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[Angarma]

I have noticed conflicting information within developer quotes concerning the Qunari Mage:

@BioMarkDarrah wrote...

@ShiroTenshiRyu wrote...

@BioMarkDarrah wrote...
1. Qunari mages (both male and female) will be available

@BioMarkDarrah How would that work though? The Saarebas have handlers so how would you have a freed Kossith. An unbound Kossith mage ©

indeed

*source*

I'd assume this confirms the Qunari Mage's origin is that of a Saarebas.

David Gaider wrote...

Battlebloodmage wrote...
Mr.
Gaider, I always assume Qunari born outside the Qun are just called
Qunari while the Tal-Vashoth are those who abandoned the Qun, so when
you said Tal-Vashoth, does it mean we're ex-quanri?

Mary
tells me that the PC would technically just be Vashoth. Either way, it's
a distinction that's only going to be relevant to the Qunari
themselves. Everyone else will simply say "Qunari", no matter where you
were born.

*source*

I'd believe this means Qunari Inquisitors will be Kossith that have left the Qun/Qunari society.
However, what differentiates them- if I understand correctly, from Tal-Vashoth is either (or both):

A) They've yet to be captured/tried to be re-educated, but if they are and then resist violently/escape, they're Tal-Vashoth.
Any formerly apart of, but then leave the Qun/Qunari society violently, are considered thus after Tal-Vashoth.

------

Which brings me to my point: Saarebas are indefinitely under the eye of an Arvaarad.
They aren't allowed to be on their own, always have to wear chained armour that can immobilise them-
Are instantly under a death mark (as well as to be hunted) if they leave an Arvaarad.

Those that do leave aren't even trusted by their own similar brethren (the Tal-Vashoth).
Instead they're often continued to be leashed when in their company (as seen in DA2).


Which begs some questions:

Firstly, how likely is it that a Saarebas escapes without causing harm (given the above information)?
Secondly, is a Qunari Mage Inquisitor considered Vashoth until proven otherwise (they show their magic)?
Thirdly, will this impact dialogue more highly than it would for 'regular' Vashoth (being careful with their kind)?

Finally, is the Qunari Mage actually considered an incognito Tal-Vashoth or does my perception need reconfiguration?



*EDIT* Here's a summary of the issue as well:

Tal-Vashoth defined in both instances here in this post automatically fit into what an escaped
Saarebas is noted as being in lore. Mark Darrah, I thought, denoted the PC *was* Saarebas.
David Gaider, however, from Mary Kirby's mouth- denotes all Qunari Inquisitors as Vashoth.

Note, the discrepancy isn't at all over whether the Qunari Mage is Saarebas or Vashoth.
It's whether they're Tal-Vashoth (due to once being Saarebas) or Vashoth (to be explained).

Modifié par Dodok, 06 février 2014 - 04:58 .

[Knight of Dane]

Developers have confirmed that all Qunari Inquisitors are vasoth.

Obviously all Qunari mages will be Saarebas, Saarebas literally means mage.

Modifié par Knight of Dane, 06 février 2014 - 02:18 .

[Treacherous J Slither]

So our Kossith Inquisitor is Vashoth and if there are any encounters with (Tal)Vashoth or Qunari one can expect bloodshed yes?

[KC_Prototype]

What is the difference between Tal-Vasoth and Vasoth? Aren't they the same thing?

[Nightdragon8]

Knight of Dane wrote...

Developers have confirmed that all Qunari Inquisitors are vasoth.

Obviously all Qunari mages will be Saarebas, Saarebas literally means mage.

the issue really isn't "what they are called" its the fact that they are bound and gagged.

Can't really be a leader if you have a handler and gag on you the whole time.

What they are wondering is "How can one be Qunari, a mage, and still be able to talk. with a soecity that is so very strict with there mages.

[CybAnt1]

Paging Mary Kirby ... paging Mary Kirby ... please report to the front office.

"Tal" Vashoth are violent.
Vashoth are not.

(used to be one opposed the Qun, the other didn't; that seems to be being moved away from)
(and have you seen a lot of pacifists in Thedas? Neither have I)

"Vashoth" = "gray ones" "Tal" = "true" "Tal-" "Vashoth" = "true gray ones"

Which explain why some are violent and some are not.

Don't ask me to explain it - I can't - it would have to make sense first. 

Modifié par CybAnt1, 06 février 2014 - 02:37 .

[ArtemisMoons]

I feel that a vashoth is a qunari who has not had involvement with the Qun. That would make since since if they left, they'd be tal-vashoth.
So they wouldn't be a sarebas as they aren't part of the Qun. They won't have a handler or their mouths sewn shut. I imagine that being a qunari mage will have the Qunari cautious around you though.

[CybAnt1]

I feel that a vashoth is a qunari who has not had involvement with the Qun. 

Nope. You must abandon it.

What do you call a (small q) qunari raised outside of the Qun? That has simply never been exposed to it? There is no qunlat term for it (yet). 

Dare I say, some appear to like it that way. 

[Cainhurst Crow]

Who cares?

[ArtemisMoons]

CybAnt1 wrote...

I feel that a vashoth is a qunari who has not had involvement with the Qun. 

Nope. You must abandon it.

What do you call a (small q) qunari raised outside of the Qun? That has simply never been exposed to it? There is no qunlat term for it (yet). 

Dare I say, some appear to like it that way. 

I figured that would be the reason between the tal-vashoth and vashoth. XD 
I mean, I assume there has to be qunari who have been brought up out of the Qun. I can't believe that all those who have abandoned the Qun were celibate. Lol 

But at this point, the thing we do know is that our qunquizzy will not be a member of the Qun so if we are a mage, what Qunari do to mages is irrelevant. 

[CybAnt1]

Yes, that would seem to be the situation. The Qunari (culture/ethos) demands Saarebas be chained and handled by a 'controller'.

Ox-men raised outside of that ethos, who are then mages, won't obey those rules.

[Clockwork_Wings]

It's to my understanding that a Vashoth is one that was born outside the qun, a second-gen Tal-Vashoth. Saarabs would probably be executed on sight, but as you can tell the Arishok, why pass up perfectly good converts? If a qunari band found a group of tal-vashoth, they'd probably execute them, but if they had children with them, it probably would be little different than taking converts after a raid. The children had not yet been offered a choice, after all.

Qunari are extremely efficient this way.

Modifié par Clockwork_Wings, 06 février 2014 - 02:53 .

[daveliam]

I thought that I read somewhere that Vashoth meant either a qunari who had abandoned the Qun, yet doesn't violently oppose it AND those who weren't exposed to it (i.e. born outside of the Qun). Maybe I'm mistaken though.

If I'm not, though, then our qunari Inquisitor would be a Vashoth either way.

[Iron Fist]

Is it really that weird for Tal-Vashoth to use Qunlat (in this case "Saarebas")?

City elves still use elven words like "shemlen," despite being raised under the auspices of human rule.

Modifié par MevenSelas, 06 février 2014 - 03:07 .

[ArtemisMoons]

Well I would see it as them shedding the Qun's roles and demands? I mean, I don't think that's canon, but it would make sense. Sarebas is a Qun role and I assume the vashoth /tal-vashoth she'd those names when they shed the role.

That said, I imagine that all qunari still hold a bit of fear/disgust when it comes to qunari mages. Lol

[Kymera X]

Wait I tought Tal-Vashoth is used by Quanri that left Qun and it means true grey ones and Vashoth is used by Quanari inside the Qun to adress the Vashoth (grey ones) Am I missing something ?! So for us we are Saarebas Tal-Vashoth when for other Qun Quanari we are just Saarebas Vashoth

Modifié par jam0603, 06 février 2014 - 03:29 .

[Iakus]

Knight of Dane wrote...

Developers have confirmed that all Qunari Inquisitors are vasoth.

Obviously all Qunari mages will be Saarebas, Saarebas literally means mage.

Well, to be technical Saarebas means "dangerous thing" 

Which makes sense, given Qunari are even more paranoid about magic than the most dogmatic templar, it seems.

I seem to recall a scene in DA2 where Hawke has to decide whether to hand Ketojen over to teh Qunari, he can point out that one of his/her allies is a mage, and not a threat.  The Qunari freak out, calling said mage a "bas Saarebas" and immediately attack.

[Angarma]

JSlither wrote...

So our Kossith Inquisitor is Vashoth and if there are any encounters with (Tal)Vashoth or Qunari one can expect bloodshed yes?

Excuse me if my original post wasn't clear: I was trying to give known facts out (relating to lore about the qunari
saarebas & developer quotes about DA:I Qunari Mage Inquisitors) to establish some idea of the current lore
perspective for the Qunari Mage Inquisitor, which I then questioned due to the information not working together.

Nightdragon8 wrote...

the issue really isn't "what they are called" its the fact that they are bound and gagged.

Can't really be a leader if you have a handler and gag on you the whole time.

What
they are wondering is "How can one be Qunari, a mage, and still be able
to talk. with a soecity that is so very strict with there mages.

Actually no, what I'm wondering, which is also the discrepancy, was no doubt ill summarised.
So I've edited my original post to include a summary of the issue, so it can be better understood.

Modifié par Dodok, 06 février 2014 - 04:54 .

[ArtemisMoons]

Based on Mary saying we'd be vashoth, I'm guessing a qunquizzy mage has never had their mouth sewn shut or been a part of the Qun at all. That seems most likely, anyhow.

[Star fury]

It's funny how Bioware managed to confuse all fans with these qunari names.

[Sentinel358]

Knight of Dane wrote...

Developers have confirmed that all Qunari Inquisitors are vasoth.

Obviously all Qunari mages will be Saarebas, Saarebas literally means mage.

No Saarebas literally translates out to "Dangerous Thing"

[Iakus]

jam0603 wrote...

Wait I tought Tal-Vashoth is used by Quanri that left Qun and it means true grey ones and Vashoth is used by Quanari inside the Qun to adress the Vashoth (grey ones) Am I missing something ?! So for us we are Saarebas Tal-Vashoth when for other Qun Quanari we are just Saarebas Vashoth

According to the codex, those who leave the Qun are called "Vashoth" or "Grey Ones".  And obviously, they have to leave Qunari society.

But the ones who actively turn on the Qun call themselves Tal -Vashoth "True Grey Ones"  They are the ones who "wage a bitter war against the Qun, the Qunari, and sometimes against order itself"  Unlike the Vashoth, they are not content to simply remove themselves from the Qun, but actively work against it. 

It sounds like the qunari Inquisitor is from the Vashoth.  Maybe even grew up outside the Qun altogether.  And so while the Qunari may consider such a mage Saarebas, the comunity the inquisitor grew up in might or might not hold the same views.

[Grieving Natashina]

I imagine an Inquisitor has the potential become Tal-Vashoth to the Qunari, depending upon what decisions we're going to make in the game.

Modifié par Starsyn, 06 février 2014 - 05:42 .

[Reznore57]

Well it would be interesting to know how Vashoth mages are treated , the Qunari really fear mages , more than templars.And many other societies fear magic.
It's possible Vashoth mages are still outcast (Saarebas) ,in tribe/society where mages are accepted ,it's usualy a very long tradition and they master schools of magic the chantry and I guess the Qun forbid.

For now , I guess it's impossible to know if Vashoth "society" still perceive their mages as "dangerous things" .If that's the case it's possible free Saarebas live in some sort of Coven with other like them or just looked for human/elf apostate.
If I remember correctly Saarebas among Tal Vashoth are not really popular , they are still feared.
They may be tolerated because they provide some firepower ,but their lack of proper training make them dangerous to others .

[Knight of Dane]

Sentinel358 wrote...

Knight of Dane wrote...

Developers have confirmed that all Qunari Inquisitors are vasoth.

Obviously all Qunari mages will be Saarebas, Saarebas literally means mage.

No Saarebas literally translates out to "Dangerous Thing"

Which means mage to them.

They don't call gaatlok "Saarebas" that's a pretty dangerous thing too.