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[Master Warder Z_]

cjones91 wrote...

Master Warder Z wrote...

cjones91 wrote...

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

Ferelden is NOT an absolute monarchy, so the King's word isn't law. The individual nobles rule their lands. The Ferelden king needs the support of the nobles, otherwise his rulership falls apart, and a new king will be elected by the Landsmeet. The king giving away land of lesser nobles is bound to upset some nobles, which would ripple out to affect the Elves too.

But who owns the lands containing Ostagar?The only people who live there are several tribes and Chasind.

There are Human settlements on the borders and within the Wilds and at least one "Lord" to be confirmed (The one who ruled over Lothering) So it would be likely that the entire province was deeded to at least one noble line.

Even the Korcari Wilds and the area surrounding it?I find it hard to believe that all of that land is under a noble's control considering all of the tribes living there.

I really don't considering that if History is anything to go by you don't need to occupy territory to own it.

.-. Besides given there are Settlements fairly deep into the Wilds that indicates to me at least that there is more then merely Barbarians within the forest; Besides Honnleath which was in the deepest portions of Feraldan alongside the Wilds was considered part of the Arling of Redcliffe.

And given the vast amount of distance from the Village and Keep it self it wouldn't be an inaccurate assumption to place the entire thing under their Domain, but that said merely because it part of the Arling doesn't mean it doesn't have minor bans to act as local Lords as Lothering proved.

So you likely have several Nobles with interested staked in keeping the region in human control if for nothing else merely to maintain their own houses fortunes.

[cjones91]

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

cjones91 wrote...

Master Warder Z wrote...

cjones91 wrote...

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

Ferelden is NOT an absolute monarchy, so the King's word isn't law. The individual nobles rule their lands. The Ferelden king needs the support of the nobles, otherwise his rulership falls apart, and a new king will be elected by the Landsmeet. The king giving away land of lesser nobles is bound to upset some nobles, which would ripple out to affect the Elves too.

But who owns the lands containing Ostagar?The only people who live there are several tribes and Chasind.

There are Human settlements on the borders and within the Wilds and at least one "Lord" to be confirmed (The one who ruled over Lothering) So it would be likely that the entire province was deeded to at least one noble line.

Even the Korcari Wilds and the area surrounding it?I find it hard to believe that all of that land is under a noble's control considering all of the tribes living there.

The Korcari Wilds are the territory of the Chasind, and I am sure that they were just GIDDY that some foreign king decided that their territory was his to give away. But the area surrounding Ostagar is a part of Ferelden, so this particualr part would belong to a noble. So as you can see, there are lots of reasons for why humans wouldn't lvoe what the king thought he could get away with.

Considering how the Dalish and Chasind have similiar lifestyles and customs I don't believe they would have a big problem with it as much as you think.

[EmperorSahlertz]

cjones91 wrote...
Considering how the Dalish and Chasind have similiar lifestyles and customs I don't believe they would have a big problem with it as much as you think.

Read a history book. Two nomadic people do usually not get a long if they live in the same area. This is of course because they would have to share resources, which are already scarce. Lack of resources of course leads to conflict.

Modifié par EmperorSahlertz, 21 janvier 2014 - 11:34 .

[cjones91]

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

cjones91 wrote...
Considering how the Dalish and Chasind have similiar lifestyles and customs I don't believe they would have a big problem with it as much as you think.

Read a history book. Two nomadic people do usually not get a long if they live in the same area. This is of course because they would have to share resources, which are already scarce. Lack of resources of course leads to conflict.

But there is plenty of land to go around,hell the Korcari Wilds is huge considering most of it is unmapped.They don't have to live in the same area since the areas in the Wilds are large enough to support small clans.

[LobselVith8]

Master Warder Z wrote...

LobselVith8 wrote...

The King and Queen (alone or together) gives land to the Grey Wardens. It's not as though bestowing land to a group is without precedent. And do you think Arl Eamon and his supporters would stand against the King and Queen for giving the Dalish the Hinterlands? Because Eamon was the only serious contender against Loghain, who can become an ally and Warden towards the conclusion of the Fifth Blight.

Ahem are you comparing the Warden's who were deeded Lands coming fresh out of a blight to the universial Piriah of Thedas?

I really don't see the situations are as Comparable.

And Eamon is a popular man tis true but he and his faction of Royalists are hardly the only Nobles within the Land.

Considering the Hero of Ferelden is a Dalish elf and acts as the Arl of Amaranthine (a high noble), with lesser nobles swearing fealty to him, I guess I hold a different view than you about what might likely happen post-Dalish Boon. Then again, Kirby said Ashalle was managing the Dalish Boon (the Hinterlands), so it doesn't seem the boon gifted to the Dalish was dismissed:

Mary Kirby wrote...

Ashalle is still in Ferelden, managing the boon given to the Dalish.

[EmperorSahlertz]

cjones91 wrote...

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

cjones91 wrote...
Considering how the Dalish and Chasind have similiar lifestyles and customs I don't believe they would have a big problem with it as much as you think.

Read a history book. Two nomadic people do usually not get a long if they live in the same area. This is of course because they would have to share resources, which are already scarce. Lack of resources of course leads to conflict.

But there is plenty of land to go around,hell the Korcari Wilds is huge considering most of it is unmapped.They don't have to live in the same area since the areas in the Wilds are large enough to support small clans.

The parts of the Korcari WIlds that are habitable are limited. Especially for nomadic people, since they cannot rely on the harvest to get them through the winter, but will have to migrate with the herds, so they can have a steady food supply throughout the winter.
So obviosuly both people would want to lvie in the ebst parts of the Korcari Wilds, now why should the Chasind accept the new ivnaders and just let the best land go to the Dalish? And why should the Dalish settle for some barely inhabitable land? Inserting the Dalish into the Korcari Wilds would inevitably leads to conflict, which it did, since the nation disintegrated within a decade.

[Cainhurst Crow]

cjones91 wrote...

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

cjones91 wrote...
Considering how the Dalish and Chasind have similiar lifestyles and customs I don't believe they would have a big problem with it as much as you think.

Read a history book. Two nomadic people do usually not get a long if they live in the same area. This is of course because they would have to share resources, which are already scarce. Lack of resources of course leads to conflict.

But there is plenty of land to go around,hell the Korcari Wilds is huge considering most of it is unmapped.They don't have to live in the same area since the areas in the Wilds are large enough to support small clans.

If it's all unmapped and such, how do you know the dalish don't need to go in the same area as a chasind. For all you know the chasind could very well count the entire wilds as their territory and use all the resources they can from it.

[dragonflight288]

I don't think the Kokari Wilds are actually owned by Ferelden. It's the border. The Kokari Wilds codex says that it's unexplored territory. Even the Tevinter Imperium hadn't conquered it or the Chasind, and Ostagar was built as an outpost to defend against the Chasind Wilders way back when.

I think it's safe to say that the Kokari Wilds are strictly Chasind territory.

[Master Warder Z_]

LobselVith8 wrote...

Master Warder Z wrote...

LobselVith8 wrote...

The King and Queen (alone or together) gives land to the Grey Wardens. It's not as though bestowing land to a group is without precedent. And do you think Arl Eamon and his supporters would stand against the King and Queen for giving the Dalish the Hinterlands? Because Eamon was the only serious contender against Loghain, who can become an ally and Warden towards the conclusion of the Fifth Blight.

Ahem are you comparing the Warden's who were deeded Lands coming fresh out of a blight to the universial Piriah of Thedas?

I really don't see the situations are as Comparable.

And Eamon is a popular man tis true but he and his faction of Royalists are hardly the only Nobles within the Land.

Considering the Hero of Ferelden is a Dalish elf and acts as the Arl of Amaranthine (a high noble), with lesser nobles swearing fealty to him, I guess I hold a different view than you about what might likely happen post-Dalish Boon. Then again, Kirby said Ashalle was managing the Dalish Boon (the Hinterlands), so it doesn't seem the boon gifted to the Dalish was dismissed:

Mary Kirby wrote...

Ashalle is still in Ferelden, managing the boon given to the Dalish.

That's lovely and Sten even made Arishok in their world.

But it isn't mine  

There has already been the whole "There is no established canon but there is a "Bioware" Canon. statement issued by them so i won't bother repeating it.

My Warden and Warden Commanders were not Elven and therefore i am not within a universe that would apply to.

But i am agruing from a standpoint from a universe it could occur within but going with a Writer line when it could disverge from personal canon to Bioware canon seems a tad bit...Convoluded to me. Hence why i avoided mentioning how the Boon could never be given in the first place, And instead focused on ways it could possibly be revoked if given.

My ultimate point being.

When it comes to Bioware and their own personal canon, it may or may not apply depending upon PC and their choices. Hence why i just avoid that line of thought in the majority of dicussions considering a good deal of Wardens are not Dalish and a good deal fo Hawke's were not Mages  

[Master Warder Z_]

dragonflight288 wrote...

I don't think the Kokari Wilds are actually owned by Ferelden. It's the border. The Kokari Wilds codex says that it's unexplored territory. Even the Tevinter Imperium hadn't conquered it or the Chasind, and Ostagar was built as an outpost to defend against the Chasind Wilders way back when.

I think it's safe to say that the Kokari Wilds are strictly Chasind territory.

China hasn't explored every inch of the Gobi but it still doesn't stop them from declaring it to be part of China.

[Jedi Master of Orion]

I think speculating exactly what the Dalish boon didn't work as planned is not worthwhile until we have more information.

[EmperorSahlertz]

We have all the information we need to approximate the reason as to why it didn't work. The Dalish was inserted into land that was already owned and/or inhabited by other people. This inevitably lead to conflict, which resulted in the Dalish giving up on the idea.

[Sylvius the Mad]

Master Warder Z wrote...

I personally never bought into the undying elves concept.

Neither have I.

But the elves do, so it's important to examine the issue from that perspective.

[Fast Jimmy]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

Fast Jimmy wrote...

Is it logical for a nation's crimes to be blamed on its race?

Of course not.  But does that stop people from doing it?

So how people perceive the actions of a nation as, instead, the actions of the entire race actually influences the reality?

[Sylvius the Mad]

The reality is that people believe things without having good reasons.

[Master Warder Z_]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

The reality is that people believe things without having good reasons.

I've said it once and i will probably say it sixteen million more times this Year.

Perception is greater then reality.

[Sylvius the Mad]

Master Warder Z wrote...

I've said it once and i will probably say it sixteen million more times this Year.

Perception is greater then reality.

I can't agree with that.

[Master Warder Z_]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

Master Warder Z wrote...

I've said it once and i will probably say it sixteen million more times this Year.

Perception is greater then reality.

I can't agree with that.

._. On Individual level Perspection is Reality, Therefore Mass Perception is Greater then Reality.

least as far as i construe it anywho.

 But that's just the Magic of my Logic.

[Giant ambush beetle]

I either have perception or reality, I can't have both at the same time.

[Master Warder Z_]

The Woldan wrote...

I either have perception or reality, I can't have both at the same time.

Really? Having no personal feelings construed from sensory information gathered from "reality" if that was true oh i would love to disscect that brain to find out why those Neurons aren't firing up those Synapses properly.

But alas this cursed country would lock me up if i did so.

But you really shouldn't say such a thing to those that find Genetic tinkering exciting 

[Pasquale1234]

Reality is an overrated mental construct.

[dragonflight288]

Master Warder Z wrote...

dragonflight288 wrote...

I don't think the Kokari Wilds are actually owned by Ferelden. It's the border. The Kokari Wilds codex says that it's unexplored territory. Even the Tevinter Imperium hadn't conquered it or the Chasind, and Ostagar was built as an outpost to defend against the Chasind Wilders way back when.

I think it's safe to say that the Kokari Wilds are strictly Chasind territory.

China hasn't explored every inch of the Gobi but it still doesn't stop them from declaring it to be part of China.

Ferelden isn't China. And medieval settings had land owners called freeholders swear fealty to the king or local lord. If the Kokari Wild's aren't explored territory, there aren't any freeholders there, and if there aren't free holders, it isn't part of the nation. 

[Sylvius the Mad]

Master Warder Z wrote...

China hasn't explored every inch of the Gobi but it still doesn't stop them from declaring it to be part of China.

Nor did that declaration make the Gobi part of China.

[Giant ambush beetle]

Master Warder Z wrote...

Really? Having no personal feelings construed from sensory information gathered from "reality" if that was true oh i would love to disscect that brain to find out why those Neurons aren't firing up those Synapses properly.

What I meant is when perceiving reality you're running reality through a bunch of filters, your senses, the brain takes the (incomplete) information from your senses and draws a picture of it. When you finally ''perceive reality'' its not reality anymore, not at all, its a construct of your senses and the interpretation of your mind. 
Thus even though reality definitely exists its imperceivable. 

Man, this beer is strong!  

[dragonflight288]

The Woldan wrote...

Master Warder Z wrote...

Really? Having no personal feelings construed from sensory information gathered from "reality" if that was true oh i would love to disscect that brain to find out why those Neurons aren't firing up those Synapses properly.

What I meant is when perceiving reality you're running reality through a bunch of filters, your senses, the brain takes the (incomplete) information from your senses and draws a picture of it. When you finally ''perceive reality'' its not reality anymore, not at all, its a construct of your senses and the interpretation of your mind. 
Thus even though reality definitely exists its imperceivable. 

Man, this beer is strong!  

...you sound exactly like Plato in Philosophy. 

The table isn't real, it's just an imitation. The original idea of the table is the most real table there is. The physical thing is nothing more than a copy of the original, which was the idea.

Not sure how much I buy that, but it does have a following.