1765 réponses à ce sujet

[Xilizhra]

Regardless, I was never under the impression that Legion wanted the reaper code upgrades for survival after the reaper was killed. He seemed to want them because they improved his people. Remember on the Normandy before this whole 3-4 option scenario occurred how he admired the reaper code upgrades for being "beautiful; indicative of life?" That seems contradictive to his technological progression views in ME2.

Even if the quarians could have been made to stop killing the geth without the code, the geth dream turned quickly into a nightmare because of how big a strategic weakness it was. The destruction of their Dyson sphere left the race in utter disarray, even shaking the notion of their immortality by destroying many backup programs that could never be retrieved again. In short, the geth's philosophy turned out to be outright wrong, and they had to adapt. Which is another component of self-reliance, after all.

And if you choose destroy after saving the geth or making peace, it turns out that the reaper code which they originally didn't believe in using or wouldn't have previously is the reason they die. There's a lesson in there.

No it's not. All AIs and VIs get zapped with the Destroy beam.

Of course, if they don't use the reaper code, they never become individuals and act as a hive mind with networked intelligence... just a bunch of machines worth gunning down really. It was only Legion who was different. And while I adore legion, I now have come to realize that if they have to use reaper code to become independent then something might not be right there. Nothing good comes from the reapers. And if they don't use the code, they stay the same which makes them very dangerous even though some do choose to keep to themselves. more than enough have killed.

The mass relays welded the galaxy together, EDI's design saved the Normandy countless times, the Thanix Cannon was an amazing weapon and the Thanix missiles turned out to save the day at the very end... "nothing good comes from the Reapers" is simply wrong.

I wanted to gun him down from ME2 when I first meet him. Nothing has changed. How would you like to be brought back from death to go through all shepard did? You're lying if you are grateful or you are a halfwit who has never lived through any kind of hell with no life experiences to draw upon to fully understand that what was done to her was horrendouse beyond words. He violated shepard in ways you can't even begin to imagine and that this game really doesn't even give that a second thought shows how pathetic they are.. Anyone with half a wit would kill that bastard in the most vicious way possible.

Er, you're not really "at peace" in death, you just have no experiences whatsoever. At least that's what happened with Shepard, who perceived a nigh-instantaneous jump between the Normandy's explosion and waking up in Lazarus Station. And to be frank, I really doubt Shepard is the sort of person who'd be resentful about being able to continue saving the galaxy.

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

Bob from Accounting wrote...

Let's not compete over who's supposedly been through the 'most hell.' It's not a mark of wisdom. Often quite the opposite.

Tell me "Bob" what's your stance on Heroism, tvtropes, and characterization?

[von uber]

Xilizhra wrote...

No it's not. All AIs and VIs get zapped with the Destroy beam.

Wait, what?

[Xilizhra]

von uber wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

No it's not. All AIs and VIs get zapped with the Destroy beam.

Wait, what?

Destroy is a broad spectrum of death for synthetic intelligence, at least as it seemed presented to me.

[KaiserShep]

Xilizhra wrote...

No it's not. All AIs and VIs get zapped with the Destroy beam.

That would simply render every computer system inoperable. If that was the case, the Normandy should not have been able to take off, and there should have been no survivors in space, since computers are a necessity for things like life support and engineering to operate.

[Iakus]

"The Crucible will not discriminate. All synthetic life will be targeted"

Another really bad line, really.

[AlexMBrennan]

That would simply render every computer system inoperable. If that was the case, the Normandy should not have been able to take off, and there should have been no survivors in space, since computers are a necessity for things like life support and engineering to operate.

I'm pretty sure that the game explicitly says that those things were damaged but easily fixed; it's nonsensical but it is in the game.

[congokong]

Xilizhra wrote...
Even if the quarians could have been made to stop killing the geth without the code, the geth dream turned quickly into a nightmare because of how big a strategic weakness it was. The destruction of their Dyson sphere left the race in utter disarray, even shaking the notion of their immortality by destroying many backup programs that could never be retrieved again. In short, the geth's philosophy turned out to be outright wrong, and they had to adapt. Which is another component of self-reliance, after all.

Very true. It was an idealistic utopia. I felt Legion was rather naive in ME2. He really thought there could be peace between the heretics and regular geth, but all wars are caused by differing opinions.

When the peaceful come in contact with aggressors, the peaceful have to become aggressors themselves or otherwise be dominated. In this case that means adapting by using any technology obtainable. It's an arms race. Real world scenario: Countries' acquisition and stockpiling of nuclear weapons as deterrents to combat other countries' nuclear weapons. Sometimes you can't take the moral high ground and have to fight fire with fire; evil with evil. ME teaches that lesson well.

Modifié par congokong, 23 février 2014 - 04:19 .

[Steelcan]

Xilizhra wrote...

von uber wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

No it's not. All AIs and VIs get zapped with the Destroy beam.

Wait, what?

Destroy is a broad spectrum of death for synthetic intelligence, at least as it seemed presented to me.

Just AIs get the axe

[General TSAR]

Some of you guys think toasters are alive and are "people"?

Heh heh, ain't that cute? BUT IT'S WRONG!!!

(Cookie for whoever gets the reference)

Modifié par General TSAR, 23 février 2014 - 06:00 .

[RangerSG]

Xilizhra wrote...

von uber wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

No it's not. All AIs and VIs get zapped with the Destroy beam.

Wait, what?

Destroy is a broad spectrum of death for synthetic intelligence, at least as it seemed presented to me.

Never says anything about VIs. It says "synthetic." And remember, in HIgh EMS, the catabrat is wrong even about how much synthetic life gets it. There's no clear evidence the Geth die in High EMS Destroy. It's only inference from The brat's words and the lack of a slide. But absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

[KaiserShep]

Meh who cares about the geth? EdI gets it even while being tucked away inside the Normandy.

[ImaginaryMatter]

KaiserShep wrote...

Meh who cares about the geth? EdI gets it even while being tucked away inside the Normandy.

I like them, how else am I supposed to read my book at night?

[DextroDNA]

"WE FIGHT OR WE DIE! THAT'S THE PLAN!"

****ing hell, the intro. Maybe if they hadn't tailored ME3 to people who'd never played the series before, the prologue wouldn't have been as painstakingingly awful.

[AlanC9]

iakus wrote...

"The Crucible will not discriminate. All synthetic life will be targeted"

Another really bad line, really.

What's bad about the line?  Besides you hating the concept, of course.

[Sir DeLoria]

StreetMagic wrote...
That's just me though. It got so bad that I turned it off after Tali killed herself and I saw the Quarians plummeting to extinction. I couldn't believe what I did. lol

Agreed, but while I find that scene to be incredibly depressing, in hindsight I find the logical flaws of that scene to be almost as sad:?

How can either side even be completely annihilated? Wiping out the Geth would take ages, if you don't destroy their servers and there must've been thousands of escape pods and smaller ships to survive the battle. After all, there were hundreds if not more pods already scattered about the planet.  

Modifié par Necanor, 23 février 2014 - 11:44 .

[von uber]

RussianZombeh wrote...

"WE FIGHT OR WE DIE! THAT'S THE PLAN!"

****ing hell, the intro. Maybe if they hadn't tailored ME3 to people who'd never played the series before, the prologue wouldn't have been as painstakingingly awful.

Try doing it as an adept and see how many husks you can kill using biotics before you get bored and use the pistol the game gives you before it lets you move on.

[shodiswe]

There are several weird things in the Geth Quarian story.

If you choose to let the Quarians die the Geth fleet is reinforced by another Geth fleet, possibly jumping in from ftl.

Otherwise those Geth reinforcemets never show up.

One can speculate why those geth wern't sent to battle by the Reapers.
It's possible that those Geth were free Geth like Legion who refused to surrender to the Reapers and instead tried to flee into the dephts and hide.

If Legion suceeds they return, otherwise they just fly off and hide like the Leviathans and Proteans (Javik).

It's possible both the Geth and Quarians survive nomatter what, even if it hurt them a lot.

But Shepard doesn't know where they go, they are just missing.

[shodiswe]

Maybe the geth had a powered down fleet outside their homesystem with all major powersystems powered down.

To avoid by both the reapers and others. But when the Geth get their upgrade and calls for them to destroy the Quarians they jump in to help.
Which ends that battle quickly and decisively.

It's entierly possible that the Geth tried to trick the Reapers and hid some of their people away and deleted all records off it. To save their species.

It might have been their plan all allong. Pretend to fight to their last while a few sneak off and hide.

Maybe the people sugesting that the Geth survived are right. Maybe their evacuation fleet escaped bouth possible genocide by the Quarians and destroy.

Modifié par shodiswe, 24 février 2014 - 12:05 .

[darthoptimus003]

how bout Ashley/Kaiden being made specters
why thay haven't done anything that would give them that status
and Ashley being a complete b the entire time made me cap her on my second play through even when I hooked up with her
sorry but the vs totally got completely stupid since horizon in ME2 questioning every thing I said or did/didn't do
come to think of it every part with the VS is completely bad

[justafan]

shodiswe wrote...

There are several weird things in the Geth Quarian story.

If you choose to let the Quarians die the Geth fleet is reinforced by another Geth fleet, possibly jumping in from ftl.

Otherwise those Geth reinforcemets never show up.

One can speculate why those geth wern't sent to battle by the Reapers.
It's possible that those Geth were free Geth like Legion who refused to surrender to the Reapers and instead tried to flee into the dephts and hide.

If Legion suceeds they return, otherwise they just fly off and hide like the Leviathans and Proteans (Javik).

It's possible both the Geth and Quarians survive nomatter what, even if it hurt them a lot.

But Shepard doesn't know where they go, they are just missing.

Well if you regard twitter as canon ala Emily Wong's death, then no matter what the Quarians survive, as when the Vorcha and male quarians came out for multiplayer, there was a post saying not all Quarians on pilgrimage were able to join the Migrant Fleet and were hired by the Alliance to train the Vorcha for combat.

As for the Geth, I find it implausible that all were destroyed either.  Every Geth that is conected to and accepts the pre-Legion Consensus is and will remain enslaved by the reapers, but as we saw with the reprogramming of the heretics, not all Geth are in constant communication with their Consensus, so there are undoubtably Geth on the fringes of space who never got the memo to download Reaper tech, and were likely spared the Quarian/Geth war, and possibly the destroy beam if you buy the hypothesis that it only targets reaper tech.

[shodiswe]

justafan wrote...

shodiswe wrote...

There are several weird things in the Geth Quarian story.

If you choose to let the Quarians die the Geth fleet is reinforced by another Geth fleet, possibly jumping in from ftl.

Otherwise those Geth reinforcemets never show up.

One can speculate why those geth wern't sent to battle by the Reapers.
It's possible that those Geth were free Geth like Legion who refused to surrender to the Reapers and instead tried to flee into the dephts and hide.

If Legion suceeds they return, otherwise they just fly off and hide like the Leviathans and Proteans (Javik).

It's possible both the Geth and Quarians survive nomatter what, even if it hurt them a lot.

But Shepard doesn't know where they go, they are just missing.

Well if you regard twitter as canon ala Emily Wong's death, then no matter what the Quarians survive, as when the Vorcha and male quarians came out for multiplayer, there was a post saying not all Quarians on pilgrimage were able to join the Migrant Fleet and were hired by the Alliance to train the Vorcha for combat.

As for the Geth, I find it implausible that all were destroyed either.  Every Geth that is conected to and accepts the pre-Legion Consensus is and will remain enslaved by the reapers, but as we saw with the reprogramming of the heretics, not all Geth are in constant communication with their Consensus, so there are undoubtably Geth on the fringes of space who never got the memo to download Reaper tech, and were likely spared the Quarian/Geth war, and possibly the destroy beam if you buy the hypothesis that it only targets reaper tech.

There is also this backup Geth fleet that only shows up if they decide to annihilate the Quarians after the upload.

They might not have been conected when the Reapers took over.

[darthoptimus003]

RangerSG wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

von uber wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

No it's not. All AIs and VIs get zapped with the Destroy beam.

Wait, what?

Destroy is a broad spectrum of death for synthetic intelligence, at least as it seemed presented to me.

Never says anything about VIs. It says "synthetic." And remember, in HIgh EMS, the catabrat is wrong even about how much synthetic life gets it. There's no clear evidence the Geth die in High EMS Destroy. It's only inference from The brat's words and the lack of a slide. But absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

the one thing I never understood was how did edi die if she wasn't synthetic
she is in the Normandy her body was just a remote. her body had to stay in proximity of the Normandy just for her to remain in control of it
and in the EC her name is on the wall don't make since but thanks to the ending all three games make no since

[Bad King]

RangerSG wrote...

Bad King wrote...

Seboist wrote...

iakus wrote...

Seboist wrote...

The Citadel coup was fan service to all the Udina haters and to a lesser extent the anti-Cerb ones. There's no point whatsoever to this mission other than to "drop loads" on Udina.

The really bizarre thing is, up until the coup, I was actually starting to like  Udina in ME3.  He was a jerk, but he was our jerk.

ME3 did provide Udina with his best portrayal in the trilogy prior to the coup.

What a waste.

I also liked him in ME1 where he basically looked out for Shepard for much of the game: he pushed for Shepard's spectre status and stuck up for him on the Citadel during his activities on Feros, Noveria and Virmire. People hated him mainly because he was rude and blunt and so were baying for his blood by ME3 because he hurt their feelings. 

No, they hated him mainly because he backstabbed Shepard and arranged for the Normandy to be taken away from him. Just like he threw Anderson under the bus (though apparently Anderson was expecting that, if the Citadel DLC interview notes are to be believed). Oh, and he didn't 'stick up for Shepard" in the one thing that mattered. He said the Reapers were a figment of imagination. Just like the Council did. So it's better to say, "He backed Shepard when it was politically expedient to do so, and then tossed him aside."

Even to the point of not reinstating him in ME2, and making Anderson deliver the news. Yeah. 

He turned against Shepard because humanity's reputation was on the line and Shepard was too dumb to actually collect any evidence that the reapers were real - he even has the audacity to ask the council to take what he says on faith. It's insane that some players ignore all the support that Udina offers Shepard throughout the game just because he turned on him (the rational thing to do in his situation) right at the end. We only see the military conflict of ME1 (Shepard's viewpoint), but Udina was fighting a very different battle - one of a political nature - to improve humanity's standing in the galactic community and to foil Saren's plots.