123 réponses à ce sujet

[CronoDragoon]

The answer depends on your view of the organic/synthetic "problem." If you believe one exists than picking Control or Synthesis is still viable. If you don't then Destroy is clearly the "best" option merely to win the war.

[NuclearPowers]

Destroy.

Anything else doesn't really make sense for my Shepard. He came to destroy the reapers, not make buddy-buddy.

[DeinonSlayer]

Destroy, regardless if they live or not. In my canon playthrough, the Geth were already dead at that point - I'm not going to base a galaxy-altering decision around the fate of one person.

Really, what Destroy reminds me of most is the choice in the end of Bring Down The Sky. Let Balak go to save the hostages, or sacrifice three lives to ensure he never gets another chance to kill millions? I choose the latter.

[Xilizhra]

This is sort of a silly question. It's a fundamental part of the decision; it's like saying "In Synthesis, the Reapers all explode into fireworks made of marshmallows," or that in Control, Shepard doesn't die and has a sort of pilot rig set up in the Citadel so she can control things with no implication at all of changing mentally.

That said, I'm still doing Control. The decision might be made more difficult, but the Reapers are too useful to throw away.

Really, what Destroy reminds me of most is the choice in the end of Bring Down The Sky. Let Balak go to save the hostages, or sacrifice three lives to ensure he never gets another chance to kill millions? I choose the latter.

And, though I just throw this out there, impede your own war assets.

[NeroonWilliams]

CronoDragoon wrote...

The answer depends on your view of the organic/synthetic "problem." If you believe one exists than picking Control or Synthesis is still viable. If you don't then Destroy is clearly the "best" option merely to win the war.

This is the correct answer.

[N0rke]

The Geth and EDI dying were my only real problem with the Destroy ending. Having worked so hard to build my war assets up to get the perfect ending, creating peace between the Quarians and Geth, and showing EDI what meant to be human it left a bad taste in my mouth when I had to decide between Commander Shepard surviving or undoing half the work he did in the game.

It would have been nice if the perfect Destroy ending spared the Geth and EDI. Most Bioware games do a good job of giving you the 'feel good' out if you play your cards right, but ME3 makes you sacrifice something no matter how right you do everything.

[teh DRUMPf!!]

Sync ofc. And Control second. Geth/EDI dying is the least of what's wrong with Destroy.

[TheOneTrueBioticGod]

Why couldn't Refuse actually be successful if you have, say, an EMS over 8000? I mean, it's not like that takes either every DLC pack and a decent amount of multiplayer *cough*that's what I have*cough*, or a lot more multiplayer. I mean, if what, 3200 is what it now takes for high-EMS destroy, then 8000 should be enough to at least win the Battle at Earth.

I'd accept over 9000. For.... reasons.

[DeinonSlayer]

Xilizhra wrote...

Really, what Destroy reminds me of most is the choice in the end of Bring Down The Sky. Let Balak go to save the hostages, or sacrifice three lives to ensure he never gets another chance to kill millions? I choose the latter.

And, though I just throw this out there, impede your own war assets.

Yes, all hail the three-year mind reader. We've been down this road before, Xil. Please don't start it up again.

[Matthias King]

I always choose destroy and just pretend that the geth and EDI aren't affected by it, because it never, ever made any sense to me that they were in the first place.

To me it was just an arbitrary caveat Bioware crammed in there to try to push the asinine ridiculousness that was synthesis.

[Xilizhra]

DeinonSlayer wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

Really, what Destroy reminds me of most is the choice in the end of Bring Down The Sky. Let Balak go to save the hostages, or sacrifice three lives to ensure he never gets another chance to kill millions? I choose the latter.

And, though I just throw this out there, impede your own war assets.

Yes, all hail the three-year mind reader. We've been down this road before, Xil. Please don't start it up again.

The way it was presented, I never thought he'd have a chance to kill millions again. No mind reading necessary.

Anyway,  if you'd prefer... my answer stays the same. Control is too useful. Imagine how much smoother reconstruction will go, for starters.

[TheOneTrueBioticGod]

HYR 2.0 wrote...

Sync ofc. And Control second. Geth/EDI dying is the least of what's wrong with Destroy.

Wait, wait, wait. 

What else could possibly be wrong with destroy besides that? I'll make it simple. 

Destroy: Anderson, Liara, Garrus, Tali?, Vega, VS, Samara, Miranda, Jacob, Thane, Wrex, Grunt, Hackett, Victus, Aria, Cortez, Traynor, Jack, Kasumi, Zaeed, the Asari, the Turians, the Salarians, the Alliance, the Volus, the Quarians(probably), the Hanar, the Elcor, the Batarians, Terminus fleet, the Leviathans, etc

Control: Timmy, Kai Leng, Cerberus

Synthesis: EDI, Joker, the Geth, Saren 

[themikefest]

destroy all the time every time no matter what.

[Bob from Accounting]

TheOneTrueBioticGod wrote...

Why couldn't Refuse actually be successful if you have, say, an EMS over 8000? I mean, it's not like that takes either every DLC pack and a decent amount of multiplayer *cough*that's what I have*cough*, or a lot more multiplayer. I mean, if what, 3200 is what it now takes for high-EMS destroy, then 8000 should be enough to at least win the Battle at Earth.

I'd accept over 9000. For.... reasons.

Because it would make the ending dependant on multiplayer. Which is completely stupid for both narrative and gameplay reasons. It would invalidate every choice and action Shepard has ever made.

Granted, the current endings aren't overwhelmingly better.

Modifié par Bob from Accounting, 21 février 2014 - 04:27 .

[TheOneTrueBioticGod]

Bob from Accounting wrote...

TheOneTrueBioticGod wrote...

Why couldn't Refuse actually be successful if you have, say, an EMS over 8000? I mean, it's not like that takes either every DLC pack and a decent amount of multiplayer *cough*that's what I have*cough*, or a lot more multiplayer. I mean, if what, 3200 is what it now takes for high-EMS destroy, then 8000 should be enough to at least win the Battle at Earth.

I'd accept over 9000. For.... reasons.

Because it would make the ending dependant on multiplayer. Which is completely stupid for both narrative and gameplay reasons. It would invalidate every choice and action Shepard has ever made.

Granted, the current endings aren't overwhelmingly better.

They already invalidate every choice he has evey made. Just saying, If I have put in the time and extra money to get my EMS over 8000, I should get to shoot the catalyst in his stupid, plot-breaking, deus-ex machina head and watch as my mighty galactic armada triumphs over him and his "synthetics kill organics, so I created synthetics to kill organics" machines. Mind me, this is refuse. 

Modifié par TheOneTrueBioticGod, 21 février 2014 - 04:30 .

[Bob from Accounting]

If you're that desperate for your super-duper mega-ultra galactic armada ending, I'm sure it's widely available to you in countless fan fiction stories. You don't need to demand such a ridiculously poorly written scenario. It's already out there for you.

[TheOneTrueBioticGod]

Bob from Accounting wrote...

If you're that desperate for your super-duper mega-ultra galactic armada ending, I'm sure it's widely available to you in countless fan fiction stories. You don't need to demand such a ridiculously poorly written scenario. It's already out there for you.

I don't really want that, but it would be better than the catalyst god child we got. Especially Synthesis. 

It would just be nice to actually see the fruits of our labor being represented in a way other than text and arbitrary numbers. 

[Bob from Accounting]

It wouldn't be better.

If you want it, you should prove it's doable and doable well by writing something out. Writing something very good. This is no good.

[teh DRUMPf!!]

TheOneTrueBioticGod wrote...

Wait, wait, wait. 

What else could possibly be wrong with destroy besides that?

-- Shepard's limbs are sundered, with no viable replacements ready without synthetic tech intact. Better off dead IMO.
-- The Volus all die, which further screws over your galactic economy.
-- The Reapers go to waste (refer to my sig quote). I'd even argue the sacrifice of those civilizations does as well.

That's not to say the Geth/EDI's deaths aren't a factor at all, but the least important one.

Destroy just sucks.

I'll make it simple. 

Destroy: Anderson, Liara, Garrus, Tali?, Vega, VS, Samara, Miranda, Jacob, Thane, Wrex, Grunt, Hackett, Victus, Aria, Cortez, Traynor, Jack, Kasumi, Zaeed, the Asari, the Turians, the Salarians, the Alliance, the Volus, the Quarians(probably), the Hanar, the Elcor, the Batarians, Terminus fleet, the Leviathans, etc

Control: Timmy, Kai Leng, Cerberus

Synthesis: EDI, Joker, the Geth, Saren

Destroy Collector Base: the whole ME2 squad.

Save Collector Base: TIM, Shepard (if chosen, ofc).

End result: saving the base benefits the player more than destroying it.


What you've invoked is the Bandwagon Fallacy. "Two million people can't be wrong." Well actually yes, they can be.

I'd also dispute your assumption on some characters choosing Destroy, but that's beside the point.

Modifié par HYR 2.0, 21 février 2014 - 04:59 .

[TheOneTrueBioticGod]

Bob from Accounting wrote...

It wouldn't be better.

If you want it, you should prove it's doable and doable well by writing something out. Writing something very good. This is no good.

Following the destruction of Cronos Station, and the revelation that the Citadel has been moved to Earth, the leaders of the war effort meet and discuss how to open the arms and use the Crucible. After a brief but bleak time, someone proposes using the Conduit on Ilos. While the Citadel was moved across the Galaxy, the Mu Relay was able to adjust and their only hope is that the conduit can too. 

The Normandy arrives at Ilos and the team goes through the conduit safely, but don't come out at the council chambers, because due to the movement, it couldn't deliver them exactly where they planned. Instead, they come out at the end of one of the wards, and Harbinger is down at the presidium overseeing the production of the new, non-terminator, reaper. Shepard meets with the CDF and fights down the wards, culminating in a bossfight against Harbinger. Under the combined firepower of the CDF, including a lot of heavy artillery (read: not "Thanix Missiles"), the smallest hole is torn in its armor and Shepard manages to jump in before Harby's barriers go up. Mind you, since the Citadel does have what amounts to gravity, Harby has had to reduce his mass and this, as we know, weakens the shields. Shepard goes solo, destroys the reaper core, and harby dies, big explosion. 

Shepard managed to get out and take cover before said explosion, and we can see the explosion has damaged the Citadel rather severly. Squad takes a walk, opens the arms as the Fleet zerg rushes the Citadel with the crucible in tow and manage to dock it, and form a ring around defending. EDI runs a diagnostic, and sees that the Citadel was far too damaged by Harby's explosion and the activition of the crucible would not be able to direct the energy through the Relays. Now comes the decision.

Option A: Shepard can tell Hackett to take the fleet and retreat out of Sol, and EDI can access the citadel's systems and disable Charon before the reapers can give chase. Then, Shepard overloads the crucible's core, setting it to supernova in the system. The Crucible is sent flying out of the Citadel and the arms close as it detonates, destroying every reaper trapped in the system,... and sacrificing Earth. Plot twist right there. 

OPtion B: Or, he can tell the fleets to stand and fight, harkoning back to the "10 billion die over here so 20 billion over there can live" talk with Garrus. They can't go by the ruthless calculus of war; they would be no better than the reapers. 

For some reason, I can't think up off the top of my head, as with the rest, Shepard gets hurt enough to be mandated for hospilazation if the EMS is high enough, otherwise Shepard and the Normandy die either on the citadel or in battle against the Reaper armada. 

Chosing option A cuts the EMS required for victory in half, and we can see the results of what Shepard did as the Galaxy launches the counter offensive. Quarians and Geth fighting side-by-side, for example. 

[TheOneTrueBioticGod]

HYR 2.0 wrote...

TheOneTrueBioticGod wrote...

Wait, wait, wait. 

What else could possibly be wrong with destroy besides that?

-- Shepard's limbs are sundered, with no viable replacements ready without synthetic tech intact. Better off dead IMO.
-- The Volus all die, which further screws over your galactic economy.
-- The Reapers go to waste (refer to my sig quote). I'd even argue the sacrifice of those civilizations does as well.

That's not to say the Geth/EDI's deaths aren't a factor at all, but the least important one.

Destroy just sucks.

I'll make it simple. 

Destroy: Anderson, Liara, Garrus, Tali?, Vega, VS, Samara, Miranda, Jacob, Thane, Wrex, Grunt, Hackett, Victus, Aria, Cortez, Traynor, Jack, Kasumi, Zaeed, the Asari, the Turians, the Salarians, the Alliance, the Volus, the Quarians(probably), the Hanar, the Elcor, the Batarians, Terminus fleet, the Leviathans, etc

Control: Timmy, Kai Leng, Cerberus

Synthesis: EDI, Joker, the Geth, Saren

Destroy Collector Base: the whole ME2 squad.

Save Collector Base: TIM, Shepard (if chosen, ofc).

End result: saving the base benefits the player more than destroying it.


What you've invoked is the Bandwagon Fallacy. "Two million people can't be wrong." Well actually yes, they can be.

I'd also dispute your assumption on some characters choosing Destroy, but that's beside the point.

What I've envoked is that Shepard has absolutely no right to go aginst what the rest of the Galaxy has trusted him to do, and especially no right to take control of the reapers or forcibly alter their entire genetic structure. And why would the Volus die? Their suits wouldn't malfunction; no reaper tech and no cybernetics in those, unless you can prove otherwise.