47 réponses à ce sujet

[ElitePinecone]

Just wondering if this has been brought up before, since I haven't seen anybody quoting it when discussing when the next game will take place.

(From pp. 4-5 of Chapter 12 in the Final Hours of ME3)



Obviously things could've changed since March 2012, but that seems pretty definitive. At the very least the original intention was for something set before or during ME3.

[SwobyJ]

I agree with him. Post-ME3 is peace in the MEU. Good times. It's pretty set.


EDIT: Yes really. This is perfectly fitting with my views and ideas. Just takes some imagination


Look up what mass effect means. As in, the definition.

Modifié par SwobyJ, 06 février 2014 - 10:24 .

[SporkFu]

That quote was from right after the game was released. He was probably burned out on the mass effect universe, and didn't want to even contemplate anything new. I know I'd be ready for a break from it.

[Malchat]

Their idea of the post-ME3 setting might have changed quite drastically in light of the ending controversy which this quote predates.

There are hints that Hudson's and Walter's original vision really was quite radical and made direct sequels inconceivable (or no longer recognisable as Mass Effect.)

The slightly forced optimism of the EC endings to appease a dismayed audience may have opened some doors previously thought shut.

Modifié par Malchat, 06 février 2014 - 11:00 .

[Khavos]

My money would be on the thinking having changed. There's not a lot of time between First Contact and the Reapers arriving again, and we know nothing major enough to make for a codex entry happened. As cool as it would be for Bioware to do a story that wasn't, "You are the savior of the universe!!!!!111" it's unlikely to happen.

[Dubozz]

Final Hours app has been filmed before....you know.. March 2012. So yeah.

[bayofangels]

I wouldn't put too much by this about their current thinking. Since Mac said that, the following has happened -

1) Everyone told them their ending and decisions for the future of the ME galaxy sucked
2) Significant portions were retconned in the Extended Cut (relays not destroyed, Citadel repaired)
3) Pre-existing DLC plans were reworked to further placate fans (creation of Leviathan, fan-requested stuff in Citadel)
4) BioWare has directly polled fans via BSN and at cons as to what they want next - majority said sequel

In short, BioWare has happily shown it will respond to fan demand and change course if necessary. And the original decisions which would have made a sequel pretty much impossible (implications of a galactic dark age) have been reverted.

Modifié par bayofangels, 06 février 2014 - 11:31 .

[Daniel_N7]

That quote was taken during the great mental breakdown of 2012. I'm sure whatever intentions they had before the post-launch crisis is irrelevant, since they probably had to rethink everything regarding the continuation of the series.

[ElitePinecone]

bayofangels wrote...

In short, BioWare has happily shown it will respond to fan demand and change course if necessary. And the original decisions which would have made a sequel pretty much impossible (implications of a galactic dark age) have been reverted.

Yeah, that's true.

Kinda awkward to reverse course so abruptly though, isn't it? It seems ME3 was planned and written on the premise that nothing would ever be set afterwards, and if they do end up making NextME a sequel, that's a whole lot of backpeddling to do on the story front. 

My only concern is how they'd treat Shepard's trilogy in that scenario. As much as the endings were massively disappointing, I think it'd be slightly weird to set the next game a bit afterwards and ignore all the enormous galaxy-changing decisions that we were supposed to have made in ME3. Given that the tone of something like Synthesis was literally a "yay technology" utopia (which Extended Cut made more insanely optimistic), it seems bizarre to set anything afterwards if every problem in the universe is solved from now to eternity. 

In a way, while I viscerally disliked the way ME3 ended, I kinda want them to stick with it - or to be stuck with it. Changing everything again just to appease fans doesn't give me a lot of confidence that there was ever a solid, thoughtful, consistent plan to begin with, and to be honest it even looks a little bit... weak-willed? Desperate?

[AlanC9]

ElitePinecone wrote...

In a way, while I viscerally disliked the way ME3 ended, I kinda want them to stick with it - or to be stuck with it. Changing everything again just to appease fans doesn't give me a lot of confidence that there was ever a solid, thoughtful, consistent plan to begin with, and to be honest it even looks a little bit... weak-willed? Desperate?

Bio's never claimed that they had a plan.

[TurianRebel212]

They have no clue what they're gonna do, lol. It's a mess.

[Iakus]

AlanC9 wrote...

ElitePinecone wrote...

In a way, while I viscerally disliked the way ME3 ended, I kinda want them to stick with it - or to be stuck with it. Changing everything again just to appease fans doesn't give me a lot of confidence that there was ever a solid, thoughtful, consistent plan to begin with, and to be honest it even looks a little bit... weak-willed? Desperate?

Bio's never claimed that they had a plan.

Indeed, they've made it pretty clear they didn't have a plan even going from ME1-ME2-ME3, let alone what comes after.  They've been winging it the whole time, and that's at least part of the reason they're in the situation they are in right now.

Far from seeming desperate, actually clearing the trilogy mess aside and starting over would be, to me, a sign they're finally getting their act together.

Sticking with the trilogy would ultimately flush the IP down the toilet, I think.

[CronoDragoon]

ElitePinecone wrote...
In a way, while I viscerally disliked the way ME3 ended, I kinda want them to stick with it - or to be stuck with it. Changing everything again just to appease fans doesn't give me a lot of confidence that there was ever a solid, thoughtful, consistent plan to begin with, and to be honest it even looks a little bit... weak-willed? Desperate?

They aren't really changing anything though because they had no idea what they wanted to do after ME3. It'd be one thing if they had a set plan to explore X event in the ME timeline before the Reaper war and then changed it to appease fans, but they didn't have a clue what they wanted to do. Accordingly, it seems they are exploring what fans want (probably a sequel) and seeing if they can grab any good ideas to run with from that. I'd consider this good business practice.

[TurianRebel212]

Based on how poorly ME3 is written, I would argue that they had no idea what they wanted to do after ME2. They blew their colllective wad and skill with that amazing mission of the suicide mission and the overall quality of ME2. Looking back on it, we all should have expected for ME3 to be a let down and anticlimactic. But the MP was good, so there's that.

[CronoDragoon]

TurianRebel212 wrote...

Based on how poorly ME3 is written, I would argue that they had no idea what they wanted to do after ME2. They blew their colllective wad and skill with that amazing mission of the suicide mission and the overall quality of ME2. Looking back on it, we all should have expected for ME3 to be a let down and anticlimactic. But the MP was good, so there's that.

Wait, you're using ME2 as an example of them knowing where they wanted the series to go?

[AlanC9]

Yeah, that struck me as a bit odd too.

[ElitePinecone]

I suppose I'm just wary of the message that sends about the ultimate value of each game, if that makes sense.

Like, Shepard and the Reapers are "zomg the most important things ever, hype hype hype change the universe permanently", right up until fans go batpoo crazy and they decide to basically ignore ME3 entirely? If the next game *is* a sequel and they introduce some new threat or McGuffin to chase as the most important thing ever, doesn't that downplay the significance of what ME3 was meant to be for this universe? Particularly if they subverted or ignored or merged the endings - I don't like them, but if Bioware weren't willing to change them a year ago, they shouldn't get that luxury by stealth now.

Having spent so much time emphasising that the Crucible choices drastically altered the galaxy (which was actually reinforced by the Extended Cut, rather than being undermined), and with all the pre-release statements about not having to worry about the universe post-ME3 so they could go crazy with the choices, I just feel that reversing course like that would compromise whatever narrative intentions they had for the end of the trilogy, in the first place.

It's probably good business practice to listen to pissed-off fans. I just wish they'd had a properly thought-out plan in the first place, and a whole lot of anger, disappointment and flailing could've been avoided.

[Iakus]

[quote]ElitePinecone wrote...

I suppose I'm just wary of the message that sends about the ultimate value of each game, if that makes sense.

Like, Shepard and the Reapers are "zomg the most important things ever, hype hype hype change the universe permanently", right up until fans go batpoo crazy and they decide to basically ignore ME3 entirely? If the next game *is* a sequel and they introduce some new threat or McGuffin to chase as the most important thing ever, doesn't that downplay the significance of what ME3 was meant to be for this universe? Particularly if they subverted or ignored or merged the endings - I don't like them, but if Bioware weren't willing to change them a year ago, they shouldn't get that luxury by stealth now. [/quote]

 [/quote]

At this point it's either downplay the endings or watch the IP die.  It's pretty clear at this point that prequels and sidequels won't be received very well.  And any sequel by definition will downplay the endings.  Just as ME3 downplayed ME2 and ME2 downplayed ME1. 

It won't matter what the new threat is.  No matter what choices were made before, all the protagonists have to start in the same place in the next game.  Destroy, Synthesis, Control, genophage, Rannoch, etc, none of that can have a major impact.

This is why I think teh next game should simply go AU.  Don't worry about Shepard's story, keep it a clsoed circle.  Don't let anyhting that happened impact the next game.  Keep the setting, throw out Shepard's story, and fill the setting with a new story.

[CronoDragoon]

I'd prefer a new space IP to AU, personally. But I am always someone who wants one consistent timeline for a setting. It's one of the reasons I can't take many comics seriously.

Modifié par CronoDragoon, 06 février 2014 - 05:45 .

[dreamgazer]

CronoDragoon wrote...

TurianRebel212 wrote...

Based on how poorly ME3 is written, I would argue that they had no idea what they wanted to do after ME2. They blew their colllective wad and skill with that amazing mission of the suicide mission and the overall quality of ME2. Looking back on it, we all should have expected for ME3 to be a let down and anticlimactic. But the MP was good, so there's that.

Wait, you're using ME2 as an example of them knowing where they wanted the series to go?

(laughs)

Obviously!

[ElitePinecone]

CronoDragoon wrote...

But I am always someone who wants one consistent timeline for a setting. It's one of the reasons I can't take many comics seriously.

Yep. Time travel and alternate universes/dimensions/continuities are the number one way to get me to walk away from any IP. If a setting can't be restrained enough and take itself seriously enough to keep to one universe, I don't have the patience for it, frankly. 

[AlanC9]

ElitePinecone wrote...
Like, Shepard and the Reapers are "zomg the most important things ever, hype hype hype change the universe permanently", right up until fans go batpoo crazy and they decide to basically ignore ME3 entirely? If the next game *is* a sequel and they introduce some new threat or McGuffin to chase as the most important thing ever, doesn't that downplay the significance of what ME3 was meant to be for this universe? Particularly if they subverted or ignored or merged the endings - I don't like them, but if Bioware weren't willing to change them a year ago, they shouldn't get that luxury by stealth now. 

I'd argue that attempting the bolded would be a problem for the series regardles of how they had wrapped up the trilogy. Bouncing around from extinction-level threat to extinction-level threat.... this is the other problem with comic books, after incoherent timelines.

Modifié par AlanC9, 06 février 2014 - 06:05 .

[ElitePinecone]

Yeah. After what was apparently said at the PAX fan session - all that stuff about elder races and guardians - I wasn't all that enthusiastic, if that's the path they're actually going down. I would've loved to see a more personal story based around one crew and their adventures as smugglers or something, but I suspect the "ancient alien baddies" thing is a convenient way to make the game all shooty.

Mass Effect already has heaps of narrative potential in the universe that they've shaped to this point (even, I think, in the pre-ME3 era), it doesn't need a whole new conspiracy, new races and a new whole slab of lore.

(Tangentially, Halo completely jumped the shark and lost me when they conjured a new existential threat by making the lore so complicated that you need to read about eight books to keep up.)

[Iakus]

ElitePinecone wrote...
Yep. Time travel and alternate universes/dimensions/continuities are the number one way to get me to walk away from any IP. If a setting can't be restrained enough and take itself seriously enough to keep to one universe, I don't have the patience for it, frankly. 

Well, Baldur's Gate and Neverwinter Nights take palce in the same setting (Faerun in the Forgotten Realms) but have absolutely nothing to do with each other.  And might as well be different universes.  SO it's not like there's no precedent.

[Han Shot First]

The Final Hours app was filmed before Mass Effect 3 released. Hudson was just giving his thoughts at the time on where he'd like to go with the series if they made any additional games. He wasn't describing anything that was actually in the works. Needless to say, a lot could have changed since then particularly with the ending controversy. The reaction from the fanbase since then about a rumored prequel or sidequel has also been overwhelmingly negative. The fans on the whole want a sequel.