1638 réponses à ce sujet

[mopotter]

There were a lot of amazing things in Mass Effect 3
- The soundtrack was fantastic (again)
- Stellar voice acting
- I really liked the dynamic Normandy, with the crew moving around and having conversations with each other (+ squadbanter during missions)
- Customization options
- Shepard felt more alive to me than in ME2
- I loved Liara's romance arc, I think the "core" romances are easily the best of the trilogy
- The Tuchanka storyline, Rannoch and the cerberus coup were well done
- Side quests, though fewer, capture the tone of the main story and integrate well into the storyline (I think the Ardath Yakshi Monastery and Grissom Academy were the best)
- Many great moments with your squadmates and other characters (the goodbye conversations in London, Liara's time capsule, the bottle shooting match with Garrus,...even small things like Charr's poem)
- Combat was the best in the series
- The story DLC were enjoyable (Leviathan, Omega and Citadel)
- Multiplayer was surprisingly fun

There are also some things I didn't like. The ending, of course (the EC made the endings...tolerable, but just barely). Kai Leng and Shepards Earth centrism annoy me to no end. And some cameos (Jacob, Morinth) were disappointing as well. But that doesn't make me hate the game, or the whole series.

 

I agree with some of this.

I have the music from all 3 games, and DA at work and listen to it just about every day.

I'm not a Liara romance fan, I liked her as a friend but i liked the time capsule a lot and the stuff Shepard did with the others. I tend to let Garrus win because I like his reaction.

One of my favorite moments was Kaiden telling Shepard to wake him up next time.

Didn't care for Ash's drunk on the floor, but found Mordin's death very appropriate and in character,

Charr's poem was great, I teared up when I gave it to his wife.

Jacob, poor Jacob.

 

I don't hate the whole series, In fact the reason I hate the ending in ME3 is because I loved the rest so much.  Without one real hopeful ending, not a body that took a breath and the player making up their own story,  I couldn't enjoy the other ones.  It went from a game that I would play for years into a game i played a few times to see if there was hope and found none. 

[themikefest]

There were a lot of amazing things in Mass Effect 3

- I really liked the dynamic Normandy, with the crew moving around and having conversations with each other (+ squadbanter during missions)

- Many great moments with your squadmates and other characters (the goodbye conversations in London, Liara's time capsule, the bottle shooting match with Garrus,...even small things like Charr's poem)

- The story DLC were enjoyable (Leviathan, Omega and Citadel)

.

The crew may of been moving around except for Traynor, Ken and Gabby(if alive)

 

The goodbyes I would've had on the Normandy before getting to Earth. Not in the middle of a battlefield. Also all the ME2 squadmates reduced to holograms which I didn't like. Why couldn't Miranda, Steve and Jack be at the FOB?. They're LI's.  Samantha not being there I understand. That would be hard to explain. Heck she doesn't even get a hologram goodbye.

 

The omega dlc was a waste. If it was maybe 4.99 I might say it was ok.

 

Leviathan I enjoyed, but Samantha got no extra dialogue even though she's a LI. Miranda and Jack could've got some extra dialogue when you see them next.

 

I don't hate the game. Far from it. My biggest complaint is at time during the game, instead of playing the femshep I created I was playing her stunt double. In otherwords Bioware's Shepard.

[von uber]

The omega dlc was a waste. If it was maybe 4.99 I might say it was ok.

 

 

Do you mean $4.99? Or £4.99? Because it is only £6 which I think is fairly reasonable (but then I quite like the Omega DLC).

[themikefest]

Do you mean $4.99? Or £4.99? Because it is only £6 which I think is fairly reasonable (but then I quite like the Omega DLC).

I mean $4.99 instead of $14.99 that I paid when it first came out.

[von uber]

I mean $4.99 instead of $14.99 that I paid when it first came out.

Blimey. Ok, that is overpriced. It only cost me £6 (and £8 for Citadel).

[themikefest]

Blimey. Ok, that is overpriced. It only cost me £6 (and £8 for Citadel).

I guess you got them on sale?

 

I didn't mind paying $14.99 for Citadel

[von uber]

I guess you got them on sale?

 

I didn't mind paying $14.99 for Citadel

 

No, not at all. That's the cost of them for me through Origin.

I bought ME1 and 2 through Steam for £10 back in November and ME3 in December from Origin for £10. Total DLC for ME2 was about £13 and for ME3 was about £25. So i got everything for £50 ($84?).

[Giga Drill BREAKER]

tbh I never hated ME3 (ok maybe I hated the last 10 minutes) but I was mostly disappointed, I felt like I was 6 and someone took my cookie.

[wright1978]

Terrible Intro. Really awful railroaded poorly conceived.

Not a fan of the Music in ME3, everytime i hear that piano music i'm infuriated. Guess it's a case of dissonance between what my charactyer feels and what the music is trying to force.

 

I liked the crew moving round. Not a fan of the limited squad though and Kasumi style dialogue approach.

Me2 cast got rather shoddy treatment imo. Miranda lack of proper involvement in Cerberus arc, Cronos etc.

Disliked the attempt to replace my personalised Shep with an awful auto-dialogued generic version.

Disliked the earth centric plot approach.

Liked Tuchanka, liked Rannoch somewhat, liked coup somewhat though would have preferred a different cerberus direction on the whole.

Linked to that don't Kai Leng and the extent of Cerberus as enemy rather than reapersand their forces.

Liked sidequests like Grissom, however the N7 and fetch scans were utterly awful. Preferred ME2 side quests approach if considered as a whole.

Combat is certainly an area where games have constantly improved.

DLC liked Omega, Citadel(exc mission which was rather weak), though Levaithan was very poor.

Entirety of game from priority earth was deeply disapppinting  through to utter trainwreck at very end.

 

Thanks to MEHEM i can probably say the game deeply disappointed me. Before that i hated that ME3 killed any desire to play the series due to trainwreck ending.

[CronoDragoon]

 What does this even mean?  Saving scum?  Do I need to ask Lukas this one?

Enjoyed DA:O and DA2, I really can't think of any decisions that I had to really think about before making them in DA2. The hardest decision was deciding which class to play because I liked both Bethany and Carver.  

 

Save scumming is really different from what you thought.

 

"The act of restoring a game's save file for the purpose of continuing play with a better outcome than was obtained the first time."

 

As for the DA2, the hardest choice in BW games, or at least the one I've spent the longest sitting there thinking about, was whether to kill Anders at the end.

[ImaginaryMatter]

Terrible Intro. Really awful railroaded poorly conceived.

Not a fan of the Music in ME3, everytime i hear that piano music i'm infuriated. Guess it's a case of dissonance between what my charactyer feels and what the music is trying to force.

 

The music is pretty emotionally manipulative, but I guess that's what makes it good. Despite being underwhelmed playing through almost the entire prologue, I get a little emotional when leaving Anderson and seeing the broken fleet above Earth.

[von uber]

The music is pretty emotionally manipulative, but I guess that's what makes it good. Despite being underwhelmed playing through almost the entire prologue, I get a little emotional when leaving Anderson and seeing the broken fleet above Earth.

 

Yep; 'Leaving Earth', 'I was lost without you' and 'Farewell and into the Inevitable' are all fantasic tracks and really do stir the emotions; that aspect is remarkably well done.

[wright1978]

The music is pretty emotionally manipulative, but I guess that's what makes it good. Despite being underwhelmed playing through almost the entire prologue, I get a little emotional when leaving Anderson and seeing the broken fleet above Earth.

 

The dissonance between what my character is feeling and what the music is trying to manipulate me to feel i probably my issue with it.

[Argolas]

Oh, dat evil manipulating music. Why didn't they write a whole soundtrack just for MY Shep?

[AlanC9]

The dissonance between what my character is feeling and what the music is trying to manipulate me to feel i probably my issue with it.

What's your character feeling, and why doesn't the music work for that?

[AlanC9]

Between games? Sure. But as an overall demonstration as to the possibility of divergent content? Witcher 2, between acts 2 and 3, blows everything away that Bioware has ever done, providing two completely different narratives and outcomes.
 
To put it another way, I think the key issue is "Should have Mass Effect 3 have been allowed force tragedy?", not "Should all video games ever be allowed force tragedy?". Games, even Bioware games, attempt to force a variety of emotions on the player all the time. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.

Note that TW2 blows Bio away at something that Bio's never really believed to be worth implementing in the first place; devs have explicitly said that they'll always go for length rather than breadth since most of us don't replay.

I agree that whether ME should do something is not at all the same question as whether games in general should do something. But then we get into the question of what ME really is; is the paradigm the "Suicide" Mission, or Virmire?

[mopotter]

Save scumming is really different from what you thought.

 

"The act of restoring a game's save file for the purpose of continuing play with a better outcome than was obtained the first time."

 

As for the DA2, the hardest choice in BW games, or at least the one I've spent the longest sitting there thinking about, was whether to kill Anders at the end.

Thanks!   I've learned something new.  Always a good thing.  

 Anders was hard the first time because I liked him, and couldn't quite believe he had done that. ok I like them all for different reasons, but unless my mage is equally obsessed I can't let him live.   

[mopotter]

The dissonance between what my character is feeling and what the music is trying to manipulate me to feel i probably my issue with it.

Have to admit, I don't listen to the music while I'm playing.  Half the time I have the sound turned off and just look at the dialogue screen because my husband is sleeping.  So I don't connect the music to anything I just enjoy it. 

[BaladasDemnevanni]

Note that TW2 blows Bio away at something that Bio's never really believed to be worth implementing in the first place; devs have explicitly said that they'll always go for length rather than breadth since most of us don't replay. [

 I agree that whether ME should do something is not at all the same question as whether games in general should do something. But then we get into the question of what ME really is; is the paradigm the "Suicide" Mission, or Virmire?

 

That's more difficult to say. If we're referring to what ME started as, I'd say Virmire was a more accurate picture. What was ME1's teaser trailer tag line? "Many choices, none of them easy?" I'd say that fits in pretty well in that context.

 

Add on top of that the concepts of Paragon and Renegade. Paragon mentality is meant to viewed as willing to entail greater risk in exchange for greater gaine, while Renegade is exclusively focused on consequentialism. Since Renegades typically make a calculated sacrifice for a calculated gain, the only way for their to be "good" and "bad" outcomes, would be for the paragons to excusively be successful.

[Reorte]

A choice isn't meaningful if it "going wrong" can be easily avoided. The player is "annoyed with himself" for a few minutes until after the reload when he gets it right.

 

The two ways around this are making choices where one outcome isn't objectively better than another, and burying factors until going back to reload becomes too bothersome.

 

 

Because most people *do* save scum. This is why Leandra's quest in DA2 only has one final outcome; there were originally multiple possible endings to that quest, but all the test groups just kept reloading to get the one because they felt they "failed" the quest.

 

Virmire is a meaningful choice precisely because there isn't an option to save both.

And because there's no possibility of saving both it doesn't hit home as hard as it could do. Screw the people who savescum. If you work on the assumption that people will then you've removed any possibility of any sort of meaningful failure, so you either don't have any at all (which is hopeless) or just force it upon the player anyway (and then they'll rightfully get annoyed with you). Neither of those are good options. Don't mess up your game by catering for the savescummers.

 

Having two options where one isn't better than the other fails to have much emotional impact, or at least more than a film can have. "I've not done anything wrong, may as well have tossed a coin for all the difference it makes" is not making the best use of the game for storytelling. Whilst reloading is a way around it it's a route that quite frankly kicks in the head anyone who claims bad outcomes are "realistic". They happen in reality thanks to cockups that quite probably wouldn't happen if people could redo the same events again.

[Reorte]

Blimey. Ok, that is overpriced. It only cost me £6 (and £8 for Citadel).

Hmm, if it's £6 I might get Omega after all.

[AlanC9]

@ BaladasDemnevanni: I consider that teaser trailer more misleading than anything Bio said about ME3. By the time they put that trailer together they had to have known that choices weren't actually going to work like that.

 

I don't quite follow what you're saying about P/R. If the paragon is taking a risk, then the paragon would be the one who occasionally fails, right? While the renegade would avoid some losses but miss the surprise gains?

[AlanC9]

And because there's no possibility of saving both it doesn't hit home as hard as it could do. Screw the people who savescum. If you work on the assumption that people will then you've removed any possibility of any sort of meaningful failure, so you either don't have any at all (which is hopeless) or just force it upon the player anyway (and then they'll rightfully get annoyed with you). Neither of those are good options. Don't mess up your game by catering for the savescummers.

 

Having two options where one isn't better than the other fails to have much emotional impact, or at least more than a film can have. "I've not done anything wrong, may as well have tossed a coin for all the difference it makes" is not making the best use of the game for storytelling. Whilst reloading is a way around it it's a route that quite frankly kicks in the head anyone who claims bad outcomes are "realistic". They happen in reality thanks to cockups that quite probably wouldn't happen if people could redo the same events again.

 

 

I don't check you on the emotional impact being less if the bad outcome was unavoidable. If anything, the reaction to ME3 shows the opposite. You were in the "tragic ending" thread over on the DAI board, right? One persistent complaint was that ME3 had too much impact; the free choice of the US in DA:O did not.

 

Edit: we're talking about kinds of emotional impact in the two cases, though.

[wolfhowwl]

There was another trailer for ME3, Interactive Storytelling, that does something similar. It also appears to have been put together after after they knew the mission wouldn't work like that.

[AlanC9]

There was another trailer for ME3, Interactive Storytelling, that does something similar. It also appears to have been put together after after they knew the mission wouldn't work like that.

 

Never saw that one. Interesting. It looks like the intent was to have the combat sequence be much harder if Shepard made the wrong dialogue choice at the start of the level, but maybe they couldn't balance it because of short dev time? At least all the dialogue made it into the game, unlike the "distress call" ME1 trailer.