16 réponses à ce sujet

[cap and gown]

Which class do you think has the easiest time on insanity? I have only played through insanity twice, both times as an engineer and found that the power set was well suited for both survival and stripping. With Reeve as a bonus power you can have a complete set of stripping powers on a fast cool down. AP ammo also worked well for ammo conservation and faster killing. Meanwhile, even 1 point in combat drone was valuable for distracting enemies. Scions were especially easy to deal with by tossing a drone at them then shooting them in the back while they dealt with the drone. Rocket troopers would even kill themselves by shooting my drone at point blank range. And with its short cool down I could constantly have a drone flying even before getting any cool down bonuses.

[RedCaesar97]

Hands-down the easiest would have to be Soldier with Mattock cheese.

I would not say it is the most fun, but definitely the easiest.

- - -

Now ignoring the completely broken setup, I think it is really hard to say which would be the "easiest". 

My first Insanity playthrough was with the Adept, and despite all the criticism it gets from some players, that was still one of the easiest Insanity playthroughs I ever had.

Modifié par RedCaesar97, 16 février 2014 - 06:16 .

[Ribosome]

Yeah, RedCaesar hit it right in the money there. ME2's Mattock is essentially the equivalent to ME3's Harrier. The combination of Mattock+Inferno Ammo+Heightened AR on the soldier results in the highest dps in the game, since (possibly due to a developer oversight) the gun isn't slowed down by AR like most of the rapid fire weapons are. And 1 point in stasis as your bonus power ensures that the strongest enemies such as YMIR mechs and Scions are dropped in seconds. This was the setup I initially used on my first insanity run and it was so easy to the point where it wasn't fun, so I swapped it out for the Revenant+Viper combo and respecced as soon as I could. Far more fun and still incredibly powerful.

My favorite has always been the Claymore vanguard. It does require you to develop a rhythm of charging in and using your squadmates powers to control clusters of enemies (Kasumi and Zaeed's grenades, or anyone with Warp, Concussive Blast, etc. are especially good at this), but once you nail it down, the results are a beautiful sight to behold

Modifié par ViaNegativia, 16 février 2014 - 09:48 .

[Yezdigerd]

Even without Mattock I can't see a class as easy and efficient just shooting and pressing adrenaline rush on cd.

Modifié par Yezdigerd, 17 février 2014 - 02:36 .

[capn233]

Depends on a whole host of things. Infiltrator used to be the most popular answer in the old days.

I don't have the Mattock, so on my computer the easiest class is Assault Sentinel w/ Stasis.  Insofar as ease just means how much difficulty there is fighting enemies.  I would agree that Soldier is probably the simplest class for a new player to jump in with because all of the abilities are straight forward.

Modifié par capn233, 17 février 2014 - 03:22 .

[a_mouse]

Easiest for a newbie is probably soldier, since it is hardy and forgiving with respect to mistakes, and has a better weapon selection from the start.  

 

But for a player with some experience who knows the maps well, I would say that ease/difficulty on Insanity is actually more a function of play style than class.  It is generally easiest to use a range-combat (RC) approach, where you try to avoid direct contact with the enemies.  If on the attack, try to clear areas of enemies and artillery (from range) before you move in.  If on the defense, try to establish a strong defensive position where you cannot be flanked, and which forces enemies into a bottleneck where you can pick them off.  Soldier and Infiltrator are particularly best suited to this style of play (which may be partly why many players will say they are the easiest).  But a well set-up Adept or Engineer is also great for RC, since their control powers (drone and singularity) work on many protected enemies (probably the easiest run I ever had was as an engineer with AR training).  

[spockjedi]

A properly built Soldier will give you the easiest time:
 
4 - Hardened Adrenaline Rush
1 - Concussive Shot
4 - Heavy Disruptor Ammo
4 - Inferno Ammo
0 - Cryo Ammo
4 - Shock Trooper
4 - Bonus power, your pick (Heavy Fortification in my case)
 
Some weapon kits that I used:
1 - Mattock, Incisor, Eviscerator and Phalanx.
2 - Revenant, Viper, Geth Plasma Shotgun and Phalanx.

The free Cerberus Assault Armor is a good option to ensure survivability.
 
Because all enemies have some kind of protection, Cryo ammo loses a great deal of usefulness, so it's better to leave it at 0 and enjoy two Level 4 ammo types:
Disruptor Ammo: use it against mechs, geth, shielded mercenaries like blue suns, shadow broker, project, prison, batarian, eclipse.
Incendiary Ammo: use it against blood pack mercs, krogan, wild animals, husks, collectors and any organic enemy without shielding.

Concussive shot at level 1 won't cause much damage to barriers, so it's good to have Jack with a Plasma Shotgun and Heavy Warp Ammo during missions involving Collectors. Characters with Warp/Reave also help.

And that was my best insanity build!

[PnXMarcin1PL]

Every class makes the insanity mode too easy /from my personal experience/

[RedCaesar97]

A properly built Soldier will give you the easiest time:
 
4 - Hardened Adrenaline Rush
1 - Concussive Shot
4 - Heavy Disruptor Ammo
4 - Inferno Ammo
0 - Cryo Ammo
4 - Shock Trooper
4 - Bonus power, your pick (Heavy Fortification in my case)
 
Some weapon kits that I used:
1 - Mattock, Incisor, Eviscerator and Phalanx.
2 - Revenant, Viper, Geth Plasma Shotgun and Phalanx.

The free Cerberus Assault Armor is a good option to ensure survivability.
 
Because all enemies have some kind of protection, Cryo ammo loses a great deal of usefulness, so it's better to leave it at 0 and enjoy two Level 4 ammo types:
Disruptor Ammo: use it against mechs, geth, shielded mercenaries like blue suns, shadow broker, project, prison, batarian, eclipse.
Incendiary Ammo: use it against blood pack mercs, krogan, wild animals, husks, collectors and any organic enemy without shielding.

Concussive shot at level 1 won't cause much damage to barriers, so it's good to have Jack with a Plasma Shotgun and Heavy Warp Ammo during missions involving Collectors. Characters with Warp/Reave also help.

And that was my best insanity build!

 

A few things:

1) Fortification is probably the worst power in the game, especially on a Soldier. The Soldier has no native cooldown bonuses, and Fortification is a combat power and so does not benefit from the Tech Cooldown or Biotic Cooldown upgrades. So you are stuck with Fortification's 12 second cooldown.

 

A lot of Soldier players take Neural Shock or Slam, which have 3-second cooldowns which do not interfere greatly with Adrenaline Rush's cooldown.

 

2) You totally underestimate Cryo Ammo's usefulness, and by extension, seem to overestimate Disruptor Ammo's ability versus shields.

 

Enemies on health can still kill you. Enemies on health can be crowd-controlled (CCed). Enemies have more health than protection (shields/barriers/armor). Weapons and powers have bonuses against protections, never against health.

 

Incendiary Ammo can panic most organics and will stop the health regeneration of Krogan and Vorcha. However, Krogan, Varren, and Husks will not panic.

 

Cryo Ammo can freeze any enemy on health. Husks will shatter immediately after they are completely frozen. Most Soldier players like to take Squad Cryo Ammo versus organic enemies to give it to the squad.

 

Depending on the rank, Disruptor Ammo can overheat enemy weapons when enemies are on health, and can disable synthetics on health. Heavy Disruptor Ammo can cause enemy synthetics to explode on "death", however, this can cause Shepard to stagger if he (or she) is too close to the explosion. Most Soldier players only take it to squad for this reason, and only use it versus synthetics. Husks and Varren are organic and do not carry weapons.

 

Shield, Barrier, armor and health damage of Disruptor, Incendiary, AP, Warp, and Shredder Ammo are taken from the base weapon damage. This is why Disruptor, Incendiary, and Cryo Ammo are more greatly valued for their crowd-control abilities rather than their damage to protections. For example, say an SMG deals 10 damage. Disruptor Ammo's +50% damage to shields mean each shot will deal only an extra 5 damage to shields. Now SMGs gain a +50% damage to shields, so that 10 damage becomes 15 damage, but Disruptor Ammo is still dealing only 5 damage. Now if you have 5 SMG damage upgrades (for +50% weapon damage) and the SMG Shield Piercing mod (+50% damage to shields), the SMG is now dealing (10 + 5) x 2.0 = 30 damage; the Disruptor Ammo is still only adding 5 damage so you will be dealing 35 damage to shields. but only 5 damage is coming from Disruptor ammo.

[spockjedi]

Good points, RedCaesar97. I'll respond to them.

1) I agree with what you said about Fortification, Geth Shield Boost would be a better choice for someone wanting a shielding power. I only picked the power for role-playing reasons (I knew I would use it ME3 too), so I left the option open for the builder.

2) The biggest deal breaker of Cryo Ammo is that you have to spend three points on Disruptor and three more on Incendiary just to unlock it. So Level 4 Cryo Ammo costs 16 points, and if you only use Cryo, 6 points and two powers are wasted, since changing the weapon or the ammo type is not practical during a firefight. If it wasn't for that, someone could, for example, ignore Disruptor and Incendiary and evolve the other five powers to the maximum.
When I played I felt that Disruptor/Incendiary had decent enough CC and other side effects. What I had in mind was removing the enemy's protection as fast as possible, and command the squad to hack/freeze/toss/levitate them. And they died very quickly. I didn't knew that Disruptor/Incendiary only increased the base damage (thanks for the info), but nevertheless I was amazed with how fast the enemy's were brought down with the proper ammo power.
Don't Disruptor/Incendiary also increase damage against synthetic/organic health? If removing health is the problem, they also help, especially the Heavy/Inferno evolutions.
What about humanoid mercs with shields? What ammo power would you use against them, having only Inferno and Heavy Disruptor?
About the synthetic explosion, lol, I don't recall that happening to me. Maybe I didn't play close enough to the enemy.

So my build adjusted to your tips would be:

4 - Hardened Adrenaline Rush
2 - Concussive Shot
2 - Disruptor Ammo
2 - Incendiary Ammo
4 - Squad/Deep Cryo Ammo (default ammo power)
4 - Shock Trooper
4 - Your favorite Bonus power

[Vigilant111]

Hmm, I have always played as infiltrators, the cloaking is too irresistible, not to mention the synergy between cloaking and sniper extra damage. Generally the key with insanity is to keep shooting as quick and precise as you can, as most powers are just useless

[ImaginaryMatter]

I've done at least two play throughs (ME1 import and NG+) for each class on Insanity. I tend to play really aggressive, sometimes recklessly, so I think the classes which are the most forgiving in that aspect are the easiest. So, I'll go with Vanguard and Sentinel.

[a_mouse]

Good points, RedCaesar97. I'll respond to them.

1) I agree with what you said about Fortification, Geth Shield Boost would be a better choice for someone wanting a shielding power. I only picked the power for role-playing reasons (I knew I would use it ME3 too), so I left the option open for the builder.

2) The biggest deal breaker of Cryo Ammo is that you have to spend three points on Disruptor and three more on Incendiary just to unlock it. So Level 4 Cryo Ammo costs 16 points, and if you only use Cryo, 6 points and two powers are wasted, since changing the weapon or the ammo type is not practical during a firefight. If it wasn't for that, someone could, for example, ignore Disruptor and Incendiary and evolve the other five powers to the maximum.
When I played I felt that Disruptor/Incendiary had decent enough CC and other side effects. What I had in mind was removing the enemy's protection as fast as possible, and command the squad to hack/freeze/toss/levitate them. And they died very quickly. I didn't knew that Disruptor/Incendiary only increased the base damage (thanks for the info), but nevertheless I was amazed with how fast the enemy's were brought down with the proper ammo power.
Don't Disruptor/Incendiary also increase damage against synthetic/organic health? If removing health is the problem, they also help, especially the Heavy/Inferno evolutions.
What about humanoid mercs with shields? What ammo power would you use against them, having only Inferno and Heavy Disruptor?
About the synthetic explosion, lol, I don't recall that happening to me. Maybe I didn't play close enough to the enemy.

So my build adjusted to your tips would be:

4 - Hardened Adrenaline Rush
2 - Concussive Shot
2 - Disruptor Ammo
2 - Incendiary Ammo
4 - Squad/Deep Cryo Ammo (default ammo power)
4 - Shock Trooper
4 - Your favorite Bonus power

I'm going to double down on everything RedCaesar just said about this.  I'll also add that Concussive Shot is not the best choice for immobilizing debuffed enemies (due to long cooldown).  You are better off leaving it blank, and spending points somewhere else.  If you want an immobilizer, take Slam or Neural Shock.  Slam has the added advantage of letting you set up warp bombs.  

 

Cryo is the most expensive immobilizing ammo power, but it's also the best.  So those 6 extra points are well spent (even if you never use them!).  But in fact you CAN use them.  What a lot of people do is take squad cryo, put it on one weapon (and the squad), and then put inferno or DA ammo on another weapon.  I totally disagree with you about the difficulty of switching weapons.  Part of the advantage of the soldier is being able to select different weapons for different enemies at different ranges.  Just set up a key to toggle the last weapon and you can rapidly switch between any two guns.  The damage differences are negligible - it's really the immobilization effect that you want to base your choices on.

[RedCaesar97]

Good points, RedCaesar97. I'll respond to them.

1) I agree with what you said about Fortification, Geth Shield Boost would be a better choice for someone wanting a shielding power. I only picked the power for role-playing reasons (I knew I would use it ME3 too), so I left the option open for the builder.

2) The biggest deal breaker of Cryo Ammo is that you have to spend three points on Disruptor and three more on Incendiary just to unlock it. So Level 4 Cryo Ammo costs 16 points, and if you only use Cryo, 6 points and two powers are wasted, since changing the weapon or the ammo type is not practical during a firefight. If it wasn't for that, someone could, for example, ignore Disruptor and Incendiary and evolve the other five powers to the maximum.
When I played I felt that Disruptor/Incendiary had decent enough CC and other side effects. What I had in mind was removing the enemy's protection as fast as possible, and command the squad to hack/freeze/toss/levitate them. And they died very quickly. I didn't knew that Disruptor/Incendiary only increased the base damage (thanks for the info), but nevertheless I was amazed with how fast the enemy's were brought down with the proper ammo power.
Don't Disruptor/Incendiary also increase damage against synthetic/organic health? If removing health is the problem, they also help, especially the Heavy/Inferno evolutions.
What about humanoid mercs with shields? What ammo power would you use against them, having only Inferno and Heavy Disruptor?
About the synthetic explosion, lol, I don't recall that happening to me. Maybe I didn't play close enough to the enemy.

So my build adjusted to your tips would be:

4 - Hardened Adrenaline Rush
2 - Concussive Shot
2 - Disruptor Ammo
2 - Incendiary Ammo
4 - Squad/Deep Cryo Ammo (default ammo power)
4 - Shock Trooper
4 - Your favorite Bonus power

 

 

The typical Soldier build looks like this:

4 - Hardened/Heightened Adrenaline Rush

0 - Concussive Shot *

4 - Inferno Ammo

4 - Squad Disruptor Ammo

4 - Squad Cryo Ammo

4 - Commando/Shock Trooper

0 - Bonus Power *

* 1 point left over to put into either C-shot or a bonus power. Bonus power is typically one of the "1-point wonders": Slam, Neural Shock, or Stasis.

 

Versus organics: Cryo Ammo for squad, Inferno Ammo for Shepard. The exception would be for husk rushes like the Reaper IFF where Cryo Ammo is just better.

Versus synthetics: Disruptor Ammo for everyone.

 

The issue with maxing a bonus power is that most bonus powers have 6-second cooldowns that interfere with Adrenaline Rush. Once you get to rank 3, Adrenaline Rush as a 3-second cooldown. So most players just spam Adrenaline Rush and never use a bonus power. An exception would be say Warp Ammo if you want to one-shot basic barriered enemies with the Widow outside of Adrenaline Rush.

 

As for damage to health: yes, I think Disruptor Ammo does deal damage to synthetic health if I recall, and Incendiary Ammo does deal damage to organic health. Now with Incendiary Ammo, the damage is actually dealt over time, and not all at once. And the damage is still calculated off the base damage. But that is only if the ammo hits health.

 

Another thing of note, is that Adrenaline Rush adds +100% weapon damage, +140% with Heightened Adrenaline Rush. So if you are shooting with Adrenaline Rush active, then ammo power damage is very small compared to the total weapon damage.

 

Now I will agree that it takes a lot of points to max Cryo Ammo. This is why it is usually specced last. Squad Disruptor Ammo is still good for the squad in most fights since it can provide some crowd control by overheating weapons and/or stunning synthetics.

 

Frozen enemies also take +100% damage and force.

 

And as for your question about humanoid mercs with shields: I would use Inferno Ammo. The interesting thing about Inferno Ammo is that if you can cause an unshielded enemy to panic from being set on fire, any other organic enemy in the Inferno Ammo explosive radius will also be set on fire and panic, even if they have shields.

[cap and gown]

And as for your question about humanoid mercs with shields: I would use Inferno Ammo. The interesting thing about Inferno Ammo is that if you can cause an unshielded enemy to panic from being set on fire, any other organic enemy in the Inferno Ammo explosive radius will also be set on fire and panic, even if they have shields.

 

Thank you for your tips. I didn't know that Inferno ammo would panic even shielded enemies. (It is my impression that simple incendiary does not panic them until they are down to health.)

 

I have a question about area incinerate: I was just fighing on Korlus and there were two Legionaires next to each other. One had lost its shields, the other still had shields. I called on Mordin's incineration blast against the unshielded one and it looked like the shielded one paniced as well. Was I seeing things? Under what circumstances, if any, does incineration blast panic protected enemies?

[RedCaesar97]

I have a question about area incinerate: I was just fighing on Korlus and there were two Legionaires next to each other. One had lost its shields, the other still had shields. I called on Mordin's incineration blast against the unshielded one and it looked like the shielded one paniced as well. Was I seeing things? Under what circumstances, if any, does incineration blast panic protected enemies?

 

Incineration Blast works the same way as Inferno Ammo (Incendiary Ammo rank 4): If you can panic the unprotected enemy, then any protected enemies within the blast radius will also panic.