27 réponses à ce sujet

[KotorEffect3]

Here is the thing I didn't mind neither the mako or the hammerhead and even enjoyed them both to a degree.  That said I didn't miss them either.

It seems like in general a lot of people want to bring back vehicle exploration they like the concept but they were not happy with the actual execution for various reasons.  If they do bring it back I am thinking ME Next will be a good time to try it out.  They are going to be working with a new game engine and they will be developing the game for more powerful hardware which opens up the possibilities for them.

I am thinking if they do bring it back they should give the player options. 
-both vehicles are available and it is up to the player to choose which ones they want to use (maybe a  pre mission briefing can give the player an idea of what kind of environment they are going into to help the player decide which vehicle they want to use)
-upgrades for both vehicles that allow us to make changes maybe we want to give the mako a little more maneuverability or the hammer head a studier hull but making those changes also forces us to choose between flexibility, durability, or firepower)
or they can ditch both and come out with an all new vehicle that gives the players some of the customization options I mentioned above.

Also maybe some missions involving submersing it in water could make things interesting perhaps?

Thoughts?

[RangerSG]

KotorEffect3 wrote...

Here is the thing I didn't mind neither the mako or the hammerhead and even enjoyed them both to a degree.  That said I didn't miss them either.

It seems like in general a lot of people want to bring back vehicle exploration they like the concept but they were not happy with the actual execution for various reasons.  If they do bring it back I am thinking ME Next will be a good time to try it out.  They are going to be working with a new game engine and they will be developing the game for more powerful hardware which opens up the possibilities for them.

I am thinking if they do bring it back they should give the player options. 
-both vehicles are available and it is up to the player to choose which ones they want to use (maybe a  pre mission briefing can give the player an idea of what kind of environment they are going into to help the player decide which vehicle they want to use)
-upgrades for both vehicles that allow us to make changes maybe we want to give the mako a little more maneuverability or the hammer head a studier hull but making those changes also forces us to choose between flexibility, durability, or firepower)
or they can ditch both and come out with an all new vehicle that gives the players some of the customization options I mentioned above.

Also maybe some missions involving submersing it in water could make things interesting perhaps?

Thoughts?

I despised the Hammerhead. Really. The execution only made it worse.

The Mako was implemented poorly on the PC. Driving it is still a chore for me. That said, I think the Virmire Approach, Conduit Run, and Therrum Approach are 3 of the best designed segments of ME1. I also liked the turret battles in Bring Down the Sky. It was the meandering 'explorations' over same-looking environments to find the one path that let you through to where that last marker was on the map that drove me absolutely insane.

So yes, have a vehicle. But have it designed so that its functional in-game. Not a glass cannon. And don't make 90% of the 'exploration' game corridors in disguise. 

[Han Shot First]

RangerSG wrote...


I despised the Hammerhead. Really. The execution only made it worse.

The Mako was implemented poorly on the PC. Driving it is still a chore for me. That said, I think the Virmire Approach, Conduit Run, and Therrum Approach are 3 of the best designed segments of ME1. I also liked the turret battles in Bring Down the Sky. It was the meandering 'explorations' over same-looking environments to find the one path that let you through to where that last marker was on the map that drove me absolutely insane.

So yes, have a vehicle. But have it designed so that its functional in-game. Not a glass cannon. And don't make 90% of the 'exploration' game corridors in disguise. 

Pretty much what he said.

[katamuro]

Han Shot First wrote...

RangerSG wrote...


I despised the Hammerhead. Really. The execution only made it worse.

The Mako was implemented poorly on the PC. Driving it is still a chore for me. That said, I think the Virmire Approach, Conduit Run, and Therrum Approach are 3 of the best designed segments of ME1. I also liked the turret battles in Bring Down the Sky. It was the meandering 'explorations' over same-looking environments to find the one path that let you through to where that last marker was on the map that drove me absolutely insane.

So yes, have a vehicle. But have it designed so that its functional in-game. Not a glass cannon. And don't make 90% of the 'exploration' game corridors in disguise. 

Pretty much what he said.

That is a large part of what we want. instead of making some crazy mountains like in ME1 where you just drive around of the corridor thing like in ME2, make vehicles part of the game story and function within that. So for example a mission where you cant land close to the objective because of some reason so you need to take a ground vehicle through some defences or terrain. Then add missions where instead of just driving around trying to spot stuff, you get missions where you need to get on the ground to scan for a hidden entrance, or maybe something crashed there. A prothean or a reaper or Leviathan artifact or ruin. there is a lot of things that can be done. But it has to be included into the narrative, not just drive around shooting and gathering "minerals". 

[Hrungr]

Personally, I'm hoping there is no "driving" or "hovercraft-ing" at all...
This is the future! 

There are flying cars, shuttles, spaceships... why would even have a wheeled tank or hover-vehicle? 

Personally, I'm hoping we'll have a nice armed & armored shuttle or fighter to pilot around on planets that is also maneuverable enough to pilot underground or in vast space stations.

Modifié par Hrungr, 22 février 2014 - 07:02 .

[katamuro]

Hrungr wrote...

Personally, I'm hoping there is no "driving" or "hovercraft-ing" at all...
This is the future! 

There are flying cars, shuttles, spaceships... why would even have a wheeled tank or hover-vehicle? 

Personally, I'm hoping we'll have a nice armed & armored shuttle or fighter to pilot around on planets that is also maneuverable enough to pilot underground or in vast space stations.

Its the same reason why certain vehicles now are designed for specified purpose. Making something that could do all things would mean it doesnt do any of them very well. For a military armoured scout vehicle like Mako or the Hammerhead certain aspects are more important. Also the sheer fact that wheels are known and fairly simple compared to many other things. Also the shuttle from ME2/3 is so wrong from engineering point of view its incredible. The way that its thrusters are positioned would make it impossible to turn or even fly in any decent way. Every time I see it I cringe a bit.

[SwobyJ]

ME1:
Therum - Was mostly fine
Feros - I liked it!
Novaria - Pretty cool..
Virmire - Boring but pretty
Ilos - Epic!
The only minus to the main mission Mako sections were the linear nature and copy-paste encounter formula. But that's a ME1 issue in itself, so whatever.
Uncharted Worlds - DIE DIE DIE. The plus to them was lack of linearity. The minus to them were annoying encounters, boring (once past the initial awe) environments, and clear padding of game time that just got ridiculous.

ME2:
Firewalker - Huh? Oh, yeah, that was neat in ways but also brutally unfair in others. I liked the speed and action. Disliked most else. Still better than Mako in UCW, but not as fun as Mako in main missions.
Overlord - I liked this. It wasn't anything special in itself, but it gave a variety to the Overlord mission that wouldn't have been there otherwise. I could also handle the encounters well, but I hoped there could have been some optional secret boss in the center part of the map that I could take down for a special reward



ME4:
-Stop with the steep cliffs except maybe in rare occasions
-LET ME UPGRADE MY VEHICLE IN WAYS I WANT TO, LIKE ANY CHARACTER
-Ground, hovering, flying, aquatic vehicles. Aw ye.
-Better shield regen, customizable shields, weapons, etc
-Combat against other vehicles and ways to balance vehicle/ground combat better. Good enemy units should hurt my vehicle badly, but facing a group of turrets like in ME1 shouldn't be a thing (it was just silly and forced me to hide in the shadows and snipe the turrets)

Basically ME1-ME2 were 'ehh ok' test runs, but if they're gonna do vehicle stuff in the next game, it'd need the love and care that ground combat got in ME2 and ME3. That's not to say ME2-ME3's ground combat was *fantastic*, but it got the attention that made it enjoyable to go through, instead of the slog to finish it to get to story (ME1).

[RangerSG]

katamuro wrote...

Hrungr wrote...

Personally, I'm hoping there is no "driving" or "hovercraft-ing" at all...
This is the future! 

There are flying cars, shuttles, spaceships... why would even have a wheeled tank or hover-vehicle? 

Personally, I'm hoping we'll have a nice armed & armored shuttle or fighter to pilot around on planets that is also maneuverable enough to pilot underground or in vast space stations.

Its the same reason why certain vehicles now are designed for specified purpose. Making something that could do all things would mean it doesnt do any of them very well. For a military armoured scout vehicle like Mako or the Hammerhead certain aspects are more important. Also the sheer fact that wheels are known and fairly simple compared to many other things. Also the shuttle from ME2/3 is so wrong from engineering point of view its incredible. The way that its thrusters are positioned would make it impossible to turn or even fly in any decent way. Every time I see it I cringe a bit.

I wouldn't mind a Mech for a vehicle, except that I never bought it for orbital drops. But it would attract those who remember Mechwarrior fondly. 

[AlanC9]

What was wrong with the Hammerhead? It was overpowered, sure, but so was the Mako.

[KotorEffect3]

AlanC9 wrote...

What was wrong with the Hammerhead? It was overpowered, sure, but so was the Mako.

Some people didn't like the hammerhead because it couldn't take much damage.   It didn't bother me.   It just meant taking a more finesse approach to combat

[Oni Changas]

KotorEffect3 wrote...

Here is the thing I didn't mind neither the mako or the hammerhead and even enjoyed them both to a degree.  That said I didn't miss them either.

It seems like in general a lot of people want to bring back vehicle exploration they like the concept but they were not happy with the actual execution for various reasons.  If they do bring it back I am thinking ME Next will be a good time to try it out.  They are going to be working with a new game engine and they will be developing the game for more powerful hardware which opens up the possibilities for them.

I am thinking if they do bring it back they should give the player options. 
-both vehicles are available and it is up to the player to choose which ones they want to use (maybe a  pre mission briefing can give the player an idea of what kind of environment they are going into to help the player decide which vehicle they want to use)
-upgrades for both vehicles that allow us to make changes maybe we want to give the mako a little more maneuverability or the hammer head a studier hull but making those changes also forces us to choose between flexibility, durability, or firepower)
or they can ditch both and come out with an all new vehicle that gives the players some of the customization options I mentioned above.

Also maybe some missions involving submersing it in water could make things interesting perhaps?

Thoughts?

My original idea was going to be a new vehichle that combines the properties of both, but this is way better. You're a guddamn genius. I like.

[Oni Changas]

KotorEffect3 wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

What was wrong with the Hammerhead? It was overpowered, sure, but so was the Mako.

Some people didn't like the hammerhead because it couldn't take much damage.   It didn't bother me.   It just meant taking a more finesse approach to combat

Overlord was a ***** and a half getting that Data Hound trophy. Having to hide behind rock while spamming missles during a vertical jump was excrutiating. No.

Both were garbage when it came to firefights against big or multiple enemies and make me hate (forced) vehichle sections altogether.

[katamuro]

The problem with both Hammerhead and Mako was that their weapons like the weapons on modern infantry fighting vehicles are not really designed for a close up fight but the way the game was made the enemies would only appear or react if you got close enough for them. its like rolling a tank into the city to take out an artillery in the bunker. No one does that. A vehicle with such weapons is supposed to shoot and fight at least 500 meters away in certain cases even a kilometer, especially when it comes to guided anti-tank missiles. Shooting it barely 100 or less meters away is just not how it was supposed to be. At least in ME1 there were certain conditions where you could snipe the enemies with the cannon from far away but most of the times they would appear only as you drove right into them.

[mhmbaSR1]

while I have said myself that I want more 'exploration' I didn't necessarily mean vehicle exploration. it would be nice to have some type of exploration in mass effect next, it was a shame when they streamlined the experience in me2 and then completely gutted it in me3. it was VERY disappointing to have no part of me3 that wasn't necessary or vital. I mean literally every map in that game was a must, and while we visited a lot of new places we never got to explore (I understand this is partly because of 'reaper war is happening' logic, and it makes sense but still) that being said...

 

a vehicle that would be implemented effectively, isn't a chore, and is enjoyable (at least to a certain extent) would be great. I would be a little wary of them bringing back either of the older ones...maybe a different version that was manufactured after the last version was seen to fail miserably? but as long as it was functional and not a pain then I would welcome it.

 

having different vehicles could be nice, as long as they were used for different situations like you said. im not really sure about having different customizations and upgrades as that could easily get out of hand since a 'vehicle mechanic' imo should at most be a minor game feature (at least in ME)

[Drone223]

As already mentioned if vehicle exploration returns, then the vehicle should have the speed and agility of the Hammerhead and the firepower and armour of the Mako.

[Zanata-Gamer]

At first I enjoyed exploring the planets, but after a time playing was boring and repetitive. 

 

BioWare could implement a new way of exploration, using different types of vehicles, it would be interesting to implement missions using various types of vehicles similar to Battlefield 3.    

[Beerfish]

I liked the Mako quite a bit, did not like the Hammerhead much.  I would be happy enough with a mako like machine again but they need to add more things to the planets that are being explored.

[AlanC9]

I despised the Hammerhead. Really. The execution only made it worse.The Mako was implemented poorly on the PC. Driving it is still a chore for me. That said, I think the Virmire Approach, Conduit Run, and Therrum Approach are 3 of the best designed segments of ME1. I also liked the turret battles in Bring Down the Sky. It was the meandering 'explorations' over same-looking environments to find the one path that let you through to where that last marker was on the map that drove me absolutely insane.So yes, have a vehicle. But have it designed so that its functional in-game. Not a glass cannon. And don't make 90% of the 'exploration' game corridors in disguise.

Wait a sec. The Virmire Approach, Conduit Run, and Therum Approach are game corridors themselves. (I actually prefer the Feros segment to all of these; at least the player has something to think about when dodging shots.)

What was wrong with the Hammerhead? Besides the OP weapon, that is.

[AlanC9]

As already mentioned if vehicle exploration returns, then the vehicle should have the speed and agility of the Hammerhead and the firepower and armour of the Mako.

You mean we should be even more invincible than we already were? The only way to get killed in the Mako is if a thresher maw comes up under you, and the Hammerhead's even worse because you don't have to even get line-of-sight to an enemy to kill it.

[Beerfish]

Wait a sec. The Virmire Approach, Conduit Run, and Therum Approach are game corridors themselves. (I actually prefer the Feros segment to all of these; at least the player has something to think about when dodging shots.)

What was wrong with the Hammerhead? Besides the OP weapon, that is.

Paper thin armour in which if you took 3 hits at the wrong time your dead.  Button fatigue from having to keep pressing to increase height with jump jets.  The levels were a big part of the problem.  Multiple frogger levels, multiple areas with lava and such meaning almost auto death. 

[Raizo]

What was wrong with the Hammerhead? It was overpowered, sure, but so was the Mako.

The poor shields. The Hammerhead had the durability of wet tissue paper. I personally did not care for 95% of all of platforming that we had to do in the Mako. Much like the Mako in ME1 the Hammerhead should have been less about overcoming environmental obstacles and more about exploration and getting from A to Z in style, when properly done using a vehicle to get from A to Z is a good way to establish scale and hype up something ( see conduit run on Ilos ).

[katamuro]

The poor shields. The Hammerhead had the durability of wet tissue paper. I personally did not care for 95% of all of platforming that we had to do in the Mako. Much like the Mako in ME1 the Hammerhead should have been less about overcoming environmental obstacles and more about exploration and getting from A to Z in style, when properly done using a vehicle to get from A to Z is a good way to establish scale and hype up something ( see conduit run on Ilos ).

 

Exactly. They could have made it more exciting. All the story connected driving bits were good. 

[jasonxxsatanna]

I've been saying this since ME2 when they gave us those god awful Hammerhead missions

 

1. gives us choice.....let the player choose which vehicle  they want to use..... example:

 

If you pick the Mako , it can be used for heavy combat areas and battlefield settings , slow but heavy armored , used for exploration.

If you  use the Hammerhead for a mission , its faster lighter, more agile and would have  aquatic uses and exploration.

If the shuttle is used , it would be for quick deployment , for those players who may not want to explore.

The vehicles picked for exploration , would reward the player with loot out in the field, maybe rare equipment and / or weapons.

 

2. Make the environments interesting not the same bumpy terrain every planet

 

3. No corridor shooting or platformer vehicle game play. (maybe some but not every mission)

 

4. Vehicles can be up graded with equipment and weaponry......maybe a wench , booster rockets, better missiles , shielding  ....all which can be bought from vendors , salvaged or found in the field.

 

5. make the equipment system similar to the weapons bench from ME3 where you can add these equipment options to the vehicle of your choose , so that the player/gamer can view the benefits or the negitive effect the equipment would have on the vehicle.

 

for example: 

If heavy armor is added to the Hammerhead it would reduce its mobility by 50% 

 

6. Please allow the player to exit the vehicle at his/her leisure .....I hated in ME2 that you could only exit the Hammerhead once the mission was complete , I liked the ME1 way where you could tackle a problem on foot or in the vehicle if you so choose to.

[AlanC9]

The poor shields. The Hammerhead had the durability of wet tissue paper. I personally did not care for 95% of all of platforming that we had to do in the Mako. Much like the Mako in ME1 the Hammerhead should have been less about overcoming environmental obstacles and more about exploration and getting from A to Z in style, when properly done using a vehicle to get from A to Z is a good way to establish scale and hype up something ( see conduit run on Ilos ).

But stronger shields would have made the Hammerhead even more OP than it was. With that weapon system if you get hit at all you're doing something wrong.

Edit: PC master race here; I don't know how the thing plays for the console peasants.

[JamesFaith]

To be honest, both Mako and Hammerhead were just necessary evil for me.

 

I would gladly avoid any vehicle simulators in next games.