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Uneven Presentation of the mage-templar conflict


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#5226
Grieving Natashina

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To be honest, what I have seen is that no matter which "side" you fall under, both agree that the book was pretty well done. You will enjoy it.

So I've heard.  Also, aren't they doing the comics in a graphic novel-style collection in June?  I enjoy some comics, but I hate collecting individual editions.  I shoot for the collections when I can.  I did that with Johnny the Homicidal Manic and The Crow, so I'm hoping I can do it again with the DA comics.



#5227
The Elder King

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We've reached a common understanding that despite their differences, mages and templars must work together to secure a future for all mankind.


I'll be fine if they stop fighting for the moment and focus on the world-treatening event.
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#5228
The Elder King

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To be honest, what I have seen is that no matter which "side" you fall under, both agree that the book was pretty well done. You will enjoy it.


Both? Are you forgetting of us neutrals/third party? I challenge you to a duel good Sir!
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#5229
MisterJB

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It probably has something to do with Anders blowing up the Chantry and everyone's tempars running high. The first thing he says is that the Circle was not responsible and then he pleads to the champion to not let her do it. He has always operated under the opinion that Meredith was simply looking for a reason to annul the circle, which she was. Did you see that scene? Meredith was not hearing anything. She was dead set determined to wipe out the circle from day one of Act III if her sending the annulment to Val Royeaux is any indication, offering anything in that particular moment was probably the furthest thing from his mind.  He simply wanted to survive.

 

In their encounter in the gallows it seemed that Meredith had regained her composure and he was trying to leverage in that fashion.

 

 

Or of course you can believe that he was hiding evidence.

This argument relies on observational skills which, of course, greatly differ between individuals unless it is just that obvious. I don't see any difference between the mental state of Meredith in those two events.

It is possible that it slipped Orsino's mind, I suposse. But it stands on very shaky ground.

 

Probably, and I'll be blunt and meta here, because the writers didn't want to distract from their intent of the emotionally charged catalyst on an irrational actor.

 

I doubt 'he wants time to hide his dirty deeds' was part of their writing thoughts at the time. Besides which, if Orisino was competent he would have long since already hidden the incriminating evidence, rather than leave it out in the open.

Probably not but, ingame, his actions raise some suspicions.

Your argument that Orsino would have already hidden it is compelling but remember that Hawke fights a great number of blood mages in the Templar ending. Perhaps Orsino was not willing to risk any of his apprentices having chosen specifically that night to be less thorough in concealing evidence of their lessons than one should have been.



#5230
Grieving Natashina

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Both? Are you forgetting of us neutrals/third party? I challenge you to a duel good Sir!

I prefer it that way.  Allows us to stay in the shadows a little better.  ^_^  :ph34r:



#5231
Hellion Rex

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Ah, here comes MisterJB. Walk softly and carry a big stick, much?



#5232
Hellion Rex

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Both? Are you forgetting of us neutrals/third party? I challenge you to a duel good Sir!

I meant the neutrals too lol. Calm thyself sir.



#5233
The Elder King

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I prefer it that way.  Allows us to stay in the shadows a little better.  ^_^  :ph34r:


I'd rather say that we remained in the shadow too long ;).  

I meant the neutrals too lol. Calm thyself sir.


I'll make an exception, for this time ;).
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#5234
EmissaryofLies

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This argument relies on observational skills which, of course, greatly differ between individuals unless it is just that obvious. I don't see any difference between the mental state of Meredith in those two events.

It is possible that it slipped Orsino's mind, I suposse. But it stands on very shaky ground.

 

Fair enough, but I submit to you these quotes.

 

KCM- "As Knight Commander of Kirkwall, I hereby invoke the Right of Annulment. Every mage in the circle is to be excecuted---immediately". "This outrage cannot be tolerated."

 

Orsino knew or suspected that Meredith had been building towards something like this, and here it is. I don't think he thought to reason with her right there on the spot right after Anders did his thing. As he said "You have doomed us all". I think Orsino was just running through a list of things to say or submit to Meredith as the remnants of the quest continued. Essentially begging for his life in the face of an inevitable death for himself and his charges as he saw it.

 

I can understand how one would view Orsino as suspicious though I do not share the same opinion.



#5235
MisterJB

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Ah, here comes MisterJB. Walk softly and carry a big stick, much?

Talk softly and carry a big stick.


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#5236
Hellion Rex

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Talk softly and carry a big stick.

Dammit. I completely ruined that.

:angry:



#5237
Grieving Natashina

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Sometimes I prefer this approach:

 

tumblr_lw2v56IqDx1r3ovdbo1_500.gif

 

Perfect for demons.


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#5238
TK514

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Sometimes I prefer this approach:
 
tumblr_lw2v56IqDx1r3ovdbo1_500.gif
 
Perfect for demons.


Indeed.

#5239
Master Warder Z_

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 I can understand how one would view Orsino as suspicious though I do not share the same opinion.

 

Because consorting with insane blood mages and assisting them with their experiments is entirely acceptable by circle and chantry law.



#5240
KaiserShep

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I found it a bit disappointing that the letter from the Circle couldn't be followed through properly somehow. I imagine Meredith would've had a field day with that one. 


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#5241
Master Warder Z_

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I found it a bit disappointing that the letter from the Circle couldn't be followed through properly somehow. I imagine Meredith would've had a field day with that one. 

 

Uh Yup.



#5242
dzs Angel

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Uh Yup.

Why?



#5243
Divine Justinia V

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I found it a bit disappointing that the letter from the Circle couldn't be followed through properly somehow. I imagine Meredith would've had a field day with that one. 

 

Meredith would have had a field day with most of the things she never knew about, in fact they probably would have made her head spin like the Gate Guardians torso. God bless her.


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#5244
Xilizhra

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Meredith would have had a field day with most of the things she never knew about, in fact they probably would have made her head spin like the Gate Guardians torso. God bless her.

One did, I think; that's the trouble.


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#5245
EmissaryofLies

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Because consorting with insane blood mages and assisting them with their experiments is entirely acceptable by circle and chantry law.

Quinten. One mage. And you don't know the extent of Orsino's involvement beyond the books nor when he sent that letter in the first place.

 

Make up whatever you please though.



#5246
Lulupab

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Meredith would have had a field day with most of the things she never knew about, in fact they probably would have made her head spin like the Gate Guardians torso. God bless her.

 

Well do you remember her death scene?

 

She dies exactly when she asks the maker for help :P

 

If there is any blessing she is not getting one.


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#5247
Xilizhra

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Quinten. One mage. And you don't know the extent of Orsino's involvement beyond the books nor when he sent that letter in the first place.

 

Make up whatever you please though.

Actually, we do: it's before Quentin went serial killer and before the Harvester research was uncovered.


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#5248
Divine Justinia V

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Well do you remember her death scene?

 

She dies exactly when she asks the maker for help :P

 

If there is any blessing she is not getting one.

 

Lmao, maybe he did bless her by plucking her out of this world because he knew she'd wind up getting killed eventually?

 

I pity her, I truly do. Like I said, I think she was far too emotionally comprised for that job.


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#5249
Lulupab

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Quinten. One mage. And you don't know the extent of Orsino's involvement beyond the books nor when he sent that letter in the first place.

 

Make up whatever you please though.

 

I always understood it this way: Orsino knew nothing about Quentin, when Hawke found him and the circle investigated his work, Orsino did not destroy his findings and kept it in case they might be useful in another incident. However it means he read them and he learned blood magic if he didn't knew how to do that before. Most mages know how to become a blood mage, they just don't become one.



#5250
Xilizhra

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I always understood it this way: Orsino knew nothing about Quentin, when Hawke found him and the circle investigated his work, Orsino did not destroy his findings and kept it in case they might be useful in another incident. However it means he read them and he learned blood magic if he didn't knew how to do that before. Most mages know how to become a blood mage, they just don't become one.

Believable in the mage ending, but from whatever fragments I picked up from the templar ending, Orsino goes into more detail about knowing Quentin.