67 réponses à ce sujet

[Heimdall]

KiwiQuiche wrote...
She's met Flemeth as well, who is some crazy woman who can make copies of herself, pretty much cheating death, and turns into a dragon. Cheating death via short cut shouldn't be such a far fetched idea for Hawke to wrap her head around.

(A) what is roleplay durr
Also, killing the Wardens would be completely justified in this scenario.

( Oh come on, Cory doesn't even bother hiding.

Flemeth doesn't possess anyone (To Hawke's knowledge).

Knowing one strange shapeshifting witch exists =\\= suspecting Corypheus can body hop

The two have no bearing on one another.  I wouldn't suspect one Mage of possession because I saw another store herself away.  Its one thing to suspect a Mage will cheat death, another to suspect the actual means.  Maybe Hawke would be wary, but general wariness does not translate into suspecting something she has no way of knowing is possible.

(A)Sure, but Hawke has to be a psychopath, being "stupid" has nothing to do with not being a psychopath.

( He does actually, rather well for someone just jettisoned from his old body a thousand years after he was awake.  I invite you to watch the clips again.  Aside from perhaps two slips, he imitates Larius and Jenaka's speech patterns almost perfectly.

Modifié par Lord Aesir, 05 février 2014 - 07:27 .

[KiwiQuiche]

Steelcan wrote...

KiwiQuiche wrote...

Steelcan wrote...

KiwiQuiche wrote...

Steelcan wrote...

KiwiQuiche wrote...

Steelcan wrote...

ugh DA threads are soooo uptight

*mojo*

try to introduce a little humor into it and the mods get all angry calling me intolerant, not a team player, discussion cancer


No they never actually said that BUT I KNOW THEY ARE THINKING IT

Slander and lies, El Nacho

SLANDER AND LIES

(this is why I love posting at 2 in the morning)


Nah its all true, Allan's had it out for me for a while now

(lol it's 8pm where I am)


Hey, just be glad it's not David after your ass (the non-mod one)

I haven't seen him in a while, actually. Woe to the Republic.

(damned non-mericuhn's)

Pfft Hero-boy got the axe

Lol well I'm impressed it took that long

[Steelcan]

KiwiQuiche wrote...

Steelcan wrote...

KiwiQuiche wrote...

Steelcan wrote...

KiwiQuiche wrote...

Steelcan wrote...

KiwiQuiche wrote...

Steelcan wrote...

ugh DA threads are soooo uptight

*mojo*

try to introduce a little humor into it and the mods get all angry calling me intolerant, not a team player, discussion cancer


No they never actually said that BUT I KNOW THEY ARE THINKING IT

Slander and lies, El Nacho

SLANDER AND LIES

(this is why I love posting at 2 in the morning)


Nah its all true, Allan's had it out for me for a while now

(lol it's 8pm where I am)


Hey, just be glad it's not David after your ass (the non-mod one)

I haven't seen him in a while, actually. Woe to the Republic.

(damned non-mericuhn's)

Pfft Hero-boy got the axe

Lol well I'm impressed it took that long

There was muchy rejoicing through out the lands


even better was when he tried to come back and promptly got banned again

[KiwiQuiche]

Lord Aesir wrote...

KiwiQuiche wrote...
She's met Flemeth as well, who is some crazy woman who can make copies of herself, pretty much cheating death, and turns into a dragon. Cheating death via short cut shouldn't be such a far fetched idea for Hawke to wrap her head around.

(A) what is roleplay durr
Also, killing the Wardens would be completely justified in this scenario.

( Oh come on, Cory doesn't even bother hiding.

Flemeth doesn't possess anyone (To Hawke's knowledge).

Knowing one strange shapeshifting witch exists == suspecting Corypheus can body hop

The two have no bearing on one another.  I wouldn't suspect one Mage of possession because I saw another store herself away.  Its one thing to suspect a Mage will cheat death, another to suspect the actual means.  Maybe Hawke would be wary, but general wariness does not translate into suspecting something she has no way of knowing is possible.

(A)Sure, but Hawke has to be a psychopath, being "stupid" has nothing to do with not being a psychopath.

( He does actually, rather well for someone just jettisoned from his old body a thousand years after he was awake.  I invite you to watch the clips again.  Aside from perhaps two slips, he imitates Larius and Jenaka's speech patterns almost perfectly.

You really missed my point with Flemeth; I was using her as an example that defys the current expectation of magic and mages since you claimed about Hawke's knowledge. She's seen a witch recreate herself from an amulet and turn into a dragon and fly away. That kinda breaks the friggin' 'typical mage' assumption you think Hawke has towards anyone magical. Hawke has seen things that have been complete out of the box, yet you act as if her thinking a Magister can possess something is completely out of this world and she shouldn't even entertain the thought.


Hawke was stupid, failed to double check and let a Magister free since she's a moron. I hope she dies off screen somewhere. Serves a loser hero like her.

[Steelcan]

wonder if there is Corypheus r34..........

[Commander Kurt]

KiwiQuiche wrote...

Hawke was stupid, failed to double check and let a Magister free since she's a moron. I hope she dies off screen somewhere. Serves a loser hero like her.

What, specifically, should Hawke have done? Would it have made sense killing the warden and letting Anders/GWsibling live (who were also clearly affected)? How do you double check?

[KiwiQuiche]

Commander Kurt wrote...

KiwiQuiche wrote...

Hawke was stupid, failed to double check and let a Magister free since she's a moron. I hope she dies off screen somewhere. Serves a loser hero like her.

What, specifically, should Hawke have done? Would it have made sense killing the warden and letting Anders/GWsibling live (who were also clearly affected)? How do you double check?

Eh, Anders was already insane, so killing him wouldn't be a hassle and woulda been a mercy. And I hardly ever have playthroughs with a GW sibling; usually let them die or have Beth join the Circle.

Double check; kill the Warden talking like Cory, to be sure.

[Commander Kurt]

KiwiQuiche wrote...

Commander Kurt wrote...

KiwiQuiche wrote...

Hawke was stupid, failed to double check and let a Magister free since she's a moron. I hope she dies off screen somewhere. Serves a loser hero like her.

What, specifically, should Hawke have done? Would it have made sense killing the warden and letting Anders/GWsibling live (who were also clearly affected)? How do you double check?

Eh, Anders was already insane, so killing him wouldn't be a hassle and woulda been a mercy. And I hardly ever have playthroughs with a GW sibling; usually let them die or have Beth join the Circle.

Double check; kill the Warden talking like Cory, to be sure.

I see. Well, thanks for explaining your stance, I was having a hard time understanding you before.

[Anvos]

Commander Kurt wrote...

KiwiQuiche wrote...

Hawke was stupid, failed to double check and let a Magister free since she's a moron. I hope she dies off screen somewhere. Serves a loser hero like her.

What, specifically, should Hawke have done? Would it have made sense killing the warden and letting Anders/GWsibling live (who were also clearly affected)? How do you double check?

Anders is already possessed so that likely rules out hiding in his body, since even if Corphyeous could possess him it would likely show noticeable signs of him in a struggle with Vengence.

As for your sibling they likely haven't been a warden long enough for the taint to effect them enough for Corphyeous to full on possess them.

Modifié par Anvos, 05 février 2014 - 11:02 .

[Commander Kurt]

Anvos wrote...

Commander Kurt wrote...

KiwiQuiche wrote...

Hawke was stupid, failed to double check and let a Magister free since she's a moron. I hope she dies off screen somewhere. Serves a loser hero like her.

What, specifically, should Hawke have done? Would it have made sense killing the warden and letting Anders/GWsibling live (who were also clearly affected)? How do you double check?

Anders is already possessed so that likely rules out hiding in his body, since even if Corphyeous could possess him it would likely show noticeable signs of him in a struggle with Vengence.

As for your sibling they likely haven't been a warden long enough for the taint to effect them enough for Corphyeous to full on possess them.

Are you arguing that Hawke should know these things? But... With all due respect, YOU don't even know these things..? I mean they're guesses, right?

[Heimdall]

KiwiQuiche wrote...

You really missed my point with Flemeth; I was using her as an example that defys the current expectation of magic and mages since you claimed about Hawke's knowledge. She's seen a witch recreate herself from an amulet and turn into a dragon and fly away. That kinda breaks the friggin' 'typical mage' assumption you think Hawke has towards anyone magical. Hawke has seen things that have been complete out of the box, yet you act as if her thinking a Magister can possess something is completely out of this world and she shouldn't even entertain the thought.


Hawke was stupid, failed to double check and let a Magister free since she's a moron. I hope she dies off screen somewhere. Serves a loser hero like her.

No, I understand your point.  It just doesn't make any sense.  Knowing that there are mages out there that defy the expectations of magic doesn't mean Hawke should be able to anticipate Darkspawn possession.  A notion that vague and indistinct can't possibly translate into such a specific and outlandish suspicion as that with any level of rational certainty.  Definitely not enough certainty to kill an ally over.  Ironicallly, you're the one that wants Hawke to act irrationally.

How precisely would Hawke have double checked?

Modifié par Lord Aesir, 05 février 2014 - 12:37 .

[Jedi Master of Orion]

Lord Aesir wrote...

Jedi Master of Orion wrote...

Alex109222 wrote...

Not related to Cory entirely but I think the Architect is another magister.

Just look at their faces and see how similar they are to eachother, their speech too, as well as their magical powers.

I refuse to believe that the Architect just came into being as a different Darkspawn, he must have got that way because he was one of the magisters that entered the golden city.

Question everything!

His speech and powers are not similar to Corypheus's. Not only that, his goal seems totally unrealted and even his problem would have been renderered totally moot if he had Corypheus' power to mimic the call of the Old Gods. He's almost like the antithesis of Corypheus in some ways. Also he seems to think he is a darkspawn and not a Tevinter.

Two people can speak and think differently, even if they're both quasi-immortal mutant mages.  That Call power could be unique to Corypheus or perhaps the Architect can't use it because he doesn't know he has it or perhaps he's suppressing it (maybe subconsciously) given his goal of freeing Darkspawn from the taint.  All the rest is easily explained by memory loss, which doesn't seem unbelievable given the extreme effect on his body (even Corypheus didn't seem to be all there, he didn't even appear to know he was a corrupted at all.)

Ok, but if the point is that they must be related because they have a similar speech pattern and power, I was showing that they don't.

[Jaulen]

KiwiQuiche wrote...

The Warden speaks to Hawke directly after the fight in Cory's speech patteren. She could, ya know, ask why they're doing that, rather than just leaving.

Well.....y'all must have missed the option to ask Larius why he was talking differently than he had been previously.

His response is something along the lines of "My mind is now clear."

[Jaulen]

Lord Aesir wrote...

KiwiQuiche wrote...
She's met Flemeth as well, who is some crazy woman who can make copies of herself, pretty much cheating death, and turns into a dragon. Cheating death via short cut shouldn't be such a far fetched idea for Hawke to wrap her head around.

(A) what is roleplay durr
Also, killing the Wardens would be completely justified in this scenario.

( Oh come on, Cory doesn't even bother hiding.

Flemeth doesn't possess anyone (To Hawke's knowledge).

Knowing one strange shapeshifting witch exists == suspecting Corypheus can body hop

The two have no bearing on one another.  I wouldn't suspect one Mage of possession because I saw another store herself away.  Its one thing to suspect a Mage will cheat death, another to suspect the actual means.  Maybe Hawke would be wary, but general wariness does not translate into suspecting something she has no way of knowing is possible.

(A)Sure, but Hawke has to be a psychopath, being "stupid" has nothing to do with not being a psychopath.

( He does actually, rather well for someone just jettisoned from his old body a thousand years after he was awake.  I invite you to watch the clips again.  Aside from perhaps two slips, he imitates Larius and Jenaka's speech patterns almost perfectly.

hawke doesn't know what the player knows or notices. Hawke's back is to Larius at the moment of posession and his/her focus is fully on dealing the killing blow to Corpheus.

Also, for Flemeth to be resurrected,  an amulet had to be brought to a special place and a special rite performed.....not at all analogus to Corpheus. KQ is trying to say since apples and bananas are both fruits, they are the same thing.


Roleplaying is 'what would you do in this situation with the information the character has available."

Meta-gaming is 'what would your character do in this situation knowing what you as a player knows"

Modifié par Jaulen, 05 février 2014 - 10:34 .

[calvinien]

Jedi Master of Orion wrote...

Alex109222 wrote...

Not related to Cory entirely but I think the Architect is another magister.

Just look at their faces and see how similar they are to eachother, their speech too, as well as their magical powers.

I refuse to believe that the Architect just came into being as a different Darkspawn, he must have got that way because he was one of the magisters that entered the golden city.

Question everything!

His speech and powers are not similar to Corypheus's. Not only that, his goal seems totally unrealted and even his problem would have been renderered totally moot if he had Corypheus' power to mimic the call of the Old Gods. He's almost like the antithesis of Corypheus in some ways. Also he seems to think he is a darkspawn and not a Tevinter.

The architect does not remember being human (if he ever was). If we assume that the architect was an ancient magister, then whatever happened to him to make him lose his memory would certainly allow for his speech to change. Corypheus JUST woke up, and doens't seem to realize that it isn't 1000 years ago or whenever the first blight started. It's also unclear exactly what happened to either of them. The architect and corypehus do not resemble darkspawn at all. Darkspawn look dirty and tainted and diseased whereas they just look like their flesh is meltying into their armor so whatever turned them form their original form INTO what we would consider darkspanw could have messed with their memories to varying degrees.

[Heimdall]

Jedi Master of Orion wrote...

Ok, but if the point is that they must be related because they have a similar speech pattern and power, I was showing that they don't.

In speech pattern you're right, they certainly don't.  As for Corypheus' power over the taint, by the information we have available, you're right that we can't say the Architect has the same power.

I'm just saying that neither of those things are great marks against the the possibility of him and Corypheus being two of a kind.  It would certainly explain his origins, his appearance and why he is so unusual amongst Darkspawn.

Modifié par Lord Aesir, 06 février 2014 - 11:52 .

[ElvaliaRavenHart]

It appears with Cory and the Architect both that something very powerful blew their faces back and melted their skin into their armor or just melted their skin period. Is the Maker a dragon? The Architect also wears a mask - so was the Architect originally from Orlais? With the Architect it also appears his mask is self piercing. Where as Cory doesn't wear a mask and seems to be directly from Kirkwall or Trevinter. He has some type of armor on. Regardless, both went through some type of transformation and whatever it was affected their appearance. There is enough of their features left to know that they were once fully human men. If the Architect is an original magister then there are two former Trevinter Magisters walking around if the Architect is still alive.

The Architect is a known liar or doesn't understand what it is to lie. He is just as powerful as Cory. If you haven't read the books and the storyline of the Architect before the actually games to get his storyline and allowing him to live is very dangerous. Between the two I'd say Cory is the more powerful. Every mage is unique and their schools and spells are custom achieved or desired.

The Architect awakened an Arch Demon. Cory kept calling to wardens and others to release him, this is mind control. Blood mage for sure. Which shows both are very powerful. Both of them being mages also allows for them to know and understand about possession which Flemeth also knows and she also knows how to preserve her life. The life gem and possession are both devices for this purpose. Seems that Flemeth uses more than one device at a time.

Unless the developers say if you killed the Architect then yes he is dead for good. In which case it would not surprise me if he preserved his own life just like Cory. Many questions also come up: are the original magisters all from different countries? We all assumed they are from Trevinter only or I did. With the Architect this might not be the case. Did they enter the Golden City from each nation on Thedas or directly from Trevinter? Does anyone have an answer to this? It's been awhile since I read all of the codexes. Maybe another magisters sunk Arlathan this way entering the golden city from there?

I'd say Cory and The Architect are both original darkspawn. I don't think both are fully corrupted as other darkspawn are, thus they are awakened, which affords them speech and free will. They must have had powerful protection spells activated to help protect them when they entered the golden city. Others with them might not have an enough protection and this is why we see the difference between them and the more corrupted form of other darkspawn. When darkspawn are fully killed do they also go to the fade when they die? What is this place beyond the fade we keep hearing about?

Also, we've never been told if the Magisters used red or blue lyrium and if this would make a difference. Seems to me they used red and this is what corrupted heaven and drove everyone crazy and in pain. Blue lyrium seems to be involved in the proper use of magic if used properly. As we saw in DA2 red lyrium corrupts. Lyrium streams can be manipulated as we saw in GOA. Lyrium is tied to the fade.

I don't fully agree that Cory is completely insane either. I felt when he was talking he was thinking of that point in time when him and the other magisters entered the Golden City and for whatever reason this is what he is thinking of when he attacks you so he can leave. The magisters were betrayed but by whom? Cory told us the golden city was already black when they got there.

If anyone knows how to tear the veil it would be darkspawn/demons, The Original Magisters, and Flemeth. All mages know how to tear the veil. So a mage(s) are involved in tearing the veil. Or a corrupted mage from a demon of some kind. Every society except dwarves has mages. Darkspawn have mages also. Could be a third magister roaming around.

We still don't know what the connection is between the darkspawn and the fade. One thing for sure, there are a lot of mysteries here.

[KiwiQuiche]

Lord Aesir wrote...

KiwiQuiche wrote...

You really missed my point with Flemeth; I was using her as an example that defys the current expectation of magic and mages since you claimed about Hawke's knowledge. She's seen a witch recreate herself from an amulet and turn into a dragon and fly away. That kinda breaks the friggin' 'typical mage' assumption you think Hawke has towards anyone magical. Hawke has seen things that have been complete out of the box, yet you act as if her thinking a Magister can possess something is completely out of this world and she shouldn't even entertain the thought.


Hawke was stupid, failed to double check and let a Magister free since she's a moron. I hope she dies off screen somewhere. Serves a loser hero like her.

No, I understand your point.  It just doesn't make any sense.  Knowing that there are mages out there that defy the expectations of magic doesn't mean Hawke should be able to anticipate Darkspawn possession.  A notion that vague and indistinct can't possibly translate into such a specific and outlandish suspicion as that with any level of rational certainty.  Definitely not enough certainty to kill an ally over.  Ironicallly, you're the one that wants Hawke to act irrationally.

How precisely would Hawke have double checked?

She should anticipate weird crap around really old crazy mages like Flemeth and Cory. So killing someone to make sure an ancient and hostile Magister doesn't escape is irrational?

I already explained that.

Jaulen wrote...

KiwiQuiche wrote...

The
Warden speaks to Hawke directly after the fight in Cory's speech
patteren. She could, ya know, ask why they're doing that, rather than
just leaving.

Well.....y'all must have missed the option to ask Larius why he was talking differently than he had been previously.

His response is something along the lines of "My mind is now clear."

Hmph. And she just takes it at face value, I take it? Typical.