262 réponses à ce sujet

[Steelcan]

Starsyn wrote...

Steelcan wrote...

Starsyn wrote...

It's an M rated game, so I don't know how "young teens' factor into this. They sure as hell shouldn't be represented over fully grown adults, including women.

lol

What, that young teens should not be getting any market representation for a M rated game.  Even the CoD marketing is towards 18-24 year old boys, not young teens which you cleverly "lol" at.

Oh and that demographic? They are not the gaming majority, by the way.  The average age of a gamer is 30 years old.

this is even better

[Grieving Natashina]

[quote]Battlebloodmage wrote...


[/quote]While I agree with you that more representation is important, I have to disagree with you about the rating and intended target audience though. Do you know the sign at the smoke shop that say the bong is strictly for smoking tobacco, yeah... about that. [/quote]

Yeah, about that.  I live in Colorado and it's not like that.  You still cannot use the word "bong" in head shops.  You can't have one that's within 1000ft of a store.  You can't have a storefront window display of pipes and accessories.  There is actually a lot of rules to prevent kids from seeing that stuff.

[quote]It's an M rated game, but EA is not the one who rated the game, and market it as a mature game would relief EA of liability from the parents. The big market for video games is often the teens, and EA knows it.[/quote]

<sigh>

If you check out the video, it's been repeated that the target audience that most in the industry aim for is 18-24 years old.   That was the main demographic...ten years ago.  Times have changed.

[Br3admax]

Starsyn wrote...

Steelcan wrote...

Starsyn wrote...

It's an M rated game, so I don't know how "young teens' factor into this. They sure as hell shouldn't be represented over fully grown adults, including women.

lol

What, that young teens should not be getting any market representation for a M rated game.  Even the CoD marketing is towards 18-24 year old boys, not young teens which you cleverly "lol" at.

Oh and that demographic? They are not the gaming majority, by the way.  The average age of a gamer is 30 years old.

What's funny is, you think that any game is advertised toward "gamers." If they were, EA wouldn't be laughing at this comment while they're counting all of the money you keep giving them. 

[Grieving Natashina]

Steelcan wrote...

this is even better

Oh, you think I just pulled that out of air?  David Gaider uses this same site (as do most gaming companies) that I'm about to link you.  They aren't some hack research company; these guys take millions of samples from games in order to compile their data.  

http://theesa.com/facts/index.asp

So keep laughing there, Chuckles.  Not sure what's so damned funny, other than your lack abilty to stay on topic.

Watch the video.  Read the site.  Go educate yourself a little.

BioWare does not think the way you assume it would.  

Oh, so it's funny that games...don't advertise to gamers?  Huh?  

So, unless you're in the acceptable norm (which, going by some of the comments is male and white,) you shouldn't get ads?

Modifié par Starsyn, 29 janvier 2014 - 03:40 .

[dreamgazer]

One of the most widely-known M-rated games. Totally geared towards mature adults.

[Am1vf]

EnigmaXOXO wrote...

I think the biggest marketing mistake is assuming that a customer should already know that a particular game features character customization in regard to race or gender. Particularly since the majority of games on the market feature white male leads and headline them exclusively on box art and ad campaigns.

I can’t tell you how many good games I passed over initially because it was easier to assume that it was just another male-centric shooter. Mass Effect, Saints Row 2, Borderlands and Fallout are just three game francizes I was late to the curve on because there was no information provided by marketers to indicate they offered player choice or character customization.

Only thanks to CUSTOMER reviews, YouTube clips and forums like this one did I eventually learn anything substantial about these games. Would have paid full price at launch had the information been provided by the so-called professional marketers. Then again… their lack of vision meant that I only paid a fraction of their original cost for the privilege of adding them to my game library.

Oh well. Better late than never, I suppose.

Anyhow, I absolutely agree that it’s just good “business sense” to market to a broader audience IF you’ve created a game that might actually appeal to those outside the straight-white-male demographic.  Rather than fearing diversity, they should embrace it as Bioware has. More customers means more money… and hopefully better games for the rest of us!

I keep seeing comments like this pop up everywhere, both in the internet and irl. Why the marketing departments don't seem to notice is a mistery to me, isn't kind of their job to gather this sort of information? see how well their marketing is working and adjust accordingly? It seems to me that if people interested in any feature don't know that certain producs have that feature the marketing department is doing something very wrong. But that's just my opinion, I know nothing about how marketing works ofc.

[Zazzerka]

68% of gamers are age 18 or older.

89% of parents are present when games are purchased or rented.

This manchild epidemic is troubling indeed.

Modifié par Zazzerka, 29 janvier 2014 - 03:41 .

[Grieving Natashina]

dreamgazer wrote...



One of the most widely-known M-rated games. Totally geared towards mature adults.

I would hope that you know that legal adult =/= mature person.  It is marketed to adults 17 and up.  That doesn't make them a mature adult.

[Steelcan]

Starsyn wrote...

Oh, you think I just pulled that out of air?  David Gaider uses this same site (as do most gaming companies) that I'm about to link you.  They aren't some hack research company; these guys take millions of samples from games in order to compile their data.  

http://theesa.com/facts/index.asp

So keep laughing there, Chuckles.  Not sure what's so damned funny, other than your lack abilty to stay on topic.

Watch the video.  Read the site.  Go educate yourself a little.

BioWare does not think the way you assume it would.  

Oh, so it's funny that games...don't advertise to gamers?  Huh?  

So, unless you're in the acceptable norm (which, going by some of the comments is male and white,) you shouldn't get ads?

And so what?

The advertising is meant for a certain demographic, usually teen through young adult males.  The actual statistics of who plays and everything else you mentioned is entirely irrelevant to that fundamental truth.

[dreamgazer]

Starsyn wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...



One of the most widely-known M-rated games. Totally geared towards mature adults.

I would hope that you know that legal adult =/= mature person.  It is marketed to adults 17 and up.  That doesn't make them a mature adult.

That doesn't really support your assertion about M-rated games and marketing, though.

Modifié par dreamgazer, 29 janvier 2014 - 03:47 .

[OdanUrr]

Starsyn wrote...

Oh, you think I just pulled that out of air?  David Gaider uses this same site (as do most gaming companies) that I'm about to link you.  They aren't some hack research company; these guys take millions of samples from games in order to compile their data.  

http://theesa.com/facts/index.asp

So keep laughing there, Chuckles.  Not sure what's so damned funny, other than your lack abilty to stay on topic.

Watch the video.  Read the site.  Go educate yourself a little.

BioWare does not think the way you assume it would.  

Oh, so it's funny that games...don't advertise to gamers?  Huh?  

So, unless you're in the acceptable norm (which, going by some of the comments is male and white,) you shouldn't get ads?

Out of curiosity, does the ESA use data from other countries besides the US?

[Grieving Natashina]

Zazzerka wrote...

CoD uses shooting, explosions, and the latest Eminem track in their advertising. That targets males from like, 8-years-old onwards.

They are marketing to adults.  Adult music, adult themes with a high dose of violence.  I can dig up some marketing that's actually aimed at 8 year olds if you like.  I assure you, it isn't anything like that.  I doubt you're old enough to have an 8 year old, but I really hope you wouldn't let them listen to Eminem and play a violet game that's not meant for them.

It's the parents responsiblity to say no.  So again, it's not about catering to young teens.  It's about catering to adults.  I'm not sure why so many posters seem almost scared of the idea.  Many women are asking for one trailer. One.  Women want to be represented too, in a game that has been established to have a lot of women in it.

Again, in the video, David Gaider himself stated that 30% of all Dragon Age players are women.  Watch the video, then come back to me.  Until you and Steel actually watch what the industry is saying, there is no point in discussing this further.

[Steelcan]

TipsLeFedora wrote...

relevant?  perhaps

[Veruin]

Starsyn wrote...
They are marketing to adults.  Adult music, adult themes with a high dose of violence.  I can dig up some marketing that's actually aimed at 8 year olds if you like.  I assure you, it isn't anything like that.  I doubt you're old enough to have an 8 year old, but I really hope you wouldn't let them listen to Eminem and play a violet game that's not meant for them.u and Steel actually watch what the industry is saying, there is no point in discussing this further.

You seriously underestimate parents these days.

That Doritos hat keeps making me think of Johnny Bravo.

Modifié par Veruin, 29 janvier 2014 - 03:50 .

[Steelcan]

Starsyn wrote...

Zazzerka wrote...

CoD uses shooting, explosions, and the latest Eminem track in their advertising. That targets males from like, 8-years-old onwards.

They are marketing to adults.  Adult music, adult themes with a high dose of violence.  I can dig up some marketing that's actually aimed at 8 year olds if you like.  I assure you, it isn't anything like that.  I doubt you're old enough to have an 8 year old, but I really hope you wouldn't let them listen to Eminem and play a violet game that's not meant for them.

It's the parents responsiblity to say no.  So again, it's not about catering to young teens.  It's about catering to adults.  I'm not sure why so many posters seem almost scared of the idea.  Many women are asking for one trailer. One.  Women want to be represented too, in a game that has been established to have a lot of women in it.

Again, in the video, David Gaider himself stated that 30% of all Dragon Age players are women.  Watch the video, then come back to me.  Until you and Steel actually watch what the industry is saying, there is no point in discussing this further.

I'm gonna respond to the bolded parts

1.  Lol no, alcohol companies advertise to teens, but they obviously can't say they are, but they still do

2.  Not a week ago I was at Gamestop and saw a Mother buy for her kid who couldn't have been more than 10 God of War 3

3.  I can show you stats from ME that say that not even 20% of players played FemShep, which leads me to assume that the percentage of female players in that is somewhere around 15%, and I'd be extremely surprised if DA was twice that

[Br3admax]

Starsyn wrote...

Zazzerka wrote...

CoD uses shooting, explosions, and the latest Eminem track in their advertising. That targets males from like, 8-years-old onwards.

They are marketing to adults.  Adult music, adult themes with a high dose of violence.  I can dig up some marketing that's actually aimed at 8 year olds if you like.  I assure you, it isn't anything like that.  I doubt you're old enough to have an 8 year old, but I really hope you wouldn't let them listen to Eminem and play a violet game that's not meant for them.

Have you played CoD, do you know what most of they're players actually sound like. I can assure you, plenty of them are kids who bought it simply for lolexplosions. 

It's the parents responsiblity to say no.  So again, it's not about catering to young teens.  It's about catering to adults.  I'm not sure why so many posters seem almost scared of the idea.  Many women are asking for one trailer. One.  Women want to be represented too, in a game that has been established to have a lot of women in it.

Whad did the majority of this have to do with anything? At all? Now you're going into a completely different tangent. As what the women are asking for, every women asking for a female trailer already knows about the game. What does that accomplish? 

Again, in the video, David Gaider himself stated that 30% of all Dragon Age players are women.  Watch the video, then come back to me.  Until you and Steel actually watch what the industry is saying, there is no point in discussing this further.

Again, what does this have to do with anything. Ads are about bringing in customers, not making the ones you have feel good about themselves. 

Modifié par Br3ad, 29 janvier 2014 - 03:52 .

[Veruin]

Steelcan wrote...
3.  I can show you stats from ME that say that not even 20% of players played FemShep, which leads me to assume that the percentage of female players in that is somewhere around 15%, and I'd be extremely surprised if DA was twice that

Unless of course most women prefer playing as male characters. 

[Zazzerka]

Starsyn wrote...

I doubt you're old enough to have an 8 year old, but I really hope you wouldn't let them listen to Eminem and play a violet game that's not meant for them.

No, but I've acted as the responsible adult when my younger brother was buying MA and R games/movies. Meaning the cashier looks at him, looks at me, I nod my head, and she rings up the purchase. I would totally let my 8-year-old listen to Eminem.

I've watched your video. There's nothing wrong with his points. But claiming that 'Dead or Alive: Beach Volleyball' is marketed at over-18s because the developers said so is far too trusting.

[Steelcan]

Veruin wrote...

Steelcan wrote...
3.  I can show you stats from ME that say that not even 20% of players played FemShep, which leads me to assume that the percentage of female players in that is somewhere around 15%, and I'd be extremely surprised if DA was twice that

Unless of course most women prefer playing as male characters. 

In which case there is really no point at all in showing a FemInquisitor or even including one

[Grieving Natashina]

OdanUrr wrote...

Out of curiosity, does the ESA use data from other countries besides the US?

 
They have a sister group called the Industrial Software Federation of Europe.

http://www.isfe.eu/industry-facts

For their part, they say that 45% of Europe's gaming population is female.  They have some age facts too, such as the amount of gamers they found under the age of 20 was 12%.

[OdanUrr]

Steelcan wrote...

2.  Not a week ago I was at Gamestop and saw a Mother buy for her kid who couldn't have been more than 10 God of War 3

That reminds me of this:

http://kotaku.com/i-...nt-g-1371011511

[jaza]

Starsyn wrote...

Zazzerka wrote...

CoD uses shooting, explosions, and the latest Eminem track in their advertising. That targets males from like, 8-years-old onwards.

They are marketing to adults.  Adult music, adult themes with a high dose of violence.  I can dig up some marketing that's actually aimed at 8 year olds if you like.  I assure you, it isn't anything like that.  I doubt you're old enough to have an 8 year old, but I really hope you wouldn't let them listen to Eminem and play a violet game that's not meant for them.

It's the parents responsiblity to say no.  So again, it's not about catering to young teens.  It's about catering to adults.

:lol::lol:

[Battlebloodmage]

[quote]Starsyn wrote...

[quote]Battlebloodmage wrote...


[/quote]While I agree with you that more representation is important, I have to disagree with you about the rating and intended target audience though. Do you know the sign at the smoke shop that say the bong is strictly for smoking tobacco, yeah... about that. [/quote]

Yeah, about that.  I live in Colorado and it's not like that.  You still cannot use the word "bong" in head shops.  You can't have one that's within 1000ft of a store.  You can't have a storefront window display of pipes and accessories.  There is actually a lot of rules to prevent kids from seeing that stuff.

[quote]It's an M rated game, but EA is not the one who rated the game, and market it as a mature game would relief EA of liability from the parents. The big market for video games is often the teens, and EA knows it.[/quote]

<sigh>

If you check out the video, it's been repeated that the target audience that most in the industry aim for is 18-24 years old.   That was the main demographic...ten years ago.  Times have changed.


[/quote]So? That doesn't negate the fact the teenage boys are a large segment of the consumers. I doubt EA would ignore them. I've never been to Colorado, but based on where I've been, Califoria, Nevada, and New York, I've never seen such rules being enforced. Bongs and pipes being displayed inside the store, and you can see it from the outside. Maybe different states have different rules... My point is about the liability though. The warning is mostly to free the maker of liability, so EA may say that the game is aiming only at mature audience, but that doesn't mean that it's their only target audience.

[Veruin]

Battlebloodmage wrote...


Yeah, about that.  I live in Colorado

 I've never been to Colorado