526 réponses à ce sujet

[SwobyJ]

"They clearly didn't add anything supporting IT"


I'll just say this to that: Citadel DLC ROCKS!!

Leviathan is good too. Omega is neat but screw those cutscene bugs.

[AlexMBrennan]

DoomsdayDevice wrote...
As for inconsistencies, AFAIK the IT actually explains most of them.

You know what they say about theories that explain everything, right?

[dreamgazer]

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

Why did Bioware a year and a half later regret not giving the player a more personally satisfying end to the game? The flat out said they "Learned some lessons". And that is not an opinion, that is a fact.

You're twisting that quote all out of context.

http://www.totalxbox...r-future-games/

"The primary take-away was never to underestimated the passion of your core fan-base. We learned that since fans had spent three games with most of these characters, their feelings about letting them go were just as strong as ours."


Sounds like a lesson learned to me.

All well and good, but it doesn't support your assertion that they "regret not giving the player a more personally satisfying end to the game", especially after releasing the EC. 

[MegaSovereign]

Mcfly616 wrote...

It might've ceased to be the Breathe Scene altogether. It would've just been a scene concretely showing our Shepard alive amongst the Citadel wreckage. Maybe he got rescued. Either way, I'm still unclear as to why he ever did that poll. You don't just go to the homepage of the group who has brought world wide negative press to your game and ask them what they believe in....for no reason at all.


They clearly didn't add anything supporting IT due to the poll results. Yet, they also didn't put an end to it either. I can only theorize that they left something out due to it.

Uh, I thought it was pretty obvious. It was to get/keep people interested. 

[mopotter]

wright1978 wrote...

MrFob wrote...

Ok, I told myself a long time ago that I was done discussing the ending but now I kinda got scooped up here and I want to answer this post.
Because if it were just the case that I could find one ending better than the rest, I'd actually be fine with them. But that's not the case.
Control and Synthesis are out immediately because I'd never trust the catalyst (and even if I would, I find the consequences as described in the EC non-sensical and rather revoting but that's just me). That leaves destroy as you say. Now if the only issue of destroy were killing all Synthetics, I could probably even live with that. Granted it's a sad thing but I never expected this to end clean and pretty, so be it.
No, the real problem I have with destroy is that it doesn't make sense. Why in the world would the catalyst offer me that option? It goes against everything that motivates him so why does he even let me choose it? Because the crucible "changed the variables"? A few sentences earlier he says it's basically just a big battery, developed by organic who never got beyond reaper level of tech, so it can't really be new to him (besides, he already knew about it before). So that doesn't make sense.
Maybe he can't control the crucible and has no choice but to offer all three options. But wait: Refuse proves that he can just shut it down if he wants and that his reapers can destroy it instantly so that's out.
What does that leave? As you said, it leave the Indoctrination Theory. The problem with that is, all you get from the IT at this point is NO ending instead of a bad ending. That's not really an improvement in my book.

That plus all the little annoying logical fallacies, the abrupt change in tone and in Shep's character as well as the narrative fallacy of providing a giant info dump in the last 5 minutes, those are the reasons why I never could make my piece with the endings. But as I said, that's just me.

This excellent post sums up one of the main reasons i'll never play the unmodded game again.

With the mods  I'm enjoying the whole series again, after a little over a year and 10 months of not playing in my favorite universe with characters I had grown to yes, care about. 

[Mathias]

dreamgazer wrote...

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

Why did Bioware a year and a half later regret not giving the player a more personally satisfying end to the game? The flat out said they "Learned some lessons". And that is not an opinion, that is a fact.

You're twisting that quote all out of context.

http://www.totalxbox...r-future-games/

"The primary take-away was never to underestimated the passion of your core fan-base. We learned that since fans had spent three games with most of these characters, their feelings about letting them go were just as strong as ours."


Sounds like a lesson learned to me.

All well and good, but it doesn't support your assertion that they "regret not giving the player a more personally satisfying end to the game", especially after releasing the EC. 

I think the reason as to why they didn't expand on the breath scene was because they didn't want one ending to seem way more appealing than the others, by having the Hero survive and reunite with his crew. Their intention with the EC was to expand on the endings, but not change them. 

I however believe without a shread of doubt that if they had to go back in time and do it all over again, they'd probably take the ending in a different route. There's no way they'd want to go through that hell again and look stupid. I mean tons of people have dissected why that ending is so damn stupid and nonsensical that they had to have heard it. But of course they're gonna stand by the ending and beat the chest saying they're proud of their work, because they're at a point of no return and don't wanna look bad. Whatever amazing vision they had, didn't translate well to the game.

[dreamgazer]

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

Why did Bioware a year and a half later regret not giving the player a more personally satisfying end to the game? The flat out said they "Learned some lessons". And that is not an opinion, that is a fact.

You're twisting that quote all out of context.

http://www.totalxbox...r-future-games/

"The primary take-away was never to underestimated the passion of your core fan-base. We learned that since fans had spent three games with most of these characters, their feelings about letting them go were just as strong as ours."


Sounds like a lesson learned to me.

All well and good, but it doesn't support your assertion that they "regret not giving the player a more personally satisfying end to the game", especially after releasing the EC. 

I think the reason as to why they didn't expand on the breath scene was because they didn't want one ending to seem way more appealing than the others, by having the Hero survive and reunite with his crew. Their intention with the EC was to expand on the endings, but not change them. 

I however believe without a shread of doubt that if they had to go back in time and do it all over again, they'd probably take the ending in a different route. There's no way they'd want to go through that hell again and look stupid. I mean tons of people have dissected why that ending is so damn stupid and nonsensical that they had to have heard it. But of course they're gonna stand by the ending and beat the chest saying they're proud of their work, because they're at a point of no return and don't wanna look bad. Whatever amazing vision they had, didn't translate well to the game.

You're right.  That's exactly why they didn't elaborate on the breath scene.  But that's their choice to make, and choose they did.  The EC actually proves that they'd probably keep the same idea, but refine it if they had the chance. Not go a different route.  

Of course, if they had the chance to go back and change things, I'm sure there's plenty they'd like to fix about ME2 and ME3.  Hindsight and all. 

[Susty Randusky]

me3 ending is best son it's real unlike that fake IT son people who thought that don't get the bread son they desperate son ending is real without extended cut son

[Mathias]

dreamgazer wrote...

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

Why did Bioware a year and a half later regret not giving the player a more personally satisfying end to the game? The flat out said they "Learned some lessons". And that is not an opinion, that is a fact.

You're twisting that quote all out of context.

http://www.totalxbox...r-future-games/

"The primary take-away was never to underestimated the passion of your core fan-base. We learned that since fans had spent three games with most of these characters, their feelings about letting them go were just as strong as ours."


Sounds like a lesson learned to me.

All well and good, but it doesn't support your assertion that they "regret not giving the player a more personally satisfying end to the game", especially after releasing the EC. 

I think the reason as to why they didn't expand on the breath scene was because they didn't want one ending to seem way more appealing than the others, by having the Hero survive and reunite with his crew. Their intention with the EC was to expand on the endings, but not change them. 

I however believe without a shread of doubt that if they had to go back in time and do it all over again, they'd probably take the ending in a different route. There's no way they'd want to go through that hell again and look stupid. I mean tons of people have dissected why that ending is so damn stupid and nonsensical that they had to have heard it. But of course they're gonna stand by the ending and beat the chest saying they're proud of their work, because they're at a point of no return and don't wanna look bad. Whatever amazing vision they had, didn't translate well to the game.

You're right.  That's exactly why they didn't elaborate on the breath scene.  But that's their choice to make, and choose they did.  The EC actually proves that they'd probably keep the same idea, but refine it if they had the chance. Not go a different route.  

Of course, if they had the chance to go back and change things, I'm sure there's plenty they'd like to fix about ME2 and ME3.  Hindsight and all. 

I don't think the EC is proof of that, because outright changing the ending would've made them look bad, whether they wanted to change it or not. But I do think if they did it all over again having learned everything they did, they probably would've gone a different route completely, or keep the same basic idea, but refine the endings in a way that leaves a more satisfying end for the player.

[dreamgazer]

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

Why did Bioware a year and a half later regret not giving the player a more personally satisfying end to the game? The flat out said they "Learned some lessons". And that is not an opinion, that is a fact.

You're twisting that quote all out of context.

http://www.totalxbox...r-future-games/

"The primary take-away was never to underestimated the passion of your core fan-base. We learned that since fans had spent three games with most of these characters, their feelings about letting them go were just as strong as ours."


Sounds like a lesson learned to me.

All well and good, but it doesn't support your assertion that they "regret not giving the player a more personally satisfying end to the game", especially after releasing the EC. 

I think the reason as to why they didn't expand on the breath scene was because they didn't want one ending to seem way more appealing than the others, by having the Hero survive and reunite with his crew. Their intention with the EC was to expand on the endings, but not change them. 

I however believe without a shread of doubt that if they had to go back in time and do it all over again, they'd probably take the ending in a different route. There's no way they'd want to go through that hell again and look stupid. I mean tons of people have dissected why that ending is so damn stupid and nonsensical that they had to have heard it. But of course they're gonna stand by the ending and beat the chest saying they're proud of their work, because they're at a point of no return and don't wanna look bad. Whatever amazing vision they had, didn't translate well to the game.

You're right.  That's exactly why they didn't elaborate on the breath scene.  But that's their choice to make, and choose they did.  The EC actually proves that they'd probably keep the same idea, but refine it if they had the chance. Not go a different route.  

Of course, if they had the chance to go back and change things, I'm sure there's plenty they'd like to fix about ME2 and ME3.  Hindsight and all. 

I don't think the EC is proof of that, because outright changing the ending would've made them look bad, whether they wanted to change it or not. But I do think if they did it all over again having learned everything they did, they probably would've gone a different route completely, or keep the same basic idea, but refine the endings in a way that leaves a more satisfying end for the player.

Meh. They had the opportunity to do more of this with the EC, and they didn't take it the way you're suggesting.

Believe what you'd like, though.  Beats the hell out of choosing whether to sacrifice humanity or not, that's for sure. 

[spirosz]

The only way to make it a satisfying end is to fix ME2.

[MegaSovereign]

3PAC wrote...

me3 ending is best son it's real unlike that fake IT son people who thought that don't get the bread son they desperate son ending is real without extended cut son

What are you on, son?

[spirosz]

MegaSovereign wrote...

3PAC wrote...

me3 ending is best son it's real unlike that fake IT son people who thought that don't get the bread son they desperate son ending is real without extended cut son

What are you on, son?

He's on that money green cheddar son, give it up to the king of the 3D world, aka Earth son.  No owls up in this bish cause we don't give a hoot, you square?  

[Mathias]

dreamgazer wrote...

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

Why did Bioware a year and a half later regret not giving the player a more personally satisfying end to the game? The flat out said they "Learned some lessons". And that is not an opinion, that is a fact.

You're twisting that quote all out of context.

http://www.totalxbox...r-future-games/

"The primary take-away was never to underestimated the passion of your core fan-base. We learned that since fans had spent three games with most of these characters, their feelings about letting them go were just as strong as ours."


Sounds like a lesson learned to me.

All well and good, but it doesn't support your assertion that they "regret not giving the player a more personally satisfying end to the game", especially after releasing the EC. 

I think the reason as to why they didn't expand on the breath scene was because they didn't want one ending to seem way more appealing than the others, by having the Hero survive and reunite with his crew. Their intention with the EC was to expand on the endings, but not change them. 

I however believe without a shread of doubt that if they had to go back in time and do it all over again, they'd probably take the ending in a different route. There's no way they'd want to go through that hell again and look stupid. I mean tons of people have dissected why that ending is so damn stupid and nonsensical that they had to have heard it. But of course they're gonna stand by the ending and beat the chest saying they're proud of their work, because they're at a point of no return and don't wanna look bad. Whatever amazing vision they had, didn't translate well to the game.

You're right.  That's exactly why they didn't elaborate on the breath scene.  But that's their choice to make, and choose they did.  The EC actually proves that they'd probably keep the same idea, but refine it if they had the chance. Not go a different route.  

Of course, if they had the chance to go back and change things, I'm sure there's plenty they'd like to fix about ME2 and ME3.  Hindsight and all. 

I don't think the EC is proof of that, because outright changing the ending would've made them look bad, whether they wanted to change it or not. But I do think if they did it all over again having learned everything they did, they probably would've gone a different route completely, or keep the same basic idea, but refine the endings in a way that leaves a more satisfying end for the player.

Meh. They had the opportunity to do more of this with the EC, and they didn't take it the way you're suggesting.

Believe what you'd like, though.  Beats the hell out of choosing whether to sacrifice humanity or not, that's for sure. 

Like I said, they didn't want to make one ending seem more appealing than the other, that's why they didn't do it. Also time and budget probably came into play too.

[ImaginaryMatter]

spirosz wrote...

The only way to make it a satisfying end is to fix ME2.

More like remake.

[MegaSovereign]

spirosz wrote...

MegaSovereign wrote...

3PAC wrote...

me3 ending is best son it's real unlike that fake IT son people who thought that don't get the bread son they desperate son ending is real without extended cut son

What are you on, son?

He's on that money green cheddar son, give it up to the king of the 3D world, aka Earth son.  No owls up in this bish cause we don't give a hoot, you square?  

k

[Mathias]

It still amazes me to this day though that people who were satisfied with the EC are so willing to look past the really bad writing. Who cares that this this and that didn't make sense and sounded stupid. At least I got my memorial scene and cool speech from Control AI Shepard.

[Susty Randusky]

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

It still amazes me to this day though that people who were satisfied with the EC are so willing to look past the really bad writing. Who cares that this this and that didn't make sense and sounded stupid. At least I got my memorial scene and cool speech from Control AI Shepard.

yeeee son og ending is legit son real catalyst getting the bread son he real son

[dreamgazer]

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

Why did Bioware a year and a half later regret not giving the player a more personally satisfying end to the game? The flat out said they "Learned some lessons". And that is not an opinion, that is a fact.

You're twisting that quote all out of context.

http://www.totalxbox...r-future-games/

"The primary take-away was never to underestimated the passion of your core fan-base. We learned that since fans had spent three games with most of these characters, their feelings about letting them go were just as strong as ours."


Sounds like a lesson learned to me.

All well and good, but it doesn't support your assertion that they "regret not giving the player a more personally satisfying end to the game", especially after releasing the EC. 

I think the reason as to why they didn't expand on the breath scene was because they didn't want one ending to seem way more appealing than the others, by having the Hero survive and reunite with his crew. Their intention with the EC was to expand on the endings, but not change them. 

I however believe without a shread of doubt that if they had to go back in time and do it all over again, they'd probably take the ending in a different route. There's no way they'd want to go through that hell again and look stupid. I mean tons of people have dissected why that ending is so damn stupid and nonsensical that they had to have heard it. But of course they're gonna stand by the ending and beat the chest saying they're proud of their work, because they're at a point of no return and don't wanna look bad. Whatever amazing vision they had, didn't translate well to the game.

You're right.  That's exactly why they didn't elaborate on the breath scene.  But that's their choice to make, and choose they did.  The EC actually proves that they'd probably keep the same idea, but refine it if they had the chance. Not go a different route.  

Of course, if they had the chance to go back and change things, I'm sure there's plenty they'd like to fix about ME2 and ME3.  Hindsight and all. 

I don't think the EC is proof of that, because outright changing the ending would've made them look bad, whether they wanted to change it or not. But I do think if they did it all over again having learned everything they did, they probably would've gone a different route completely, or keep the same basic idea, but refine the endings in a way that leaves a more satisfying end for the player.

Meh. They had the opportunity to do more of this with the EC, and they didn't take it the way you're suggesting.

Believe what you'd like, though.  Beats the hell out of choosing whether to sacrifice humanity or not, that's for sure. 

Like I said, they didn't want to make one ending seem more appealing than the other, that's why they didn't do it. Also time and budget probably came into play too.

They also could have made Control and Synthesis even more "appealing" to even the balance, but they didn't.

And they had plenty of time. They simply made the decision to go this route because they wanted to.

[dreamgazer]

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

It still amazes me to this day though that people who were satisfied with the EC are so willing to look past the really bad writing. Who cares that this this and that didn't make sense and sounded stupid. At least I got my memorial scene and cool speech from Control AI Shepard.

LOL @ things making sense in the MEU. 

I'm still waiting for them to explain how the cipher works and how the conduit defies the way relays operate.

Modifié par dreamgazer, 07 février 2014 - 01:53 .

[MegaSovereign]

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

It still amazes me to this day though that people who were satisfied with the EC are so willing to look past the really bad writing. Who cares that this this and that didn't make sense and sounded stupid. At least I got my memorial scene and cool speech from Control AI Shepard.

If we're being frank....um yea why not? If the OP is telling us anything coherent it's that he prioritizes the outcome of the story more so than whether it's great writing or not. 

There's nothing amazing about people being happy with their outcome. 

[MegaSovereign]

J. Reezy wrote...

MegaSovereign wrote...

spirosz wrote...

MegaSovereign wrote...

3PAC wrote...

me3 ending is best son it's real unlike that fake IT son people who thought that don't get the bread son they desperate son ending is real without extended cut son

What are you on, son?

He's on that money green cheddar son, give it up to the king of the 3D world, aka Earth son.  No owls up in this bish cause we don't give a hoot, you square?  

k

You are so lost right now.

I've been away from the forum for 10 days. 

[dreamgazer]

MegaSovereign wrote...

J. Reezy wrote...

MegaSovereign wrote...

spirosz wrote...

MegaSovereign wrote...

3PAC wrote...

me3 ending is best son it's real unlike that fake IT son people who thought that don't get the bread son they desperate son ending is real without extended cut son

What are you on, son?

He's on that money green cheddar son, give it up to the king of the 3D world, aka Earth son.  No owls up in this bish cause we don't give a hoot, you square?  

k

You are so lost right now.

I've been away from the forum for 10 days. 

I haven't, and I'm right there with you.