265 réponses à ce sujet

[RangerSG]

Sion1138 wrote...

starlitegirlx wrote...

No, my gender doesn't enter into it at all. If Mark didn't suck beyond words, I would have loved to play male shep and try the different romances. In fact, having a male voice that is good at voice acting would have made it especially enjoyable. As it was, playing male shep with Mark doing the voice was just tedious. He sounded like he was reading a very boring book. No inflections. No sense of motivation. And when you listen to every other voice actor in the game, it's even worse. Look at Garrus. Look at Liara. Look at Tali. Even Anderson telling you he was born in London every twenty minutes like he's on the verge of Dementia does it better than anything Mark did in ME1 and ME2 combined. I don't even think I finished playing 2.

Skyrim is a different story. So many races and you really don't actually see your character if you run it first person. It's clip free, which I've come to appreciate after all the cutscenes that we got for ME3 - made it half movie, half game. Less fun. But if I am going to see the scenes, I would have loved to do one male shep that was the model they chose and then create one of my own. I feel like Mark's bad voice acting took that away from me. I started the game with male shep and then switched to female because I couldn't get into it. That's when all my fun began. But I really did try to go back to Male shep twice after that.

So you don't project, you don't enter into the world as some derivative of yourself.

From my point of view, that's a basic requirement. How can I bring myself to genuinely care about events and choices made if the character I am inhabiting has no relation to myself in their views and traits?

Of course, I am able consider viewpoints which are not my own or infer the development of certain character traits as a consequence of character's history but only to a certain degree. In essence I will always be playing myself, modified by the secondary world.

That's what I call role-playing, but apparently this isn't a wide-spread view. I had no idea.

A couple more questions: What would you say to a mute protagonist and how much are you able or willing to fill in the blank spaces regarding your character's thoughts, behavior, mannerisms, tone etc.?

To me, 'projecting yourself' is the antithesis of role-playing. A RPG exists to be something you are not. To 'project yourself' into a narrative is one of the cardinal sins of writing. And while it doesn't hurt a computer game, it definitely is painful in a tabletop RPG as well.

[CrutchCricket]

RangerSG wrote...
To me, 'projecting yourself' is the antithesis of role-playing. A RPG exists to be something you are not. To 'project yourself' into a narrative is one of the cardinal sins of writing. And while it doesn't hurt a computer game, it definitely is painful in a tabletop RPG as well.

It depends on the degree of the projection. You can't play a character well if you aren't able to relate at least partially to some aspect of them.

[DoomsdayDevice]

I'm a dude myself, but Femshep FTW.

[Shuidizi]

I always try out both genders in a game if it's available, with only one exception and that's Baldur's Gate series.

[Massa FX]

I only play femshep...

Tried default male shep a couple times but its awkward for me. I'm a woman and I want roleplay as a woman. Cross gender playing isn't for me if I have a choice. Bioware always gives players gender choice. For that I'm grateful.

[TheMyron]

@OP; Perhaps it's because you tend to "get into character" when playing an RPG like Mass Effect and you just can't play as a girl if you're a guy.

If so, I totally know how you feel.

[TheMyron]

RangerSG wrote...

To me, 'projecting yourself' is the antithesis of role-playing. A RPG exists to be something you are not. To 'project yourself' into a narrative is one of the cardinal sins of writing. And while it doesn't hurt a computer game, it definitely is painful in a tabletop RPG as well.

Indeed, I am pretty sure none of us are N7 troopers, but you can still "project yourself", to a degree.

[TheMyron]

If you are still arguing over who is better; Mark Meer or Jennifer Hale, Why not compare them as a Hanar and a female Elcor?

[Daxamite]

Ive tried both, i usually prefer playing male shep, i just dont like the female shep voice actor v much.

[BassStyles]

My original game was Sheploo and I always regard him as my canon dude. Initially I viewed him as the only way to go, but I decided to do a Renegade Femshep and she is near and dear to me haha

I just recently completed a Saintly Paragon Femshep so I now have three characters I would transfer to ME4 if it allows it. So as to the original question, I prefer Sheploo.

[BurningBlood]

My tabletop pencil-and-paper roleplaying is quite similar to what Starlitegirlx describes. If I'm going to play a role, then it must necessarily be at least somewhat "me" simply because I'm the one playing it. Even if I try to play someone totally different, I can't, because I'll subconsciously project myself into the role in one way or another; and even if I could remove myself entirely from the role, I wouldn't enjoy playing such a character because I wouldn't identify with it at all.

However, as RangerSG pointed out, if I'm just playing "me with guns and armour" then... that's pretty shallow roleplay. Ideally, I take a character's background and try to figure out how that person would be different from me, and how they would be the same as me; project myself into the similarities, and use that character to explore the differences (or... use the differences to explore the character?)

It has to be a mix. If it's all me it's a bit stale, but if it's none of me then I just don't care about the character.

[Han Shot First]

Br3ad wrote...

Han Shot First wrote...

So many lulz, you don't even know. 

What I see anytime someone posts a screenshot of default FemShep:

[congokong]

congokong wrote...

And maleShep is the only one that can be a complete **** by kissing Miranda and then having sex with Jack, Kelly, Liara, Tali, and Morinth all in the same game.

Mcfly616 wrote...
Miranda and Tali in the same game....you sure?

congokong wrote...
Learn to read.

Mcfly616 wrote...
take your own advice....

WTF are you talking about? Look at the bold/underline. You're vague because you make no ****ing sense.

Modifié par congokong, 20 février 2014 - 06:28 .

[RangerSG]

CrutchCricket wrote...

RangerSG wrote...
To me, 'projecting yourself' is the antithesis of role-playing. A RPG exists to be something you are not. To 'project yourself' into a narrative is one of the cardinal sins of writing. And while it doesn't hurt a computer game, it definitely is painful in a tabletop RPG as well.

It depends on the degree of the projection. You can't play a character well if you aren't able to relate at least partially to some aspect of them.

Relate is not the same as insert. Sure, you need a degree of empathy with any character. A non-relatable character in reading, writing, or gaming is simply disinteresting. 

But that's not the same as 'projection' which connotes more than tangential similarities (some of which are completely impossible to avoid). The issue is the deliberate insertion of self into narrative.

[Iron Star]

When I first started playing Mass Effect way back I couldn't fathom playing as femshep. I really couldn't make a face for her that just felt right, so I played maleshep. About a year and a half after ME2 had come out I started a femshep, and got stuck with her just because all the armors on her looked absolutely amazing. Since then I was stuck with her.

I've played through the entire ME3 story at least seven times by now, never even selected maleshep in the ME3CC.

If anyone thinks it's relevant, I'm a guy.

Modifié par Get fired up, 20 février 2014 - 11:19 .

[Sion1138]

I get what you're saying, and I agree. That's approximately what I said, it's you but modified by the secondary world. However, one can only accommodate so much modification before losing the ability to relate deeply.

How is it possible for you to enter into the role of a female when you are a male? Because the way I see it, there are fundamental things to a female which you can not possibly relate to on an emotional level, unless you are somewhat feminine.

Modifié par Sion1138, 20 février 2014 - 01:33 .

[Sion1138]

RangerSG wrote...

CrutchCricket wrote...

RangerSG wrote...
To me, 'projecting yourself' is the antithesis of role-playing. A RPG exists to be something you are not. To 'project yourself' into a narrative is one of the cardinal sins of writing. And while it doesn't hurt a computer game, it definitely is painful in a tabletop RPG as well.

It depends on the degree of the projection. You can't play a character well if you aren't able to relate at least partially to some aspect of them.

Relate is not the same as insert. Sure, you need a degree of empathy with any character. A non-relatable character in reading, writing, or gaming is simply disinteresting. 

But that's not the same as 'projection' which connotes more than tangential similarities (some of which are completely impossible to avoid). The issue is the deliberate insertion of self into narrative.

But isn't that the point of a role-playing game? If I'm not goint to insert myself in there, I may as well read a novel or watch a movie, which are things I do but the game is something different.

It asks me to care for it's world in a more personal way and therefore, I need to be personally there.

[Sion1138]

BurningBlood wrote...

It has to be a mix. If it's all me it's a bit stale, but if it's none of me then I just don't care about the character.

Right, exactly. I would say that the starting statements, the initial variables especially must be relatable. 

I don't see this as beeing the case if I choose the opposite gender.

[Artifex_Imperius]

If i play just for fun, like speedy fps style play through femshep will do. But If i played mass-effect series with alot of empathy, placing my-self in shepard shoes believing for that moment while im playing the choices that i make reflect who i am. i cant play femshep it feels disconnected as a guy.

i believe that for those that didn't place themselves as their shepards would always feel disconnected. their unrealistic choice's wont really reflect in the game choices or connect with the storyline. this leads to the ending discontent.

[fchopin]

I play both without any problems but if i had to pick only one then it would be the default male Shepard.

[CrutchCricket]

RangerSG wrote...
Relate is not the same as insert. Sure, you need a degree of empathy with any character. A non-relatable character in reading, writing, or gaming is simply disinteresting. 

But that's not the same as 'projection' which connotes more than tangential similarities (some of which are completely impossible to avoid). The issue is the deliberate insertion of self into narrative.

A large part of empathy is inserting the self. "Place yourself in another's shoes" and so on.

Yours is a question of scale; how much of yourself can you put into a character before it's just you in a different skin. And I would argue that in video games at least, you're not actually able to reach that threshold.

In video games your choices are necessarily constrained. Furthermore your character also takes actions that aren't subject to your choice. And justifying those with the image of the character you created takes far more than just inserting yourself. Finally, the escapist element to video game protagonists skews any insertion to a more idealistic form. People who make Shepard in their own image don't really make him in their actual image at all. They insert an idealized version of themselves. And an ideal version of you is still a character separate from you.

[Oni Changas]

Xemnas07 wrote...

 So, is it just me, or does anyone else feel just... wrong playing as femshep? I mean, I'm not anti-feminist or anything, and Jennifer Hale does a great job with her voice acting, but for some reason, playing as femshep just doesnt feel right to me. I started my first playthrough as femshep in ME1 and when i thought about getting to the citadel DLC with her, i just couldnt do it; i cant picture anyone else but my default shep saying goodbye to the crew one last time.

Maybe some day I'll be able to complete a playthrough with her, but that is not this day.

Same here, but also add to this the fact that the female models are small and thin. It'd be nice to go through with a female tank with a body built like Meryl from MGS4 (very feminine and full figured but she looks like she can rip your throat out). I find it had to buy a woman doing half the stuff Shepard does, and even moreso a relatively small one.

This may be too much to ask due to resource limitations, but I think it'd be cool to choose a body type in Mass Effect 4.

[Chashan]

Xemnas07 wrote...

 So, is it just me, or does anyone else feel just... wrong playing as femshep? I mean, I'm not anti-feminist or anything, and Jennifer Hale does a great job with her voice acting, but for some reason, playing as femshep just doesnt feel right to me. I started my first playthrough as femshep in ME1 and when i thought about getting to the citadel DLC with her, i just couldnt do it; i cant picture anyone else but my default shep saying goodbye to the crew one last time.

Maybe some day I'll be able to complete a playthrough with her, but that is not this day.

Well, in that case your taste is bad and you should feel bad.

In all seriousness, it's the exact opposite for me: I went custom Ms Shepard first, and much later tried to roll Mr Shepard in ME1, trying to check and see whether a likeness that roughly approaches this persona couldn't be done*.

Plan was to play a douchy Renegado. Performance of Mr Meer simply made me forget about that right after Eden Prime. Stuck with Hale ever since.

*May have to give the character creator a whirl again just to see whether such a face-shape is remotely possible or not. Didn't quite get there last time.

[sharkboy421]

Its been said but OP that is totally fine that you can't get into a play through as femshep.  The choice is there for a reason and I love that Bioware gave it to us.

The very first time I played ME I used maleshep and I loved the game.  I went to play it a second time and decided to try out femshep and for me, it just seemed more natural.  Something about femshep clicks more with ME than maleshep does for me.

I think both Hale and Meer did a fantastic job in all the games and liking one more than the other is nothing more than personal taste.  I do however think that Meer was much more reserved in ME1 at the very least, but I have read that he was specific direction in the recording booth to try and be as neutral as possible.  Which is a shame as he is a fantastic actor and comedian.  Regardless, both Hale and Meer have their own style to voicing Shep and neither is better or worse, just different.