16 réponses à ce sujet

[Zso_Zso]

I finsihed a full insanity playthrough from Me1 -> Me2 -> Me3 with a Vanguard, including all DLCs, so finally I got the Platinum trophies for all.

It was a fun journey. My impressions on the game changes of the 3 chapters:

1. Story quality was best in #1 and got worse with progression.
2. Fight mechanics were the opposite, i.e. they have improved 1 -> 2 -> 3
3. Character development / RPG interactions (dialogs) were best in #2, worst in #3

The ending has been throroughly criticized already, so I do not need to add much to it, just 1 tiny thing that just hit me :

The sudden change during the beam-run after I got hit is just too much to accept at face value:
- after fast-paced charge dynamic battles, the slow-mo crawling is really painful and immersion breaking
- I have been hit hard and down to health-gate many times before and still could just charge to regen my shields and fight on, but now suddenly I lost all my biotic powers... Why ? It feels strange and out of place
- I went into the mission with a single weapon: my Wraith shotgun, but suddenly I only have a pistol, why ?
- even if I accept a hand-wave space magicky explanation that I got hit so hard that I "forgot" my biotics and I lost my shotgun and found that pistol only, I cannot possibly imagine any sane explanation how my red Inferno-armor (which I was wearing most of the game for its +30% cooldown speed and power damage benefits) got suddenly replaced by a blue N7 armore !?!?! Did Harbinger quickly undress me and change my diaper armor  while I was knocked out ?
- the character I had to crawl with looked like my evil-clone from the Citadel DLC, definitely did not feel like that was my Sheppard.
- of course it went further downhil after that with the TIM scene and the even worse holo-child encounter

Modifié par Zso_Zso, 10 février 2014 - 08:22 .

[Ajensis]

Glad you enjoyed your insanity playthroughs :-) did you start ME1 from scratch? I find it really challenging to play the first on Insanity unless it's a New Game+.

I have many issues with ME3's ending, but I wouldn't count most of your points among them, or at least of any significance. The slow-motion part seemed a fitting change of pace to me (as long as we forget the details of a Reaper weapon's potency and the likelihood of surviving even a near-hit). The beam rush was the climax to the London segment, so a drastic change like this doesn't disturb me. And biotics? I can fully accept that Shepard is in no condition to biotic charge anything at this point, let alone unleash a Throw. Gameplay aside, biotic skills are supposed to be really taxing abilities. Your Wraith turning into a Predator, as you said it's somewhat easily explained by losing your own weapon when Harbinger almost hits you and then just picking up the closest thing you could find. It's not unlikely that some of the soldiers who died before you would've dropped this standard-issue weapon.
Okay, the change of armour can't be explained, but it's just one of those situations where you have to roll with it. While it could've been awesome if the game recognised what you've been wearing and showed a scorched version of that, I don't find it unfair that they chose a shortcut here. After all, there are many different combinations of armour using either N7, Hahne-Kedar, Kassa Fabrication, Serrice, etc. etc. No game is perfect, there'll always be something to nit-pick.

Of course, I might be annoyed by some small detail that you don't find bothersome, so maybe it's just a case of different things bugging different people :-)

At any rate, hope the ending didn't tarnish the enjoyment of the trilogy's last chapter for you. And hopefully we'll soon hear news about the next Mass Effect!

[Zso_Zso]

The Insanity run in ME1 was actually a New Game+ run, starting from level 56, the previous run-through (from scratch) to get to that level was on Hardcore difficulty (which was much harder for the first few missions than the Insanity with level 56+). Then I ended ME1-insanity with level 60 which got me a level 5 start in ME2, from which I could easily reach level 30 by the end and then imported that to ME3 to go from 30 -> 60.

You are right, there are much bigger issues with the ending, than my armor nit-pick, I just mentioned these things because I already knew about the main things and was prepared for them, but these things just really hit me on this last play-through and have not seen them mentioned -- also I played it shortly after playing the Citadel DLC fighting my clone who was wearing that same N7 armor (I guess that's the default), so it was kind of creepy.

Modifié par Zso_Zso, 10 février 2014 - 08:32 .

[Derpy]

Playing MP plat is way harder than insanity.

[SwobyJ]

Relax, it's just a dream.

[Daemul]

Nate_Assassin wrote...

Playing MP plat is way harder than insanity.

Duh...

[Argentoid]

Zso_Zso wrote...

1. Story quality was best in #1 and got worse with progression.
3. Character development / RPG interactions (dialogs) were best in #2, worst in #3

I beg to differ. Story quality was top-notch (though not perfect) in ME1. ME2 was flat out bad in terms of writing, but I can agree that the characters introduced in this game were well written. ME3 did some slight improvements and had a cohesive plot. The intro and the ending are bad, we can agree on that.

- I have been hit hard and down to health-gate many times before and still could just charge to regen my shields and fight on, but now suddenly I lost all my biotic powers... Why ? It feels strange and out of place

Shepard was pretty much in bad shape at that time. She/he doesn't have the strength to use biotic powers... the moment you use them, you might fall into the ground almost unconscious just like what happens to Miranda in Sanctuary (if Kai Leng succeeded in harming her). It is stated in the codex that using biotics is pretty exhausting.

- I went into the mission with a single weapon: my Wraith shotgun, but suddenly I only have a pistol, why ?

Because Harbinger's all-powerful beam obliterated you, losing most of your shields, armor and also your weapons. You pick up a handgun from the ground from your fellow soldiers that were trying to get to the beam, which seems pretty reasonable.

- even if I accept a hand-wave space magicky explanation that I got hit so hard that I "forgot" my biotics and I lost my shotgun and found that pistol only, I cannot possibly imagine any sane explanation how my red Inferno-armor (which I was wearing most of the game for its +30% cooldown speed and power damage benefits) got suddenly replaced by a blue N7 armore !?!?! Did Harbinger quickly undress me and change my diaper armor  while I was knocked out ?

Developer oversight / lazyness / rush to finish the game.

- the character I had to crawl with looked like my evil-clone from the Citadel DLC, definitely did not feel like that was my Sheppard.

wut 

- of course it went further downhil after that with the TIM scene and the even worse holo-child encounter

Why "of course"? Please elaborate. About the TIM scene, not the Catalyst one.

Modifié par Argentoid, 10 février 2014 - 09:00 .

[Derpy]

Daemul wrote...

Nate_Assassin wrote...

Playing MP plat is way harder than insanity.

Duh...

I went from playing MP gold non-stop to playing story at medium and it felt easier than bronze.

[CronoDragoon]

Argentoid wrote...
I beg to differ. Story quality was top-notch (though not perfect) in ME1. ME2 was flat out bad in terms of writing, but I can agree that the characters introduced in this game were well written. ME3 did some slight improvements and had a cohesive plot. The intro and the ending are bad, we can agree on that.

Depends what you mean by writing and story. ME1 has the best plot progression but really bad character writing and dialogs (edit: bad by BW's standards). Of the entire cast I'd only keep Wrex's writing and maybe Kaidan's.

Modifié par CronoDragoon, 11 février 2014 - 05:27 .

[Argentoid]

CronoDragoon wrote...

Argentoid wrote...
I beg to differ. Story quality was top-notch (though not perfect) in ME1. ME2 was flat out bad in terms of writing, but I can agree that the characters introduced in this game were well written. ME3 did some slight improvements and had a cohesive plot. The intro and the ending are bad, we can agree on that.

Depends what you mean by writing and story. ME1 has the best plot progression but really bad character writing and dialogs (edit: bad by BW's standards). Of the entire cast I'd only keep Wrex's writing and maybe Kaidan's.

Garrus' writing is actually good, but that's me.

In ME1's case I was just pointing the plot's writing which was good. ME2 was terrible. ME3 was good too, excluding the ending and the intro.

Character writing for me goes like this...

ME2 > ME3 > ME1

[Han Shot First]

ME1's main plot is overrated because of nostalgia. It has arguably the largest plot hole in the series.

Saren attacks a human colony (and ultimately exposes himself as a traitor) to obtain a Prothean beacon he already possessed (had a spare on Virmire) to find the location of a Conduit he didn't need to gain access to an area of the Citadel both he and his Asari commandos already had access to.

ME1 was a fun ride but it does require that you ignore a weak plot. And NPC companion dialogue in ME1 is the worst of the series.

[CronoDragoon]

Argentoid wrote...
Garrus' writing is actually good, but that's me.

Perhaps because ME2 was my first game in the series I can't appreciate it, since Garrus's ME2 character arc is essentially the same as ME1, except with more humor in his personality. In ME1 he was a much stiffer character.

In ME1's case I was just pointing the plot's writing which was good. ME2 was terrible. ME3 was good too, excluding the ending and the intro.

Character writing for me goes like this...

ME2 > ME3 > ME1

That all makes sense.

[ImaginaryMatter]

Han Shot First wrote...

ME1's main plot is overrated because of nostalgia. It has arguably the largest plot hole in the series.

Saren attacks a human colony (and ultimately exposes himself as a traitor) to obtain a Prothean beacon he already possessed (had a spare on Virmire) to find the location of a Conduit he didn't need to gain access to an area of the Citadel both he and his Asari commandos already had access to.

ME1 was a fun ride but it does require that you ignore a weak plot. And NPC companion dialogue in ME1 is the worst of the series.

I believe Liara states that the Virmire beacon is also damaged and delivered an incomplete message. If that's not the case it is very possible that Saren found the beacon sometime after the events of Eden Prime.

I don't recall if the Asari commandos had access to the Council chambers but even so I assume the Council chambers have very strict security and they wouldn't stand idly by as Saren tinkered around with the station controls.

[CronoDragoon]

ImaginaryMatter wrote...
I don't recall if the Asari commandos had access to the Council chambers but even so I assume the Council chambers have very strict security and they wouldn't stand idly by as Saren tinkered around with the station controls.

Why are the station controls even in the Council chambers to begin with? This is the sort of never-ending questioning that could be applied to all 3 games.

[ImaginaryMatter]

CronoDragoon wrote...

ImaginaryMatter wrote...
I don't recall if the Asari commandos had access to the Council chambers but even so I assume the Council chambers have very strict security and they wouldn't stand idly by as Saren tinkered around with the station controls.

Why are the station controls even in the Council chambers to begin with? This is the sort of never-ending questioning that could be applied to all 3 games.

I assume the Council moved their chambers there because it's the grandest place on the Citadel. As for why the controls are in the tower itself I would say because the Council chambers made the coolest place for a final confrontation, although I'm sure some reasonable story explanation could be used to explain why the Reapers but it there (perhaps because it insured the controls could be found).

[CronoDragoon]

ImaginaryMatter wrote...

I assume the Council moved their chambers there because it's the grandest place on the Citadel. As for why the controls are in the tower itself I would say because the Council chambers made the coolest place for a final confrontation, although I'm sure some reasonable story explanation could be used to explain why the Reapers but it there (perhaps because it insured the controls could be found).

To be clear this doesn't bother me at all, but I often read posts where people cut ME1 a lot of slack (such as "because it's the coolest place for the final confrontation". Not that I think that's a bad reason necessarily) but are unwilling to suspend their disbelief for ME3 in a similar manner. In the end it must come down to the visceral reaction the player gets from completing ME1 (yay!) compared to ME3 (boo!). The latter gives them an excuse to go back and nitpick. I think we've agreed on this in another topic but just reiterating it.

[ImaginaryMatter]

CronoDragoon wrote...

To be clear this doesn't bother me at all, but I often read posts where people cut ME1 a lot of slack (such as "because it's the coolest place for the final confrontation". Not that I think that's a bad reason necessarily) but are unwilling to suspend their disbelief for ME3 in a similar manner. In the end it must come down to the visceral reaction the player gets from completing ME1 (yay!) compared to ME3 (boo!). The latter gives them an excuse to go back and nitpick. I think we've agreed on this in another topic but just reiterating it.

I think remember that, every story has a nitpick but most of them are so tiny and spaced that no one ever notices them until something big causes them to comb through the plot more critically (something about a sweater). Many of them that are noticable I find myself willing to forgive for the sake of pacing or player agency, cause in video games we constantly need things to shoot at; the most noticeable being Citadel: Expose Saren.