99 réponses à ce sujet

[ImaginaryMatter]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

The kid in the shaft and the ghost kid don't look different. They're the exact same model. The ghost kid just has a different effect applied to it. Bioware also used a doubling effect, but if you look closely, they have the same facial features, the same hoodie, and the same pants and hair. The lighting tricks also make them appear to be different.

I always found it humorous that the Reaper god wears a hoodie.

[Sion1138]

Yeah, it is obvious, but also apparently pointless.

[dreamgazer]

StreetMagic wrote...

pattywagon wrote...

Well the kid was tied to the indoctrination theory. In the codex you hallucinate people and voices, and have weird dreams which is tied to the kid. So the question is the ending, was Shepard imagining all of that after the explosion that had him black out for a few seconds? Or did everything happen, but destroy was the true ending as Shepard lives and the other options were tied to indoctrinated protagonists, Saren and the Illusive Man.

Sometimes I wonder if that initial blast at Earth in front of the commitee (before Anderson wakes him up) is the only blast that happened, and everything since has been in his head. Then at the end, he's imagining the same blast in a much more elaborate scenario against Harbinger in the beam run.

Sometimes I wonder if everything that happens after the Prothean beacon interaction in ME1 was nothing but visions in Shepard's head.

[Han Shot First]

dreamgazer wrote...

StreetMagic wrote...

pattywagon wrote...

Well the kid was tied to the indoctrination theory. In the codex you hallucinate people and voices, and have weird dreams which is tied to the kid. So the question is the ending, was Shepard imagining all of that after the explosion that had him black out for a few seconds? Or did everything happen, but destroy was the true ending as Shepard lives and the other options were tied to indoctrinated protagonists, Saren and the Illusive Man.

Sometimes I wonder if that initial blast at Earth in front of the commitee (before Anderson wakes him up) is the only blast that happened, and everything since has been in his head. Then at the end, he's imagining the same blast in a much more elaborate scenario against Harbinger in the beam run.

Sometimes I wonder if everything that happens after the Prothean beacon interaction in ME1 was nothing but visions in Shepard's head.

Sometimes I wonder if the entire story was Gillian Grayson playing with a snow globe containing a model of the Normandy, with the entire story being the fertile imagination of her autistic mind.

[Cainhurst Crow]

Go home cricket you're jesse ventura.

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

Han Shot First wrote...

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

The kid in the shaft and the ghost kid don't look different. They're the exact same model. The ghost kid just has a different effect applied to it. Bioware also used a doubling effect, but if you look closely, they have the same facial features, the same hoodie, and the same pants and hair. The lighting tricks also make them appear to be different.

They do look different. One looks like a real person. The other looks like V.I. hologram. They might have the same facial features or height and so forth, but they aren't identical.

NOTE: I called the one on the Citadel "the ghost of the kid." Your arguement is very weak.

Children don't speak like the one in the vent did, especially if they're scared. There was no logical way the kid, if real, should have survived the blast from that reaper on the building by hiding in the vent. The kid also must have had building climbing abilities like Spiderman. How did he get from that rooftop to that other building? And scaling the exterior? He did better than any husk. Children just don't scale building exteriors like that, especially that far up. I've seen them be creative at getting into places, but this was ridiculous. 

Shepard is either indoctrinated which can't be because they threw this out. So this means symbolism, and if you subscribe to symbolism you have to subscribe to bad writing theory because it's horrid. This leaves only one path: Shepard is crazy and is hallucinating. 

Kaidan: "Doctor, I think she's waking up."
Chakwas: "How do you feel, Commander?"
Shepard: "Like the morning after shore leave. How long was I out?"
Chakwas: "72 hours. You really shouldn't challenge a Krogan to a drinking contest. Ryncol can do nasty things to your insides and give you terrible hallucinations."
Shepard: "Kaidan? You're alive? But how? Anderson's dead. What about the Reapers? Where is Liara? I need to see Liara!"
Chakwas: "I'd better sedate her. Shepard, what's this about Reapers and who is this Liara?"
Shepard: "What year is this? This doesn't look like the Normandy."
Kaidan: "2183. And the Normandy? What's the Normandy? You're aboard the SSV Tokyo. Captain Anderson is on the bridge."

[Br3admax]

NeonFlux once again insulting people who don't agree with him and his IT induced superiority complex. That's new.

As to the OP, sure. Whynah? I for one think that it's weird for the soldiers to specifically close the door after the kid took almost ten whole seconds to get onto it, but hey, that's just me.

[CronoDragoon]

Han Shot First wrote...

The kid in the beginning was real.

Evidence for this is that the kid appears to be a real flesh and blood person, while the Catalyst does not. In contrast the Catalyst only looks like a V.I. hologram imitating a real flesh and blood person. If the child was some sort of Reaper mind trick all along, than why do the child from the beginning and the dream sequences and the Catalyst look different?

The Catalyst was simply playing a mind game by taking a form that was psychologically significant to Shepard. The child was real, the Catalyst's form was not.

This thread is actually positing a third explanation: that Shepard was already hallucinating due to breaking down mentally from stress. It's therefore possible for the kid to neither be real nor evidence of Catalyst indoctrination.

[Cainhurst Crow]

Nobody seems to blink when I punch a reporter in the face, I guess she must not be real.

[TurianRebel212]

NeonFlux117 wrote...

Nah, the kid is a Reaper induced hallucination. Hence the growls, the reaper horns, oily shadows, whispers in the Dark and finally the ending.

But most on BSN are ignorant to that fact. So.... Yeah. It's whatever you want it to be. It's "high level stuff" and has 'art' and 'integrity'. Great stuff.

Who say's it's a "Reaper" induced one tho..... :wizard:

[Han Shot First]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

Han Shot First wrote...

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

The kid in the shaft and the ghost kid don't look different. They're the exact same model. The ghost kid just has a different effect applied to it. Bioware also used a doubling effect, but if you look closely, they have the same facial features, the same hoodie, and the same pants and hair. The lighting tricks also make them appear to be different.

They do look different. One looks like a real person. The other looks like V.I. hologram. They might have the same facial features or height and so forth, but they aren't identical.

NOTE: I called the one on the Citadel "the ghost of the kid." Your arguement is very weak.

On the contrary, its the argument Indoctrination Theorists that is weak. If all manifestations of the kid are Harbinger or the Catalyst or some form of Reaper indoctrination, why do the child from the beginning and the manifestation of the Catalyst look different? If it is indoctrination all along, shouldn't they be identical?

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...
Children don't speak like the one in the vent did, especially if they're scared. There was no logical way the kid, if real, should have survived the blast from that reaper on the building by hiding in the vent. The kid also must have had building climbing abilities like Spiderman. How did he get from that rooftop to that other building? And scaling the exterior? He did better than any husk. Children just don't scale building exteriors like that, especially that far up. I've seen them be creative at getting into places, but this was ridiculous. 

How did Shepard survive the blast in High EMS Destroy? How was Shepard able to be resurrected after being spaced, suffocating, burning up in a planetary atmosphere and colliding with the surface of that planet at meteoric speed? How was Kasumi able to execute those Jedi/Ninja acrobatics on top of that moving gunship, moves that no real life human would be able to pull off? How are Samara or Miranda or ME3 Liara able to endure being exposed to hostile enviroments without helmets or proper armor? Do all of those prove IT as well?

Some elements of the child's appearance in ME3 straining suspension of disbelief does not necessarily prove it is all a figment of Shepard's imagination. It isn't the first element of the series to be a bit far-fetched.

CronoDragoon wrote...

This thread is actually positing a third explanation: that Shepard was already hallucinating due to breaking down mentally from stress. It's therefore possible for the kid to neither be real nor evidence of Catalyst indoctrination.

I'm skeptical.

I think these threads are just evidence of fans sometimes ascribing deeper meanings to scenes were none exists.

Modifié par Han Shot First, 07 février 2014 - 09:34 .

[NeonFlux117]

TurianRebel212 wrote...

NeonFlux117 wrote...

Nah, the kid is a Reaper induced hallucination. Hence the growls, the reaper horns, oily shadows, whispers in the Dark and finally the ending.

But most on BSN are ignorant to that fact. So.... Yeah. It's whatever you want it to be. It's "high level stuff" and has 'art' and 'integrity'. Great stuff.

Who say's it's a "Reaper" induced one tho..... :wizard:

They're one in the same bro. They or "it" or whatever, tell you this. "Created in our image".

[CronoDragoon]

Han Shot First wrote...
I think these threads are just evidence of fans sometimes ascribing deeper meanings to scenes were none exists.

Well hell, it's a forum for a 2-year old game.

[TurianRebel212]

NeonFlux117 wrote...

TurianRebel212 wrote...

NeonFlux117 wrote...

Nah, the kid is a Reaper induced hallucination. Hence the growls, the reaper horns, oily shadows, whispers in the Dark and finally the ending.

But most on BSN are ignorant to that fact. So.... Yeah. It's whatever you want it to be. It's "high level stuff" and has 'art' and 'integrity'. Great stuff.

Who say's it's a "Reaper" induced one tho..... :wizard:

They're one in the same bro. They or "it" or whatever, tell you this. "Created in our image".

Yeah, it's probably just squid face and pals messing with you even more. Basically the biggest troll of all time in MEU. 

[Cainhurst Crow]

Remember the time we chased spectre vasir into a resturant and nobody reacted to her walking in except the woman she grabbed? And more suspicious that woman seems to disappears during the fight and even during the aftermath and suddenly reappears again?

She and vasir, reaper hallucinations the whole time. The shadow broker reaper alliance conspiracy is still afoot.

[NeonFlux117]

TurianRebel212 wrote...

NeonFlux117 wrote...

TurianRebel212 wrote...

NeonFlux117 wrote...

Nah, the kid is a Reaper induced hallucination. Hence the growls, the reaper horns, oily shadows, whispers in the Dark and finally the ending.

But most on BSN are ignorant to that fact. So.... Yeah. It's whatever you want it to be. It's "high level stuff" and has 'art' and 'integrity'. Great stuff.

Who say's it's a "Reaper" induced one tho..... :wizard:

They're one in the same bro. They or "it" or whatever, tell you this. "Created in our image".

Yeah, it's probably just squid face and pals messing with you even more. Basically the biggest troll of all time in MEU. 

ME3 in and of itself is the great troll bro. Not only trolling Shepard. But as result trolling the player and thus the community. It's actually pretty clever. I'm sure that's what Overlord Hudson meant by "high level stuff". Again, most don't "get it" but that's what 'it' is.

[Han Shot First]

CronoDragoon wrote...

Han Shot First wrote...
I think these threads are just evidence of fans sometimes ascribing deeper meanings to scenes were none exists.

Well hell, it's a forum for a 2-year old game.

None of this is new though. Its all a rehash of stuff that came up in March of 2012.

The only difference now is that with ME3 completely finished and there being no additional DLC, all of these pet theories are debunked. Had there been some deeper meaning attached to some of these scenes, whether that be Shepard indoctrinated or parts of ME3 being the hallucination of a mind that had gone quite mad, it would have been confirmed at some point in the actual games or the downloadable content.

Not that there is anything wrong with that being a player's personal head canon mind you, but once they transition from head canon to trying to claim it was writers' intent (when it clearly wasn't), they've gone a bit far out into left field.

Modifié par Han Shot First, 07 février 2014 - 09:43 .

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

Han Shot First wrote...

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

Han Shot First wrote...

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

The kid in the shaft and the ghost kid don't look different. They're the exact same model. The ghost kid just has a different effect applied to it. Bioware also used a doubling effect, but if you look closely, they have the same facial features, the same hoodie, and the same pants and hair. The lighting tricks also make them appear to be different.

They do look different. One looks like a real person. The other looks like V.I. hologram. They might have the same facial features or height and so forth, but they aren't identical.

NOTE: I called the one on the Citadel "the ghost of the kid." Your arguement is very weak.

On the contrary, its the argument Indoctrination Theorists that is weak. If all manifestations of the kid are Harbinger or the Catalyst or some form of Reaper indoctrination, why do the child from the beginning and the manifestation of the Catalyst look different? If it is indoctrination all along, shouldn't they be identical?

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...
Children don't speak like the one in the vent did, especially if they're scared. There was no logical way the kid, if real, should have survived the blast from that reaper on the building by hiding in the vent. The kid also must have had building climbing abilities like Spiderman. How did he get from that rooftop to that other building? And scaling the exterior? He did better than any husk. Children just don't scale building exteriors like that, especially that far up. I've seen them be creative at getting into places, but this was ridiculous. 

How did Shepard survive the blast in High EMS Destroy? How was Shepard able to be resurrected after being spaced, suffocating, burning up in a planetary atmosphere and colliding with the surface of that planet at meteoric speed? How was Kasumi able to execute those Jedi/Ninja acrobatics on top of that moving gunship, moves that no real life human would be able to pull off? How are Samara or Miranda or ME3 Liara able to endure being exposed to hostile enviroments without helmets or proper armor? Do all of those prove IT as well?

Some elements of the child's appearance in ME3 straining suspension of disbelief does not necessarily prove it is all a figment of Shepard's imagination. It isn't the first element of the series to be a bit far-fetched.

I'm not arguing Indoctrination Theory. Please understand this. There is too much straining of disbelief throughout the story. Since we've discarded Indoctrination Theory, and I'm guessing you're arguing against Crazy Shepard Theory, but you still seem to sort of cling to Bad Writing Theory, I notice. However, I think my last post covers it. Ryncol Theory.

Shepard was on shore leave, went out drinking with some friends, and challenged a Krogan to a drinking contest. The Krogan picked ryncol. Shepard matched him shot for shot and woke up in sick bay 72 hours later aboard the SSV Tokyo commanded by Captain Anderson. The SSV Normandy was never built. They had never been to Eden Prime. All of this happened during a ryncol induced hallucination while Shepard was unconscious for 72 hours. Shepard woke up after picking one of the three endings from Hell. Shepard has a hell of a hangover. Do not challenge Krogans to drinking contests.

[TurianRebel212]

NeonFlux117 wrote...

TurianRebel212 wrote...

NeonFlux117 wrote...

TurianRebel212 wrote...

NeonFlux117 wrote...

Nah, the kid is a Reaper induced hallucination. Hence the growls, the reaper horns, oily shadows, whispers in the Dark and finally the ending.

But most on BSN are ignorant to that fact. So.... Yeah. It's whatever you want it to be. It's "high level stuff" and has 'art' and 'integrity'. Great stuff.

Who say's it's a "Reaper" induced one tho..... :wizard:

They're one in the same bro. They or "it" or whatever, tell you this. "Created in our image".

Yeah, it's probably just squid face and pals messing with you even more. Basically the biggest troll of all time in MEU. 

ME3 in and of itself is the great troll bro. Not only trolling Shepard. But as result trolling the player and thus the community. It's actually pretty clever. I'm sure that's what Overlord Hudson meant by "high level stuff". Again, most don't "get it" but that's what 'it' is.

lulz, so you actually think BioWare is gonna bring Shepard back in the next game???

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

TurianRebel212 wrote...


lulz, so you actually think BioWare is gonna bring Shepard back in the next game???

Do you know that with Ryncol Theory they could do just that! 

It even fits Casey's criteria of being before the endings. Technically the old Shepard's story is over. But a new Shepard story could begin, and they could completely do away with this idea of the Reapers. And they don't have to canonize any of the endings. Everyone wins!!!

Modifié par sH0tgUn jUliA, 07 février 2014 - 09:49 .

[Han Shot First]

Bad Writing Theory pretty much sums up my position perfectly.

Modifié par Han Shot First, 07 février 2014 - 09:48 .

[NeonFlux117]

Not the next game. The one after. EAware knows it has a good thing going with Shepard and a potential cash cow to milk. EA policy and practice requires there to be AT LEAST one more game with Shepard. You should know this better than most... As you have played a Battlefield game once or twice. They just slap some "player appreciation" stuff and "premium ultra spectre" service on it and the little EA drones (I mean "customers") will eat it up.

It will happen. It will be...... Glorious.


side note- And remember TR. For the Team.... The "TEAM" needs us to be great.

For the Empire.