142 réponses à ce sujet

[jrob6]

Peer of the Empire wrote...

Krogan always go to rank 6.  Always

That's a good idea if you're priority is high health/shields over high damage output.  I'm assuming you prefer the build  in your sig.  If so, then you definitely have a ton of shields and a quick shield recharge speed.  But in doing so, you're sacrificing a lot by only having 2 grenades and 3 points in the passives.  To each their own, I suppose.

[hostaman]

XFG-65 wrote...

Fitness is a waste of points beyond rank 2. You're almost always going to want to put 2 ranks in fitness, but any more than that is a waste. There are a few exceptions:

- Juggernaut: always max out fitness. Always.
- Krolord: always max out fitness. Always.
- Drell: good to max out fitness because you get 20% movement speed bonus.
- Destroyer: if you decide you really absolutely hate and can't stand the missile launcher or the multifrags, then you can max fitness, but that's not recommended.
- Krogans and batarians: you might want to take fitness to rank 4 or you could even go to rank 6 if you decide that you don't want carnage/lift grenades/tech armour/blade armour whatever.

But for all the other characters, fitness is useless and a waste of points beyond rank 2. Asari, quarians, humans with 500 base shields, turians, salarians...DO NOT spec into full fitness. Never. If you want to be more tanky, use a cyclonic 4, it's infinitely more useful than fitness.

When I started off playing, I used to max out fitness all the time because I had no idea what I was doing, I thought HP works the same as in other games, but it's completely different, investing in fitness makes very little difference to your survivability. This game relies on health and shield gate, you can't really be in the face of your enemy, you have to be very cautious and use a lot of soft cover. It's not practical to try to tank all damage head on, the best way to survive is to be able to dodge, move fast and use soft cover often. Geth scanner helps in a huge way.

Which does mean that the less able players tend to go down a lot on some of the open maps with poor cover like Hydra and Condor, and muggins here with his nooby full health is into clutch mode again!

I might not be optimal but I make a good paramedic 

[Peer of the Empire]

jrob6 wrote...

Peer of the Empire wrote...

Krogan always go to rank 6.  Always

That's a good idea if you're priority is high health/shields over high damage output.  I'm assuming you prefer the build  in your sig.  If so, then you definitely have a ton of shields and a quick shield recharge speed.  But in doing so, you're sacrificing a lot by only having 2 grenades and 3 points in the passives.  To each their own, I suppose.

Krogan does much more damage with more survivability.  They have no weapon power, move more slowly and have no dodge.  Only with this spec will they be able to make optimal use of the shield gate.  On Platinum, his shields will begin to regenerate, in combat - this means there will be no nerds hiding in the corner and getting owned. 

You will note that with this build already all his powers are at maximum.  The only thing that would change with no fitness is max carnage (lol), 6% damage on inferno grenade and 13% weapon damage.  A large part of a krogan's damage even on Platinum is from melee

Passives is not very useful unless wanting to 1 shot Platinum phantom barriers with the acolyte.

Inferno grenade does not spec like Lift Grenade.  Base grenade capacity will always be 2.

Modifié par Peer of the Empire, 27 janvier 2014 - 01:33 .

[Dovakiin_N7]

Ferocious Panda wrote...

i only play platinum and I notice a huge difference from 500 shields to 825 shields. Good luck surviving long with 500 shields against an all out dragoon rush. What are you gonna do, "right hand advantage it?" lol

game just isn't that black and white. skipping fitness is almost never advisable

this. ^. Fitness on BSN is underrated. Skipping it on infiltrators and stim packs perhaps make sense. But I find I get downed by swarmers, banshee balls, atalas rocket DOT, Seeker plague , 2 elbow of justice or a geth hunter GPS shot.  Nothing worse than wasting a ops pack because of ravager goo.  

[Dovakiin_N7]

15% shield regeneration on fitness 5 + Multicapacitor. Try it. Too it with shield cell if you wish.

[jrob6]

Peer of the Empire wrote...

jrob6 wrote...

Peer of the Empire wrote...

Krogan always go to rank 6.  Always

That's a good idea if you're priority is high health/shields over high damage output.  I'm assuming you prefer the build  in your sig.  If so, then you definitely have a ton of shields and a quick shield recharge speed.  But in doing so, you're sacrificing a lot by only having 2 grenades and 3 points in the passives.  To each their own, I suppose.

Krogan does much more damage with more survivability.  They have no weapon power, move more slowly and have no dodge.  Only with this spec will they be able to make optimal use of the shield gate.  On Platinum, his shields will begin to regenerate, in combat - this means there will be no nerds hiding in the corner and getting owned. 

You will note that with this build already all his powers are at maximum.  The only thing that would change with no fitness is max carnage (lol), 6% damage on inferno grenade and 13% weapon damage.  A large part of a krogan's damage even on Platinum is from melee

Passives is not very useful unless wanting to 1 shot Platinum phantom barriers with the acolyte.

Inferno grenade does not spec like Lift Grenade.  Base grenade capacity will always be 2.

You make a lot of absolute statements.  I'm not criticizing your build, just saying that's one way to spec it with the priority being health/shields.  I realize that the base grenade capacity will always be 2, but taking grenade capacity 5, choosing 5b in fortification, and taking power damage in the passives makes for a much different Krogan Soldier than yours.  

[LanceCucumber]

jrob6 wrote...

Peer of the Empire wrote...

jrob6 wrote...

Peer of the Empire wrote...

Krogan always go to rank 6.  Always

That's a good idea if you're priority is high health/shields over high damage output.  I'm assuming you prefer the build  in your sig.  If so, then you definitely have a ton of shields and a quick shield recharge speed.  But in doing so, you're sacrificing a lot by only having 2 grenades and 3 points in the passives.  To each their own, I suppose.

Krogan does much more damage with more survivability.  They have no weapon power, move more slowly and have no dodge.  Only with this spec will they be able to make optimal use of the shield gate.  On Platinum, his shields will begin to regenerate, in combat - this means there will be no nerds hiding in the corner and getting owned. 

You will note that with this build already all his powers are at maximum.  The only thing that would change with no fitness is max carnage (lol), 6% damage on inferno grenade and 13% weapon damage.  A large part of a krogan's damage even on Platinum is from melee

Passives is not very useful unless wanting to 1 shot Platinum phantom barriers with the acolyte.

Inferno grenade does not spec like Lift Grenade.  Base grenade capacity will always be 2.

You make a lot of absolute statements.  I'm not criticizing your build, just saying that's one way to spec it with the priority being health/shields.  I realize that the base grenade capacity will always be 2, but taking grenade capacity 5, choosing 5b in fortification, and taking power damage in the passives makes for a much different Krogan Soldier than yours.  

The points in your build for carnage would be better spent on your passives, as it is best used as a detonator. You will get an increase in overall damage to carnage AND Inferno grenades for a loss of 10% recharge time on carange which is neglible. Also by increasing the power damage you increase your killing time, and should increase your survivability. 
 
I usually run a 6/3/6/6/5 on Krogan Soldier. Below is a link for INVADERONE's gameplay build showing the same build.

 

[NuclearTech76]

We've had this discussion in depth before.

social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/343/index/17470280 

agreeordie.com/features/gaming/592-me3-philosophy-of-fitness

[Creator Limbs]

Peer of the Empire wrote...

XFG-65 wrote...

Fitness is a waste of points beyond rank 2. You're almost always going to want to put 2 ranks in fitness, but any more than that is a waste. There are a few exceptions:

- Juggernaut: always max out fitness. Always.
- Krolord: always max out fitness. Always.
- Drell: good to max out fitness because you get 20% movement speed bonus.
- Destroyer: if you decide you really absolutely hate and can't stand the missile launcher or the multifrags, then you can max fitness, but that's not recommended.
- Krogans and batarians: you might want to take fitness to rank 4 or you could even go to rank 6 if you decide that you don't want carnage/lift grenades/tech armour/blade armour whatever.

But for all the other characters, fitness is useless and a waste of points beyond rank 2. Asari, quarians, humans with 500 base shields, turians, salarians...DO NOT spec into full fitness. Never. If you want to be more tanky, use a cyclonic 4, it's infinitely more useful than fitness.

When I started off playing, I used to max out fitness all the time because I had no idea what I was doing, I thought HP works the same as in other games, but it's completely different, investing in fitness makes very little difference to your survivability. This game relies on health and shield gate, you can't really be in the face of your enemy, you have to be very cautious and use a lot of soft cover. It's not practical to try to tank all damage head on, the best way to survive is to be able to dodge, move fast and use soft cover often. Geth scanner helps in a huge way.

Krogan always go to rank 6.  Always

My Krogan Adept says otherwise. As does my Sentinel. My Soldier and Krolord couldn't be reached for comment, and neither could the Vanguard.

Modifié par prostheticlimbs, 27 janvier 2014 - 03:28 .

[Dr. Tim Whatley]

Put as many points in fitness as you feel comfortable with. Don't feel pressured into skipping ranks just because someone else tells you to.

[Moby]

millahnna wrote...

I just did my first try with suicide charge and I think that's my preference as well.

My venom is only 4 to my Wraith 6 so for weight purposes I'm sticking with the Wraith for now.

Give 4 in passives and 4 in Smash a shot, with a decent pistol sporting melee stunner and power magnifier.  Also note that Power Synergy from Charge lasts for 10 seconds - you can go without Bonus Power.  Personal preference.

Power Efficiency will be a godsend if you're worried about cooldowns.

[TopTrog]

It all depends, as with most things in this game. If there is a power I find myself not using at all (such as Pull), full fitness is of course much more useful. On many character builds I like this is not the case, so full fitness is rather the exception.

A rough guideline that has worked well for me is to reach around 900 shields (with most characters not inherently possessing a means of damage reduction), be it by fitness or cyclonics or both.

This is about the value at which a single gold phantom palm blast or geth prime pulse will not immediately put me on shieldgate. This has been working pretty well, maybe it´ll work for you as well.

[Heldarion]

I always cut points from powers if I deem some of their final evolutions not worth it and assign them to fitness.

Then there are cases like Combat Drone and Electric Slash/Biotic Slash where I spec out of them completely and assign 21 points to fitness.

[Miniditka77]

Tokenusername wrote...

Cyclonics.

^^This.

There's a lot of "tough guys/girls" out there who talk big about not using fitness, and then they go slap a Cyclonic III or IV on their no-fitness builds.*  If you aren't planning on using a Cyclonic, I say you should take R4 in Fitness on most characters.  The biggest exception is for sniper Infiltrators - you can get away with no Fitness, because Cloak can get you out of hairy situations.

*Not saying everyone who uses no-fitness builds does this, but I see a lot of them, and they make me laugh.

[NuclearTech76]

Miniditka77 wrote...

Tokenusername wrote...

Cyclonics.

^^This.

There's a lot of "tough guys/girls" out there who talk big about not using fitness, and then they go slap a Cyclonic III or IV on their no-fitness builds.*  If you aren't planning on using a Cyclonic, I say you should take R4 in Fitness on most characters.  The biggest exception is for sniper Infiltrators - you can get away with no Fitness, because Cloak can get you out of hairy situations.

*Not saying everyone who uses no-fitness builds does this, but I see a lot of them, and they make me laugh.

And why would you need fitness when you have cyclonics?

FWIW I'm not saying skip fitness when there aren't better alternatives.

[ClydeInTheShell]

I didn't read all the responses in the thread but I read the OP's question and here's my answer:

Obviously on melee builds you take all the melee damage you can get. On kits with high max shields & health (Krogan, Batarian, Destroyer, Juggernaut and some cases Turians, Collectadept to a lesser degree) you take some or all fitness because they benefit from it noticeably.

On all the other kits (Human, Drell, Volus, Asari, Quarian, Salarian, Geth) the difference between 0 fitness and full fitness is something negligible like 300-400 health or shields, except Geth who have a lot of shields and little health. So you're better served to use the points in your powers and passives so you kill faster. Killing faster means you kill what would be killing you before it actually does.

Modifié par ClydeInTheShell, 27 janvier 2014 - 04:35 .

[NuclearTech76]

I could go into great detail but I'm too damn lazy to do it at this point.

[Miniditka77]

NuclearTech76 wrote...

Miniditka77 wrote...

Tokenusername wrote...

Cyclonics.

^^This.

There's a lot of "tough guys/girls" out there who talk big about not using fitness, and then they go slap a Cyclonic III or IV on their no-fitness builds.*  If you aren't planning on using a Cyclonic, I say you should take R4 in Fitness on most characters.  The biggest exception is for sniper Infiltrators - you can get away with no Fitness, because Cloak can get you out of hairy situations.

*Not saying everyone who uses no-fitness builds does this, but I see a lot of them, and they make me laugh.

And why would you need fitness when you have cyclonics?

FWIW I'm not saying skip fitness when there aren't better alternatives.

Saying "I don't need fitness because I use Cyclonics" is fine.  I'm making fun of the people who say "I don't need fitness" as though it's a sign of their skill (ignoring the fact that they're using a Cyclonic).  

Anyway, I don't have enough Cyclonics to use them all the time, and I find that I don't really need them on a lot of classes if I take R4 in Fitness (at least not for Gold).

Modifié par Miniditka77, 27 janvier 2014 - 04:43 .

[Saints]

Shield battery> cyclonics

[NuclearTech76]

Miniditka77 wrote...

NuclearTech76 wrote...

Miniditka77 wrote...

Tokenusername wrote...

Cyclonics.

^^This.

There's a lot of "tough guys/girls" out there who talk big about not using fitness, and then they go slap a Cyclonic III or IV on their no-fitness builds.*  If you aren't planning on using a Cyclonic, I say you should take R4 in Fitness on most characters.  The biggest exception is for sniper Infiltrators - you can get away with no Fitness, because Cloak can get you out of hairy situations.

*Not saying everyone who uses no-fitness builds does this, but I see a lot of them, and they make me laugh.

And why would you need fitness when you have cyclonics?

FWIW I'm not saying skip fitness when there aren't better alternatives.

Saying "I don't need fitness because I use Cyclonics" is fine.  I'm making fun of the people who say "I don't need fitness" as though it's a sign of their skill (ignoring the fact that they're using a Cyclonic).  

Anyway, I don't have enough Cyclonics to use them all the time, and I find that I don't really need them on a lot of classes if I take R4 in Fitness (at least not for Gold).

Well, I've soloed with a level one drell on Gold, so IDK that I do need fitness. It does afford me the luxury of being a little more aggressive in play style though. FWIW I don't think it's a sign of skill either way. I can RHA the game with or without fitness.

[ClydeInTheShell]

Saints944 wrote...

Shield battery> cyclonics

I agree, it's a very underrated armor bonus.

[Beerfish]

I go full fitness for quite a few classes because I find I simply do not use one of the classes base abilities often enough to justify it.

Drell Adept - Often don't spec into pull.
Human Sent - Often don't spec into Tech Armour
QF eng - Often don't spec into turret.

[Jeremiah12LGeek]

Saints944 wrote...

Shield battery> cyclonics

I find this is very true on most of of the kits I use.

Unless I'm trying something very specific, I don't bother using cyclonics on kits that don't have high shields, anymore.

Modifié par Jeremiah12LGeek, 27 janvier 2014 - 05:18 .

[ClydeInTheShell]

Beerfish wrote...

I go full fitness for quite a few classes because I find I simply do not use one of the classes base abilities often enough to justify it.

Drell Adept - Often don't spec into pull.
Human Sent - Often don't spec into Tech Armour
QF eng - Often don't spec into turret.

Drell Adept no pull? Ok.

But HSent no Tech Armor?!?!? In favor of what?