300 réponses à ce sujet

[Silfren]

Br3ad wrote...

Silfren wrote...

Br3ad wrote...

AnonymousLamppost wrote...

Also, I have only heard men complain about Anders hitting on them, but no women complain about Isabela hitting on them. Why are men so threatened when it comes to their sexuality?

We don't have enough time for this conversation, unfortunately. Anyway, you're misinturpreting a few things. 

No, they're not actually.  Nearly all the complaints men have raised about this issue can be boiled down to "OMFG ANDERS HIT ON MY MALE PC OMG WHY U MAKE THIS A SAUSAGE FEST BIOWARE????"  That infamous tweet Gaider received the other day is EXACTLY what most of men's gripes have amounted to.

This statement implies that all men think the same. We don't. That all men can be compared to gamers, especially BioWare gamers. They can't. And that all men, hell, even the majority of the men complained. We didn't. 
Most people put the game down after four hours. Most people don't go on the internet and complain. This is the vocal minority, and it's not fair to compare them to everyone. 

No, it implies that NEARLY all the complaints from the men WHO HAVE COMPLAINED, i.e. MOST men's gripes have amounted to.  I highlighted the key words for your benefit. 

I used words like nearly and most and specifically called out the men who *have* complained.  None of that says that I think or that I said all men think the same and if you're getting that out of my comment, that's on you, not me.

If the statement didn't apply to you, then it wasn't about you, clearly.

[Zenbry]

ElementalFury106 wrote...

eluvianix wrote...

You honestly draw the line for realism at 4 bi people, when we have a world with dragons, darkspawn, blood magic, and Qunari?

Lmao, well yes, I do. I understand Dragon Age is set in our equivalent of a medievil culture, where bisexuality was more common, but regardless I do. It's just not likely that every character is attracted to both sexes.

Some characters? Sure, absolutely. But all? Nah.

Notice how no character is only gay. At least not in the DA universe. Always were bisexual, if they were going to go down any path that wasn't straight (no pun intended).

The only romances I recall being exclusively gay are Cortez and Traynor from ME3.

But in DA2 they weren't bi-sexual, except for Isabela, they were oriented toward whatever the players gender was. You heard no mention of Fenris, Merrill, or Anders being attracted to men if you played as a femHawke. And the converse is true for Male Hawke.

We know they swing either way because we are informed gamers, but in game they weren't "bi". That's why I don't have a problem with player-sexual.

If I missed some conversation in game please correct me. I don't mind being wrong!

Edit: 'd! Wow this thread is moving fast.

Modifié par Zenbry, 18 février 2014 - 12:53 .

[mikeymoonshine]

Shinian2 wrote...

mikeymoonshine wrote...

Well the ME3 way is preferable although I would prefer that the gay characters aren't just both minor characters that aren't even companions.

However I don't mind the playersexual (or whatever) thing so if it's easier for them to do that them I am fine with it.

Honest question, what difference does it make if they aren't companions in ME3?

I can only picture this making a difference if it was like DAO and you could talk to them anywhere.

Just seemed like two characters were made up solely to please the gay people. Which they were and it's fine with me but I would rather they made at least one of the companions gay if they are going to have gay people in the game. 

[Master Warder Z_]

eluvianix wrote...

thats1evildude wrote...

What do you mean "again"? Sebastian was ladies-only.

And the ladies can keep him.
:innocent:

Agreed.

Choir Boy was boring.

[Sjofn]

Shinian2 wrote...

mikeymoonshine wrote...

Well the ME3 way is preferable although I would prefer that the gay characters aren't just both minor characters that aren't even companions.

However I don't mind the playersexual (or whatever) thing so if it's easier for them to do that them I am fine with it.

Honest question, what difference does it make if they aren't companions in ME3?

I can only picture this making a difference if it was like DAO and you could talk to them anywhere.

I thought the way ME3 had the non-companion romances were surprisingly beefy, but the fact remains that people are generally going to think of people who never leave the ship, if you will, as more "minor" than a companion. People like bringing their LI with them places most of the time, I suspect.

[Iakus]

I wonder if DAI will have an Amulet of Mara?

[WidePaul]

I'd prefer a mix of straight, bi and gay romances if possible but its Bioware's game and world, they can do what they like. If they want to make everyone playersexual, that's fine by me, and if they wanted to make everyone hermaphrodites, that's there choice, although I've now got an image of varric with breasts stuck in my head.

[AresKeith]

iakus wrote...

I wonder if DAI will have an Amulet of Mara?

Might as well, in DA2 Hawke was the Amulet 

[Br3admax]

Silfren wrote...

No, it implies that NEARLY all the complaints from the men WHO HAVE COMPLAINED, i.e. MOST men's gripes have amounted to.  I highlighted the key words for your benefit. 

How do you get that from, "Why are men so threatened when it comes to their sexuality?" This is what I'm responding to. Eitherway, I know nothing about what, "MOST men's gripes" are, but I doubt either of us could prove if most men who complained complained about Anders hitting on them. 

[They call me a SpaceCowboy]

Silfren wrote...



As was pointed out, I was referring to the DA2 characters.  I should've been clear on that.  Much as I liked Origins, I find DA2's handling of LIs MUCH better.  I don't think players should ever be cut off from the LI they want over something like this.  Especially after removing all such gender-based restrictions in DA2, it would be a woefully backwards move to go back to Origins after giving us DA2 in the first place.

I would have thought Isabela was obviously bi in DA2 as well, and Zevran was in DA2 as well for that one scene. Did he flirt with hawke? I've forgotten.

However yes, I was referring to both games, but left out Leliana since she wasn't in both games. (well, not in any romance sense at least.)

As I stated earlier, what I liked about DAO romances was that there was a buildup over time, story wise, not the Mass Effect style two talks and then sexy-time. I honestly don't care if all the romances are bi as long as they are written as such, and written well.

[Steelcan]

iakus wrote...

I wonder if DAI will have an Amulet of Mara?

yes, its called Inquisitor's genitalia, it makes everyone swoon because the alternative is that someone gets angry their potnetial waifu don't swing that way

[Silfren]

CybAnt1 wrote...

Add to this the fact that the way the LIs are written, they are *never* de facto bi.  They could easily be construed as gay for one playthrough or straight for another. 

Well, Leliana strongly hints that her relationship with Marjorlaine was sexual as well as mentor-student in the arts of bardic assassination and seduction, but of course doesn't come out and directly say it. Still, it's as we like to say, very strongly implied. 

A fair deal more than implied, I think.  But it doesn't really refute my point.  It's worth pointing out that some people DON'T define themselves as bi because they don't look at sexuality as something to be categorized as either/or/both. but see themselves as merely sexual.  I think that Leliana, Zevran, and Isabela--especially Isabela--embody that idea rather well. 

I DO think that far, FAR more people are bisexual than is realized--or believed.  Then again, I see a lot of merit to the argument that at the end of the day, we are simply sexual creatures and that the fixation on categorizing preferences has led to largely artificial and arbitrary ideas about sexual orientation.  Cultural traditions DO play a role in this. 

[Master Warder Z_]

Steelcan wrote...

iakus wrote...

I wonder if DAI will have an Amulet of Mara?

yes, its called Inquisitor's genitalia, it makes everyone swoon because the alternative is that someone gets angry their potnetial waifu don't swing that way

A sad sign of the times...

[DeinonSlayer]

Steelcan wrote...

iakus wrote...

I wonder if DAI will have an Amulet of Mara?

yes, its called Inquisitor's genitalia, it makes everyone swoon because the alternative is that someone gets angry their potnetial waifu don't swing that way

Andraste forbid that a character might have their own preferences...

[SlottsMachine]

All I wanted was a Qunari only book club, everyone thought I was cray.

[General TSAR]

Yep.

Though I am hopeful that we will have restrictions based on race, sexuality, and even political/religious views.

Modifié par General TSAR, 18 février 2014 - 12:59 .

[daaaav]

AnonymousLamppost wrote...

I think that the term "bisexual" should'nt apply unless the character says that. Such as Anders, When you are playing as a female Hawke he is heterosexual, and when you are a male he is homosexual. The two variations of Hawke exist in separate universes you cannot blend them by saying that Anders is bisexual because he will have sex with male and female Hawke, because only one Hawke exists at a time. Calling him bisexual is looking at both alternate timelines at the same time.

Also, I have only heard men complain about Anders hitting on them, but no women complain about Isabela hitting on them. Why are men so threatened when it comes to their sexuality?

Yeah. This topic doesn't end well due to several misinterpretations nicely summed up in this post.

I don't like "playersexual" characters because as an example, Anders should be whoever he is regardless of the nature of the player. His relationship with Karl should not have been scrubbed simply because the PC is a certain gender. I think that Bioware thought they came up with a clever way to accomodate more choices with regards to character relationships but It truly rubs me the wrong way.

The reason many reasonable folks complain about the way the Anders romance is initiated is due to the fact that it wasn't as obvious as similar senarios with other characters.  I.e. they felt that the dialogue option offered did not match the expected outcome. Unreasonable people may object due to Anders being more forward than other characters (or for reasons due to their own insecurities concerning sexuality, but they should simply be encouraged to get over it...)

[Orian Tabris]

Silfren wrote...

Br3ad wrote...

AnonymousLamppost wrote...

Also, I have only heard men complain about Anders hitting on them, but no women complain about Isabela hitting on them. Why are men so threatened when it comes to their sexuality?

We don't have enough time for this conversation, unfortunately. Anyway, you're misinturpreting a few things. 

No, they're not actually.  Nearly all the complaints men have raised about this issue can be boiled down to "OMFG ANDERS HIT ON MY MALE PC OMG WHY U MAKE THIS A SAUSAGE FEST BIOWARE????"  That infamous tweet Gaider received the other day is EXACTLY what most of men's gripes have amounted to.

For me, the gripe isn't that Anders hit on one of my male Hawkes, it's that in Awakening, he is shown as being interested in females, and only those who looked too much into it actually thought that he might be bi-sexual.

Then in 2, he apparently slept with Carl, and his character changed. I can understand his change in stance on mages, but to also change his sexuality? May as well not attempt to bring two characters back, and to instead, create a completely new character who always firmly believed that mages need to be free. Actually, that would have been better since less people would have hated DA2. Also, Varric may not have chosen a nickname for one of Hawke's companions, despite he, himself, easily being definable with that same name (Blondie).

[Silfren]

AnonymousLamppost wrote...

I think that the term "bisexual" should'nt apply unless the character says that. Such as Anders, When you are playing as a female Hawke he is heterosexual, and when you are a male he is homosexual. The two variations of Hawke exist in separate universes you cannot blend them by saying that Anders is bisexual because he will have sex with male and female Hawke, because only one Hawke exists at a time. Calling him bisexual is looking at both alternate timelines at the same time.

Also, I have only heard men complain about Anders hitting on them, but no women complain about Isabela hitting on them. Why are men so threatened when it comes to their sexuality?

Something of a nitpick.  This is external to the game, but it has been said that Anders relationship with Karl happens on all playthroughs, so he can't be said to necessarily be purely heterosexual in a f!Hawke playthrough.  And if you talk to him as a m!Hawke, he specifically says he never saw any reason to limit his romance options because of gender. 

[Steelcan]

DeinonSlayer wrote...

Steelcan wrote...

iakus wrote...

I wonder if DAI will have an Amulet of Mara?

yes, its called Inquisitor's genitalia, it makes everyone swoon because the alternative is that someone gets angry their potnetial waifu don't swing that way

Andraste forbid that a character might have their own preferences...

Of course they ahve preferences, it just so happens that the Inquisitor can make their loins burn with a fire like no other person can, because....

because....




HEROISM

[Br3admax]

DeinonSlayer wrote...

Steelcan wrote...

iakus wrote...

I wonder if DAI will have an Amulet of Mara?

yes, its called Inquisitor's genitalia, it makes everyone swoon because the alternative is that someone gets angry their potnetial waifu don't swing that way

Andraste forbid that a character might have their own preferences...

Their preference is for PCs. They don't live in a Mac world. 

[Veruin]

Stop flashing the David signal damn it.

Steelcan wrote...
because....




HEROISM

Modifié par Veruin, 18 février 2014 - 01:02 .

[Steelcan]

Veruin wrote...

Stop flashing the David signal damn it.

Steelcan wrote...
because....




HEROISM

David is gone, his star burned too bright and for too long

[Hanako Ikezawa]

AnonymousLamppost wrote...

I think that the term "bisexual" should'nt apply unless the character says that. Such as Anders, When you are playing as a female Hawke he is heterosexual, and when you are a male he is homosexual. The two variations of Hawke exist in separate universes you cannot blend them by saying that Anders is bisexual because he will have sex with male and female Hawke, because only one Hawke exists at a time. Calling him bisexual is looking at both alternate timelines at the same time.

This sums up my opinion on the issue pretty well.