Guest_StreetMagic_*
Not everyone wants to be the warden "again". Speak for yourself.
If there's anything I want from DAO, it's not that. Hell, I envied my other companions more than the main character. They had better prospects and cooler lives. Like I say to Anders in DAA: All Wardens have to look forward to is dying young and eventually being forgotten.
Not that Hawke is any better off. I feel sorry for him too.
Hawke is automatically better off for not having to deal with the darkspawn or the crappy Wardens forever, that is, depending on how Inquisition handles this character's story. If nothing significant is made of it, then it's pretty much left to our imagination, but Hawke's journey lends itself better opportunities than the tainted Warden. As for the being forgotten part, I have no problem with that. It's not like the person that dies would know the difference.
I played DA2 first, despite fan rage, and I really, really loved it. However, most of the fan rage I saw just seemed mostly racist, sexist and homophobic, with the occasional I don't like the graphics or mechanics. So I figured I would love the game and what do you know, I loved it. When I got around to playing DA:O, I really hated it and do not want to replay it again. I love the characters, but the game mechanics were horrible, the world didn't seem as big as everyone had claimed, and story wise it was just stock Bioware story, nothing really earth shattering as people seem to believe it is.
DA2 was at least an attempt by Bioware to break that stock story telling loop they got themselves into, and I think they did very well. I loved the fact Hawke wasn't some major, world saving character, just a small time, local legend. They just needed more polishing on that ending. From what I can tell, a lot of people complain that they want the same old, stock Bioware story telling back. They harp on nostalgia of KOTOR1, ME1, and DA:O. They miss being big, damn, special snow flake, heroes, with everyone fawning over them like their mere presence is like standing before God himself, and with clean cut villains who laugh manically and you want to kill them cause they are just obviously so extremely evil, you're an idiot for arguing otherwise.
Rose-Tinted glasses, I suppose. I play Origins first but there was no rage boiling in my gut, when DA2 came out. I really enjoyed them both. Like everything, they had bad and good points. Not understandin' all the DA2 hate.
and with clean cut villains who laugh manically and you want to kill them cause they are just obviously so extremely evil, you're an idiot for arguing otherwise.
DA2 was filled with those. Kirkwall was like an asylum with all the lunatics running around.
DA2 was filled with those. Kirkwall was like an asylum with all the lunatics running around.
That is exactly how I felt about it.
DA:2 was very different from its predecessor; it went in a different direction that defied the expectations of many. I think this is responsible for many, if not most, of the vitriol we see directed at this game. People who feel this way tend to be loud, especially on the internet.
For me personally, it was a bit of a learning curve. I rage quit my first play through after Cullen told my mage Hawke, who just saved him from demons by shooting lightening out of her fingers, that mages weren't normal people "like you and me". I'm glad I gave it a second try though, because I haven't loved a game like DA:2 since Xenogears back in 1998. I found the combat fun and exhilarating. I love the characters (Fenris, to me, is one of the best written characters I've ever come across, game, book or otherwise), I love the more personal story, the intimate scope. I found it very compelling to play a character that was trying to be a good person but also trying to survive and support the family. I loved playing as a mage using deft political maneuvering to get cozy with the Templars as an apostate (and I used NO magic around them until the bitter end). To me, it felt very Sophoclean, and that is to its great credit.
In the end though, people like what they like. Vitriol aside, some aren't going to like the changes, whether they're comparing DA:2 to Origins or not. Why does one person prefer tea, while another prefers coffee? They just do. I'm glad you decided to put the fan ranting aside and see for yourself. DA is a single player game and thus a personal experience; your opinion of your own experience is ultimately all that matters.
Apparently this site http://www.metacriti...ii/user-reviews has information and reviews from users.
For PC the negatives were 61%.
445 positive
191 mixed
1019 negatives
You could read the reasons. Many have already been stated. They also have user score for Xbox 360 and PS3. Both had high % of negative scores. I don't think this is going to be a problem for them in the future. They have already learned from this. It may hurt returning customers. I'm sure their original sales of DA 2 benefited from the fact that DAO was a hit.
i don't have to convince u anything but, as the game I had spend most time with.
I know this game better than u do 
A lot of people are complaning about the scale of the story being to small, but I think that it is was just right for both games respectively.
Origins was the game that introduced us to the universe, and for that they gave it a large and epic scale to show us as many different
aspects as possible.
DA2 however was used to focus more on one aspect of the universe namely mages and how they are treated in Thedas and setting
up the mage-templar war. For this the scale was perfect because it gave us an emotional link to the conflict and showed us how the
everyday man feels about it. Of course the story could have been polished more, but it wasn't a deal breaker for me.
Also the game is called Dragon Age and not Darkspawn Age or Grey Warden Age. The Blight is still a major threat to Thedas and always will be.
But appart of the wardens and Orzimmar, it doesn't inpact the life and fate of the other nations and life in general when there isn't one.
And the universe is rich enough and has several plot points ready that can serve for so many good and possible more interesting stories than the
Blight.
Guest_StreetMagic_*
Yeah, I like both aspects of scale.
Just that DA2 need to make Kirkwall and it's surrounding territories more rich (starting with no cut and pasting). I know this is something acknowledged the most by Bioware themselves, so I won't carry on about it. It's nice that they recognize this fault.
The general idea of the game is fine to me though. I prefer it in some ways.
-extreme reuse of environments
-tiny undetailed maps (and there are only a handful due to reuse)
-endless exploding mooks that fall out of the sky or ceiling
-even main plot quests are short and not engaging
-less companion interaction
-time skips are used for no reason and passage of time is not shown AT ALL
-lazy, disjointed plot that has you literally doing chores first for the deep roads then the Qunari/Viscount, then Meredith/Orsino
-Ridiculous last bosses and ending
-inability to have any effect on the world or your own circumstance
-quests happen the same way no matter what you do (Grace even if you help her, Feynriel no matter where you send him, last battle sequence, etc...)
-tone system extremely detrimental to roleplaying, the tones are extreme and you sound insane switching from one to another
-no puzzles, nothing to explore
There's nothing wrong with liking DA2, it does have some good aspects (mainly the characters, VA, and armor) I myself didn't HATE it, I was just extremely disappointed. It was like expecting creme brûlée and getting a pop tart. I do think you should get the DLC if you haven't already. IMO it was a huge improvement on the base game.
i don't have to convince u anything but, as the game I had spend most time with.
I know this game better than u do
Why are you posting this to me? Your post doesn't make sense. I haven't told you to think a certain way.
This is the topic question: "So why do people think DA2 is so bad compared to DA:O?"
I'm answering that topic question with data and that is the only thing I'm doing.
You have a right to your own opinion and I'm in no way trying to convince you. If you don't like the data don't read it. I provided the data to answer the question only.
-quests happen the same way no matter what you do (Grace even if you help her, Feynriel no matter where you send him, last battle sequence, etc...)
Feynriel is not the best example, because his fate can actually vary quite a bit, starting from the responses you give as part of the demons' illusions in the Fade. In my playthrough, he becomes a stable-minded mage in Tevinter, but he can also become a tranquil, in which case Arianni kills herself, or he becomes a dreamstalker that kills people.
I'll grant you Grace, because it's sort of frustrating that she blames you for her boyfriend's death even though he attacked, despite her own pleas not to.
I was not surprised by Grace because such events happen in RL. Some police dread going to domestic violence cases for this very reason. The woman or man being abused will all of a sudden turn on the person coming to the rescue. Hawke and party are still the people who killed according to Grace the best man I ever knew.
This is the essence of my experience with all of BioWare's games. And why I know that, regardless of what Inquisition ends up being, I will love it thoroughly.BioWare charm is all I need and this has it in abundance.
Personally, I find "user reviews" to be utterly useless for my purposes. The vast majority of critiques seem to revolve around aspects that I consider entirely dependant on taste and preferences. When they do contain something I might find useful for evaluating the game myself, I have to filter away 95% of the content, be it stuff that I categorically disagree with, or even find borderline toxic, before I get down to the essence of something that might affect my interest. And frankly, I find it both easier and less painful to buy the game and figure out for myself. Video gaming has a long way to go to become a cheap hobby.Apparently this site http://www.metacriti...ii/user-reviews has information and reviews from users.
Different people had different expectations for DA2. Those who were jonesing for a continuation of their Warden character felt cheated, and perhaps that's understandable. However, I approached DA2 as a story that was part of a larger whole and I've enjoyed it tremendously.
Like yourself I didn't play DA2 right away because of the fan outcry and now I'm kicking myself for ignoring my own rules about paying attention to Internet clamor. No, DA2 wasn't DAO. Yes, the map re-use gets a trifle old. However, many, many things about this iteration of DA were very, very well done...but that's, like, my opinion, man.
This is the essence of my experience with all of BioWare's games. And why I know that, regardless of what Inquisition ends up being, I will love it thoroughly.
Personally, I find "user reviews" to be utterly useless for my purposes. The vast majority of critiques seem to revolve around aspects that I consider entirely dependant on taste and preferences. When they do contain something I might find useful for evaluating the game myself, I have to filter away 95% of the content, be it stuff that I categorically disagree with, or even find borderline toxic, before I get down to the essence of something that might affect my interest. And frankly, I find it both easier and less painful to buy the game and figure out for myself. Video gaming has a long way to go to become a cheap hobby.
But I'll stop there, because this post was on the way to becoming a political rant.
Did you post the question? As far as I'm concern it is just data. Let the person who posted the question decide. Otherwise why would they ask the question?
Are you claiming those customers don't count because you don't agree with them? I'm not invested in this at all. As far as I'm concern it provides a response to the following question posted: So why do people think DA2 is so bad compared to DA:O?
Here is the best part: The person is free to use it or not.
Your Comment:"But I'll stop there, because this post was on the way to becoming a political rant."
I don't see why? I thought the original poster was just looking for data. Is there some other purpose that has not been stated in the original question?
Feynriel is not the best example, because his fate can actually vary quite a bit, starting from the responses you give as part of the demons' illusions in the Fade. In my playthrough, he becomes a stable-minded mage in Tevinter, but he can also become a tranquil, in which case Arianni kills herself, or he becomes a dreamstalker that kills people.
I'll grant you Grace, because it's sort of frustrating that she blames you for her boyfriend's death even though he attacked, despite her own pleas not to.
I meant the first quest with him. Send him to the circle or send him to the Dalish and you still end up in the same predicament where he's trapped in the fade and get the same second quest in the same location. Side with Meredith or side with Orsino, doesn't matter you still have to randomly kill both. Help Ser Varnel kill the Qunari or try to save them from him and you still end up with Seamus dead and the Qunari attacking, etc...
This is the essence of my experience with all of BioWare's games. And why I know that, regardless of what Inquisition ends up being, I will love it thoroughly.
Personally, I find "user reviews" to be utterly useless for my purposes. The vast majority of critiques seem to revolve around aspects that I consider entirely dependant on taste and preferences. When they do contain something I might find useful for evaluating the game myself, I have to filter away 95% of the content, be it stuff that I categorically disagree with, or even find borderline toxic, before I get down to the essence of something that might affect my interest. And frankly, I find it both easier and less painful to buy the game and figure out for myself. Video gaming has a long way to go to become a cheap hobby.
But I'll stop there, because this post was on the way to becoming a political rant.
User reviews are only really helpful if the reviewer likes the same elements of games that you do. A game review from someone who loves combat and game mechanics and graphics and skips dialogue and cutscenes and doesn't to sidequests or romances or remember the names of characters would not be helpful in the slightest to me. I don't care about graphics, combat, mechanics, flashiness, etc...but story, roleplaying, characters, and customization are vital to me.
The most helpful thing you can watch is a "Let's Play" so you can see for yourself.
I meant the first quest with him. Send him to the circle or send him to the Dalish and you still end up in the same predicament where he's trapped in the fade and get the same second quest in the same location. Side with Meredith or side with Orsino, doesn't matter you still have to randomly kill both. Help Ser Varnel kill the Qunari or try to save them from him and you still end up with Seamus dead and the Qunari attacking, etc...
Sounds like you're describing the limits of individual agency.
Undermining the illusion of which still does not equate a good design-decision.
Especially regarding the end-game this becomes all the more jarring: throwing one's lot in with either leader means squat as both inevitably are reduced to frothing lunatics. The Qunari-arc has problems on that front too - one can't strangle the life out of Petrice right in act 1 why, again? -, but at least that's alleviated somewhat by the options presented for its resolution - handing 'bella over, duel the Arishok or kill any Qunari in sight.
I enjoyed DA2. Sure it had it's flaws but I felt it did some things better than DAO.
The biggest flaw of the game was the reused environments and the lack of traveling but I think the DLCs made up for that. Combat was fun but it was kind of bland but again the DLCs did improve upon that.
Overall, I felt the game was good but not as good as DAO. DAI looks like it's going to blow both games out of the water so far though.
I meant the first quest with him. Send him to the circle or send him to the Dalish and you still end up in the same predicament where he's trapped in the fade and get the same second quest in the same location. Side with Meredith or side with Orsino, doesn't matter you still have to randomly kill both. Help Ser Varnel kill the Qunari or try to save them from him and you still end up with Seamus dead and the Qunari attacking, etc...
That doesn't seem like the same thing to me, because his quest line is still incomplete. Wayward Son is basically about what you as Hawke support, but Feynriel's story isn't over. From that point onward, however, you can determine his fate, and it's not fixed, unlike the end of what Act of Mercy begins. Now, as for Act of Mercy, let's say that Grace gets caught by the templars no matter what. What if in Act 3, she actually tries to help you because of what you did for her in Act 1? Her being caught by the templars regardless of what you do becomes irrelevant.
That doesn't seem like the same thing to me, because his quest line is still incomplete. Wayward Son is basically about what you as Hawke support, but Feynriel's story isn't over. From that point onward, however, you can determine his fate, and it's not fixed, unlike the end of what Act of Mercy begins. Now, as for Act of Mercy, let's say that Grace gets caught by the templars no matter what. What if in Act 3, she actually tries to help you because of what you did for her in Act 1? Her being caught by the templars regardless of what you do becomes irrelevant.
It was two separate quests. The second quest had different outcomes, the first did not. Even in the fade Feynriel dreams of both the keeper and the first enchanter when it should have been one or the other. If sent to the Dalish he shouldn't know what the inside of the Kirkwall circle looked like or who the first enchanter was and vice versa. The whole game gave me the impression of "meh, the player isn't smart enough to notice the difference, we'll just throw in explosions and backflips and their tiny brains will be distracted."
For me it'd probably have to be the fact that Hawke doesn't really get to win anything. Everyone from Qunari agents to ancient Magisters gets to play him for a fool and they wouldn't even let me be the one to end gorram Petrice!
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