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What makes a great villain?


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#26
Volus Warlord

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 What makes a great villian:
1.) Competence-The villain may make a few mistakes here and there, but in general is VERY good at whatever they do. They can get results where others can't.
2.) Persistence- Unyielding; does not give up or concede anything easily.

And then it splits off...

The Sympathetic Villain-Does what they do due to outside pressures and circumstances. Feel like what they are doing is the best option, at least for their immediate concerns.
3a.) Noble Intentions-Does not willfully bear "evil" ideals or loyalties.
4a.) Pressured towards "Evil"-Feels as if they have little to no choice in their actions. What they are doing may not be the right way, but it's the only way.
5a.) Slippery Slope of Rationalization-Do X because it's the only way, then do Y because not doing Y would invalidate doing X... and so on and so forth.

The Zealot-Does what they do in accordance to a preconceived and self-imposed set of concepts or ideals. 
3b.) Tunnel Vision-Cares little for others' viewpoints, well-being, or ways of life IF they violate the code. 
4b.) Servant of the "Light"-Views the code as superior to all other ideologies and all beings, possibly including themself.
5b.) Unforgiven-Those perceived to have the desire to impede or eliminate the code are a blight that must be purged.

The Pig-All about self-advancement at any cost. Money, status, rank, whatever. 
3c.) God Complex-They are absolutely vital and everyone else is absolutely expendable. 
4c.) Fraudelence and Manipulation- Tries to get others to do their work for them with implicit or explicit promises of money, status, rank or love, only to betray when it becomes expedient to.
5c.) Charm and Terror-Can be both very charismatic and absolutely disgusting.

Modifié par Volus Warlord, 02 février 2014 - 10:58 .

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#27
spirosz

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Image IPB

#28
MassivelyEffective0730

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Good writing and good acting (where applicable).

Modifié par MassivelyEffective0730, 02 février 2014 - 11:07 .


#29
The Flying Grey Warden

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Gravitas and a voice actor who can melt into a role and have a great time being the character. Everyone remembers villains for how they were on screen, not how they were in a fight. That being said, I think they should be slightly more skilled thrn the protagonists, but not too much. Certainly no Meredith crap.

#30
Br3admax

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The Flying Grey Warden wrote...

 That being said, I think they should be slightly more skilled thrn the protagonists, but not too much. Certainly no Meredith crap.

wat?

#31
Jeremiah12LGeek

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When you like them, or find them compelling.

There are many ways to accomplish that, but it is still a fairly rare achievement.

#32
SgtSteel91

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Someone you love to hate

#33
rasloveszev

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 Belief that they are the good guys. 

That's why I loved to hate Meridith and Lohgain. They did such awful evil things in the name of  'good' and there was no talking them out of it. 

Howe was a typical Disney Villain who clearly was the villain and knew it, so there was no debating why he needed to die.

Modifié par rasloveszev, 02 février 2014 - 11:10 .


#34
HiroVoid

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rasloveszev wrote...

 Belief that they are the good guys. 

That's why I loved to hate Meridith and Lohgain. They did such awful evil things in the name of  'good' and there was no talking them out of it. 

Loghain'll actually say he regrets a lot of the things he did and feels he needs to atone for them if you spare him.  The big point I think he doesn't regret is pulling out of Ostagar since he blames Cailan for charging in despite telling him not to, that the army was lost, and Loghain charging in with his men would have just resulted in all of his men dying.

Modifié par HiroVoid, 02 février 2014 - 11:12 .


#35
MassivelyEffective0730

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rasloveszev wrote...

 Belief that they are the good guys. 

That's why I loved to hate Meridith and Lohgain. They did such awful evil things in the name of  'good' and there was no talking them out of it. 


Awful and evil is subjective. As is good.

You can make a rational argument for why they were right you know.

Their actions were no more 'evil' than yours, and their 'good' was no less than yours. People define things differently.

#36
SerriceIceDandy

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For an antagonist, I'd say believability is key. In my opinion, Dolores Umbridge from Harry Potter is one of the best villains I've encountered. She's conceited, prejudiced and cruel; and she uses her beliefs to justify her actions to make the world more befitting to her opinion. She's not a Saturday-Morning-Cartoon Villain in the sense she does bad things for the sake of doing them. Unlike Voldemort, despite his reasons being just as simple (yet compelling), Umbridge doesn't commit great acts of grandiosity. In some ways, there are elements of her that are present in people we know in politics, like (UKIP or Republican politicians). Her actions are small, but great in effect.

#37
MassivelyEffective0730

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HiroVoid wrote...
Loghain'll actually say he regrets a lot of the things he did and feels he needs to atone for them if you spare him.  The big point I think he doesn't regret is pulling out of Ostagar since he blames Cailan for charging in despite telling him not to.


I do believe Cailan was impatient and wreckless, and got what comes with that on the battlefield. Granted, several of Loghain's reasons for abandoning him are pretty selfish and weak, but the guy didn't really think through the whole attack in the first place.

#38
The Don's Hound

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Not being cliches.

#39
HiroVoid

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DrunkShepardFTW wrote...

For an antagonist, I'd say believability is key. In my opinion, Dolores Umbridge from Harry Potter is one of the best villains I've encountered. She's conceited, prejudiced and cruel; and she uses her beliefs to justify her actions to make the world more befitting to her opinion. She's not a Saturday-Morning-Cartoon Villain in the sense she does bad things for the sake of doing them. Unlike Voldemort, despite his reasons being just as simple (yet compelling), Umbridge doesn't commit great acts of grandiosity. In some ways, there are elements of her that are present in people we know in politics, like (UKIP or Republican politicians). Her actions are small, but great in effect.

No Democratic politicians like this?

#40
The Flying Grey Warden

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Br3ad wrote...

The Flying Grey Warden wrote...

 That being said, I think they should be slightly more skilled thrn the protagonists, but not too much. Certainly no Meredith crap.

wat?


You know. Magic mcguffin powers, teleportation, statues coming alive, freezing everyone and bringing the fight to a halt in order to deliver a monologue of crazy ranting.  

Meredith crap.

#41
HiroVoid

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The Flying Grey Warden wrote...

Br3ad wrote...

The Flying Grey Warden wrote...

 That being said, I think they should be slightly more skilled thrn the protagonists, but not too much. Certainly no Meredith crap.

wat?


You know. Magic mcguffin powers, teleportation, statues coming alive, freezing everyone and bringing the fight to a halt in order to deliver a monologue of crazy ranting.  

Meredith crap.

Yeah.  I always find it weird when someone mentions Meredith has to have that to fight Hawke since Hawke's beaten dragons before.  Is there not supposed to be other people in the world who can kill dragons and other stuff?

#42
MassivelyEffective0730

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HiroVoid wrote...

DrunkShepardFTW wrote...

For an antagonist, I'd say believability is key. In my opinion, Dolores Umbridge from Harry Potter is one of the best villains I've encountered. She's conceited, prejudiced and cruel; and she uses her beliefs to justify her actions to make the world more befitting to her opinion. She's not a Saturday-Morning-Cartoon Villain in the sense she does bad things for the sake of doing them. Unlike Voldemort, despite his reasons being just as simple (yet compelling), Umbridge doesn't commit great acts of grandiosity. In some ways, there are elements of her that are present in people we know in politics, like (UKIP or Republican politicians). Her actions are small, but great in effect.

No Democratic politicians like this?


Not to delve into politics here, but the Republican ones seem to be the preaching the stuff that Umbridge and Dumbledore wanted. That and Democrats are crazy, Republicans are backwards. I'll take crazy, thanks.

#43
TheChris92

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If Adachi from Persona 4 taught me anything then it is the fact that it doesn't take a sympathetic villain to be a good villain -- A villain who truly believes in his own twisted ideas of how the world works, who feels compelling and dangerous can be very, very frightening. In other words, a well written villain is all it really takes I'd say.

#44
AresKeith

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Competent
Has a reason instead of lulevil
good voice acting
someone who can give the protagonist a challenge

#45
Lulupab

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Demons are villain. Duh.

#46
SerriceIceDandy

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HiroVoid wrote...

No Democratic politicians like this?


I'm not interested in starting a political debate, but I'm sure there probably are. I was just using that term as classism displayed by the character is often associated with that wing of politics in layman's terms.

#47
Mr.House

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TheChris92 wrote...

If Adachi from Persona 4 taught me anything then it is the fact that it doesn't take a sympathetic villain to be a good villain -- A villain who truly believes in his own twisted ideas of how the world works, who feels compelling and dangerous can be very, very frightening. In other words, a well written villain is all it really takes I'd say.

Adachi did nothing wrong!

#48
Noctis Augustus

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Intimidating physical appearance and personality.

#49
Orian Tabris

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I actually thought they handled Meredith fairly well. They definitely took some liberties, and went out there, but overall it was good. The ability to turn statutes into sentient beings was fine (I'm pretty sure there's a name for it), but the fact that she could jump into the air, as if flying, was just silly. As silly as it sounds, being able to make inanimate objects come to life with a magic imbued sword seems like it could be legit if magic were real, but that same magic imbued sword allowing the user to fly doesn't make sense.

I guess it's that an item shouldn't be able to grant the user physical abilities, only magical ones (or ones that aren't physically connected to the item).

#50
rasloveszev

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HiroVoid wrote...

rasloveszev wrote...

 Belief that they are the good guys. 

That's why I loved to hate Meridith and Lohgain. They did such awful evil things in the name of  'good' and there was no talking them out of it. 

Loghain'll actually say he regrets a lot of the things he did and feels he needs to atone for them if you spare him. 


He lost his chance at redemption when he used slavery to fund his stupidity. And that's on top of poisoning Eamon, inspiring Uldred's rebellion, and framing the Wardens for Calin's murder. Nope! I let Alistair fight him, and automatically became his excutioner.