Questa discussione ha avuto 55 risposte

[Abraham_uk]

It's okay, you don't have to like RPGs.

 

Plenty of people prefer shooters.

 

 

 

I don't see moving from a very interesting RPG system with shooting-dice mechanics never seen before to another generic Gears of War wannabe as an improvement, quite the contrary. You can say that you like the shooter mechanics more than the RPG ones and that's completely fine, but not everyone likes games getting dumbed down to the point where you can't hardly distinguish one from another.

 

Talking as a TPS fan I'd rather be playing Vanquish, Rainbow Six, SOCOM or Gears.

 

 

Huge oversimplification combined with huge assumptions.

 

I love RPG's.

I love shooters.

I love fancy powers.

I love exploration.

I love interaction between well written characters.

I love a well told storyline.

 

So I feel the need to wholeheartedly disagree with the sweeping assumptions made of every single person who preferred Mass Effect 2/3 combat over Mass Effect 1 combat.

 

 

 

Mass Effect 3 is for me the best in terms of combat. Though it could be a lot more challenging.

 

It has:

 

Customisable armour: where you can mix and match different pieces

Weapon mods: to alter how your weapon performs in a meaningful way

Binary evolutions for power ranks: Whereas Mass Effect 1 was 12 linear evolutions with each evolution providing 1% or 2% improvement to said power.

Faster paced combat: Okay this isn't for everyone granted, but the urgency of combat really fit the urgency of the Reapers coming to town.

Improved control: You are a much more agile combatant.

Better weapon variety: Not only is there loads of weapons to choose from, any class can carry any weapons. Some people still insist that the adept should be restricted to a pistol. So that the adept can choose hundreds of the same 2/3 pistols with slightly different stats. Very RPG right?

 

 

 

 

What is RPG really about?

No one is in agreement over this one. However for me, the RPG features that truly mattered, was where the first game actually excelled.

 

Mass Effect 1 had:

 

Meaningful exploration

Multiple hub worlds (if only they weren't copy and paste)

Large number of NPCs in which you can have conversations with

Meaningful choices (which to be fair Mass Effect 2 and 3 also had)

A plethora of side missions that you could randomly stumble across. Each with their own story. (Mass Effect 2 had these and Mass Effect 3 had fetch quests instead)

Interesting side missions on the Citadel

Interesting optional side missions in other hub worlds

 

 

 

 

When I say I prefer Mass Effect 3's combat, IT DOESN'T MEAN I DON'T LIKE RPG's.

Also it is possible to enjoy Mass Effect 3 for what it is without being a cover shooter fan.

Please don't dump your generalisations on everyone.

There are some things that Mass Effect 2 and 3 did better than Mass Effect 1 in my opinion.

[Vapaa]

You say like ME2/ME3 weren't just another mediocre TPS, nobody is saying ME gameplay was perfect.

 

 

Without being perfect they're still on a whole different league as ME1, and ME3 with it's increased mobility even crossed the line to good.

 

No separe command for CQC: CQC is silly anyway, if you let a Krogan/shotgunner/armored guy get close to you should be dead already, game over.

 

No offense, but that's a pathetic excuse if I ever saw one...not all ennemies are melee units

 

Useless holster weapons command: Controlling your character in a RPG game, blasphemy!

 

Irrelevant in combat situation and its presence is even more jarring when we don't get a cover or melee button.

 

 

Overlapping powers: Overlapping > mindless spamming

 

That's exactly what I did in ME1: spam avaalible powers...Singularity or Lift ? who cares they do the same job.

 

 

Dumb IA: Welcome to 99,9% of videogames, a good AI is hard to do and even harder to promote (atleast compared to shiny graphics).

 

A basic mook that charges at my squad totally alone and without cover fire from his teammates is not just bad, but a totally useless behavior to program. It's as if the IA is stupid on purpose

[This is the End My Friend]

The BSN can give a false impression of the first game to a player who just has played one or both of the sequels. Because of the nostalgia factor of being the first game to get most players hooked on the series, it tends to be massively overrated on these forums.

 

 

Or people just like different **** and all that. 

[Vapaa]

In Mass Effect you don't shoot, you tell Shepard to shoot an enemy, the game rolls a dice and depending on the position, attributes, mods and weapons the bullet either hits or not, those are RPG mechanics, not shooter ones.

 

[...]

 

As far as combat goes Mass Effect is a third person RPG while ME2/3 are third person shooters, just like DA is a RPG and not a H&S.

 

In Dragon age you pick a target and the game attacks it itself, in ME you have complete control of Shepard: you aim and shoot; TPS mechanic.

 

 

In Mass Effect 2/3 you put the cursor on top of an enemy and all the bullets hit, you simply aim, press a button and everything is dead. My lvl 1 engineer hits 5 headshots in 10 seconds because I played thousands of hours of Counter Strike, not because he knows how to handle a sniper rifle.

 

Shepard a battle-hardened elite soldier, makes sense s/he can use a gun.

[ErikModi]

Just finished Mass Effect, and while the gameplay is still annoying, once you get used to it (and get some of the late-game, game-breaking gear) it does become rather a cinch.

 

For the record, I tend to prefer RPGs to action/shooters/whatevers.  My reflexes just aren't good enough to make me a skilled player.  Which is why the hacking game in ME1 had me snarling, it required the kind of reflexes I just don't have.

 

But thing about ME1 is that the RPG elements, in my opinion, were implemented very poorly.

 

Gear selection is all well and good, but there were too many things that were too "samey," or too "all or nothing."  Many items had stats so similar they might as well have been the same (and I even came across one set of armor with the exact same stats as another set.  I forget what they were.)  Other items would have marginal boots to all stats, or a massive boost to only one, both of which are equally uselss from my perspective.  By the time you get into mid-game, some items start dropping which are clearly better in every way to what you've had before, which only makes it that much more jarring when one of the "old" items drops and you see how lackluster it really is.  Later games did much better, I think, in tailoring the individual weapons and armors to individual play styles, letting you customize your character how YOU wanted to play.

 

"Exploration" is also rather pointless.  While running through the galaxy and surveying planets is fun, driving around in the Mako is just annoying, and the "exploration" is actually hindered by the vehicle's mobility.  You can climb almost ANY slope, but it takes some time, making actually getting from point A to point B uninteresting and annoying, either because you're searching for the route that will let you travel there at higher speed (and thus wasting time), or going directly and slowing down over tall peaks (also wasting time.)  And when you hit the slopes you CAN'T climb. . . well, enjoy backtracking.

 

Character progression was also very poor.  As stated, the evolution of your character is pretty much strictly linear, save for buying sufficent levels of Power X to unlock Power Y.  While I did have fun using Throw and Lift to keep enemies off balance, I still found myself mostly just shooting things dead (granted, I was playing on the lowest difficulty, because making it through the story enjoyably is more important to me than "a challenge.")  The powers were just not as interesting or well-thought-out, I feel, as they were in the later games.  While several powers remained, I feel they had better "niches" in the overal scheme of combat tactics, making each one its own special snowflake that can be the absolutely best power to have in the right situation.  The powers in ME1 felt more like slight improvements in one situation or another.  Power X will work slightly better than Power Y right now, but if I accidentally use Power Y, I'll still be alright.

 

The story and writing are great, but they always are with BioWare, and the story did indeed pick up long about Virmire and got a lot more engaging.  Still, the game has several flaws, and I'm glad they were ironed out in the later installments.

[Baalzie]

Well, console... That about says it all.
I'm an avid PC player. And believe me "clunky controls" is exactly what we got with ME2 and ME3 with the STUPID "Spacebar does it all" bullshit.
Not to mention "Oh there's a thingie to duck behind, spacebar means glue!" No I wanted to use that thing that was ACTUALLY highlighted, but you chose to get glued to that rail instead... Asshat...
Or "Wanted to sprint to the door but got glued to the chair halfways out in the open to get shot..." Yey... Stupid consolification!

The controls of ME1 were actually WAY better than in the sequels. Maybe not so much for buttonclicking gamepad users, but for the rest.
Dumbing down things is not the way to go imho... But the big masses seem to prefer it, and it DOES make it easier to play on consoles (Why ever anyone want consoles is beyond me, but to each it's own) so it's a viable option for the companies, since it gives them cash like hell... Not that it gives me(!) anything good but meh...

And hopping back a few years in time you were expecting a prequel to ME2? Uhm... They tend to TRY to better themselves when they make sequels. Especially in planned trilogies. I might not agree on many "approvements" but to NOT think a game would feel older when one plays the original after playing the sequel with a few years of production in between ? Uhuh...

The thing with RPG's is that... They're ROLE PLAYING GAMES... Not action fps's... Even though ME2 and definitely ME3 was quite a few steps towards interactive movies with some fps... And a slight miniscule hint of rp'ing in there somewhere...

[ErikModi]

Role-playing isn't just an engine.  It's a frame of mind.  And Mass Effect, to my mind, NEVER sacrificed role-playing for action.  You still get to RP your Shepard, decided the fates of civilizations based on who YOU want this character to be.  That is the very essence of role-playing.  Many computer/console "RPGs" have basically no role-playing, since the characters, their personalities, and the story itself is fixed, you're just along for the ride.  While I love the series, Final Fantasy is probably the biggest offender here.  Rather than giving you a character you can flesh out and make choices for, they give you several characters with predetermined personalities and goals, and the story more or less leads you around by the nose.  This isn't necessarily bad (they wouldn't have fifteen games in the series with countless spinoffs if it was), but it is NOT "role-playing."

 

And again, I never said that I expected ME1 to be exactly like ME2.  All I said was that I was not prepared for how dramatic the difference was, and how really poorly-designed the game is from a gameplay standpoint.  The mechanics that most people associate with RPGs and ONLY RPGs were not well implemented, and the aspects that people normally associate with action games were also not well-implemented, and the two aspects constantly got in the way of each other.  Tightening up BOTH of those aspects, and moving closer to a "traditional" action game gameplay format while keeping the RPG aspects that WORKED, but more importantly, keeping the RPG MINDSET of "this is YOUR character, YOU decide who s/he is" was, in my opinion, the right way to go.

[Thermopylae]

Actually I quite liked to scope of Mass Effect One, missions/ assignments involve ship to ground vehicle to foot and the story starts with humans and slowly involves more exotics ie aliens and the equipment is more customizable. It's a solid well developed RPG that involves a lot of exploration and some of my friends prefer ME1 to ME2. Of course ME2 involves a character built around the actor Yvonne Strahovsky and the combat in ME3 is definitely more refined. But one of the reasons for playing ME1 is to get a sense of the original vision for the ME universe.

 

But I see the point of the multiple critiques as well. Perhaps evaluating it with respect to what was around at the time it was published, 2008, is also useful.

[The Sarendoctrinator]

 

Thresher Maws are a ******, no way around it.

Some good advice that I got years ago when I joined BSN, and I was playing a Sentinel at the time as well - choose the Bastion specialization. At level 12, enemies caught in Stasis will take damage. Defeat them while they can't move. Easiest thresher maw fight ever. 

[MegaIllusiveMan]

Now, granted, I'm still pretty early in the game (on my way to pick up Liara now), but I have to say, if I'd started with Mass Effect 1, I probably would not have been hooked into the series as much as I am.  The writing and characters are still great, but as Yahtzee says, "BioWare doesn't get credit for that from me anymore."  It's pretty much a constant that BioWare games are well-written and well-characterized, but that's only half of what makes a game great.  The best I can say about the original Mass Effect in terms of gameplay is "playable," and that's not much.

 

Well, I bet 10 Cerberus Bucks that you're wrong.

 

It was a major disappoint (for you) because you expected all the things(or most of it, like powers) be on the First Mass Effect. If you had played Mass Effect 1 BEFORE the others, you would say that "This game is awesome, I am impressed, Damn Krogans, Turrets, etc..." and when ME2 came out, you would say that the Hammerhead totally sucked and wanted the Mako to return on ME3

 

The point is, if you want all ME2 Things in ME1 to stay "Hooked" at the game, then you will be disappointed.

[MegaIllusiveMan]

Some good advice that I got years ago when I joined BSN, and I was playing a Sentinel at the time as well - choose the Bastion specialization. At level 12, enemies caught in Stasis will take damage. Defeat them while they can't move. Easiest thresher maw fight ever. 

 

That is, if you aim  Stasis at the Thresher Maw correctly after exiting the Mako. You only get one shot at this...

[Reever]

I loved the game, although some of the stuff you've listed were annoying, of course! But the atmosphere, characters and story more than made up for it!

Can wait to do a ME 1-2-3 playthrough in one go!

[Vigilant111]

@OP: Glad you have finished the game, and I would like to share my thoughts based on my own experience with the trilogy, if you would allow it. I actually started playing ME trilogy with ME3, and went on to play ME1 then ME2. At first I was terrible at ME1, I found its combat mechanics abysmal and had a terrible time adjusting to it. However, over time, I grew to like this particular game more and more, I actually felt my character got stronger and stronger throughout the game.

 

The powers and the weapons are great in ME1, namely Lift and Spectre Master Gear, which both got retrenched for some reason. Sure, the later installments feature more sophisticated gameplay with manipulation of cooling down periods and power combos, but in ME1, it is all about brute force and raw power, what you see is what you get, if you lift can a gigantic geth colossus, then you lift a gigantic colossus, no tricks required. With the hacking stuff, ME2 is actually worse, I don't know, maybe some people like it because the hacking adds to suspense

 

To me, ME1 is really about getting a sense of the vastness of the galaxy, and that is what all those seemingly mindless mineral runs are all about, the idea is to get you to explore the landscape, to be aware of potential dangers of extraterrestrial travel and to develop an appreciation of your squadmates on those lonely, lonely planets or deserted spacecrafts. ME1 successfully constructed a beautiful universe, fill with danger and intrigue, tinged with a sense of romance, and for that I think it is the best game in the trilogy

[Endurium]

I played both Starflight games years ago, which ME1 was heavily inspired by, so for me many things in ME1 were an improvement or at least nice to see in 3D. Glad the OP at least managed to finish ME1.

 

Despite the inventory system, the frogger hacks for everything including mineral samples (really Bioware?), and the Mako + unnatural terrain, I rather enjoy the game. I do a full playthrough about once a year on PC, when I'm feeling like running another Shepard through the trilogy.

 

Finding minerals in ME1 is more engaging than the snorefest of scanning planets in ME2.

[Durhon]

I still find myself having fun in Mass Effect 1 when I playthrough it, and I started with Mass Effect 2.

[The Sarendoctrinator]

That is, if you aim  Stasis at the Thresher Maw correctly after exiting the Mako. You only get one shot at this...

 

I'm sure I didn't get them in one shot every time. My aim isn't always very reliable. 

 

Usually, I leave the Mako behind before going into an area with thresher maws because it tends to get destroyed by the acid blasts if it's sitting too close, and then watch the mini-map very closely - the big enemy dot appears right before the thresher maw comes above ground, so I have a chance to position Shepard. If you really watch them, it's also possible to tell when they're going to shoot the acid by a change in their movements, which gives enough time to dodge. I've actually beaten them with my Vanguard this way, but Stasis makes things a lot easier. 

[KotorEffect3]

I like ME 1 because I played it back when it came out.  Since then it has admittedly aged.  I still enjoy going back to play it but part of that is because it just makes my experience richer in the sequels if I run my Shepard through ME 1 first (I have never used the genesis comics although I have them downloaded).  The changes from ME 1 to ME 2 were pretty substantial more so than ME 2 to ME 3 in my opinion.  If it wasn't for story reasons I could see why a newcomer would have a hard time getting into ME 1.

[Farangbaa]

I'm sure I didn't get them in one shot every time. My aim isn't always very reliable. 

 

Usually, I leave the Mako behind before going into an area with thresher maws because it tends to get destroyed by the acid blasts if it's sitting too close, and then watch the mini-map very closely - the big enemy dot appears right before the thresher maw comes above ground, so I have a chance to position Shepard. If you really watch them, it's also possible to tell when they're going to shoot the acid by a change in their movements, which gives enough time to dodge. I've actually beaten them with my Vanguard this way, but Stasis makes things a lot easier. 

 

Just stay in the Mako, ride around until the Maw surfaces. Stop driving, wait until the acid blast animation starts then start driving again. Rince, repeat. When it's on it's last sliver of health get out of the Mako and finish it. You stop moving because this gives you a higher chance that the Maw won't go back into the ground, which is not only annoying, you also have a chance that it will hit the Mako on resurfacing.

 

Obviously you never stop shooting at it during this entire process.

 

Also I still play ME1. I only do full trilogy runs, it gives me much more feeling with that Shepard.

[Undead Han]

It's okay, you don't have to like RPGs.

 

Plenty of people prefer shooters.

 

 

 

I don't see moving from a very interesting RPG system with shooting-dice mechanics never seen before to another generic Gears of War wannabe as an improvement, quite the contrary. You can say that you like the shooter mechanics more than the RPG ones and that's completely fine, but not everyone likes games getting dumbed down to the point where you can't hardly distinguish one from another.

 

Talking as a TPS fan I'd rather be playing Vanquish, Rainbow Six, SOCOM or Gears.

 

 

I prefer RPGs to shooters. That being said, in an RPG that involves the player characters shooting things rather than hacking them to death, I prefer shooter mechanics to dice rolls. And there is nothing inherently smarter about D&D style dice rolls, and thus there was no 'dumbing down' by dropping it. Its just a different gameplay mechanic.

[Gkonone]

ME1 is very story driven as it's laying the groundwork for the other games, also the combat and interface feel a bit clunky compared to the other two games.

I like ME1 mostly for that groundwork.

[Excella Gionne]

I felt the same way as well, and still do, but I make the effort to play it. I wished that I got to play it from the first game, but nope, I was a sad PS3 owner. Now, I enjoy the Trilogy on both PC and PS3. Because I played ME1, I now understand the jokes in ME2.

[CptFalconPunch]

ME1 is very story driven as it's laying the groundwork for the other games, also the combat and interface feel a bit clunky compared to the other two games.
I like ME1 mostly for that groundwork.

By playing ME2 or 3 first you're spoiling yourself too much. One of the best parts on ME1 was exploration, planets, races, etc. In the latter instalments everything is taken for granted, hence going back to a game where everything granted is presented all over the place feels... like you've spoiled the whole game. The "newish" factor if you will.

But damn, the fun and deep story, the superb writing (mostly), the atmosphere, the music and the characters are all there to make you forget about the shortcomings.

And contrary to some people here, I like the combat in ME1. The biotics are tons of fun, the guns feel great aswell. Then there is so much customization (armors, grenades, omni-tools) giving it quite a large variety.

[Sarcastic Tasha]

Just stay in the Mako, ride around until the Maw surfaces. Stop driving, wait until the acid blast animation starts then start driving again. Rince, repeat. When it's on it's last sliver of health get out of the Mako and finish it. You stop moving because this gives you a higher chance that the Maw won't go back into the ground, which is not only annoying, you also have a chance that it will hit the Mako on resurfacing.

 

 

Yup stopping the Mako is absolutely the key to beating thresher maws. Although I go for the jumping technique instead. Just drive right up to the thresher maw and stop just far enough that it can't bash you. Jump when you see it sicking out its acid and shoot until you need to jump again.