, imo. Not a bad guy, not a good one. So a mixture of Alistair and Loghain? Is that possible? I wish.

[duckley]

I loved the Alistair romance -I loved how Alistair kind of grew up in DAO - I loved his personal story and despite how much he had experienced loss and rejection, he kept his sense of humour and his sense of duty. Heck he was even respectful to Isolde based on his caring for Eamon. What a guy.

Zevran's romance was Ok. The only romances I have truly enjoyed aside from Alistair is Morrigan and Isabella.

Most of the other companions annoy me

[Mirrman70]

I despised Alistair until he was hardened, seemed like he was just trying to hide from everything using humor. I prefer either the prince/princess innocent type of of romance (leliana, merrill and Tali), the seductress (Morrigan, Isabela) or the best friend (you could make the claim that Alistair was this but it depended entirely on your playthrough and decisions, only Varrc and Aveline seem like they could have held this role)

[KiwiQuiche]

I did like the variance with the romances in DAO-

Alistair was...very sweet, with his romance. It got kinda way too gooey and sugary though. I mean, sweet is nice, but sometimes it was like romancing a unicorn or something.

Morrigan, I prefer having her as a friend, especially with male Warden's since she's kinda like "ya know, never been friends with a man who hasn't slept with me" and that was an interesting convo XD

Leliana is my fave for my female Wardens. I liked how she's sweet and trying to make a new life, but willing to kick some ass when it comes to it.

Zevran, well he's just fun XD Especially when he's actually in love with you and it's all sunshine and daisy and rampant innuendos.

Each romance has a different feel to it; Alistair's is just very sweet. Sometimes too much, though.

EDIT: That's one of the reasons why I think the DAO romances trump the DA2 ones- everyone in DA2 was either stupid, insane or bigoted or a combo. Izzy was the only one who wasn't off her rocker. <_<

Modifié par KiwiQuiche, 20 janvier 2014 - 12:56 .

[Star fury]

If biower makes a companion like Alistair I really really hope they cut the whining. It was embarassing when my Cousland girl had to put up with Alistair's endless tears about Duncan when her family was brutally butchered.

[Zeleen]

Great to see discussions going on...   I am so looking forward to this game...  and also replaying DA:O  if DA I  has as much replay value we are really in for a treat!!

and speaking of treats...

Pasquale1234 wrote...

I love it when you can do that - and I think that some of the companion quests in DA can help to create that feeling.

I usually romanced Isabela, and mostly because I found her to be a breath of fresh air amongst the heaviness of the other LI's issues and having to watch the world fall apart around me.  Then you get to this huge romantic moment where Hawke gets to play the hero in laying it all on the line for her by accepting the Arishok's challenge - and the fight itself turns out to be like this.

thank you Pasquale1234 !!!!!! 
if Any one reading this forum hasn't seen that video - you are in for a treat!! 

Modifié par Zeleen, 04 février 2014 - 08:36 .

[wiccame]

Zeleen wrote...

Great to see discussions going on...   I am so looking forward to this game...  and also replaying DA:O  if DA I  has as much replay value we are really in for a treat!!

and speaking of treats...

Pasquale1234 wrote...

I love it when you can do that - and I think that some of the companion quests in DA can help to create that feeling.

I usually romanced Isabela, and mostly because I found her to be a breath of fresh air amongst the heaviness of the other LI's issues and having to watch the world fall apart around me.  Then you get to this huge romantic moment where Hawke gets to play the hero in laying it all on the line for her by accepting the Arishok's challenge - and the fight itself turns out to be like this.

thank you Pasquale1234 !!!!!! 
if Any one reading this forum hasn't seen that video - you are in for a treat!! 

lol thats just what my Hawke does....