Government without representation of the governed is not legitimate. If the Chantry purports to govern mages, then mages must be allowed into the Chantry government without discrimination.
Well, maybe some discrimination, like if the mage in question has a criminal history or not. If this was made a rule, I would also wish for templars and seekers also be held to the same standard.
Well, maybe some discrimination, like if the mage in question has a criminal history or not. If this was made a rule, I would also wish for templars and seekers also be held to the same standard.
What I mean is that magehood wouldn't be a hindrance to selection in and of itself. As for criminal histories, that'll affect applications in the same way it does nonmages.
Government without representation of the governed is not legitimate. If the Chantry purports to govern mages, then mages must be allowed into the Chantry government without discrimination.
This isn't really the way Thedas works. Argue that it should work this way if you want, but the fact is that almost none of Thedas's governments seem to work this way unless you're a noble.
What I mean is that magehood wouldn't be a hindrance to selection in and of itself. As for criminal histories, that'll affect applications in the same way it does nonmages.
Alistair implies that that's pretty well meaningless to the Chantry, unless your crime involved magic.
This isn't really the way Thedas works. Argue that it should work this way if you want, but the fact is that almost none of Thedas's governments seem to work this way unless you're a noble.
Even nobles aren't guaranteed that (Awakening).
This isn't really the way Thedas works. Argue that it should work this way if you want, but the fact is that almost none of Thedas's governments seem to work this way unless you're a noble.
Then I'll rephrase my argument if I have to make it in-game if Thedas is too primitive to understand the concept.
Alistair implies that that's pretty well meaningless to the Chantry, unless your crime involved magic.
Then the "magic" part will no longer apply either.
Even nobles aren't guaranteed that (Awakening).
Though Ser Temmerly does seem to think they are. (Taking the smugness out of his tone was incredibly satisfying, btw.)
Though Ser Temmerly does seem to think they are. (Taking the smugness out of his tone was incredibly satisfying, btw.)
Heh. Fun times all around. Alas poor Mhairi.
Though Ser Temmerly does seem to think they are. (Taking the smugness out of his tone was incredibly satisfying, btw.)
Yup. 
I love it when he goes "You can't do that! I'm a noble." My response. "I'm a dwarf prince, favorite son of the king, and I was exiled for fratricide, regardless if I did it or not. Watch me."
Probably the most satisfying noble shut-up in DA for me is... well, I can't even remember his name. If you join the mercenaries in the prologue, in Act 1 your old boss gives you a job to kill a nobleman who ambushes previous mercenaries. He comes out, strutting in his superiority, and you can talk to him... or just pick the murder knife, at which point he quickly realizes that he's about to die, and says something about being avenged by his sons before taking it to the gut.
Not the most insufferable ****** of them all, but it's such a final turn around from 'I was more intelligent and ambushed your fellow' to 'meet the murder knife' that it stands out.
Plus, it's kind of fun to roleplay the attempted revenge assassination attempt later on.
"Hawke, you killed my father!"
"Did I? I kill lots of fathers. Can you give me a hint?"
"He was an important nobleman!"
"Varric, have I killed any important noblemen?"
While I've never played DA2 myself, the wiki says the noble Meeran sends you after in Act I is Lord Harriman.
Alistair implies that that's pretty well meaningless to the Chantry, unless your crime involved magic.
Leliana's kinda proof.
While I've never played DA2 myself, the wiki says the noble Meeran sends you after in Act I is Lord Harriman.
This is true. Also, Lord Herriman's wife makes a deal with a Desire Demon they came across underground while expanding the foundation of their manor, and you fight her and the demon in Act 2.
While I've never played DA2 myself, the wiki says the noble Meeran sends you after in Act I is Lord Harriman.
You haven't?
She also expressed that she set a boy's hair on fire.
._. Cause and effect at work here.
Wynne said mages are killed for things they didn't even do. It's the cause and effect of the dominant religion preaching that mages are cursed with magic, and vilifying them to the point where lynch mobs murder men and women with magical ability.
Wha it is not folks would burn mages without chantry hm?
Simple considering damage and destruction that mages love to cause it is understandable reaction especially among uneducated people.
When chantry have rather negative views on magic chantry doctrine don't here problem are mages not chantry teachings...
Almost forgot. This needs to be stated twice. It's too amusing a correlation to forgo it.
"The mages exist because we allow it, and they will end because we demand it."
Can't wait to wipe out the reap--Templars.
Wha it is not folks would burn mages without chantry hm?
Simple considering damage and destruction that mages love to cause it is understandable reaction especially among uneducated people.
When chantry have rather negative views on magic chantry doctrine don't here problem are mages not chantry teachings...
Outside of the Chantry and the Qunari, there are not any societies that we know of that vilify mages and magic. Heck, before the Chantry showed up the Rivaini enjoyed a perfectly peaceful relationship with their mages and the Seers. Heck, the non-mages supported them so much that the Chantry was forced to make a lot more concessions regarding the treatment of mages than any other Circle is allowed because the mundanes of Rivain don't appear to fear magic the way the Chantry and other Orlesian nations.
And by Orlesian nations, I mean nations that Orlais had at one point occupied, even if they were later driven out.
Outside of the Chantry and the Qunari, there are not any societies that we know of that vilify mages and magic. Heck, before the Chantry showed up the Rivaini enjoyed a perfectly peaceful relationship with their mages and the Seers. Heck, the non-mages supported them so much that the Chantry was forced to make a lot more concessions regarding the treatment of mages than any other Circle is allowed because the mundanes of Rivain don't appear to fear magic the way the Chantry and other Orlesian nations.
And by Orlesian nations, I mean nations that Orlais had at one point occupied, even if they were later driven out.
It doesn't say much as chantry is most of thedas and tevinter is only country that supports mages and is pro-mage...
mostly primitive cultures have good relationship with mages and dalish elves prove that even despite low number of mages dalish mages are still very destructive and toxic for the world same i can see in rivain. mages were hardly working for their reputation and it aren't just racial/culture prejudices at least in most cases.
It doesn't say much as chantry is most of thedas and tevinter is only country that supports mages and is pro-mage...
mostly primitive cultures have good relationship with mages and dalish elves prove that even despite low number of mages dalish mages are still very destructive and toxic for the world same i can see in rivain. mages were hardly working for their reputation and it aren't just racial/culture prejudices at least in most cases.
The Dales was a nation with free mages that didn't vilify magic, since the elves saw magic as a gift of the Creators. Their current nomadic lifestyle is a matter of survival against the templars and the Chantry, who criminalized their religion and culture.
A nation of free mages that didn't emulate Tevinter. An existing contradiction to the doctrine espoused by the Chantry.
Yeah i can only see how many disasters they had when they were country unless they had something like circles... even small in numbers dalish mages are endless mine of disasters but every mage is one well almost every... and to be honest i doubt that their country smelled like roses i bet they had something behind their ears it is dragon age after all.
Besides they attacked orlais so what you expected that chantry will huge them? i have no doubt that chantry was power hungry but i doubt that elves were so clean as they claim.
The Dales was a nation with free mages that didn't vilify magic, since the elves saw magic as a gift of the Creators. Their current nomadic lifestyle is a matter of survival against the templars and the Chantry, who criminalized their religion and culture.
A nation of free mages that didn't emulate Tevinter. An existing contradiction to the doctrine espoused by the Chantry.
Yeah i can only see how many disasters they had when they were country unless they had something like circles... even small in numbers dalish mages are endless mine of disasters but every mage is one well almost every... and to be honest i doubt that their country smelled like roses i bet they had something behind their ears it is dragon age after all.
Besides they attacked orlais so what you expected that chantry will huge them? i have no doubt that chantry was power hungry but i doubt that elves were so clean as they claim.
Mages were among some of the nobility who governed the Dales, so it's unlikely there were Circles. Some Keepers are even descended from the nobility of the Dales. Magic is a gift of the Creators to the Elvhen, after all; not a curse.
As for the war, it depends on what happened. The Dalish and the elven Warden claim the inception of the war was the refusal of the elves to convert to the human religion, followed by an invasion of their sovereign territory; the humans say the elves started it by attacking Red Crossing. We don't know the truth at this point, and it's likely we never will.
So we have disasters route... magic isn't gift but if dalish don't want admit it well their call but as proven mages are problem even among dalish clans...
I doubt that chantry was nice and fine in that war but same for elves truth is that there is no "innocent" side never just current side claims that they were.
Leliana's kinda proof.
Though it doesn't occur to her that a blood mage might be treated worse than she is.
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