262 réponses à ce sujet

[Grieving Natashina]

Oh, gotcha. Yeah, I agree.

No worries, I wasn't offended in the slightest. I used to be on the ToR forums, as well as the cesspool known as the dreaded battle.net and I'd see patterns there like this too.

Speaking of patterns...

Pro-tip: Never ever ever mention the name Sylvanas on the wow forums.  Just...don't.

Modifié par Starsyn, 29 janvier 2014 - 08:17 .

[Firky]

I saw an amazing conversation on twitter where The Longest Journey/Dreamfall's creator was chatting with a guy who "could identify as a wizard, barbarian or assassin, but not as a female character." (The Dreamfall games are mostly female characters, apart from Kian who just had a little section in the 2nd game.)

I'm not sure it's occurred to some guys that women (including me, ignore my avatar) have played as a lot of male characters because it's either that or not play.

Whoever is on the box won't bother me, personally, but guys don't get that turning down games like Dreamfall based on protagonist may be a relative luxury.

[Grieving Natashina]

Firky wrote...

I saw an amazing conversation on twitter where The Longest Journey/Dreamfall's creator was chatting with a guy who "could identify as a wizard, barbarian or assassin, but not as a female character." (The Dreamfall games are mostly female characters, apart from Kian who just had a little section in the 2nd game.)

I'm not sure it's occurred to some guys that women (including me, ignore my avatar) have played as a lot of male characters because it's either that or not play.

Whoever is on the box won't bother me, personally, but guys don't get that turning down games like Dreamfall based on protagonist may be a relative luxury.

Modifié par Starsyn, 29 janvier 2014 - 08:27 .

[Firky]

I'm pretty sure that puppy is the one that's awesome. So cute.

[Grieving Natashina]

That picture never fails to make me smile. I love bassets and beagles.

[Firky]

Oh hey, and speaking of twitter, Mike mentioned this game a while back.

http://www.crystalshard.net/hq.htm

It's the middle-aged gamer lady's ultimate nostalgic fantasy. I'm playing it now. I loved those old QFG games. Probably because I can identify as a fighter, mage, thief AND man.

Totally worth a play, IMO.

Modifié par Firky, 29 janvier 2014 - 09:15 .

[WidePaul]

More equality all round would be nice, and if we could get a reversible cover like ME3, i'd be happy. I'll admit it I'm easy to please.

[Battlebloodmage]

This is why I love the Walking Dead games. They're not afraid to use females and/or minority characters as leads. Hell, the people who survived the first game are all minorities.

[Knight of Dane]

This is how they should do it, (just with added female characters) I think that's trailer brilliance right there at 0:50 with Duncan.

Modifié par Knight of Dane, 29 janvier 2014 - 09:42 .

[KiwiQuiche]

Yeah it's always a white bearded dude on advertizement :| Kinda stale after a few decades or so.

Firky wrote...

I saw an amazing conversation on twitter
where The Longest Journey/Dreamfall's creator was chatting with a guy
who "could identify as a wizard, barbarian or assassin, but not as a
female character." (The Dreamfall games are mostly female characters,
apart from Kian who just had a little section in the 2nd game.)

I'm
not sure it's occurred to some guys that women (including me, ignore my
avatar) have played as a lot of male characters because it's either
that or not play.

Whoever is on the box won't bother me,
personally, but guys don't get that turning down games like Dreamfall
based on protagonist may be a relative luxury.

lol at people who claim they can't 'get' female characters thus thats a legit reason to ignore them. It just reminds me of what G. R. Martin said during an interview;



Seriously, women aren't weird foreign aliens. I just don't get the 'omfg women are unknowable weirdies durr'

Modifié par KiwiQuiche, 29 janvier 2014 - 10:48 .

[Star fury]

KiwiQuiche wrote...

Yeah it's always a white bearded dude on advertizement :| Kinda stale after a few decades or so.

[KiwiQuiche]

Star fury wrote...

KiwiQuiche wrote...

Yeah it's always a white bearded dude on advertizement :| Kinda stale after a few decades or so.

And that isn't counting the latest ones.


Though personally I have no idea what kinda point you were trying to make, Star

Modifié par KiwiQuiche, 29 janvier 2014 - 10:51 .

[Absafraginlootly]

I never understood why games that allow you to create your own character of whatever gender don't advertise that fact more. Its a major thing that they have and other games don't.

I hope that the marketing either doesn't look in detail at the pc or empthasizes that you get to make your own by showing different ones. I also hope the box cover doesn't have the protagonist on it nevermind what gender, I've always thought that made for a rather boring cover, which doesn't exactly inspire you to pick the thing up and look at its features.

Failing that I hope it isn't another white male protagonist on the cover because I know that there are female gamers who will see that and then not give the game a second glance because that's what I did with Mass Effect. I looked at Mass Effects cover and saw another shooter with a white male protagonist and didn't bother looking further because I wasn't interested in that, turns out I love mass effect but I never would have found that out if a hadn't played Dragon Age first.

Since the purpose of box covers (so far as I can figure) is to catch the attention and hopefully money of people looking around a games store, who won't necessarily know anything about the game. I would think, they wouldn't want to risk putting off potential customers by focusing on a specific protag gender, when making your own pc is a feature. But then what do I know? 

Welp, that's my opinion blarf of the day.

Modifié par Absafraginlootly, 29 janvier 2014 - 11:02 .

[Knight of Dane]

KiwiQuiche wrote...

Star fury wrote...

KiwiQuiche wrote...

Yeah it's always a white bearded dude on advertizement :| Kinda stale after a few decades or so.

*snip*

*Snippity*
*Snippitysnip*

And that isn't counting the latest ones.


Though personally I have no idea what kinda point you were trying to make, Star

I must admit, though I get it now, at first I though you were saying "Yeah it's always a white-bearded dude on advertizement"

[Bayonet Hipshot]

No.

I would rather Bioware try to include all of them in the marketing. DA I now have 4 different races with separate genders, so eight different possible Inquisitors.

It would be a lot better to market and advertise the fact that this game is about choices and variety as opposed to just human male and human female main character. Plus given the fact that DA is more about the world and the story, they should focus on marketing the fact that we have varied locations and places.

The would be a better marketing strategy IMO. There are plenty of games out there with either use a human male / human female protagonist for their marketing already.

[KiwiQuiche]

Knight of Dane wrote...

KiwiQuiche wrote...

Star fury wrote...

KiwiQuiche wrote...

Yeah it's always a white bearded dude on advertizement :| Kinda stale after a few decades or so.

*snip*

*Snippity*
*Snippitysnip*

And that isn't counting the latest ones.


Though personally I have no idea what kinda point you were trying to make, Star

I must admit, though I get it now, at first I though you were saying "Yeah it's always a white-bearded dude on advertizement"

Black white-beared wizard for DAI

[Grieving Natashina]

I think Star was just trying to say he wasn't bearded. I'm not sure what that has to do with anything though. Okay, so he doesn't have a beard...He's still the archetypal white guy that most of us have seen for years. Bionic Commando (the first one) and Starcraft are a couple of really old school games that feature that. Crap like this has been going since the beginning of video games.

Don't mind Star. They did tell me earlier that it would be a waste of money to market to women. Even though BW is a AAA company that doesn't exclude any gender and would love to get some more folks from all walks of life/gender/color ect ect to buy their games.

It is getting better, slowly. Still, outside of a few Super Mario games, things like Heavenly Sword (highly underrated), Metroid (I try to pretend The Other M never happened), Tome Raider and a few others, the overwhelming majority of AAA games that come out feature male protagonists. Not all of them, but most.

It doesn't have to be a human lady on the cover, since I do like the blank/black box ideas.  However, it would be awesome to see it in the advertising.   Show me a lady that isn't another generic white guy kicking some arse in the trailers.

It's gotta be more fitting than "This is the New Sh**" by Marilyn Manson for Origins.  I love Origins, the song was okay, but the combination of the two made no sense.

Modifié par Starsyn, 29 janvier 2014 - 11:11 .

[Firky]

The Sin wrote...
I would rather Bioware try to include all of them in the marketing. DA I now have 4 different races with separate genders, so eight different possible Inquisitors.
 

Totally agree, but how?

Like, you couldn't put them all on the box without it looking weird. (Could you?)

And I guess you mean marketing in general, but if 8 different looking protags appeared in different places, would people still be able to identify the game.

(Like I said, I think this is totally the way it should be done but I have no idea how.)

PS. @KiwiQuiche - That's brilliant.

Modifié par Firky, 29 janvier 2014 - 11:08 .

[Knight of Dane]

Absafraginlootly wrote...

I never understood why games that allow you to create your own character of whatever gender don't advertise that fact more. Its a major thing that they have and other games don't.

I don't have direct reference to this, mostly because I'm too lazy to find it, but I seem to remember some time back that a study or article showed that the games that feature a "main character" sells more, and that if they are men even more. (Which is why I guess DA2 felt like slapping Default Hawke on the cover)

The article then also made a point that many players never use character custoimization. Mass Effect was used as an example, and indeed many players just went with the default Shepard (Male, Sheploo, Soldier, etc.) and never knew they could make their own design.








See a trend?

[KiwiQuiche]

Starsyn wrote...

I think Star was just trying to say he wasn't bearded. I'm not sure what that has to do with anything though. Okay, so he doesn't have a beard...He's still the archetypal white guy that most of us have seen for years. Bionic Commando and Starcraft are a couple of really old school games that feature that. Crap like this has been going since the beginning of video games.

Don't mind Star. They did tell me earlier that it would be a waste of money to market to women. Even though BW is a AAA company that doesn't exclude any gender and would love to get some more folks from all walks of life/gender/color ect ect to buy their games.

It is getting better, slowly. Still, outside of a few Super Mario games, things like Heavenly Sword (highly underrated), Metroid (I try to pretend The Other M never happened), Tome Raider and a few others, the overwhelming majority of AAA games that come out feature male protagonists. Not all of them, but most.

It doesn't have to be a human lady on the cover, since I do like the blank/black box ideas.  However, it would be awesome to see it in the advertising.   Show me a lady that isn't another generic white guy kicking some arse in the trailers.

It's gotta be more fitting than "This is the New Sh**" by Marilyn Manson for Origins.  I love Origins, the song was okay, but the combination of the two made no sense.

Beard/rough stubble which is what I was saying. Apparently I need to be incredibly friggin precise for people to get it. And yes I'm fed up with the typical "white buff dude" in every damn advertisement with women left as either eye-candy or ignored, even in a RPG that lets you choose gender.

Oh, Star's in that park of "don't bother about women even though they make up 45% of the gaming community they're a minority"?


@Dane- you mean the 'dramatic walk outta an explosion" trend? And if you compare it with female characters on covers very rarely do you find any that are completely covered/arms/in stances like that.

Heck, with ME1 I just bought it 'cause it was cheap- then I realized you could play as a woman. I sure as heck would of bought it a lot earlier if I knew you could pick genders.

Modifié par KiwiQuiche, 29 janvier 2014 - 11:12 .

[Ridwan]

A good trailer would blend in both sexes and the different races.

[Grieving Natashina]

KiwiQuiche wrote...



Beard/rough stubble which is what I was saying. Apparently I need to be incredibly friggin precise for people to get it. And yes I'm fed up with the typical "white buff dude" in every damn advertisement with women left as either eye-candy or ignored, even in a RPG that lets you choose gender.

Oh, Star's in that park of "don't bother about women even though they make up 45% of the gaming community they're a minority"?

Even better.  We're such a minority of players for Dragon Age games (even though neither Star nor myself could find a source for the total number of female or male DA players) that it would be a waste of time to market for us. Then used the numbers from an entirely different game series, from the middle of the franchise (ME2) to base their point.

Here's the "logic" behind Star's reasoning.  I hope I'm getting this correct.

18% of players rolling female in an unrelated game from over 3 years ago
Plus being in the 40-45% range (as women have been for 3-4 years now according to ESAs own site)
Equals...we're not worth advertising to.

I agree with some of the other posters that say that BioWare would make more money by having at least a trailer or two with a lady character.   Oh and not a human one either.  That's something they do need to let the general playerbase know: You are not forced into being just a human.

Stupid edit.  Thanks for eating that.  

Trying again: Just remember, cool guys don't look at explosions.

Modifié par Starsyn, 29 janvier 2014 - 11:24 .

[Star fury]

KiwiQuiche wrote...

Starsyn wrote...

I think Star was just trying to say he wasn't bearded. I'm not sure what that has to do with anything though. Okay, so he doesn't have a beard...He's still the archetypal white guy that most of us have seen for years. Bionic Commando and Starcraft are a couple of really old school games that feature that. Crap like this has been going since the beginning of video games.

Don't mind Star. They did tell me earlier that it would be a waste of money to market to women. Even though BW is a AAA company that doesn't exclude any gender and would love to get some more folks from all walks of life/gender/color ect ect to buy their games.

It is getting better, slowly. Still, outside of a few Super Mario games, things like Heavenly Sword (highly underrated), Metroid (I try to pretend The Other M never happened), Tome Raider and a few others, the overwhelming majority of AAA games that come out feature male protagonists. Not all of them, but most.

It doesn't have to be a human lady on the cover, since I do like the blank/black box ideas.  However, it would be awesome to see it in the advertising.   Show me a lady that isn't another generic white guy kicking some arse in the trailers.

It's gotta be more fitting than "This is the New Sh**" by Marilyn Manson for Origins.  I love Origins, the song was okay, but the combination of the two made no sense.

Beard/rough stubble which is what I was saying. Apparently I need to be incredibly friggin precise for people to get it. And yes I'm fed up with the typical "white buff dude" in every damn advertisement with women left as either eye-candy or ignored, even in a RPG that lets you choose gender.

Oh, Star's in that park of "don't bother about women even though they make up 45% of the gaming community they're a minority"?


@Dane- you mean the 'dramatic walk outta an explosion" trend? And if you compare it with female characters on covers very rarely do you find any that are completely covered/arms/in stances like that.

Heck, with ME1 I just bought it 'cause it was cheap- then I realized you could play as a woman. I sure as heck would of bought it a lot earlier if I knew you could pick genders.

Actually I like to play games with a female protagonist, bonus points if they have a brilliant voice actress like Jennifer Hale. I was just pointing a fact that male gamers consist a majority of game audience, thus marketing will always target them first and foremost. But feel free to portray me as a male chauvinist pig, both of you. 

I don't know why you're so concerned about marketing, if I were you, I would be more interested in equal playing field for male and female protagonists. 

So some quote about "45% of female gamers" from a questionable source suddenly became a bible for you, LMAO. Seems legit. 

Modifié par Star fury, 29 janvier 2014 - 11:28 .

[Grieving Natashina]

Questionable source? Pray tell, how is the ESA questionable? Enlighten me, O Wise One. Tell me the credible source. Teach me your ways. Show me your reasoning as to why you believe ESA is crap and your ancient sources from a different game series are oh so reliable.

Yes, I'm feeling snarky today.  

I was attacking your apparent logic. You're quick to be insulted this morning.  I never called you a pig, nor tried to imply as such. That was your reasoning, correct? I can quote you from earlier in the thread if you'd like.

The OP as well as I'm concerned because we'd like to actually see our gender in the ads. Like most men get to all the time.  See, while I agree that more games should have female protagonists, shouldn't we at least start by having a trailer with a game that has already featured female protagonists?

Modifié par Starsyn, 29 janvier 2014 - 11:36 .

[KiwiQuiche]

Star fury wrote...

KiwiQuiche wrote...

Starsyn wrote...

I think Star was just trying to say he wasn't bearded. I'm not sure what that has to do with anything though. Okay, so he doesn't have a beard...He's still the archetypal white guy that most of us have seen for years. Bionic Commando and Starcraft are a couple of really old school games that feature that. Crap like this has been going since the beginning of video games.

Don't mind Star. They did tell me earlier that it would be a waste of money to market to women. Even though BW is a AAA company that doesn't exclude any gender and would love to get some more folks from all walks of life/gender/color ect ect to buy their games.

It is getting better, slowly. Still, outside of a few Super Mario games, things like Heavenly Sword (highly underrated), Metroid (I try to pretend The Other M never happened), Tome Raider and a few others, the overwhelming majority of AAA games that come out feature male protagonists. Not all of them, but most.

It doesn't have to be a human lady on the cover, since I do like the blank/black box ideas.  However, it would be awesome to see it in the advertising.   Show me a lady that isn't another generic white guy kicking some arse in the trailers.

It's gotta be more fitting than "This is the New Sh**" by Marilyn Manson for Origins.  I love Origins, the song was okay, but the combination of the two made no sense.

Beard/rough stubble which is what I was saying. Apparently I need to be incredibly friggin precise for people to get it. And yes I'm fed up with the typical "white buff dude" in every damn advertisement with women left as either eye-candy or ignored, even in a RPG that lets you choose gender.

Oh, Star's in that park of "don't bother about women even though they make up 45% of the gaming community they're a minority"?


@Dane- you mean the 'dramatic walk outta an explosion" trend? And if you compare it with female characters on covers very rarely do you find any that are completely covered/arms/in stances like that.

Heck, with ME1 I just bought it 'cause it was cheap- then I realized you could play as a woman. I sure as heck would of bought it a lot earlier if I knew you could pick genders.

Actually I like to play games with a female protagonist, bonus points if they have a brilliant voice actress like Jennifer Hale. I was just pointing a fact that male gamers consist a majority of game audience, thus marketing will always target them first and foremost. But feel free to portray me as a male chauvinist pig, both of you. 

I don't know why you're so concerned about marketing, if I were you, I would be more interested in equal playing field for male and female protagonists. 

So some quote about "45% of female gamers" from a questionable source suddenly became a bible for you, LMAO. Seems legit. 

...



Seriously? Like, seriously?

Ugh.