420 réponses à ce sujet

[CybAnt1]

Hit points are abstractions, as the very first D & D manuals stated.

200 hit points could mean you are surviving, say, 20 sword blows. In reality, what's "really" happening outside the abstraction, is that you are so good at maneuvering, evading, making sure your shield or armor blocks, parrying, or whatever else, that out of those 20, most are glancing or not very deep blows.

It's not that a normal human could survive 20 "full on" sword hits. It's just that #20 is the one that finally kills you because you're bleeding, fatigued, wounded, battered, and - now you get the one that does you in.

For monsters, hit points mean, they really are big, and tough, and monstrously hard to kill, like you would expect. After all, you would expect to need a lot of hits to take down a high dragon.

In theory, that's how it's all supposed to work.

[The Elder King]

Personally, I don't think the war will end in DAI, so I doubt any faction will be annihilated (well, the RT could be). And from what the devs said about the mage-templar war (expecially in own GI video), it seems that they want to portray the war not as 'good vs had' but as a fight between factions that have both good points and bad points. Which makes me happy (along with the fact that they stated that both the templars' and mages' portrayals in DA2 was intentionally made to show their worst side).

[EmperorSahlertz]

Hawke being stabbed through the gut and liftet up by the Arishok, The Warden being mauled by a bear, eaten by a dragon, crushed by an Ogre, doesn't leave much room for interpretation.

EDIT: I do agree though, hit points should never be taken literally and those things I lsited, mainly happens because they look awesome. I was just trying to illustrate why some people might interpret hit points literally.

Modifié par EmperorSahlertz, 31 janvier 2014 - 05:20 .

[Veruin]

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

Hawke being stabbed through the gut and liftet up by the Arishok, The Warden being mauled by a bear, eaten by a dragon, crushed by an Ogre, doesn't leave much room for interpretation.

Don't forget Hawke impaling themselves with a staff. 

[Wulfram]

I'd love it if we got animations that showed non-lethal hits as more like glancing blows. I'm fairly sure it's impractical, particularly in a game with a whole lot of abilities to deal with, but still, it'd be nice.

[EmperorSahlertz]

Didn't KotOR do just that? Can't remember sepcifically but I could ahve sworn that the combat animations in that game was actually duels, and not just a bunch of mobs wailing on eachother endlessly until one tobbled.

[dragonflight288]

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

Didn't KotOR do just that? Can't remember sepcifically but I could ahve sworn that the combat animations in that game was actually duels, and not just a bunch of mobs wailing on eachother endlessly until one tobbled.

Sometimes it did. Sometimes it looked like the vibroblade or lightsaber went into your opponents stomach and they had a few hitpoints left and the fight continued. 

[KainD]

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

Didn't KotOR do just that? Can't remember sepcifically but I could ahve sworn that the combat animations in that game was actually duels, and not just a bunch of mobs wailing on eachother endlessly until one tobbled.

Only if the weapon types matched.

[EmperorSahlertz]

dragonflight288 wrote...

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

Didn't KotOR do just that? Can't remember sepcifically but I could ahve sworn that the combat animations in that game was actually duels, and not just a bunch of mobs wailing on eachother endlessly until one tobbled.

Sometimes it did. Sometimes it looked like the vibroblade or lightsaber went into your opponents stomach and they had a few hitpoints left and the fight continued. 

Well, at least it is an approximation of the ideal animations.

[Realmzmaster]

Orian Tabris wrote...

Realmzmaster wrote...

If mages are so powerful why hasn't Tevinter beaten the Qunari and turn them into slaves? Why haven't the mages taken out the dwarves? Could it be that dwarves have a resistance to magic and have a high tolerance to lyrium?
The problem that a mage has is that any spell requires time to cast. In that time a templar will close any distance between the templar and the mage which can mean one dead mage. Or an archer will loose an arrow. So who will be faster the archer or the mage? My bet is on the archer.

What about the rogue templar who can hide in the shadows? How will the mage detect his/her presence before he/she strikes?

I'd like to point out that not all spells have an actual cast time. My bet is on the mage - assuming it is a spell without a cast time, and they know which spell they're casting - because there's no wait time. As for the archer, they'd have to be extremely powerful, able to pull an arrow out of the quiver, put it to the wire/string, and pull on that wire/string. I'm guessing that a properly pulled arrow would be faster than a spell, but not enough to bridge the gap.

Depends on the style of archery. The Mongol style archer can achieve 10 arrows in 4.9 seconds hitting all targets. This was accomplished by Lars Andersen. The previous record was 7 arrows and targets in 15 seconds.
The arrows fired are still powerful enough to pentrate chain mail.
 The English longbow archer can achieve 3 arrows in 4.2 seconds. Mongol style archery was for mobile combat on horse back, but could be used on the ground.

The Mongol archer was not as concerned with distance because that was the point of the horse to close that distance. The Mongol archer shoots instinctively.

The English archer was concerned with power, distance and accurracy. My money is still on the archer and Templar. Templars are not limited to just sword and shield.

Modifié par Realmzmaster, 31 janvier 2014 - 07:52 .

[x-aizen-x]

See? this is what I said in the Thread. Since know one can give a logical way in which a Templar can beat a mage 1 on 1 you all resort to you last defense... nerfing. We have to pretend that a Templar will just not be a affected by a mage hurling fire balls at him. We are ignoring the fact that the Templars armor would heat up to scorching degrees. Truth is a group of Templars would yes demolish a single mage. but 1 on 1 never. All I see is a bunch of people nerfing the mages to ridicules lvls in order to have a valid argument. I cant nerf a Templar cause there is no nerfing to do. Templars use weapons and skill and dats it. But people can overuse the charging factor. When all I have to do is ask how can a man in iron armor not be in the least bit damaged when getting blasted with fire.

[The Elder King]

@x-aizen-x: Asunder shown pretty well how templars' abilities work. Evangeline can summon an aura that will negate part of the effect of magic (I recall that she used it against a mage that cast a ffe spell). The games didn't make a good job, but Asunder shown why templars can fight mages well.
As for the last part of yours post, is the same reason whey your character isn't killed when an archer hits him, or why my Warden survived being used as a chewing gum by 'Andraste'.

[shodiswe]

Mages tend to requier a lot of training and experience to be effective in a fight.

[HiroVoid]

Didn't Cassandra mow down blood mages in Dawn of the Seeker as fast as Hawke did in gameplay?

[Hellion Rex]

HiroVoid wrote...

Didn't Cassandra mow down blood mages in Dawn of the Seeker as fast as Hawke did in gameplay?

She was decapitating people faster than I've seen in a long time.

[HiroVoid]

eluvianix wrote...

HiroVoid wrote...

Didn't Cassandra mow down blood mages in Dawn of the Seeker as fast as Hawke did in gameplay?

She was decapitating people faster than I've seen in a long time.

Well, there you have it.  Canon, official material of a single templar mowing down a bunch of mages outside of gameplay.

[Lulupab]

HiroVoid wrote...

eluvianix wrote...

HiroVoid wrote...

Didn't Cassandra mow down blood mages in Dawn of the Seeker as fast as Hawke did in gameplay?

She was decapitating people faster than I've seen in a long time.

Well, there you have it.  Canon, official material of a single templar mowing down a bunch of mages outside of gameplay.

She almost failed to stop a catastrophe planned by blood mages. She had help, the fact that it was from another mage and a spirit healer no less is amusing.

[HiroVoid]

Rassler wrote...

HiroVoid wrote...

eluvianix wrote...

HiroVoid wrote...

Didn't Cassandra mow down blood mages in Dawn of the Seeker as fast as Hawke did in gameplay?

She was decapitating people faster than I've seen in a long time.

Well, there you have it.  Canon, official material of a single templar mowing down a bunch of mages outside of gameplay.

She almost failed to stop a catastrophe planned by blood mages. She had help, the fact that it was from another mage and a spirit healer no less is amusing.

That doesn't really refute my point about a lone templar cutting down a bunch of mages combat-wise.

Modifié par HiroVoid, 31 janvier 2014 - 07:54 .

[Lulupab]

HiroVoid wrote...

Rassler wrote...

HiroVoid wrote...

eluvianix wrote...

HiroVoid wrote...

Didn't Cassandra mow down blood mages in Dawn of the Seeker as fast as Hawke did in gameplay?

She was decapitating people faster than I've seen in a long time.

Well, there you have it.  Canon, official material of a single templar mowing down a bunch of mages outside of gameplay.

She almost failed to stop a catastrophe planned by blood mages. She had help, the fact that it was from another mage and a spirit healer no less is amusing.

That doesn't really refute my point about a lone templar cutting down a bunch of mages combat-wise.

So? Win in combat lose the whole country. 

[Tarek]

in theory mages have unlimited power, while templars have a limit....

in fact

a mage has the potential to destroy armies or cities alone, while a templar has ZERO chance of attaining anything like that potential

[HiroVoid]

Tarek wrote...

in theory mages have unlimited power, while templars have a limit....

in fact

a mage has the potential to destroy armies or cities alone, while a templar has ZERO chance of attaining anything like that potential

Well, at least for the first part, mages have a limit.  It's called mana which is a point that's been cited before.  Of course, having a lot of lyrium or sacrificing a bunch of people helps with increasing power, but the former is hard to obtain without having a contract with the dwarves and the latter is morally bad and is only going to inspire people to fight against the mages harder (I believe the latter reason was actually pointed out by a Tevinter mage as to why not to use blood magic in certain situations which in his case was against the Qunari).

[Tarek]

also if something is resistant to magic, a mage can always use the environment to destroy it

templar: " I have magic resistance, prepare to die..."

mage:" that's nice but this 2 ton boulder is not... so im gonna telekenticaly throw it on ur face... bye"

squish

[HiroVoid]

Tarek wrote...

also if something is resistant to magic, a mage can always use the environment to destroy it

templar: " I have magic resistance, prepare to die..."

mage:" that's nice but this 2 ton boulder is not... so im gonna telekenticaly throw it on ur face... bye"

squish

But is it a magic boulder?  .....seriously, I don't know how this worked gameplay-wise in previous games, so I don't know if it just counted as physical or nature damage, or if their was some kind of magic attack related with it.

On the other hand, that's why most templars focus as tanks.

[Realmzmaster]

Rassler wrote...

HiroVoid wrote...

eluvianix wrote...

HiroVoid wrote...

Didn't Cassandra mow down blood mages in Dawn of the Seeker as fast as Hawke did in gameplay?

She was decapitating people faster than I've seen in a long time.

Well, there you have it.  Canon, official material of a single templar mowing down a bunch of mages outside of gameplay.

She almost failed to stop a catastrophe planned by blood mages. She had help, the fact that it was from another mage and a spirit healer no less is amusing.

The point being made is that she is still mowing down blood mages like there is no tomorrow. A mage that cannot get his/her spells off in time are dead mages.  In close combat the advantage goes to the warrior, templar or rogue.

A mage who throws an AOE like fireball on a rapidly closing foe is going to catch himself/herself in the effect. A mage requires distance to be effective which is why they are the artillery of the fantasy world. Mages like artillery need protection otherwise it will be overran.

Mages need time to cast the spells especially spells that have the ability to wipe out large numbers of warriors. Someone has to buy the mage that time.

Also sheer numbers will take down any foe. There are more mundanes than there are mages or templars. The mages will run out of mana at some time. You then have dead mages.

If mages are as powerful as many think they would have conquered Thedas by now, but that is not the case.

[Lulupab]

Realmzmaster wrote...
]

The point being made is that she is still mowing down blood mages like there is no tomorrow. A mage that cannot get his/her spells off in time are dead mages.  In close combat the advantage goes to the warrior, templar or rogue.

A mage who throws an AOE like fireball on a rapidly closing foe is going to catch himself/herself in the effect. A mage requires distance to be effective which is why they are the artillery of the fantasy world. Mages like artillery need protection otherwise it will be overran.

Mages need time to cast the spells especially spells that have the ability to wipe out large numbers of warriors. Someone has to buy the mage that time.

Also sheer numbers will take down any foe. There are more mundanes than there are mages or templars. The mages will run out of mana at some time. You then have dead mages.

If mages are as powerful as many think they would have conquered Thedas by now, but that is not the case.

Because mages didn't want to rule over Thedas. There are plenty of mages like Bethany or Wynne etc... who just want peace, even many of the apostates.

We don't know what is the limit for mages power? Who is to say mages cannot come together in numbers, lets say 100, and cast a spell that rots all food and water in a huge area? What then? The precius lyrium wont save the templars anymore and they will die cause of thirst/hunger.

Everything is specualtion until stuff are revealed.

Modifié par Rassler, 31 janvier 2014 - 08:13 .