TK514 wrote...
LobselVith8 wrote...
I see the reality of Thedas being filled with kingdoms that are intolerant towards the Dalish and the elven religion, and with templars hunt them down. I'm not seeing why that point continually gets glossed over with people who conveniently forget how elves, mages, and heathens are treated by Andrastians.
If the other nations are intolerant of the Dalish, it's because the Dalish have given them no reason to be otherwise. And the load about Templars hunting Dalish is hogwash. The Templars don't give a fig about the Dalish. The Templars hunt Mages, regardless of race. They aren't picking on those poor stupid Dalish out of some racial or religious bias. Without harboring mages, it is unlikely roving bands of savages who are doing a passing job of wiping themselves out would ever get a visit from the Templar order.
Well, I trust Merrill explicitly saying that templars hunt down the Dalish.
I'm also not going to vilify the Dalish as savages for refusing to give up their heritage, or being wary of strangers when they're targets of violence and persecution for their cultural values and their religious beliefs.
TK514 wrote...
LobselVith8 wrote...
The people who encroach their clans seem to be templars, who pursue them, or even Andrastians threatening the Dalish to convert can happen, as it did with the Sabrae clan. Humans even tried to burn down Velanna's clan. I don't see why that makes the Dalish bad guys.
Really. The Human Warden was a Templar? Or a Missionary? Or trying to burn down the clan?
How about Hawke? Which of the things you listed was Hawke? Was the Champion there on a mission of racial intolerance? Or Duncan. Clearly Duncan was just an elf hating sociopath, looking for an excuse to kill him some Knife Ears.
Merrill points out that the clans are nomadic because the Dalish are hunted down. Ariane protected her clan from a templar who hunted them down. Velanna's clan faced the wrath of humans who turned to burn them away from their settlement. I'm not seeing anything in your statement that changes those facts.
TK514 wrote...
Or Brother Genetivi. Here's your evil Chantry man, in the flesh. So which of those terrible Chantry sins was he there to visit upon the Dalish? Baby eating, perhaps? Urinating on their totems? Maybe he was going to sacrifice their Hallah to the Maker. Surely, such a man, serving such an evil organization, was up to no good near a Dalish camp.
You mean the man who wrote that humans were the rightful masters of Thedas? I wonder how it would sound if someone said a particular ethnic group were the rightful 'masters' of a specific continent.
TK514 wrote...
No?
Yet in each case, the visitor received unwarranted hostility, if not outright racism, from the Dalish. Racism that extend to their own people, should someone dare to mingle with humans.
The Dalish can not survive by starting every contact with "Go away, shemlen, or we'll kill you."
Yeah, I recall the sheer racism of the Dalish raising Aveline as one of their own. Or welcoming Feynriel into their clan, and protecting him from templars. Or welcoming Arianni back into the clan. Or signing a treaty to aid non-elves against the Blight.
And considering Mother Hannah has to assure an Amell Warden that a lynch mob won't try to kill him, I'm not going to pretend that the Dalish face no dangers from strangers.
TK514 wrote...
LobselVith8 wrote...
The Dalish are condemned as heathens, and their religion is the main issue in any alliance with an Andrastian nation. I'm not seeing why the entirety of the blame is laid at the feet of the Dalish. I'm certainly hoping the Inquisition affords the protagonist an opportunity to build alliances that can help the Elvhen, as well as dislodging Orlesian power from the Dales.
The Dales are an absurd goal. You keep demanding that the Dalish should get that specific chunk of land back. The chunk of land that was stolen from someone else to give to them, and which hasn't been theirs for longer than they lived there. A land surrounded by Andrastian nations, who you claim will find it impossible to allow them to exist peacefully.
There are rumors of an elven rebellion in the Dales, and a gathering of the Dalish in the Dales is supposed to happen. That's why I bring up the Dales.
TK514 wrote...
So what sane reason would they have for wanting that particular hunk of land back? There are no great Elven libraries there, or any more lost elf culture than they'd find anywhere else. Given the neigborhood and the current inhabitants, It's probably the least suitable chunk of land outside of Tevinter. On the flip side, we have at least three countries that deviate from the White Chantry. Nevarra has it's own decidedly un-Chantry practices, and Rivain is about as un-Chantry as you can find. We even know that at one time, there were rumors of the Dalish considering settling on Llomerryn. And sadly we already know how much support Ferelden would realistically offer to the Elves if push came to shove.
Nevarra follows the faith of Andraste and the kingdom of Rivaini purged the Qunari who converted with their Andrastian and nationalist forces.
TK514 wrote...
So what is it about the Dales that makes the Dalish such idiots? Just because they were gifted a plot of land once doesn't mean they have some divine right to it for the rest of time. If they can take it, it's theirs for as long as they can hold it, but they don't deserve it until they can take it. And the moment they lose it, it isn't theirs anymore. There are potential allies, and other places to live in Thedas. The Dalish simply refuse to even attempt to cultivate or consider any of them. They'd rather wander from place to place, doing their best to ****** off or kill anyone who gets close, regardless of intention, with predictable results.
Considering that the Andrastian kingdoms consider the Dalish heathens and criminalize their religion and culture, I'm doubtful that it would be as simple as you claim. Even Merrill thinks a new kingdom would be the target of half of Thedas. My hope would be that the Inquisition could change the balance in favor of the elves.
Modifié par LobselVith8, 19 janvier 2014 - 06:58 .
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