1765 réponses à ce sujet

[MassivelyEffective0730]

Really now? Do you have an idea that's an iota better than a super-duper magic weapon?

 

What 'strengths and weaknesses' are those? How are they developed and utilized? What are the themes tied to these devices? What are the potential outcomes? What's the climax of this plan? What are the consequences?

 

Can you answer any of these questions? Or is this just 'Shepard finds a super-duper Reaper gun and builds it and shoots the Reapers'? A story a three year old could come up with?
 

 

David, there's no point engaging you. It's an exercise in futility as you illogically (and irrelevantly) tear down any possible answer. All you're really here to do is impetuously scoff and slight people and belittle their opinions as poor and childish while you build yourself up to satisfy a tremendous ego problem by saying how much more clever you think you are to a point where you have the gall to proclaim that you are insulted and that your time is wasted as if we should care that your opinion is somehow almighty and righteous and we are but brainless peons who must worship every fathom of your 'heroic' opinion since you are by far our superior and know more than we can ever hope too. Basically, it's like a self-important tale a three year old would come up with. Which you're acting like. 

[KaiserShep]

I have never understood why everyone thought the Collectors were terrible.

 

Wait...what? I imagine people think they're terrible for the same reason why the Ebola virus and children's leukemia are largely unpopular. Find me a redeeming quality in the Collectors and I'll find you Oscar-worthy material from Tommy Wiseau.

[KaiserShep]

Really now? Do you have an idea that's an iota better than a super-duper magic weapon?

 

What 'strengths and weaknesses' are those? How are they developed and utilized? What are the themes tied to these devices? What are the potential outcomes? What's the climax of this plan? What are the consequences?

 

Can you answer any of these questions? Or is this just 'Shepard finds a super-duper Reaper gun and builds it and shoots the Reapers'? A story a three year old could come up with?
 

 

Sure, lemme just yank a few massive story details out of my ass. No pressure.

 

Do you require a spreadsheet, or perhaps a flow chart, my liege?

[MassivelyEffective0730]

Wait...what? I imagine people think they're terrible for the same reason why the Ebola virus and children's leukemia are largely unpopular. Find me a redeeming quality in the Collectors and I'll find you Oscar-worthy material from Tommy Wiseau.

 

Haha, hilarious, a regular comedian. 

 

I mean as a plot element and enemy. 

[Bob from Accounting]

Sure, lemme just yank a few massive story details out of my ass. No pressure.

 

Do you require a spreadsheet, or perhaps a flow chart, my liege?

 

Without details, the only, literally the only thing you have is Shepard finding a cache of old technology. And that's utterly nothing. It's about the most generic idea around.

 

So yes. Maybe you should think a bit on those issues, and then maybe you'll be credible to say how it should have been done.

[KaiserShep]

Well, egg on my face. I didn't think the Collectors were bad, but I think they were underutilized. The suicide mission is actually a bit too easy. I was really hoping to face a bit more of a hellish battle in the base. I mean, did I wipe out all of the available Praetorians or something?

[CptFalconPunch]

I'm not making an argument or a claim. Hence why I'm calling you out without saying anything in return. Don't turn the argument onto me. 

 

I don't even have to say anything nomore, I just have to quote you. This is starting to get hillarious.

[von uber]

I suspect massively that you rate me2 so highly because of it featuring a large amount of miranda and to a lesser extent your favourite terrorist organisation.

[Barquiel]

The collectors made absolutely no sense. Why would the reapers even rush to create a new Reaper just for the sake of creating one while they have a galaxy to reap? What exactly was the point of the human reaper? We're also told that the Collectors were not going to finish the human reaper without striking Earth...using their one cruiser against several alliance fleets, I guess? Shepard stopping the collectors from their meaningless activity achieved absolutely nothing in stopping the reapers threat.

[KaiserShep]

The fate of the Collectors is kind of weird. We destroy their cruiser and either destroy the entire base or simply eradicate the population in it, but then ME3 rolls around and crams them into multiplayer. Rule of cool is a hell of a drug.

[Bob from Accounting]

If you're looking for an alternative to the ending of ME 2, I was looking back at the old threads of David7204 to see what the person everyone accuses me of being was like, and his suggestion was really quite brilliant. Powerful, plausible, very elegant. Far and away superior to anything else I've seen here. 

 

Solves a ton of problems.

 

- Gives the collectors a far more plausible motive yet allows the fundamentals of the story to remain intact.

- Gives ME 2 a much more important role without weakening the Reapers.

- Eliminates the problem of indoctrination in ME 3. (Why do we never see or fight indoctrinated armies except Cerberus?)

- Has very strong thematic ties that would satisfy both Paragons and Renegades.

- Makes the final choice much more powerful.

- Eliminates the human Reaper, Reapers made from goo, all that nonsense.

[SporkFu]

The fate of the Collectors is kind of weird. We destroy their cruiser and either destroy the entire base or simply eradicate the population in it, but then ME3 rolls around and crams them into multiplayer. Rule of cool is a hell of a drug.

Is it any worse than fighting geth in MP after making peace on Rannoch? 

[themikefest]

I would like to know what the collectors were doing while we were chasing Saren.

[MassivelyEffective0730]

I don't even have to say anything nomore, I just have to quote you. This is starting to get hillarious.

 

I don't think you understood the implications of my statement, or of argument in general. You were asking me why I wasn't saying anything in return about my point. The reason is because point in the argument was unstated, and that I was challenging your points. I don't need to express my opinion to challenge yours.

[MassivelyEffective0730]

I suspect massively that you rate me2 so highly because of it featuring a large amount of miranda and to a lesser extent your favourite terrorist organisation.

 

I suspect there's nothing worth saying to convince you otherwise since you're bound and determined to see this as truth no matter what I could possibly say.

[SporkFu]

I would like to know what the collectors were doing while we were chasing Saren.

Any info we got from Miranda, Jacob, TIM, suggests that no one really knew much about them, they appeared out of the omega 4 relay now and then, traded tech for whatever they needed and vanished back through the relay. 

 

No sources or quotes to go with this, though. All from memory. 

[Jorji Costava]

Haha, hilarious, a regular comedian. 

 

I mean as a plot element and enemy. 

 

I wouldn't call the Collectors terrible or anything, but here is what my criticism would be: Generally, when you make the stakes smaller (as ME2 does), you also want to make them more personal as well. For instance, after the Rebel base on Hoth is evacuated in The Empire Strikes Back, not much of obvious large scale consequence to the Empire or Rebellion happens in the rest of that movie. But what does happen in that movie crucially involves the interpersonal dynamics between Luke, Vader, Luke's friends, Yoda, etc. In other words, as the stakes get smaller and the focus becomes more narrow, the stakes get more personal as well.

 

This is where I think the Collectors fall a bit short. They're a smaller scale villain than Sovereign or the Reapers, but they're also completely impersonal; there's no possibility of having a grudge against the Collectors, being betrayed by them, or any other sort of interesting interpersonal dynamic. So the Collectors end up just coming across as Reaper flunkies who we are fighting so that the Reaper threat can be kept more or less in stasis during the course of the game.

 

EDIT: Fixed wording.

[themikefest]

Any info we got from Miranda, Jacob, TIM, suggests that no one really knew much about them, they appeared out of the omega 4 relay now and then, traded tech for whatever they needed and vanished back through the relay. 

 

No sources or quotes to go with this, though. All from memory. 

I know that part. I mean why couldn't they of help Sovereign

[SwobyJ]

If you're looking for an alternative to the ending of ME 2, I was looking back at the old threads of David7204 to see what the person everyone accuses me of being was like

 

Just stop.

[MassivelyEffective0730]

If you're looking for an alternative to the ending of ME 2, I was looking back at the old threads of David7204 to see what the person everyone accuses me of being was like, and his suggestion was really quite brilliant. Powerful, plausible, very elegant. Far and away superior to anything else I've seen here. 

 

Solves a ton of problems.

 

- Gives the collectors a far more plausible motive yet allows the fundamentals of the story to remain intact.

- Gives ME 2 a much more important role without weakening the Reapers.

- Eliminates the problem of indoctrination in ME 3. (Why do we never see or fight indoctrinated armies except Cerberus?)

- Has very strong thematic ties that would satisfy both Paragons and Renegades.

- Makes the final choice much more powerful.

- Eliminates the human Reaper, Reapers made from goo, all that nonsense.

 

This is gold. Really, this really is comedic gold.

 

Such beautiful, mindless, self-shilling and self-aggrandizing wanking. That's really all that this can be called.

 

Or are we still pretending that Bob isn't a not-David wearing Groucho glasses?

[KaiserShep]

I would like to know what the collectors were doing while we were chasing Saren.

 

While I can't fault this too much since it's optional dialogue, it seems weird that Shepard can ask about the Collectors as if he/she already knows that they exist at Freedom's Progress.

 

If you're looking for an alternative to the ending of ME 2, I was looking back at the old threads of David7204 to see what the person everyone accuses me of being was like, and his suggestion was really quite brilliant. Powerful, plausible, very elegant. Far and away superior to anything else I've seen here. 

 

LOL. Don't ever change. Keep chasing that rainbow.

[Jorji Costava]

This is gold. Really, this really is comedic gold.

 

Such beautiful, mindless, self-shilling and self-aggrandizing wanking. That's really all that this can be called.

 

Or are we still pretending that Bob isn't a not-David wearing Groucho glasses?

 

Hey now, they're just drawing from the same well, that's all.

[SporkFu]

I know that part. I mean why couldn't they of help Sovereign

Oh... Lol, I knew that.   

 

Well, Sovereign said something like each reaper is like a nation in itself. Maybe Harby told him to get his own army. 

[Iakus]

I know that part. I mean why couldn't they of help Sovereign

 

Some seeker swarms at the Battle of the Citadel would have meant an easy victory for Saren.

[Ryriena]

Some seeker swarms at the Battle of the Citadel would have meant an easy victory for Saren.

Yup or not have them use those seeker swarms during that fight. I found the seeker swarms to be a stupid idea anyway, but that's just me as it didn't make a ton of sense.