84 réponses à ce sujet

[GenericEnemy]

Was playing Awakening recently, and it reminded me of something annoying: on every playthrough, there will be one companion who's development is cut short because one is always recruited right before the finale. ME2 did it too with Legion, ME3 with Tali, and some could say Loghain too, though in his case id let it slide.

so...just felt like saying, here's hoping most/all of the companions will be recruited early enough that each will have a fair shake. DAO and DA2 were good about it, hopefully that continues. Not like Awakening.

[Sentinel358]

Good point, i was lucky i never used Velanna so it didnt affect me

Modifié par Sentinel358, 08 février 2014 - 08:27 .

[Gamercat]

Agreed. On all points.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

They are also guilty of killing of a companion at the beginning of each game. 

Modifié par LDS Darth Revan, 08 février 2014 - 09:23 .

[kuro_sasori]

I haven't thought about this too much, but I agree. The devs were given that extra year which will probably mean they will have more than enough time to develop the companions properly and evenly I would like to think. I do not know if the PAX video is indicative of anything but it probably means the three we see there are the first three we will meet in game; guess it depends on how late that Crestwood scene is into the game.

[The Baconer]

I don't really mind getting Loghain so late in the game, I just hate the fact that his stats are ass.

[BouncyFrag]

Legion is annoying since once he's on board the silent countdown to the Collector attack kicks in along with the weak plot element of the entire companion crew leaving the Normandy in a single shuttle because 'reasons'. In later playthroughs I took Legion along onTalis loyalty mission for the lulz and drama which Bioware delivered in fine fashion, but to do this you have to give up rescuing most of the crew due to the silent countdown.

Modifié par BouncyFrag, 08 février 2014 - 09:55 .

[Nightdragon8]

kuroi_sasori wrote...

I haven't thought about this too much, but I agree. The devs were given that extra year which will probably mean they will have more than enough time to develop the companions properly and evenly I would like to think. I do not know if the PAX video is indicative of anything but it probably means the three we see there are the first three we will meet in game; guess it depends on how late that Crestwood scene is into the game.

I love how people think "they where given a year so they should have alot of time to do XXXX" thats not how it works

Honestly Gaider can't work on some parts because the speicalizations aren't decided on, because the combat people haven't deicided the balance of them. so the whole "they have a year" doesn't really mean much.

[kuro_sasori]

Nightdragon8 wrote...

I love how people think "they where given a year so they should have alot of time to do XXXX" thats not how it works

Honestly Gaider can't work on some parts because the speicalizations aren't decided on, because the combat people haven't deicided the balance of them. so the whole "they have a year" doesn't really mean much.

 I thought by saying "I would like to think," it would be somehow clear that I was speculating, I am sorry if I was not clear enough . I do not know much about game developing, I apologize for theorizing without a solid base and I thank you for clarifying that for me. I thought they would somehow use much of this time to polish things that were already finished, obviously I do not know how much detail goes into this. Thanks again for the explanation.

[Knight of Dane]

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

They are also guilty of killing of a companion at the beginning of each game. 

In memory of Wilson.



We will never forget him.

[kuro_sasori]

Knight of Dane wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

They are also guilty of killing of a companion at the beginning of each game. 

In memory of Wilson.



We will never forget him.

I would not miss that guy but poor Jenkins...

[Jonathan Seagull]

I actually like characters joining throughout the story, rather than having them all dumped in at once. It actually makes me a little sad when I know that I've reached the point where no one else is coming aboard. And if a character is designed to join late, like Loghain, it's not like I'm being deprived of content. I might wish I had more time to get to know them, but that's different.

I do think a situation like Legion is problematic because of the timer issues. But in general, I kind of like the way Mass Effect handles it a lot of the time, which is that characters can potentially join you at different times, depending on what order you do things in. Like getting Liara early on or waiting until near the end. So that way, if you want that character to play more of a role, you can recruit them early. If you want them to join later or play a smaller part, you can recruit them later.

But I don't inherently mind some companions coming in a bit later than others. I think it's even better that way sometimes in terms of pacing. I have at least one DA2 run where I waited until Act III to recruit Sebastian. My first ME3 run I waited until somewhere around Thessia to get Javik. It's nice to have the option, especially if people do want to get the characters earlier. But I'll admit that I would not like it if all the characters always joined early in the game.

Modifié par Jonathan Seagull, 08 février 2014 - 11:16 .

[ziloe]

GenericEnemy wrote...

Was playing Awakening recently, and it reminded me of something annoying: on every playthrough, there will be one companion who's development is cut short because one is always recruited right before the finale. ME2 did it too with Legion, ME3 with Tali, and some could say Loghain too, though in his case id let it slide.

so...just felt like saying, here's hoping most/all of the companions will be recruited early enough that each will have a fair shake. DAO and DA2 were good about it, hopefully that continues. Not like Awakening.

In fairness, you could get Tali early and do her mission later. But mostly I agree, especially with how much I loved Legion. I took him through all of the DLC though, and therefore felt like I had enough time with him too.

[themikefest]

BouncyFrag wrote...

Legion is annoying since once he's on board the silent countdown to the Collector attack kicks in along with the weak plot element of the entire companion crew leaving the Normandy in a single shuttle because 'reasons'. In later playthroughs I took Legion along onTalis loyalty mission for the lulz and drama which Bioware delivered in fine fashion, but to do this you have to give up rescuing most of the crew due to the silent countdown.

You can always do Tali's loyalty mission after the suicide mission depending on if she lives or not.

[Aaleel]

In Legion's case it made sense seeing that there wasn't much to ME2's story outside gathering squad mates, if you got all of them early the game would have went straight downhill on rails afterwards.  So they had to give you a few, throw in a collector mission, give you a few, throw in another collector mission, etc to help with the pacing.

But I did like getting all my squad mates early in ME1 seeing you had everyone but Liara before you left the Citadel, and the game almost pushed you to get Liara next by being the only real lead at the time being Beneizia's daughter.  You had your ship and your crew and star map and the game said have at it

Loghain was pretty much dictated by the story, but I've never spared him so I don't know what effect this had on his story or use.

Tali I really didn't understand, especially as one of the original returning characters, but I guess the whole Turians won't help unless you get Krogans first, and then Wrex having is demands kind of dictated how that ME3 story flowed as well.

[N0rke]

I much prefer the ME1 style of getting companions. It's a little dorky in the grand scheme of things and has to be handled carefully, but it allows you to try all the companions early on in the tutorial stages and gives you a feel for who you want your main companions to be. I'd much prefer that than doing what I did in ME3. I basically carried around a filler companion I didn't care about until I got Tali.

[Wulfram]

Having a character who has been a major presence in the game earlier, like Loghain, join the party late in the game can work. But if the guy just shows up as a party member then it's not good if they turn up too late.

[PSUHammer]

N0rke wrote...

I much prefer the ME1 style of getting companions. It's a little dorky in the grand scheme of things and has to be handled carefully, but it allows you to try all the companions early on in the tutorial stages and gives you a feel for who you want your main companions to be. I'd much prefer that than doing what I did in ME3. I basically carried around a filler companion I didn't care about until I got Tali.

ME1 companion pacing wasn't that great.  Garrus's loyalty quest was over so fast that he said the same thing for 80% of the rest of the game.  He was essentially a silent character from that point forward.

I am not sure why this topic is such a big deal.  As in life, people come and go.

As for Loghain's stats sucking when you get him.  I haven't played through the game after the first time without using respec potions.  I just build them the way I like.
 

[CybAnt1]

For what ever reason, DA2 forces you not to pick up Sebastian Vael until Act 2. Even though you paid for the bloody m-fer. All he does is ask you to do some stuff in Act 1, but he won't join your party until Act 2. (Of course, he won't if you don't do his stuff in Act 1.)

So I always get him last. In general, the later you get a character, the less control you have over "shaping" him (i.e. leveling), because you get them at a higher level. The good news is Maker's Sigh, and plenty of it on sale at Black Emporium, so you can "start from scratch". As I recall, it had 99 bottles, but you'd have to be pretty odd to feel the need to use that many bottles.

The good news on the customize your party front is it seems the "iconic look" doctrine is out for this game, and you can buy them the same armor pieces your PC wears/uses. (I approve).

Oh, and as for Loghain, I only finally decided to spare him in my 3rd playthrough. It really is a win/win if you let him do the deed with the Archdemon after becoming a Warden, for those who want to avoid both the DR and US, you and Alistair can live, and he gets 'redemption' (and you get 'satisfaction'). :innocent:

Modifié par CybAnt1, 08 février 2014 - 03:01 .

[chris2365]

kuroi_sasori wrote...

Knight of Dane wrote...

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

They are also guilty of killing of a companion at the beginning of each game. 

In memory of Wilson.



We will never forget him.

I would not miss that guy but poor Jenkins...

Trask Ulgo from KOTOR. Why does Bioware have to do this:crying:

[Iron Fist]

Wait, we're talking about dead prologue companions now?

Mhairi was the best. Why'd she have to die? 

Never forget.

Modifié par MevenSelas, 08 février 2014 - 06:03 .

[TK514]

The other problem I have with latecomers is gameplay related. The longer it takes to get a companion, the more likely it is that I've gotten comfortable with my roster. That leaves the latecomer as superfluous to requirements, so to speak. Sebastian is an excellent example, even if he is DLC. By the time I can get him, I've already got my team built.

It doesn't help that he is at best the third, and possibly the fourth, rogue in the party.

[ME_Fan]

Funnily enough, with regards to Legion and the structure of Mass Effect 2 in general, originally it was a lot more open, and Legion's acquisition was not tied to the main narrative until later in development. I'll quote the Mass Effect wiki;

◾Early in Mass Effect 2 development, Legion's acquisition mission was not part of the critical path, and could occur earlier in the game. Only later was it decided to fold the Reaper IFF into Legion's acquisition. This required only slight rewrites to the existing mission aboard the derelict Reaper. Evidence of this earlier design lies in Legion's unique dialogue lines for places like Omega, which can be heard if one uses save file modification and brings Legion along for the mission.

The main issue with Legion in particular is that as another user pointed out, is acquisition is tied to the end-game countdown to the crew being abducted. If it weren't for this, (e.g. you could choose when to activate the IFF) I wouldn't mind him being a late game addition, as the story makes more sense that way.

New characters and companions coming in over the course of the game is more interesting in my opinion, even if it does mean they have less time in your squad/party.

Modifié par ME_Fan, 08 février 2014 - 06:14 .

[Lady Sif]

Tamlen was the best. I still wish they wouldn't have killed him off

[BouncyFrag]

I approve of the lack of See Jory tribute pics. BSN, you've made me proud.